Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[Chaos Warp]

OMG YOU RUINS HER CHARACTER NOW HOW WILL I FAP TO HER

You realize I'm not one of those and dislike her new design for completely different reasons right?

Edited October 23, 2012 by The Eggster

[Kuzu]

Maybe because people don't like the particular way she was modernized here? You know, there's always that.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Maybe because people don't like the particular way she was modernized here? You know, there's always that.

I'm tempted to joke about how it's "BAW GREEN EYES!" all over again. But enlighten us on what's wrong with how they modernized her.

[Mauro Fonseca]

I'm going to sound like a picky little faggot here, but I actually really really really dislike the use of blue as an eye color for Sonia. It's not anywhere near "baw green eyes" levels, but as a spriter, I have my reasons. I'll go find a random art topic to rant in.

The joke is that it's colour rotation. Sonic is blue with green eyes, Manic is green with pink eyes, Sonia is pink with blue eyes. Ziggy needs to improve his colouring a bit, and most particularly on his decision to use huge yellow flares.

Also, 4chan's newfound obcession with Sally means there's a shitload of fanart already, and so far only two pics are rule 34! That's something.

[Aquaslash]

The joke is that it's colour rotation. Sonic is blue with green eyes, Manic is green with pink eyes, Sonia is pink with blue eyes. Ziggy needs to improve his colouring a bit, and most particularly on his decision to use huge yellow flares.

His eyes are pink there? I thought it was red. Probably because of all the yellowing. That's actually the first I've seen that little gag used. Most common eye color for Manic seems to be red, with hazel used almost as much and blue used occasionally. I don't quite know what to think of that gag either. I'll have to sit on that one for a while

[TheEzekiel300]

Ian for the win!!! Ian isn't a perfect writer, but he truly honers Sonic's name. I have no problem with the design. When I first picked up the comics in 2008 I said that the SatAM characters needed to be modernized except for Bunnie. All Bunnie needed was a glove. Ben Bates, Tracey Yardley, Jammal Peppers and Spaz did a good job making the SatAM cast feel more like they belong in Sonic's world than Steven Butler did then Ian came and made it better with Rotor and Sally's design. Ian saved this comic. No more over the top furry drama and terrible artwork. I can't tell you how many times I looked up Sally in google's images and the stupid looking fan art of her popping up. The Sally fans do a good job into making her look ugly and making her feel out of place with their terrible art work. It's just the truth. The only fan person that draws the SatAM cast on what they should look like is Tazi San. All other art stinks. Although, you get only a few good ones still, Tazi is the best.

Ian isn't perfect but he is a kick butt writer and awesome story teller. The protagonist, Sonic got a new design,so it's only fair that the love interest, Sally, get's a new design.

Edited October 23, 2012 by TheEzekiel300

[Your Vest Friend]

The only fan person that draws the SatAM cast on what they should look like is Tazi San. All other art stinks.

Bullshit.

So what happens when we see Dulcy next? She's a female and she ain't clothed. Is she gonna have some unfeasibly large dress on or something?

Quite frankly, I think Dulcy's done with as a character. She's never really fit into the cast that well, and Ian doesn't really want to write for her, it seems. She's pretty much the opposite of every other reptile (who can be deader than doorknobs and still cameo long past their deaths), in that regard.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Wally Gator

[bwrosas]

For the past week, the overall fan base has been split down the middle about Sally's new redesign/rough concept draft redesign that was unveiled a little over a week ago at the New York comic con.

Many fans have expressed their like and dislike for the new design. 50% feel that it's about time she had a change. While the other 50% feels that the change/redesign is unnecessary and betrays who the character is.

50% of the fans are in agreement with Ian Flynn, when he said that the characters need to mesh with the current look of the Sonic franchise. The other 50% feels that the reason the redesign occurred is because of two reasons, one being the "soccer parents" (which Ian has denied had no influence in the decision for the change) and/or the Sega Corporation and their mandates.

However, despite the differences in the overall fan base, one question does seem to be asked from both sides. A question that makes a possible majority of the fan base wonder one thing. And that one thing is : Is/was this current Sonic story arc nothing more then an excuse to finally get Sally fully clothed?

The reason the fan base (at least the majority of it) asked this question, is because they want to know if this is what this entire story arc has been leading up to. They want to know that if the nearly a year and the current/October issues of both the main Sonic comic and the spinoff Sonic Universe comic, which for this month are looked at as nothing more then promotional advertisements/tie-ins for the Summer Olympic Games which already took place this past late July/early to mid August, as well as for the Mario and Sonic London Olympics videogame tie-in as well as the upcoming Sonic and Sega All-Stars Transformed racing game which is due out next month, that if their interruptions of this story arc with the exception of the back story for issue 242 of the main comic as well as the upcoming summer crossover which will be spread across the Sonic Universe comic, the main Sonic comic, and the Mega-Man comic, they want to know that with all that if the redesign is the reason for this long drawnout story arc.

Believe it or not, many fans believe that to be the case. And the reason being, is because some of them feel that if Ian, Archie and Sega wanted to give Sally a redesign, they could've easily done it in a short back story or a short front story in the main comic. As one fan said and I will use this as an example, Ian could have easily wrote a short story where Sally went with either Amy or Bunnie to go shop for clothes, have either girl tease Sally about her wearing the same outfit and being a Tomboy, show her said outfit that was revealed at the New York comic con, have it either one of them say she would never think about wearing something like this, only to have Sally prove them wrong by purchasing and wearing said outfit and deciding that maybe this is a good look for her to go with from now on. Now that's not exactly how this one fan put it, but if they read this, they will understand that it was close enough.

The point that the fan base that questions if this story arc was nothing more than an excuse to give Sally a new look, the point their trying to make and get a cross to others out there, is that this whole story arc could have been done, but not at the expense of doing what Ian did to Sally just to give her a redesign at the end.

Now my personal feelings on this, is if that is the case, then I do agree that it could have been done with a short story. However I am willing to give Ian the benefit of the doubt and as he said in the additions that he added to his DA Journal, I am going to take what he says for right now at face value. Because in all honesty, why go through all this, with the possibility that the upcoming summer crossover may have something to do with the story arc, due to the fact that the rumor going around is that it will/may involve the missing blue chaos emerald, why go through all that just to have the climax being Sally getting a redesign. To me it doesn't make sense.

The reason being that it doesn't make sense, is that one of the things he added when he made some additions to his DA Journal, he said that the redesign when it's finalized after a possible tweak here and there in the design, does it say how, when and at "what cost" Sally will be restored at. No it doesn't. And what caught my eye, was the at "what cost"part. Which got me thinking what if, what if he takes a page out of let's say the third and final season of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers, the page I'm talking about is when they did the Alien Ranger story arc and had the Power Rangers themselves reduced/deaged to kids, but with their teenage personalities and memories intact. It got me wondering, if perhaps the "what cost" of Sally's return, that perhaps it could be that thanks to possibly the power of the chaos emeralds, if not the blue chaos Emerald that time reverses, with the exception that Sonic and his friends along with Sally regain their teenage personalities and memories, thus explaining perhaps the redesign for Sally and maybe some other characters.

You may read that, and say that's far-fetched even for Ian Flynn, but you got of think of it this way, this story arc is supposed to be Ian Flynn's masterpiece, the story arc that defines his time writing for Archie comics, so I wouldn't put it past Ian to do something of that sort or magnitude, nor should you.

As far as who is to blame for the decision for the redesign of Sally and possibly other characters in the comics, as mentioned before, Ian Flynn pretty much debunked the whole soccer parents theory, even though there are some that still feel they had a role in it, and that Ian is covering his tracks and their's, by saying they didn't have any involvement. Which if true leads to the second option.

That being of course, the Sega Corporation. And why Sega? Because at the end of the day, whether we like it or not, they do have the final say or at least one of the final says when it comes to the comic and the characters involved, whether those characters are game characters on nongame characters, they will at least have some of the final say in what takes place. And if they are the ones truly responsible for the change in Sally's design as well as possibly other future characters, then there is very little we can say about it.

Now don't get me wrong, apparently from what Ian said, Archie comics does at least listen to fan input and criticism, and from what he said recently in the additions to his journal, let's just say that rough concept teaser of Sally's new redesign, may or may not be the final draft/concept design for her going into 2013. Which means they may add some additional details to her final design.

When it comes to this current story arc, from the summaries and video reviews and typed reviews I have read and seen, I can say this. Some like to say, that Ian Flynn is trying to make this current story arc into another version of his web comic Other – M. Which if was/is the case, from what some have described seeing as this story arc has progressed, perhaps may have a point. But giving Ian Flynn the benefit of the doubt, what I see in my honest opinion, is someone that had to get an epic story off their chest. And in my honest opinion, perhaps he wanted to do something in the style of his web comic, which he did kind of achieve with the Silver story arc. But wanted to do more so in the main comic. Thus is the reason for the "Mecha-Sally/World Tour II/Death Egg MK II" story arc that is currently being released, written and by fans standards read and criticized/enjoyed, because Ian, (in my humble opinion) had to get an/this epic story off his chest, out of his mind, checked off his list and by the start and in the middle of next year, hopefully done and over with.

That, my fellow Sonic fans, in my humble/honest opinion is the reason why this story arc was started and is currently going today, because I feel, giving him the benefit of the doubt, he just had to get this story arc out of the way, whether we like it or not.

Thank you for taking the time to read this, I know it was long, but hey would you rather read this or watch a 22 min. plus video on YouTube where I talked about the same thing, I think the choice is easy to make, don't you?

God Bless

Tuesday, October 23, 2012

time : 12:18 PM Pacific.

[Mauro Fonseca]

I must ask, where do you get these marvellous percentages of yours?

[Mangoaxe5]

I must ask, where do you get these marvellous percentages of yours?

He pulled them out of his ass.

I love when fans make up fake percentages. I remember last year one guy on Bumbleking kept making up percentages about whether or not Sally would survive Genesis.

[Vertekins]

Jesus Christ, Now I fully know that Ian can't do a damn thing with Sally without her "fans" acting all high and mighty about it as if they're has to be a reason for it approved by them.

She's been given a LONG overdue design alteration that doesn't justify this bitching and ridiculous speculation as to the reason behind it. She's been given a pair of shorts and gloves and a closed shirt, that's all there is to it.

[Blackbell]

For the past week, the overall fan base has been split down the middle about Sally's new redesign/rough concept draft redesign that was unveiled a little over a week ago at the New York comic con.

Many fans have expressed their like and dislike for the new design. 50% feel that it's about time she had a change. While the other 50% feels that the change/redesign is unnecessary and betrays who the character is.

50% of the fans are in agreement with Ian Flynn, when he said that the characters need to mesh with the current look of the Sonic franchise. The other 50% feels that the reason the redesign occurred is because of two reasons, one being the "soccer parents" (which Ian has denied had no influence in the decision for the change) and/or the Sega Corporation and their mandates.

However, despite the differences in the overall fan base, one question does seem to be asked from both sides. A question that makes a possible majority of the fan base wonder one thing. And that one thing is : Is/was this current Sonic story arc nothing more then an excuse to finally get Sally fully clothed?

The reason the fan base (at least the majority of it) asked this question, is because they want to know if this is what this entire story arc has been leading up to. They want to know that if the nearly a year and the current/October issues of both the main Sonic comic and the spinoff Sonic Universe comic, which for this month are looked at as nothing more then promotional advertisements/tie-ins for the Summer Olympic Games which already took place this past late July/early to mid August, as well as for the Mario and Sonic London Olympics videogame tie-in as well as the upcoming Sonic and Sega All-Stars Transformed racing game which is due out next month, that if their interruptions of this story arc with the exception of the back story for issue 242 of the main comic as well as the upcoming summer crossover which will be spread across the Sonic Universe comic, the main Sonic comic, and the Mega-Man comic, they want to know that with all that if the redesign is the reason for this long drawnout story arc.

Believe it or not, many fans believe that to be the case. And the reason being, is because some of them feel that if Ian, Archie and Sega wanted to give Sally a redesign, they could've easily done it in a short back story or a short front story in the main comic. As one fan said and I will use this as an example, Ian could have easily wrote a short story where Sally went with either Amy or Bunnie to go shop for clothes, have either girl tease Sally about her wearing the same outfit and being a Tomboy, show her said outfit that was revealed at the New York comic con, have it either one of them say she would never think about wearing something like this, only to have Sally prove them wrong by purchasing and wearing said outfit and deciding that maybe this is a good look for her to go with from now on. Now that's not exactly how this one fan put it, but if they read this, they will understand that it was close enough.

The point that the fan base that questions if this story arc was nothing more than an excuse to give Sally a new look, the point their trying to make and get a cross to others out there, is that this whole story arc could have been done, but not at the expense of doing what Ian did to Sally just to give her a redesign at the end.......

God Bless

Tuesday, October 23, 2012

time : 12:18 PM Pacific.

If all they wanted to do was give Sally clothes they would have just done it like they did back towards the beginning or when they changed Bunnie's design back in 232 etc. I don't see what the major issue is with changing her design. If she was changed to fit in with the Sega Statuse Quo then surely this can only be good news for Sally Fans as it shows Sega taking an interest in her.

Ian has given us a creative and exciting storyline with given us Mecha Sally- in the last five years her character has had numerous changes in her personality and has been badly written. After she is changed back we'll probably see more of the old, decent Sally and her new design looks like a sign of this.

I also wonder where these percentages come from. Mind you about 86% of statistics are made up

[Mangoaxe5]

as it shows Sega taking an interest in her.

Sega's interest in Sally went up by 1%.

See I can make up percentages as well.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Vampfox

[Chaos Warp]

I'm tempted to joke about how it's "BAW GREEN EYES!" all over again. But enlighten us on what's wrong with how they modernized her.

Okay, here we go.

My main problem with it is that they made her look too young. Like, in her previous look, she looked fairly mature. But now I think she looks too child-like. Sally's supposed to be 17-ish as far as I know, now they kinda made her look 10-ish.

And I will admit it is jarring to see her clothed like this, but that's not why I dislike it. That's something I can easily get over.

Edited October 23, 2012 by The Eggster

[bwrosas]

Sega's interest in Sally went up by 1%.

See I can make up percentages as well.

it what it feels like to me that's all

[JaidynReiman]

It has been said that 90% of all percentages are made up on the spot. Sorry, had to be said.

I do think Sally looks a little too young in her new design. I think they need to make her look a little older. Other than that, I do like it a lot.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

He pulled them out of his ass.

I love when fans make up fake percentages. I remember last year one guy on Bumbleking kept making up percentages about whether or not Sally would survive Genesis.

Please, that's nothing compared to at least 2 fans back on the old forum who paraded around the topic claiming that "50% of the fans wanted Sally dead" during Endgame. Fellow Sally-fan and Moderator Flyboy Fox called them out on where they got there sources from no more than several times and they still danced around her question while ranting about "50% wanted her dead", so it was obvious they were pulling that out of there ass.

Okay, here we go.

My main problem with it is that they made her look too young. Like, in her previous look, she looked fairly mature. But now I think she looks too child-like. Sally's supposed to be 17-ish as far as I know, now they kinda made her look 10-ish.

And I will admit it is jarring to see her clothed like this, but that's not why I dislike it. That's something I can easily get over.

Now see, I can actually understand and see that...a bit.

Although really, to be fair, ever since they pulled the plug on the more human-like proportions of her design and made her closer to Sonic before this redesign she's looked a lot younger by comparison.

Edited October 24, 2012 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Anti Alias]

Just asking, how many SegaSonic comics Archie made? you know, based in the game continuity?

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Just asking, how many SegaSonic comics Archie made? you know, based in the game continuity?

A few.

Generally speaking, there aren't any "SegaSonic" comics within the Archie verse based on the game continuity because they blend it with both the games, SatAM, and original content.

For example, we don't have a Sonic Heroes comic, but we still see the Egg Fleet, Egg Pawns, and 3 man teams between a lot of the Sega Characters. We have adaptations of the games, but that's generally the Adventure, 3D, Genesis, and I think there was a Sonic & Knuckles one unless there's something I missed. But other than that, don't expect to see anything exclusively for the games.

[Badnik Zero]

The old adaptations weren't really adaptations, they were more like a game outline filled in with Archie cast. The newer adaptations are much more true, but they tend to be six page shorts that take place outside the comic universe. I'd say we've never had a true adaptation at all.

And for the changes on Sally besides the clothes... Her facial fluff is gone, her eyes are much wider, her hairstyle is less poofy, her chest pattern is concealed, and her tail is straight instead of doe-like. So don't say it's just the clothes. It's pretty drastic unless you're trying to ignore it.

Edited October 24, 2012 by American Ristar

[bwrosas]

The old adaptations weren't really adaptations, they were more like a game outline filled in with Archie cast. The newer adaptations are much more true, but they tend to be six page shorts that take place outside the comic universe. I'd say we've never had a true adaptation at all.

And for the changes on Sally besides the clothes... Her facial fluff is gone, her eyes are much wider, her hairstyle is less poofy, her chest pattern is concealed, and her tail is straight instead of doe-like. So don't say it's just the clothes. It's pretty drastic unless you're trying to ignore it.

Yes, but right now it's a rough concept teaser art/image draft, that according to Ian, is/could be/will be subject to changes and tweaks

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

The old adaptations weren't really adaptations, they were more like a game outline filled in with Archie cast.

Isn't that exactly what an adaptation is? A story taken from another source and adapting it for different purposes?

And for the changes on Sally besides the clothes... Her facial fluff is gone, her eyes are much wider, her hairstyle is less poofy, her chest pattern is concealed, and her tail is straight instead of doe-like. So don't say it's just the clothes. It's pretty drastic unless you're trying to ignore it.

Not more drastic than when they gave Sally more human-like proportions, and I don't see a lot of the complaints from that than I do for this one. The clothes are the most noticeable element of the redesign, so it's not so much ignoring everything else than it is hitting a larger bullseye.

[Badnik Zero]

I really disagree. Characters have been given different outfits before. The clothes don't bother me at all. It's like if Knuckles was given a jacket, I really don't care. If Knuckles got a haircut and his head changed shape, that's more like what I'm saying here.

[Jix Hedgehog]

... Didn't Coral say the Specials were being retired after the poster issue (#5)?

Some questions for you all here :

1. Do you think the one-shots and the crossover should have waited till the end of the arc?

2. Do you think the crossover will be canon or non-canon?

3. Do you think other characters will get the same treatment as Sally with her redesign?

4. Do you think with Sally getting a Sega like style, and with the "Rumored" reboot being talked about, do you think this is a sign that she may be a playable character in future games, or more so the "Rumored" Reboot?

5. Do you think the artist drew influence from the orignal pink Sally design, when it comes to her facial features?

6. Do you think the artist got influence or stole ideas from the SonicGX Flash Series design of Sally?

1. What arc do you mean? They had appropriate gaps between arcs, so they kind of fit

2. Non canon, like the previous crossovers (be it mind-wipes .. whatever)

3. They've already happened (Bunnie is tall, has a hat, Rotor suddenly aged 40 years, Antonie... got a sword?)

4. Doubt it, as long as SEGA of Japan/Sonic Team have a say with the series, we won't be seeing American characters in the games (not counting Spinball... they..... they kind of let us have that one)

5. The reboot Sally looks closer to the recent Sal than the early on Sal

6. Don't know, never seen/heard of a GX.. but even if they did, the people behind GX can't do anything about it (legally)

Wouldn't an alternate universe version of Sonic still have black eyes?

Or am I just thinking about this too much

Not at all, if Archie want a true ending to Underground, they'll keep eyes black.. there's no point in getting the rights to do an Underground comic, figuring out an ending that'll please fans then botching the entire thing with incorrect colours

Edited October 24, 2012 by Jix Hedgehog

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I really disagree. Characters have been given different outfits before. The clothes don't bother me at all. It's like if Knuckles was given a jacket, I really don't care. If Knuckles got a haircut and his head changed shape, that's more like what I'm saying here.

Yeah, well I'm not exactly hearing those complaints about it. I'm hearing more about the outfit than anything else, mainly due to how she's wearing them now after going almost 20 years without a change of clothes. Ian made note of it on his DeviantArt journal, so it's obviously the outfit being the bigger notice than anything otherwise he wouldn't mention it.