Sonic 4 Playtested By Community Member

[Indigo Rush]

Even Sonic Advance 2 had some Spinball Physics in there.

[azoo]

Yes indeed it did. It had quite a bit of spinball physics; it's just that the level design never takes advantage of it; as the only thing Advance 2's level were built for were.. Well, holding right. :/

[Doctor MK]

I don't really want to get involved in the whole "it's Sonic Advance 2 again" argument until I've seen more footage, particularly final code footage. However, I will say that I'm of the opinion that - be it called Sonic the Hedgehog 4 or not - I'm more than happy with it being like Advance 2 if it really is that similar (which it doesn't look like to me at the moment), because I enjoyed that game and it was certainly one of the better Sonic games in recent memory.

The physics don't look like they're going to absolutely kill the game, sure they're a little bit loose and floaty in areas, but this will hopefully be tweaked (especially if SEGA has been taking note of all the fan reactions) and we should have a decent enough Sonic game in the end with any luck.

Edited February 24, 2010 by MK Skillz

[Tyranno]

I suppose someone needs to say this.

WHY IS THIS NOT BEING STOPPED?!

No, I don't mean by Sega. Why is the fandom casually accepting, and then ENCOURAGING these links? Why was any effort made to validate Endri in the first place?! The fact that we're seeing this AT ALL is both borderline criminal and completely CONTRARY TO THE SPIRIT OF GOODWILL Sega has been giving us.

Even if you don't care for the direction the game is taking itself, Sega has been down right princely about all of this. But because people haven't gotten the website updates they wanted or unsatisfied with concept art, that justifies this flagrant disrespect? Sega not only reached out to fans, they INCLUDED THEM, and ran one of the most charming and fun contests for the fandom that they've ever done.

And what do we do?

We hype up this stolen footage, this breach of NDA, and we perpetuate it, giving this person his full 15 minutes of fame. And then there are the people who justify it because it lets them "figure out the game" or that they deserve it.

I have never been more disappointed in this fandom in my life. At the very least, when we fought in the past, it was about a subjective issue of quality. Here... here we're spitting in Sega's faces.

Whether this is going to be a good game, a classic game, or even an awful game is irrelevant. The arguments about whether it's real or a final version of the game is irrelevant. This? Is taking something that is not meant to be taken.

And I have no sympathy for the section of the fandom that acts like jive like this is right anymore.

Edited February 24, 2010 by Razorsaw

[Badnik Zero]

I'm not part of the video game industry. I'm a fan and consumer. A leak is a leak - you can't "clean up" the information, so what do you expect people to do?

[Carbo]

I love Jim Sterling.

[Pelly <3's U]

Oh I'm sorry, we'll just ignore information about the most anticipated game around these parts.

It's the least we could do for Sega :U

[Kintor]

That was well said Razorsaw, I think you make a very good point. Sega has gone to great lengths in recent months to connect with this fanbase. The very fact that Sonic 4 exists at all shows that Sega has been paying attention to the discussions taking place here and in other Sonic communities. These so called ‘leaks’, wether they are merely rumours or stolen information, are very damaging. Such sentiments cause nothing but confusion. If these stories are simply lies then it breeds mistrust within the fanbase, nobody like being cheated by troll. Worse still, if anything source of leak information is true, it is a highly illegal act. Moreover, Sonic 4 is not yet finished; revealing parts of the game before Sega is ready serves only to damage the game, clouding perceptions with information that will quickly become out of date as the game leaves this alpha stage of development. I think that a little more trust and patience are in order; Sega will reveal more information in time, to generate hype for the game. They will do this when Sonic 4 is ready and the best it can be – not before.

[Thirsty Pocket]

I don't think Sega should be playing things too close to the chest anyways. Suprises are not always good, but are always too late to change. With this project, Sega seemed so happy, and confident that they finally got things right with the fans. They also seemed like they were listening to them. If they are, I bet theyre sweating bullets because they can't do major changes. I think fans should shush and let the games do what they will (Im talkin to you, Zelda fans!) ... except for Sonic fans. Most series have only a few legit gripes that usually get fixed. Bur Sonic is drowning in unfixed problems, and new ones. If these problems had chances to be caught early, they should have been.

EDIT: I truly am greatful to Sega for trying. I enjoyed a majority of Sonic's games. But I am tired of his name being dragged through the mud. I do not have opinions for or against leaks, but I do beleive Sega ought to be more open at earlier development stages.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Lando The Bat

[Tyranno]

You give the fanbase a look earlier in development, and you give everyone ELSE a look too.

There's a reason why they have to be secretive.

But even then... and even if the game is terrible, it's not right to take a big wet piss on any matter of trust shared between a company and its fanbase.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Razorsaw

[Tornado]

So, again, what are you proposing? I'm not saying that the fanbase should be actively searching out for stuff from Sega, even when they are stupid enough to host it on the public FTP server; but when the leaks occur do you expect the information to just be ignored?

[Tyranno]

Yes.

The news and fan sites have the responsibility and the power to put a lock on discussion and not show the information. It won't kill everything, but it will help to SOME extent.

[Blacklightning]

I could be wrong here, but I thought the issue was moreso that fans actively spread leaks and encourage the practice of such, much less that they take notice of them.

EDIT: Ninja'd.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Blacklightning

[Tornado]

Yes.

The news and fan sites have the responsibility and the power to put a lock on discussion and not show the information.

That's a pretty funny joke.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Tornado

[Tyranno]

I don't see what's so funny about expecting a moderator or site owner to use their power to enforce something that's right and fair.

[JEV3]

For reasons I stated in the other topic with the screenshots, I have enough reason (for myself) to doubt a sonic fan that I don't altogether know too well... considering the screenshots he supposedly leaked are rather poorly shopped. It would not surprise me if this was some kind of epic troll, which only goes to show that some of us eat this stuff up every bit as eagerly as TSSZ.

I don't think this is so much about the legality of it all as it is the fact that a lot of people are acting like total idiots in response to this. Not surprising, as long as there is a natural variety within the fanbase, there will be a few crazies among the fans, and as long as there are crazies, stuff like this is going to travel fast.

[Kintor]

That's a pretty funny joke.

Nonsense, this is about a basic matter of trust between Sega and the fanbase. Stealing unfinished parts of the game is both illegal and disrespectful to the whole development team. Even if not true, these rumours can cause significant damage; nothing worse then blaming Sega for some random Troll’s Photoshop job. It’s true that many people would like to see this game before release, to see how it is developing and quite possibly get excited for the game. I’m sure that Sega is well aware of this fact, they have already released trailers and concept art, even involving the whole fanbase in the hype. It is Sega’s choice when this information should be release, they above all else want Sonic 4 to be a success; they will release new information when the game is in a respectable state and not before – as it should be. Any less just isn’t being fair to Sonic 4, let alone Sonic the Hedgehog.

[Rusty Spy]

I'm seeing the same type of thing in regards to level design. However, the Advance 2 physics engine was still particularly unsuited for use in any kind of low speed platforming, as seen clearly when Dimps reused it for exactly that purpose in Sonic Advance 3.

WOAH WOAH WOAH BACK UP!

NO NO NO! Adv 2's physics were >>>> Adv 3's! Play Adv 3 again and TRY and tell me with a straight face that the engine plays the same. Advance 2's physics were PERFECT for slow platforming, Adv 3 completely fucked up the jumping physics. You rocket at top speed when ever you jump which is the REAL reason why Adv 3 sucks in the platforming department.

And Adv 3's level design was so convoluted and confusing that it was impossible to properly remember any of the levels. Take a map of the first stages from Adv 1 and 3 and you'll see a HUGE difference.

[Pelly <3's U]

I don't see what's so funny about expecting a moderator or site owner to use their power to enforce something that's right and fair.

This has happened before due to requests but the simple fact is once the information is out there....it's out there.

If someone can't talk about it in one place they'll just find another place. It sucks for leaks to happen, but you can't just make information disappear as easily as you'd think.

[Tyranno]

But if you cut it down in notable places, it will limit its EXPOSURE.

Toonzone forums do a very good job of supressing unliscensed youtube leaks and all sorts of stuff that isn't meant to be seen. I know for a fact this stuff is plausible.

[Blacklightning]

Oh, god. While I did agree with you initially Razorsaw, the extents you want to enforce this to is borderline China censorship. It would've been nice to catch a leak like this before it happened, so to speak, but it's happened, shit's everywhere and there's not a damn thing we can do about it. Let it go.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Blacklightning

[Pelly <3's U]

But if you cut it down in notable places, it will limit its EXPOSURE.

Toonzone forums do a very good job of supressing unliscensed youtube leaks and all sorts of stuff that isn't meant to be seen. I know for a fact this stuff is plausible.

It's plausible, but not all that effective and without its own controversy.

[Tyranno]

Of for the love of... can we do this without borderline calling me a communist here?

This is a common practice on forums in other fandoms. Especially ones that have levels of communication between them and the series creators.

And it's not oppressive to do something that PROTECTS someone else's IP. You say that and you get close to justifying leaks from the moment they start as "not stifling journalism."

Our right to essentially WHINE about something is not prioritized over Sega's control over their own creation, or not risking their reputation and invalidating their program to promote the game. That is, yannow, part of the whole thing's BUDGET.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Razorsaw

[Tornado]

I don't see what's so funny about expecting a moderator or site owner to use their power to enforce something that's right and fair.

Because you are acting as if they are violating a moral quandary that doesn't exist in the first place. The information was leaked. It is out there. Why the fuck should we not discuss it?

Stealing unfinished parts of the game is both illegal and disrespectful to the whole development team.

Which hasn't happened. At all.

Even if not true, these rumours can cause significant damage;

They can also build hype. They can even turn out true!

nothing worse then blaming Sega for some random Troll’s Photoshop job.

Which also hasn't happened.

It is Sega’s choice when this information should be release, they above all else want Sonic 4 to be a success; they will release new information when the game is in a respectable state and not before – as it should be. Any less just isn’t being fair to Sonic 4, let alone Sonic the Hedgehog.

Statements like this make me wonder if the only reason the bitching about the leaks is even happening is because the reaction to them have been overwhelmingly negative. If everyone was writing flowery reviews of happiness towards the leaks, would this have even been brought up? Considering about half of the news threads in the Video Game forum are pretty much rumours only, I'm gonna say no.

[DaBatGuy]

But if you cut it down in notable places, it will limit its EXPOSURE.

Toonzone forums do a very good job of supressing unliscensed youtube leaks and all sorts of stuff that isn't meant to be seen. I know for a fact this stuff is plausible.

The problem is that it's impossible to regulate information once it's on the web. Sega can toss out C&D's on every site they come across but for every cooperative TSS there are 20 or more TSSZ's that will distribute the info regardless.