Sonic Runners (iOS/Android) - Thread Version 2.0

[KHCast]

So you're fully on board with it then as a pay to play. And basically I have to understand the game needs to be nearly unfair to play regularly unless I grind and waste my time on it? Gotcha. 

 

People have lives, and are not willing to waste them grinding on a boring game that only rewards you with a character that you can use in the boring game. There are games that actually excell at the F2P system that SEGA should take notes from.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

When you enter into a free to play game, you can't complain knowing that the sole point is to make money, not your enjoyment. Once you understand that you'll know who's fairer and who isn't. Runner's doesn't feel much like a F2P because it's not really designed as one. If you're not willing to pay you need to be able to grind, and grind a ridiculous number of hours. (I never spent a cent on Love Live, but I was able to grind in events and still make it to top tier against people who pay and there are MANY more in that game than Runners. You just need the conviction.)

Except that's completely backwards. When the game was in it's pre-worldwide launch state, before Sega began all the bs F2P practices, there was a good amount of people here saying that once the worldwide launch hits, they were going to buy some RSRs in order to reward Sega for making a game which doesn't have these idiotic practices, only for Sega to fuck that all up as soon as the worldwide launch happened. As shocking as it sounds, offering the player a fair and fun experience will actually want to make them give you money. By doing grinding bullshit, it's only going to drive them away and make them stop playing altogether.

[KHCast]

I don't know why people seem to think a free to play game can't be fun and encourage you to spend? How many f2p games has Jim sterling pointed out himself as fun games that deliver solid experiences that still do the money grubbing system? 

 

You're seriously telling me I can't complain about a game not being fun? Really? The thing games are meant to do? Be fun. Thank you for being the thing AAA devs bank for. 

[SuperAj3]

So you're fully on board with it then as a pay to play. And basically I have to understand the game needs to be nearly unfair to play regularly unless I grind and waste my time on it? Gotcha. 

 

People have lives, and are not willing to waste them grinding on a boring game that only rewards you with a character that you can use in the boring game. There are games that actually excell at the F2P system that SEGA should take notes from.

Your last point is totally true. But this isn't an American F2P, those seem to be much more fair (I love Dash's model of global challenges, that was the best model!).
It's sad but true. They are designed to be played for free but if you look at all the top players you'll see how many hours a day they put into the game. You can still play for fun and enjoy it. I mean, I don't grind in this game, I just play when I have free time and if I'm lucky I'll get a character. All the events are still there and we get to hear new music by Tomoya Ohtani all for free, so that's still fine. I mean, does it make a difference if you miss a character? Play long enough and you'll at least get one. 

Except that's completely backwards. When the game was in it's pre-worldwide launch state, before Sega began all the bs F2P practices, there was a good amount of people here saying that once the worldwide launch hits, they were going to buy some RSRs in order to reward Sega for making a game which doesn't have these idiotic practices, only for Sega to fuck that all up as soon as the worldwide launch happened. As shocking as it sounds, offering the player a fair and fun experience will actually want to make them give you money. By doing grinding bullshit, it's only going to drive them away and make them stop playing altogether.

I know Sonic Team's been unfair with this. I was pissed about it as well XD But we've seen they clearly don't care about us (look at everyone's reports of customer service experiences). Pre Worldwide was much more fair and better IMO (double the RSR, more lives, 3 daily spins). What you're saying I feel the same way. I wonder if pre worldwide was to see how willing people were to pay? And then they ramped up. If that's the case they're clearly money-minded which is disappointing.

 

I don't know why people seem to think a free to play game can't be fun and encourage you to spend? How many f2p games has Jim sterling pointed out himself as fun games that deliver solid experiences that still do the money grubbing system? 

 

You're seriously telling me I can't complain about a game not being fun? Really? The thing games are meant to do? Be fun. Thank you for being the thing AAA devs bank for. 

You're allowed to complain LOL I complain about their shit a lot!
I just said enjoyment isn't their main focus XD It's the money.

Edited October 25, 2015 by SuperAj3

[PurinxPop]

really? Not making much money? Where are you getting those claims from? Cause it sure seems to be making quite enough to continue going the way it is. And really, if making things simpler for consumers is now considered a bad thing(which it really isn't, since consumers would be more willing to spend money if things were better constructed.) and people actually back SEGA got doing this....well fuck, quite the time we live in where we put corporations needs and desires over the consumer.

"This is game is literally a F2P mobile game that is meant to be a time waster" - said by certain people to others who complain about the roulette system. The same people who are making that statement are saying that this game is the most unfair and is the manifestation of Satan just because they are salty they can't get their favourite character in an F2P game. "FREE TO PLAY". Just because the game is free to play doesn't mean the development cost is. You know, there are a ton of people who just WANT to play their favourite character for 10 or so minutes. If a game of this caliber allowed it, SEGA wouldn't be making much profit AT ALL. If you are so upset you can't play the character you want, chances are you are a fan of the franchise or said character, and monetization practices are targeted towards you.

This argument doesn't excuse the blatant disregard for any sort of play-testing for this game, but it's just cancer seeing some of the posts here like "this is the greediest f2p mobile game on the market". Clearly this is the first time you've been exposed to a game like this; there are PLENTY of other games like this that are far more casual unfriendly. This game is the most generous in terms of stamina and premium currency. THE GAME REPLENISHES YOUR REVIVE TOKENS AT THE END OF EACH EPISODE. Other games prevent you from playing for a certain time period unless you spend premium currency. If you can't reach the end of the episode in 3 tokens, chances are you are not very good at this game, which necessitates spending money. 

THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH SPENDING MONEY ON A MOBILE GAME THAT'S FREE TO PLAY. You guys need to get the idea that "companies trying to generate a profit are pure evil" out of your head.

As much as I hate grinding or spending money in this game, games are always going to operate like this from now on. Business practices are becoming more strict because, well, why service these entitled whining of consumers if you are losing more money than generating? Not a game, but look at YouTube Red, a paid subscription based service for the once completely-free YouTube. A lot of videos are being taken down by copyright claims and are going to be exclusive to this new service. This all happened because 1/5 people who browse youtube use ad blockers and YT cannot generate enough revenue. Likewise, all these unrealistic expectations for a revamp in the monetization system for this game would probably run it into the ground. 

Except that's completely backwards. When the game was in it's pre-worldwide launch state, before Sega began all the bs F2P practices, there was a good amount of people here saying that once the worldwide launch hits, they were going to buy some RSRs in order to reward Sega for making a game which doesn't have these idiotic practices, only for Sega to fuck that all up as soon as the worldwide launch happened. As shocking as it sounds, offering the player a fair and fun experience will actually want to make them give you money. By doing grinding bullshit, it's only going to drive them away and make them stop playing altogether.

If RSR would be much easier to get, there would be no point in giving SEGA money at all. There's no guarantee that said people are going to give sega money because why should they with their pricing on RSR?

Edited October 25, 2015 by PurinxPop

[Ryannumber1gamer]

"This is game is literally a F2P mobile game that is meant to be a time waster" - said by certain people to others who complain about the roulette system. The same people who are making that statement are saying that this game is the most unfair and is the manifestation of Satan just because they are salty they can't get their favourite character in an F2P game. "FREE TO PLAY". Just because the game is free to play doesn't mean the development cost is. You know, there are a ton of people who just WANT to play their favourite character for 10 or so minutes. If a game of this caliber allowed it, SEGA wouldn't be making much profit AT ALL. If you are so upset you can't play the character you want, chances are you are a fan of the franchise or said character, and monetization practices are targeted towards you.

This argument doesn't excuse the blatant disregard for any sort of play-testing for this game, but it's just cancer seeing some of the posts here like "this is the greediest f2p mobile game on the market". Clearly this is the first time you've been exposed to a game like this; there are PLENTY of other games like this that are far more casual unfriendly. This game is the most generous in terms of stamina and premium currency. THE GAME REPLENISHES YOUR REVIVE TOKENS AT THE END OF EACH EPISODE. Other games prevent you from playing for a certain time period unless you spend premium currency. If you can't reach the end of the episode in 3 tokens, chances are you are not very good at this game, which necessitates spending money. 

THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH SPENDING MONEY ON A MOBILE GAME THAT'S FREE TO PLAY. You guys need to get the idea that "companies trying to generate a profit are pure evil" out of your head.

As much as I hate grinding or spending money in this game, games are always going to operate like this from now on. Business practices are becoming more strict because, well, why service these entitled whining of consumers if you are losing more money than generating? Not a game, but look at YouTube Red, a paid subscription based service for the once completely-free YouTube. A lot of videos are being taken down by copyright claims and are going to be exclusive to this new service. This all happened because 1/5 people who browse youtube use ad blockers and YT cannot generate enough revenue. Likewise, all these unrealistic expectations for a revamp in the monetization system for this game would probably run it into the ground. 

If RSR would be much easier to get, there would be no point in giving SEGA money at all. 

If RSRs were easier to get, it might show that Sega aren't being desperate enough to make the game and it's F2P elements so annoyingly terrible in order to get money, and therefore, people will actually reward Sega for doing this. And no, before you begin claiming that "I can't confirm that" There are numerous posts dating back to when the game first launched that many people said they'd give Sega money because they put the game in front, instead of F2P nonsense. 

[SuperAj3]

I still don't like the F2P Idea. It makes more money sure, but Runners is still a game I'd prefer a 3DS eShop title. Pay for the game, get it with ALL the characters and timed in-game events.

[KHCast]

Except the game to many at its core isn't even all that special. It's mediocre at best, so it's not really delivering to a majority a fun solid experience. To me, the games a load of boring monotonous shit with not much to do when just playing it as a time waster. 

 

Im not going to invest my time betting on a chance at maybe getting a character that only barely improves the game by a hair. The f2p system in place in runners, no matter where it originated from, is not sound in the eyes of many. And really it doesn't matter where it's from, I'm not gonna sympathize when the point is still to get money from you. 

Edited October 25, 2015 by Michael Munroe

[SuperAj3]

Except the game to many at its core isn't even all that special. It's mediocre at best, so it's not really delivering a liberal fun solid experience. To me, the games a load of boring monotonous shit with not much to do when just playing it as a time waster. 

 

Im not going to invest my time betting on a chance at maybe getting a character that only barely improves the game by a hair. The f2p system in place in runners, no matter where it originated from, is not sound in the eyes of many. And really it doesn't matter where it's from, I'm not gonna sympathize when the point is still to get money from you. 

It's true, there are other Japanese F2P games that are much more solid and enjoyable. If you're not enjoying it much maybe take a break? I do that when I start to stop enjoying the game. I know it's Sonic, so I can't just abandon it XD But I will take time off.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

It's true, there are other Japanese F2P games that are much more solid and enjoyable. If you're not enjoying it much maybe take a break? I do that when I start to stop enjoying the game. I know it's Sonic, so I can't just abandon it XD But I will take time off.

There's where the problem lies. Just because other F2P games have done it, in no way makes it an acceptable business practice. If that was the case, you might as well say Rise of Lyric was acceptable because Assassin's Creed Unity released a few weeks before hand, and was slightly worse. It does not excuse a ripoff business practice designed to take more money off the consumer. I mean for fuck sake, how do you defend Sega telling you that they want you to spend £30 just to get Amy? It's absolutely inexcusable.

[KHCast]

 "When you enter into a free to play game, you can't complain knowing that the sole point is to make money, not your enjoyment." Sure seems like you're saying I'm not allowed to complain about their shit.

 

Also I stopped playing like a month ago. Not coming back to it. It's just not worth the time. I'm better off playing Kingdom Hearts unchained X.

[SuperAj3]

OK, we've all reached an understanding XD Just keep in mind this is a F2P, and that their motivations aren't going to change. It's sad but true. It's not a rip-off if people support it XD And people seem to be paying for this game. It's their choice, you can still get everything in-game for free (Look at some top players like Starlight Aurora, he's not payed a cent and has maxed out all buddies!)

 

[KHCast]

OK, we've all reached an understanding XD Just keep in mind this is a F2P, and that their motivations aren't going to change. It's sad but true. It's not a rip-off if people support it XD And people seem to be paying for this game. It's their choice, you can still get everything in-game for free (Look at some top players like Starlight Aurora, he's not payed a cent and has maxed out all buddies!)

 

people support Fee to Pay practices. That make it okay?

[SuperAj3]

 "When you enter into a free to play game, you can't complain knowing that the sole point is to make money, not your enjoyment." Sure seems like you're saying I'm not allowed to complain about their shit.

 

Also I stopped playing like a month ago. Not coming back to it. It's just not worth the time. I'm better off playing Kingdom Hearts unchained X.

XD You know I said that's not my intention, no need to start an argument. Also if you've stopped playing a month ago, no need to come back and rip on the game XD Just end it now, no need to argue. Sorry for getting you riled up as well. Not my intention.

[Shadowlax]

OK, we've all reached an understanding XD Just keep in mind this is a F2P, and that their motivations aren't going to change. It's sad but true. It's not a rip-off if people support it XD And people seem to be paying for this game. It's their choice, you can still get everything in-game for free (Look at some top players like Starlight Aurora, he's not payed a cent and has maxed out all buddies!)

 

No its a rip off, people are just pouring money into it. I have played better FTP games, just because this one has sonic doesn't mean all is forgiven

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Again, people bought Assassin's Creed Unity. It doesn't make it one bit OK to then release broken and buggy games and then say "oh we'll patch them later, jeez guys, it's like you EXPECTED a functioning game when you bought it"

And just because he hasn't played it in a month doesn't mean he can't and shouldn't rip on a game. If it uses a business model, that he hates, he has the right to criticize it.

[PurinxPop]

Ok, it's fair to argue that the core gameplay is a piece of shit after all these buggy updates, which is a consensus we've all come to. 

But the monetization practices should not be confused with the core gameplay in terms of rating this game. Most people weren't bothered at all that much when the Chaotix came out on the roulette at first because the game was still in its early stages and was fun to play.

Just pray they fix everything with the 2.0.0 update and we can return to those happy days.

[KHCast]

I stopped playing tons of games I dislike and still discuss them. There's nothing wrong with that.:/

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Ok, it's fair to argue that the core gameplay is a piece of shit after all these buggy updates, which is a consensus we've all come to. 

But the monetization practices should not be confused with the core gameplay in terms of rating this game. Most people weren't bothered at all that much when the Chaotix came out on the roulette at first because the game was still in its early stages and was fun to play.

Just pray they fix everything with the 2.0.0 update and we can return to those happy days.

Dude, no one is complaining about the core gameplay, and getting it confused and such. The core gameplay is bugged, and needs fixing. Yes, that's true. I mentioned that in my post, but it doesn't mean we can't talk about another one of the massive problems in the game. The one that directly turns the game into a complete game of luck if you can progress in the leaderboards or not, aka, the main selling point of Runners' gameplay in the first place.

[SuperAj3]

People with only Sonic and Tails can still top the leaderboards. It's just practice makes perfect. Sure character buffs are useful but I've seen you don't need roulette characters to top the runners league boards. (Plus the Runners league boards aren't helpful when you're higher ranked, total score rewards the RSR so just keep playing. More small scores all add up and you'll be rewarded!)

[KHCast]

Missed quoting this 

"This is game is literally a F2P mobile game that is meant to be a time waster" - said by certain people to others who complain about the roulette system. The same people who are making that statement are saying that this game is the most unfair and is the manifestation of Satan just because they are salty they can't get their favourite character in an F2P game. "FREE TO PLAY". Just because the game is free to play doesn't mean the development cost is. You know, there are a ton of people who just WANT to play their favourite character for 10 or so minutes. If a game of this caliber allowed it, SEGA wouldn't be making much profit AT ALL. If you are so upset you can't play the character you want, chances are you are a fan of the franchise or said character, and monetization practices are targeted towards you.

This argument doesn't excuse the blatant disregard for any sort of play-testing for this game, but it's just cancer seeing some of the posts here like "this is the greediest f2p mobile game on the market". Clearly this is the first time you've been exposed to a game like this; there are PLENTY of other games like this that are far more casual unfriendly. This game is the most generous in terms of stamina and premium currency. THE GAME REPLENISHES YOUR REVIVE TOKENS AT THE END OF EACH EPISODE. Other games prevent you from playing for a certain time period unless you spend premium currency. If you can't reach the end of the episode in 3 tokens, chances are you are not very good at this game, which necessitates spending money. 

THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH SPENDING MONEY ON A MOBILE GAME THAT'S FREE TO PLAY. You guys need to get the idea that "companies trying to generate a profit are pure evil" out of your head.

As much as I hate grinding or spending money in this game, games are always going to operate like this from now on. Business practices are becoming more strict because, well, why service these entitled whining of consumers if you are losing more money than generating? Not a game, but look at YouTube Red, a paid subscription based service for the once completely-free YouTube. A lot of videos are being taken down by copyright claims and are going to be exclusive to this new service. This all happened because 1/5 people who browse youtube use ad blockers and YT cannot generate enough revenue. Likewise, all these unrealistic expectations for a revamp in the monetization system for this game would probably run it into the ground. 

If RSR would be much easier to get, there would be no point in giving SEGA money at all. There's no guarantee that said people are going to give sega money because why should they with their pricing on RSR?

SEGA is a AAA dev, and as such they'll abuse any chance they can to make money, especially when it comes to free to play or any mobile practices. I can bet, it's not cause of lack of money that they are doing this practice, just like how it wasn't cause of money EA had to make Dungeon Keeper mobile shit. No, I'm not complaining cause I didn't get Rouge or whoever the latest and greatest character is. I'm complaining because I'm against the core practice of how they are monetizing the enjoyment and fan loyalty. And people are eating it up and defending it.

Paying money to get better, is like paying money for easy fatalities, where is the fun in that? And just cause other games do it worse, isn't gonna make me feel like i should give Runners a pat on the back.

 

There's nothing wrong with spending money on a GOOD Free to Play game that has a decent amount of enjoyment to balance the microtransactions the dev is requesting, and to me, Runners isn't anywhere near good enough to justify purchases imo. And again, I point to Dungeon Keeper. 

 

And maybe they will maybe they won't. People hated Deus Ex's Augment your pre-order shit, and look what happened there. People when they're loud enough have power in their words.

Edited October 25, 2015 by Michael Munroe

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Dude, a Sonic and Tails from a person with practice, isn't going to do shit against a person with Rouge/Halloween Rouge, and useful buddies with practice. You can get high scores on the boards sure, but if a person with the same amount of skill has far better characters, you aren't going to surpass them.

[SuperAj3]

Dude, a Sonic and Tails from a person with practice, isn't going to do shit against a person with Rouge/Halloween Rouge, and useful buddies with practice. You can get high scores on the boards sure, but if a person with the same amount of skill has far better characters, you aren't going to surpass them.

People can last for 2 hours straight without dying XD Some leaderboard members get 100 million with just Sonic and Tails. It was possible even when Shadow and Rouge came out. Memorise all the layouts of each stage! Things become so predictable your character no longer matters because you'll never die XD Just practice and you'll be able to at least keep ranking up. You don't need to be 1st to progress.

[NoirSuede]

People can last for 2 hours straight without dying XD Some leaderboard members get 100 million with just Sonic and Tails. It was possible even when Shadow and Rouge came out. Memorise all the layouts of each stage! Things become so predictable your character no longer matters because you'll never die XD Just practice and you'll be able to at least keep ranking up. You don't need to be 1st to progress.

Well the problem is that when used by 2 people with the same skill level, the guy using Shadow will ALWAYS score more because of his passive bonuses and the fact that he (and all of the unlocks) has no downsides whatsoever.

[TailsTellsTales]

OK, we've all reached an understanding XD Just keep in mind this is a F2P, and that their motivations aren't going to change. It's sad but true. It's not a rip-off if people support it XD And people seem to be paying for this game. It's their choice, you can still get everything in-game for free (Look at some top players like Starlight Aurora, he's not payed a cent and has maxed out all buddies!)

 

I am sure that person ended up paying major cost in the form of time because that person probably ended up playing 12 hours a day. If they had the original worldwide release version then they probably still be playing 12 hours a day lol. The point is no normal person should have to play nowhere near 12 hours a day to get the things on there.