Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Darinian]

12 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

Yeah, I feel kinda vindicated that more people are starting to noticed and be bothered by it nowadays. I remember pointing it out in Sonic 4, Colours, and Generations, and people told me I was just looking for reasons to hate on the games. It won't bother everyone that the games work like this, but I can't imagine that it would bother anyone if the games were built in such a way that scripting wasn't necessary. Or even if it wasn't there at every point for no reason, like it is with the booster and springs in Forces Green Hill.

Momentarily. Try hitting a spring, with or without the homing attack, and don't hold any directional input. Sonic will cease all horizontal movement very quickly. Or heck, just watch this trailer at 0:28. Sonic 4 is a totally different engine to the Generations/Forces (obviously) so it does things differently. But springs in that game are still pretty much the same as the are in the 3D games - they neuter player control until the scripted event is over. 

Mission completed and that is an upwards facing spring

[Muscles Maximum]

That video is really satisfying to me for some reason

[Sonikko]

12 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

Momentarily. Try hitting a spring, with or without the homing attack, and don't hold any directional input. Sonic will cease all horizontal movement very quickly. Or heck, just watch this trailer at 0:28. Sonic 4 is a totally different engine to the Generations/Forces (obviously) so it does things differently. But springs in that game are still pretty much the same as the are in the 3D games - they neuter player control until the scripted event is over. 

I'm not defending Sonic 4 by any means, but vertical springs kept your horizontal momentum, at least when hit by using the homing attack. If you stop holding right you fall like a rock but that's just how momentum works in that game, you have to keep pushing the direction to keep your momentum, which is inexcusable, but still. It's not that the mechanic is not there, it's that it's butchered by the physics system.

[Ayliffe]

I... don't mind Lost World's controls, actually. Rather pointless run button aside (would've made more sense to have a walk button IMO), it was pretty fun to play about with and the easy-to-spam spindash is a right ol' laugh. I can kinda appreciate what they were going for with the parkour too, even if it wasn't that great overall.

No, the problem Lost World has is getting these controls that'd work well in more open levels... and shoving it into TUBES

[Sonikko]

My main grip with Lost World's controls was the fact that you had two different speeds when moving forward and when moving left or right. Why even?

It made navigating the 3D levels quite wonky. Oh and the fact that the physics system is basically nonexistent, that too.

[Blue Blood]

24 minutes ago, Zoroark & Flare said:

Mission completed and that is an upwards facing spring

Thank you for proving my point? Look what happens at the end there the scripted event of the spring ends - before Sonic starts falling straight down, he starts going straight up. It's a mixture of strangely programmed springs and Sonic 4's physics.

It's not as bad as Forces, but the behaviour in S4 is still unnatural. Different springs will limit horizontal movement proportional to how high the spring launches Sonic vertically. 

[Darinian]

@Blue Blood if you would please read this

41 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

But springs in that game are still pretty much the same as the are in the 3D games - they neuter player control until the scripted event is over. 

I'm trying to disprove this. If you'd like I can upload a video with me holding left on that spring...

[Blue Blood]

18 minutes ago, Zorua & Flare said:

@Blue Blood if you would please read this

I'm trying to disprove this. If you'd like I can upload a video with me holding left on that spring...

They're not identical, but functionally very, very similar. 

We can argue the finer details if you wish, but the overall point that I'm trying to make (pretty hamfistedly) is that every Sonic game that we've seen for around the last decade has awkward scripting that interrupts flow. That includes the springs Sonic 4 as well as the 3D games and lots of other faceats. For whatever reason, Forces has made it a talking point.

[Darinian]

That... I can agree with.

[Chris Knopps]

This thread is starting to remind me of Rise of Lyric now...

You know, what with the spring and boost pad stuff...

How about we talk about how Sonic never has any slipping animations when he runs along water on a stone/brick/paved passage? he controls like a car yet lacks the physics of one.

Mentioning this because of the water in the Modern stage in Forces.

[Shiny Gems]

37 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

This thread is starting to remind me of Rise of Lyric now...

You know, what with the spring and boost pad stuff...

How about we talk about how Sonic never has any slipping animations when he runs along water on a stone/brick/paved passage? he controls like a car yet lacks the physics of one.

Mentioning this because of the water in the Modern stage in Forces.

I don't think this happened in Generations as well. There was one part near the end of modern Green Hill where Sonic runs on a path covered by water. I could remember wrong, but he just ran normally when he ran or boosted on that path instead of slipping.

[blueblur98]

8 hours ago, PC the Hedgehog said:

I'm not disappointed at all. Can't say there's much to be excited about either, though. We still barely know anything about the game, and I'd rather not get emotionally invested one way or the other based on less than 3 minutes of footage. Color me cautiously optimistic at this point.

same

 

[Kintor]

5 hours ago, Tracker_TD said:

Lemme just correct you there:

That's a somewhat better picture, as you acknowledge the continue size of the Sonic fanbase but it's still far from accurate. You'll find plenty of people who like Sonic Adventure 2 and consider it one of the most iconic Sonic game ever made. Just as you'll find considerable overlap between Sonic fans eager to buy both Sonic Forces and Sonic Mania, as both are Sonic games. That the tastes of the Sonic fanbase are sophisticated enough to accommodate more than one type of Sonic game at the same time. Encouraging this concept of a divide between Sonic Mania and the rest of the Sonic fanbase doesn't help anybody.

1 hour ago, Chris Knopps said:

This thread is starting to remind me of Rise of Lyric now...

You know, what with the spring and boost pad stuff...

How about we talk about how Sonic never has any slipping animations when he runs along water on a stone/brick/paved passage? he controls like a car yet lacks the physics of one.

Mentioning this because of the water in the Modern stage in Forces.

Sonic has always made a point of defying the laws of physics where ever possible. Even if the Sonic games use a 'physics engine' the point is not to replicate reality but rather to allow Sonic to consistently preform so many fantastic stunts. Like in Sonic 3's Hydrocity Zone, where Sonic is able to run across the surface of the water like it was a solid road thanks to his speed. The same can true of a mundane stone pavement slick with water, Sonic is moving so fast that he negates any slight loss of grip that the water might have caused. That to the outside observer (the player) water on a brick path have no appreciable impact on Sonic's movement.

[Tracker_TD]

11 minutes ago, Kintor said:

That's a somewhat better picture, as you acknowledge the continue size of the Sonic fanbase but it's still far from accurate. You'll find plenty of people who like Sonic Adventure 2 and consider it one of the most iconic Sonic game ever made. Just as you'll find considerable overlap between Sonic fans eager to buy both Sonic Forces and Sonic Mania, as both are Sonic games. That the tastes of the Sonic fanbase are sophisticated enough to accommodate more than one type of Sonic game at the same time. Encouraging this concept of a divide between Sonic Mania and the rest of the Sonic fanbase doesn't help anybody.

Just realised there was indeed a small detail missing, fixed it now:

Joking aside; I don't doubt Sonic Forces is going to do decently sales-wise; there hasn't been a Modern Sonic outing in years (even bearing in mind Classic and Bubsy gegging in on this one) and plenty of folks will buy it purely on the fact it's a new Sonic game. I'm talking about game quality, and it's relatively clear reaction to Forces is lukewarm at best, pretty negative beyond that. 

[Blue Blood]

3 minutes ago, Kintor said:

That's a somewhat better picture, as you acknowledge the continue size of the Sonic fanbase but it's still far from accurate. You'll find plenty of people who like Sonic Adventure 2 and consider it one of the most iconic Sonic game ever made. Just as you'll find considerable overlap between Sonic fans eager to buy both Sonic Forces and Sonic Mania, as both are Sonic games. That the tastes of the Sonic fanbase are sophisticated enough to accommodate more than one type of Sonic game at the same time. Encouraging this concept of a divide between Sonic Mania and the rest of the Sonic fanbase doesn't help anybody.

It's just a joke to make people laugh. If you don't like it, ignore it. But there's literally nothing more to it than that. Nobody is actually, genuinely insinuating that you can't be interested in both titles. Forces on it's own is going to really please some people too who haven't the faintest interest in Mania.

It's a joke. Hee hee har har. 

[Kintor]

Just now, Tracker_TD said:

Just realised there was indeed a small detail missing, fixed it now:

Joking aside; I don't doubt Sonic Forces is going to do decently sales-wise; there hasn't been a Modern Sonic outing in years (even bearing in mind Classic and Bubsy gegging in on this one) and plenty of folks will buy it purely on the fact it's a new Sonic game. I'm talking about game quality, and it's relatively clear reaction to Forces is lukewarm at best, pretty negative beyond that. 

Well okay then, at least your willing to consider the wider range of tastes in the Sonic fanbase. There's plenty of different viewpoints out there which don't always get the full attention you'd think given the size of those groups. For example, I think that the Sonic Fanbase the would go nuts for a Chao Garden phone app; but that's a conversation for another time. As for Sonic Forces, I think that the hype for the game is continuing to build; I expect that Sonic Forces will receive greater attention at E3 and even more post-release of Sonic Mania when Sega's marketing can give Sonic Forces its undivided attention.

[Badnik Mechanic]

45 minutes ago, Kintor said:

 As for Sonic Forces, I think that the hype for the game is continuing to build.

Can you just link to one place where people can be seen to be getting more excited as the day's go on? I would be fascinated to see what they find worth hyping and how many of them there are.

Just one link.

 

 

[Kintor]

16 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Can you just link to one place where people can be seen to be getting more excited as the day's go on? I would be fascinated to see what they find worth hyping and how many of them there are.

No offense but the days of narrowing down the Sonic fanbase to a single place and sentiment are long gone. Even the existence of SSMB itself is something of an anomoly these days, to many active forums are seen as a rare and unusual way to communicate from a bygone era of the internet. Regardless, there has been much in the way of positive sentiment lately thanks to Sonic Forces. The fact that gamers are now seriously talking about 3D Sonic games as a respectable purchase is a significant development.

[Badnik Mechanic]

11 minutes ago, Kintor said:

No offense but the days of narrowing down the Sonic fanbase to a single place and sentiment are long gone. 

Well if it's in more than one place it should be easy to link to one, more than one in fact?

That is if indeed these do actually exist.

[blazefan519]

Listen man, I'm one of the few people on the message boards here that is actually still somewhat exited for Forces. If you can't handle the fact that some people are disappointed or just downright hate Forces then ignore 'em. And a lot of the times, it's just people joking around, something that you're either meant to laugh at and not take seriously. Don't spew nonsense like, "the hype for Forces is growing", "it'll sell 100M copies", or "Forces is the pinnacle of 3D Sonic" or some other crap.'Cuz you're either really stretching it or it's not even true. I mean, it's gotten down to the point where you've been constantly disproven and can't even provide evidence for any of your claims and it's a little sad that this happens all the time now. Look mate, there's needs to be a point where you realize that is it really worth constantly doing this. It makes you look like a fool, and I honestly think I can actually speak for everyone when I say that we're tired of it.

[Kintor]

11 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

Well if it's in more than one place it should be easy to link to one, more than one in fact?

That is if indeed these do actually exist.

Why go to all this effort? Are you planning to write another editorial on the front page calling out those unfortunate souls for the amusement of the forum?

Seriously though, my point is that the presence of Sonic Forces has remarkable improve the quality of conversation around 3D Sonic games. Over the last couple of years many gamers felt that they could just dismiss 3D Sonic games outright; when the last thing they remember is a Sonic Boom glitch reel video posted on YouTube. However, Sonic Forces has changed all that, now 3D Sonic games are once again being taken seriously by most gamers.

[Diogenes]

I dunno, man, maybe providing even the slightest piece of evidence in favor of your argument might help you convince someone more than repeating yourself a thousand times?

[Celestia]

I'm actually enjoying how this game looks so far (for the most part) and I don't believe for a second that hype is building to any significant degree at the moment. Like, I could believe that most fans are at least mildly interested in the game, but even if I'm not as down on it as most, the GHZ footage definitely seemed to kill anything resembling "hype." I expect trailers to fix that, tho' that's no guarantee either. "Hype" is bad anyway, but that's a whole other conversation.

And as for people outside the fanbase...I rarely see people talk about Sonic, positively or negatively. Maybe it's just the circles I'm in / pay attention to, I dunno.

[Zippo]

4 minutes ago, Kintor said:

Why go to all this effort? Are you planning to write another editorial on the front page calling out those unfortunate souls for the amusement of the forum?

So basically, you have absolutely no evidence of any kind to back up your claims? 

Okay, cool, gotcha. 

 

[Sonikko]

I've seen people say "Wasn't a 3D Sonic game coming out? What's this game then?" referring to the Green Hill footage. I wouldn't say there's much hype surrounding the game. Everything kinda fell apart when the GHZ footage came out, both inside the fanbase and outside of it.

It's not that we're nitpicky or can't be pleased, what we've been shown doesn't really look GOOD.

And while Sonic may have been a laughing stock a couple of years ago, now people just don't care, outside of some Mania hype, and that does not look good, especially for a Mascotte character. Mario Odissey had some mixed opinions when it was shown, but people are constantly talking about it and they know Nintendo will not screw up a Mario game, so they might be puzzled, but they know the're getting a quality game in the end.

Do we know that? It will be technically refined and a complete game, not like 2006 (as in not broken and technically unfinished), but a quality product? Who knows.