Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Tracker_TD]

Just now, Kintor said:

This isn't a contest between Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces and you're certainly not going to start a civil war in the Sonic fanbase today.

 

In the end both Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces are necessary to help restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise. The success of Sonic Mania will show that Sega respects the heritage of the franchise, proving that great 2D Sonic games stop with 16-bit hardware. While the success of Sonic Forces will be opportunity to confront past failures in the 3D platformers and redeem the Sonic franchise's status as a respectable AAA franchise. The problems of the past can't be ignored but with Sonic Forces there is a chance for the Sonic Franchise to at last move forward free of shame.

Pfft, my aim isn't to start a war.

I'm just pointing out the different in reception at large to Mania and Forces, as seen in the addition to my post above.

[JezMM]

Dude I LOVE the look of Sonic Forces, it's exactly what I wanted, but even I think you're putting too much faith into 40 seconds of footage here just because the graphics have AAA production values.

[Kintor]

9 minutes ago, Tracker_TD said:

Pfft, my aim isn't to start a war.

I'm just pointing out the different in reception at large to Mania and Forces, as seen in the addition to my post above.

You certainly sound like you'd relish a fight between classic and modern fans. Which would be counter-productive to say the least. I mean, I know that the Sonic fanbase has a reputation for being hyper-aggressive but really now we work so much better when we're fighting other people and not each other.

Both Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces are fighting to restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise. Of the two I say that Sonic Forces has the harder job, since it has to directly undo the damage wrought by Lost World and Sonic Boom. Still, 40 seconds of Sonic Forces gameplay have done much to repair some of the superficial damage. It will take longer to change those deep-seated prejudices but now at least the work has begun.

[Tracker_TD]

Just now, Kintor said:

You certainly sound like you'd relish a fight between classic and modern fans. Which would be counter-productive to say the least. I mean, I know that the Sonic fanbase has a reputation for being hyper-aggressive but really now we work so much better when we're fighting other people and not each other.

 

Both Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces are fighting to restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise. Of the two I say that Sonic Forces has the hard job, since it has to directly undo the damage wrought by Lost World and Sonic Boom. Still, 40 seconds of Sonic Forces gameplay have done much to repair some of the superficial damage. It will take longer to change those deep-seated prejudices but now at least the work has begun.

I like Modern Sonic tho

Adventure 1's my second favourite Sonic game innit

If Forces looks a bit naff right now, and it kinda does beyond the graphics, and people are picking up on that (contrary to what you're saying), then I can point that out without it being "to start a war." C'mon, get a grip. 

[Kintor]

4 minutes ago, Tracker_TD said:

I like Modern Sonic tho

Adventure 1's my second favourite Sonic game innit

If Forces looks a bit naff right now, and it kinda does beyond the graphics, and people are picking up on that (contrary to what you're saying), then I can point that out without it being "to start a war." C'mon, get a grip. 

But here just a minute ago you were all about bragging how Sonic Mania was going to beat the shit out of Sonic Forces and humiliate Sonic Team in the process. That's hardly what I'd call an overture of friendship. Because the only that stinks around here is a mentality to play Sonic Mania against Sonic Forces, when in reality both are proud Sonic games that seek to overcome past failures and restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise.

[Ellipsis-Ultima]

Right, the synopsis states that Sonic has failed and Eggman actually won and now it's a battle between the forces of good and then the forces of evil, theme mainly focuses on forces and power.

So yeah other characters will be there (but as cameos) but what if the other villains also make a comeback, such as the Deadly six? Or it's most likely a new set of evil robots ( Death Egg Sentinels included) and prolly Metal Sonic as one of the bosses...

Also, seeing the other characters beat some robots and assist the player while playing as Sonic sounds like a neat concept!

[BlueFlare]

4 hours ago, Drunk Michael Myers said:

My bet on the third playable character: Metal Sonic

I would be down for that or just be something new. Boom Sonic would kill it for me.

[Tracker_TD]

4 minutes ago, Kintor said:

But here just a minute ago you were all about bragging how Sonic Mania was going to beat the shit out of Sonic Forces and humiliate Sonic Team in the process. That's hardly what I'd call an overture of friendship. Because the only that stinks around here is a mentality to play Sonic Mania against Sonic Forces, when in reality both are proud Sonic games that seek to overcome past failures and restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise.

What I said is if Sonic Mania is better than Forces, then it will embarrass Sonic Team. C'mon. Read. 

[JezMM]

17 minutes ago, Kintor said:

But here just a minute you were all about bragging how Sonic Mania was going to beat the shit out of Sonic Forces and humiliate Sonic Team in the process. That's hardly what I'd call an overture of friendship. Because the only that stinks here is a mentality to play Sonic Mania against Sonic Forces, when both in reality both are proud Sonic games that seek to overcome past failures and restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise.

Sometimes the truth ain't friendly.  No-one in the fanbase WANTS that to happen, but considering the majority of critics just plum prefer classic Sonic gameplay, aesthetics and characterisation/story-focus etc to Modern Sonic, it may very well be what happens in the grand scope of things.  I hope Forces breaks that trend too, but Generations didn't and Forces currently looks to be more of the same, as much as that pleases me personally.  Mania will likely review better and a bunch of people will talk about how a small team of fans can make a better game than a full AAA development team (which I mean is often true anyway with less comparable games but yeah).

 

EDIT: Omg are you actually so bitter about our past... two... two arguments (one of which wasn't even an argument, you just insisted that it was, kinda like you're doing with Tracker now actually) that you're actively ignoring me now?  Geez lol.

[Kintor]

5 minutes ago, Tracker_TD said:

What I said is if Sonic Mania is better than Forces, then it will embarrass Sonic Team. C'mon. Read. 

You specifically used the phrase: "if Mania kicks the everloving shit out of Forces..."; There's such a thing as having a friendly rivalry between upcoming Sonic games and there's being needlessly mean spirited towards something else the moment Sonic Mania stops being the most popular topic of conversations. I like both Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces, there shouldn't be any internal conflict. Mercifully few Sonic fans are adopting such a self-destructive 'us vs them' mentality between Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces.

[JosepHenry]

6 minutes ago, Fusion Force said:

Right, the synopsis states that Sonic has failed and Eggman actually won and now it's a battle between the forces of good and then the forces of evil, theme mainly focuses on forces and power.

So yeah other characters will be there (but as cameos) but what if the other villains also make a comeback, such as the Deadly six? Or it's most likely a new set of evil robots ( Death Egg Sentinels included) and prolly Metal Sonic as one of the bosses...

Also, seeing the other characters beat some robots and assist the player while playing as Sonic sounds like a neat concept!

If the Deadly Six are even MENTIONED in this game my hype will go to an abyss

But I wouldn't mind Metal Sonic and other robots returning, like Gamma clones.

[Bowbowis]

Saying that Eggman wouldn't kill anybody, or that he wouldn't do it deliberately is wrong. Factually wrong. We're talking about the guy who tried to nuke Station Square, the guy who blew Prison Island sky high, the guy who was about to fire the Eclipse Cannon, and the guy who trapped Sonic in a capsule full of explosives and launched him into space with no known means of escape. Even if you choose to believe that nobody died as a result of his actions on Prison Island that's still four instances in which Eggman was indisputably taking actions which would result in death had it not been for factors outside of his control and/or expectation. Whether he's actually killed anyone or not is irrelevant, it's intent to kill that matters.

Eggman may be childish but beneath that he's still a brilliant, ruthless, power hungry, bastard. If someone like Sonic gets in his way it makes sense for him to try and eliminate the threat and while he may need people on the planet to worship him he doesn't need all the people. If it's a matter of destroying a strategic target like Prison Island, razing a city for resources, or flat out wiping a nation of the map to cow the rest into submission Eggman would do it in a heartbeat. The good doctor may not enjoy killing, he may not go out of his way to do it, but if it furthers his goals he woldn't even bat an eye. That's my take on it at any rate.

Side note: Outside of Shadow Sonic games never really adress casualties one one way or the other (the whole "Perfect Chaos didn't kill anyone" thing was an invention of Sonic X) so the death toll is typically left to the player's imagination but far from a confirmed zero.

[Tracker_TD]

2 minutes ago, Kintor said:

You specifically used the phrase: "if Mania kicks the everloving shit out of Forces..."; There's such a thing as having a friendly rivalry between upcoming Sonic games and there's being needlessly mean spirited towards something else the moment Sonic Mania stops being the most popular topic of conversations. I like both Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces, there shouldn't be any internal conflict. Mercifully few Sonic fans are adopting such a self-destructive 'us vs them' mentality between Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces.

Yeah, but I said if. Just because I chose some flavourful language doesn't change my point.

If Mania is better than Forces in the "being good" department, nobody's going to care it's "a downloadable 2D game"; because most critics have been asking for a proper return to 2D Sonic since the 3D games went to shit . There, less war-waging now? Blimey.

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, Tracker_TD said:

Yeah, but I said if. Just because I chose some flavourful language doesn't change my point.

If Mania is better than Forces in the "being good" department, nobody's going to care it's "a downloadable 2D game"; because most critics have been asking for a proper return to 2D Sonic since the 3D games went to shit . There, less war-waging now? Blimey.

Lets just admit it.

Mania will shut down Sonic Team of Japan.

We can all live happily ever after with the new Sonic Team of America.

Good day. lol

[Ajavalo]

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

[Blue Blood]

Good fucking God... Now I remember why I stopped posting here.

Let's summarise, shall we?

• Forces has some good points.
• Forces has some not so good points.
• Everybody wants Forces to be a good game. 
• Everybody wants Mania to be a good game, too.
• We haven't seen much of Forces yet.
• What we have seen so far it looks similar Generations. 
• Forces has another aspect that we don't yet know about.

That's it. Bloody hell...

[Kintor]

1 minute ago, Tracker_TD said:

Yeah, but I said if. Just because I chose some flavourful language doesn't change my point.

If Mania is better than Forces in the "being good" department, nobody's going to care it's "a downloadable 2D game"; because most critics have been asking for a proper return to 2D Sonic since the 3D games went to shit . There, less war-waging now? Blimey.

My point is that by design Sonic Mania can't single handily restore the reputation of the Sonic franchise, no matter how good it actually is on release. The only way to overcome the problems of the Sonic franchise is by confronting those failure, meaning that Sonic Team needs to make a new 3D platformer and a damn good one at that. Fortunately, Sonic Team is doing just that; the tried and true gameplay of Sonic Generations is a solid foundation to work with and still represents the best chance of bringing long-term stability to the Sonic franchise as a whole.

[JosepHenry]

5 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

Maybe is part of the HUD?

[Diogenes]

2 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

Nah, it's terrible. With no lock-on icon you're just guessing what, if anything, you're going to attack when you press the button.

[Blue Blood]

3 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

 

I'd love an option to disable the reticules. Some people like them though, and I don't exactly hate it being there. They were probably absent from the footage because it's either an early build or they were intentionally disabled (like the HUD).

[BlueFlare]

6 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

Yup, did notice it and I'm very happy the way it is now, without the lock-on reticules.

Edit: better make it optional, though, just to make everyone happy.

[Ayliffe]

2 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

Something about the gameplay that almost nobody seems to have noticed: there are no Homing Attack reticules!

Assuming this will remain in the final game, do you thing the Homing Attack is better without the blatant lock-ons on targets?

Personally I'd prefer the homing attack reticule to be an optional thing you can toggle on/off in the game's settings - there for people who want that extra help when targeting but removable for people who don't like it.

[Chris Knopps]

I'm for a toggle icon for homing attacking, personally I'm sick of them, makes Sonic too much like a shooter when it's already too much like an auto-play coaster.

[JezMM]

Yeah I dig the lack of reticules, it's more... involving somehow.  But allowing them as an option is fine too.

Sonic Generations definitely had the best options menu in a long time for this sort of thing.  Hopefully this game follows suit with even a little more on top.

 

 

The only issue is whether they do any moments like the homing attack focused DLC stages in Sonic Unleashed where aiming to a particular target was important - I kind of loved that gameplay since it wasn't just pushing A over and over without really thinking about it, and I'd like to see that return.  Perhaps a middle ground could be found - no sound effect but targets glow with a subtle highlight when they're your current aim.

[Diogenes]

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

I'm for a toggle icon for homing attacking, personally I'm sick of them, makes Sonic too much like a shooter

What does this even mean?