Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric (Wii U)

[Willsy]

Do we know how big the hub is meant to be yet? I'm just wondering if there might be some redeeming factors in the hub world or something. I won't hold my breath but I'm keeping tabs on this to see that at least.

[The Deleter]

Seems like we have hit the what are we talking about phase atleast twice in this topic now. Anyway, just wanted to mention a while ago someone said that the game running like crap was the only completely objective complaint. I would say you need to add graphics to that list. Low quality textures and lighting are as much of an objective flaw as a low framerate and glitches.

We don't really know how well the Graphics are meant to be right now, as there was some technical confusion about it a while back, but yes, those would be objective flaws.

 

Do we know how big the hub is meant to be yet? I'm just wondering if there might be some redeeming factors in the hub world or something. I won't hold my breath but I'm keeping tabs on this to see that at least.

Seeing as how the gameplay footage in the trailers shows all four characters in the same area several times, and since the only time all four will be together will be in the hubs, I'd say the hub at least spans over three level tropes.

[Enesephus]

Do we know how big the hub is meant to be yet? I'm just wondering if there might be some redeeming factors in the hub world or something. I won't hold my breath but I'm keeping tabs on this to see that at least.

I don't think so, but that old hub footage from the Cry Engine 3 trailer made it look pretty big to me. I believe the hub is meant to be the village the show primarily takes place in, so I would think it'd be pretty nicely sized and full of stuff to do. I'm sure we'll at least have people to talk to.

[TheLaw34]

 

What I do have a problem with is them stating these hugely subjective statements all over the forum, as if they're fact, should be applied as a collective conscious, and (possibly unintentionally) talking down to the developers as if they are failing hard at what they're trying to accomplish, and should end up catering to them instead. Not only is this forcing an opinion down someone's throat, ("You can't just ignore these flaws!", "Incompetence isn't a flaw anymore?", and "Sonic Boom is HORRIBLE game, everyone in asia hates it" comes to mind) it's degrading the moral of the forum, and possibly BRB itself, especially if more members than Steven Frost visit here. That's why I want to make a distinction between objective and personal flaws, as constructive criticism is far more helpful and worthwhile than a false perception on what is genuinely good and bad for a game.

 

All that really matters is peoples opinions on it. Not every statement has to be prefaced with "in my opinion" or "I think". If someone thinks somethings bad they are gonna say "it is bad" that's just the way things work, we cant all be afraid to say what we think.

Also I think alot of what you have been doing is saying that sonic boom achieves the goal of fitting into the action adventure genre(which it technically does). The problem is that others think that is is a bad game in that action adventure genre. It has boring action, it looks like a bland adventure and its combat is a huge downgrade from other fighting games. If you want to say all that matters is that they managed to make a functioning game the fits in that genre then fine, you're right, they did. But the thing is that's all they did.

[- Eternal Paradox -]

When and where do you think it's more likely possible for SEGA to leak new information about Sonic Boom?

 

I think given SEGA's track record, we should perhaps be watching the internet very carefully.

 

The Sega press vault would be a good place to start. I think they tend to have spaces and release dates for information before it arrives. Hogfather's the only one I know of who can get in at the moment.

 

It's possible a member of staff might say something they shouldn't in an interview or online (facebook, twitter), but with so many people in a company it's hard to keep tabs. There's also the possibility that it might be in a developer snapshot or footage, such as the Sticks or Metal Sonic info.

 

When I have no idea, it's hard to gauge this sort of thing. The game apparently launches in November, there'll probably be a few summer updates so I'd expect any leaks to be around the time of those - but then the rest is up to SEGA.

[LongcrierCat]

Let's get this out of the way. 

 

At worst, Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric is an average game. An average game fills the criteria, but may not have anything special of note in the way of difficulty or design that will lure people into the experience. 

 

Some people will like it, some people won't. This certainly isn't that grand Sonic game some of us dreamed about, and unfortunately we will have to keep thinking on that until another developer (or fan developers, hint hint) come around and make that thing that we want so badly. I think it should be fair for some people to find this game perfectly fine fluff to play through while some have more refined palettes. Of course, this shouldn't be an excuse for the developer to use their demographic, i.e. kids, as an excuse to churn out a shite product. 

 

But what constitutes a shite product? For starters, if it doesn't work. If it's glitchy and unplayable and overall broken, then there's no excuse. You have a genuine turd. If it works mostly with very few bugs? Then it's average unless you've managed to do the unthinkable. You made a bland game. 

 

Now this is getting into the real meat of what could make or break a game like this. It's important when you're working to your genre, instead of creating without a genre in mind, to keep its elements intact. This isn't to say there isn't a poor way of doing it or that it will feel weird when you have a pre-established franchise in place that you're using for your vehicle to make said game. Did the games play differently before this? Were they beloved by an audience? Then there will be preconceived notions on how this should play. 

 

This game is a beat-em-up action adventure platformer. Can you jump? Can you move across terrain? Can you move? Can you fight? Will enemies react to the fighting? Will they engage you by attacking back? This is all answered in the footage. And from what I see this succeeds that. Now does it do it well? At the least it works. But just because something works doesn't mean it will be good necessarily to someone else. Does this game exude Sonic? Is it fast? Speed stages exist, albeit are fairly average, cream of the Temple Run crop. So you can't say there isn't something speedy there. But is it done well? It's the execution, but even that is an objective quantifier that some people savvy to code and game mechanics can be harshly (but not undeservedly) critical of. 

 

Some people have different factoring expectations. I like DMC 3, someone else likes DmC, for example. I can call them out for liking a game that scores on you easier than the harder game. There's different standards. Some people will be fine with a game that's average or above and some people will only take the best that the genre of choice can offer. I like the new Raymans, you can like the new Sonics. We can like both, even, even if it's for different reasons entirely. 

 

For some people, the effect of So Average is Mediocre comes into play in videogames so often, because of these standards. 

 

I've been in the boat that most of the last 16 years of the franchise have not been up to par and that games I even found enjoyable have aged badly and more recent games that were supposed to be my cup of tea failed other expectations of mine in terms of coding, physics, and general game sense. I've even outright called those games what I feel they are, but that doesn't stop them from being what they are. Objective things that many people will have a different view on entirely from my own. I can go ahead and say it's shit all I want from Sonic Adventure to  Sonic Colours, but someone will have their own argument directed from their own experiences as a videogamer and their specific tastes.

 

This doesn't make me or you wrong or right. This just means we're on different sides of the scale here. This is us being objective. We can have our opinions but the fact is that this is an object. We'll have our opinions on the object. But if it's at least stable it's a solid object at the very least, regardless of what we feel the quality to be. 

 

So far, this game seems alright. Not really that "Sanicky" game that I or you guys want. But it's a game. It's not really that good, but it's not really that bad either. But the expectations from this franchise's history will have an effect on how you feel about it. 

[TheLaw34]

Ahem. Established that everyone has a different taste, I have a question.

 

When and where do you think it's more likely possible for SEGA to leak new information about Sonic Boom?

I think they said something about having more info on the next episode of sonic center.... Whenever that is.

[Detective Shadzter]

Another site unimpressed by Rise of Lyric:
http://nintendo.about.com/od/Wii_U_Previews/fl/Sonic-Boom-Rise-of-Lyric-ndash-Hands-On-Wii-U-Preview.htm
 
Is this tidbit new?

The developers seem anxious that their young target audience not get too frustrated; if you’re struggling during a boss battle the game will lower its difficult during the battle then reset it to where it was at the end.

[Sami]

Do we really have to have these thorough semantic discussions about the meaning of opinions and facts every fucking time quality is brought up? 

 

I'm aware that different people may think different things. I passed the 1st Grade too.

[The Deleter]

All that really matters is peoples opinions on it. Not every statement has to be prefaced with "in my opinion" or "I think". If someone thinks somethings bad they are gonna say "it is bad" that's just the way things work, we cant all be afraid to say what we think.

Also I think alot of what you have been doing is saying that sonic boom achieves the goal of fitting into the action adventure genre(which it technically does). The problem is that others think that is is a bad game in that action adventure genre. It has boring action, it looks like a bland adventure and its combat is a huge downgrade from other fighting games. If you want to say all that matters is that they managed to make a functioning game the fits in that genre then fine, you're right, they did. But the thing is that's all they did.

You're right, people don't have to say "in my opinion" or "I think" right after every sentence. That's pointless, as it's generally your opinion anyway.

 

I'm talking about when they call it "Bad". Bad is inherent with the game itself, not the opinion of the viewer. It's defining how well a game did at what it was trying to accomplish. Therefore, in order for the statement to hold any ground, it has to be objective and factual.

 

If you want to make nonfactual assumptions on what is bad or not, knock yourself out. But for me, and possibly a few others, this is a trigger word that says "This is objective and factual and should totally be the general mindset!", which doesn't help when people vehemently defend such an accusation. Bland, boring, and uninteresting are all comments I don't really have a problem with, but if wrapped up and put in a "bad" argument, then that comes across as condescending to me, and is totally worth rebutting.

 

Choose your words carefully, or else others will take offense by it.

 

 

Also, everything LongcrierCat said.

[Balding Spider]

Another site unimpressed by Rise of Lyric:

http://nintendo.about.com/od/Wii_U_Previews/fl/Sonic-Boom-Rise-of-Lyric-ndash-Hands-On-Wii-U-Preview.htm

 

Is this tidbit new?

News to me.

[BonkersTheAutomaton]

While I haven't payed much attention to this thread at all (or anything Pre E3 in a long time).  I can still happily say that I am still excited for Sonic Boom.  Rise of Lyric, Shattered Crystal and the TV series look to be amazing game in my eyes.  I know that Critics are going to say that it is bad (especially after everything we have been seeing recently with nearly every person out their beside major Sonic fans), but I am still going to buy this game regardless of what the critics say.  Not because I'm a sonic fan, but because I like the look of this game.  don;t get me wrong, being a sonic fans those help but I can't help but feel hyped about this game.

[Nepenthe]

Uh, yes they were. Look a few pages back.

 

I realize that many people have personal gripes with the game, and I'm not trying to change their minds on that front exactly. They can either be interested in the game or not, that's their business.

 

What I do have a problem with is them stating these hugely subjective statements all over the forum, as if they're fact, should be applied as a collective conscious, and (possibly unintentionally) talking down to the developers as if they are failing hard at what they're trying to accomplish, and should end up catering to them instead. Not only is this forcing an opinion down someone's throat, ("You can't just ignore these flaws!", "Incompetence isn't a flaw anymore?", and "Sonic Boom is HORRIBLE game, everyone in asia hates it" comes to mind) it's degrading the moral of the forum, and possibly BRB itself, especially if more members than Steven Frost visit here. That's why I want to make a distinction between objective and personal flaws, as constructive criticism is far more helpful and worthwhile than a false perception on what is genuinely good and bad for a game.

 

The only statement you've cited as being problematic is when people tell others "you may like it but you can't defend the flaws," because this statement relies on the assumption that people who like the game on its own merits are being willfully ignorant or delusional about them instead of merely holding an opposing point of view. I've already addressed why that's shitty in an earlier post.

 

But to bash the game without tacking on an "in my opinion..." or "I think this looks like..." is not passing an opinion off as fact. It is merely stating an opinion. Any thought that is inherently competent and subjective in nature is an opinion, and it doesn't actually matter how bluntly or angrily it is stated. If I say "Sonic CD is a clusterfuck," I should not be obligated to further substantiate that statement anymore than a person who says "Sonic CD is an awesome game" should be obligated to substantiate theirs. Negativity does not suddenly invite the burden of proof.

 

Both sides need to back down from slinging around demands to adhere to goalposts that are so far removed from rational discourse as to be out of the stadium altogether. Take a deep breath and realize that people are either going to like this game or they're not, and that- if you disagree with someone- you have literally found the fundamental disagreement that cannot be further challenged or broken down in any meaningful manner, and you must simply agree to disagree and move on. Truly if someone simply likes the look of the combat, they can't get much deeper into the "why" without relying on subjective descriptors versus actual logical syllogisms backed by objective evidence. Likewise if someone hates it. This will only actually change once we get our hands on the game. So on this front, everyone needs to chill.

 

Furthermore, even if I agreed with you that rampant negativity is the inherent problem with the very moral fiber of the forum (and you know, not simply people being way too personally offended at opposing thought, people being snarky, condescending, and assholish, and overall refusing to take others in good faith), the big point you're missing is that you are not actually authoritatively obligated to tackle the issue on your own, especially by arguing illogically and in circles, and especially without staff input. That's why we're here- to uphold the rules and the spirit of the forum as best we can. If you really want to fix the issue, you would do better by setting an example and posting in the way you want to see people posting in response to others and to the information about the game, ignoring the negative opinions if they really bother you that much (just block people if you have to), and reporting the things that needs to be reported, instead of obligating yourself to help fix anything. While I understand your frustration, it must be said- in all of the conversing you have done in an effort to dismiss or argue down people's negative points of view, you have actually aggravated the problem, not alleviated it.

 

This goes for everyone, because this isn't actually the first time I've had to say something about this. People not liking a game are not the problem. People stating negative opinions are not a problem. Bluntly stating a negative opinion is not anymore stating "an opinion as fact" than bluntly stating a positive opinion is. Do not dump the problems you perceive on the forum on those who are doing nothing wrong. That is unfair to them.

 

Likewise, if you are telling someone that they should not defend flaws that are entirely subjective in nature, you too are performing a similar grievance. If someone likes this game as it has been designed, then they simply like it, and it is also unfair to put upon them the impossible task of somehow objectively substantiating this feeling. If you dislike Sonic Boom because it looks like shit, people can like it because it looks like good fun. This is how opinions work.

 

I'm going to be more stringent in warning and striking people about this kind of behavior, because the topic has long since devolved into shit and shows no signs of getting better on its own, especially when more trailers and screens drop. Back off. Calm down. Discuss the game in good faith. Do not take everything personally. Do not make this personal.

[jords]

I just realize that the characters eyes look better from the reveal trailer. From that they had huge black eyes and now they look normal, which is good. Its like they were stoned XD

So nice work on that part.

So does any one have any idea what the controls are like? I'd assume A is jump and the rest are combat related attacks or enerbeam.

[omote23]

All right you won Sonic Boom is an unfixable shitty game I already want my refound blaaargh I'm so angry and negative right now are you happy!?!?!?!

God fucking dammit! Why can't I be POSITIVE?!?!?!?!?

Anwser. Yes.

Now I'm happy because one person finally know Sonic Boom will be flopped

Sent from my SHW-M250S using Tapatalk 2

[TearForFear]

Anwser. Yes.

Now I'm happy because one person finally know Sonic Boom will be flopped

Sent from my SHW-M250S using Tapatalk 2

 

I was sarcastic.

[ImPantsAtThis]

Anwser. Yes.

Now I'm happy because one person finally know Sonic Boom will be flopped

Sent from my SHW-M250S using Tapatalk 2

 

Why do you take such delight in negativity towards Boom? Is it a 'yes, I was right' thing, or do you really think Boom's development will legitimately hurt SEGA's finances? I just don't see why someone on a Sonic fansite is happy a Sonic game is being poorly-received pre-release.

[TCB]

I haven't posted in this topic in a WHIIIIIIIIIIIIILE.

 

Right now, my interest in this game is mild. That's not to say there are things I like from what is shown so far. I mean, the combat looks to be something I can enjoy, however it does looks a bit shallow in some areas. Hoping for more in-depth combat system ala Unleashed's Werehog. 

 

Platforming looks to be alright, don't really have much to say about that yet. 

 

The atmosphere is one the higher points about the game for me. To me, it feels it oozes more atmosphere than the last few Sonic games. At the same time, admittingly it's a whole different 'sense' of atmosphere, if you understand what I mean when comparing it (if you can compare that is) with the main series games since...Unleashed/Colors?

 

Other than that...it really doesn't scream out to me. I just think while I'm a sucker for action-adventure games like this, something is just...off. I can't put my finger on it, but it's just nagging feeling I have about the game that's not a priority of mine to get 'Day 1' at all. Can anyone help me with what that is?

 

That, and I will need to get a Wii U first. And even then, there are other games I hope to get before this. 

 

So that's pretty much how I feel about this version I guess? After reading pages upon pages of this thread and seeing things cool down somewhat I felt it was comfortable to jump in with my quick thoughts on Rise of Lyric.

[Nepenthe]

Anwser. Yes.

Now I'm happy because one person finally know Sonic Boom will be flopped

Sent from my SHW-M250S using Tapatalk 2

 

I'm giving you a strike for four reasons:

 

1.) The post you were responding to was already handled by a staff member, so there was absolutely no need to bring it up again.

 

2.) Your response goes against the spirit of everything I just outlined in my last post, in particular about not making things personal, so that's effectively two staff members you have stepped over without regard for what they have said.

 

3.) This post is not actually contributing anything towards any discussion whatsoever. It is yet again a reiteration of an opinion you have expressed plainly plenty of times before. Disliking Sonic Boom is fine but actual spamming is not- something that earned previous members a permanent ban when they insisted on just flooding the forum with nonsensical negativity and instigating shit about Sonic Lost World.

 

4.) Being genuinely happy at someone's distress and annoyance just kind of a shitty thing to express in general.

Seriously, if you actually care about being a member of SSMB for a long while, then knock it off when you come back.

[The Deleter]

So does any one have any idea what the controls are like? I'd assume A is jump and the rest are combat related attacks or enerbeam.

From what I can tell, the X button is used for ground pounding, the Y button is used for spindashing, the A button is for jumping and home attacking, and the B button for general melee kicks. The different combos I presume come from the combination of these attacks.

[TheLaw34]

From what I can tell, the X button is used for ground pounding, the Y button is used for spindashing, the A button is for jumping and home attacking, and the B button for general melee kicks. The different combos I presume come from the combination of these attacks.

I think the Y button may be used for both spin dashing and homing attack cant really give a source but it would make sense since it works exactly the same as the spin dash but in the air.

[Willsy]

If that's true, I really don't like that control setup. I'd much prefer B to be jump and A to be spin dash, it would be strange and awkward to have the jump mapped to A.

[Enesephus]

I'd rather A be Jump. I have no idea why, since I've been a PlayStation gamer all my life and only got my Wii U in late January, but pressing A to jump feels more natural to me than B to Jump on my gamepad.

 

Anyone think you'll be able to map the controls to different buttons in the final game? That'd probably be a good idea.

[jords]

OK now looking at the gamepad I'd rather the jump would be better off as B I thought A was at the bottom.

[The Deleter]

I think the Y button may be used for both spin dashing and homing attack cant really give a source but it would make sense since it works exactly the same as the spin dash but in the air.

I hope it is. I generally like my HA and double/triple jump as far apart from one another as possible, so that I have more options with how I play.

 

As for A or B, I'd much rather have it be assigned to A. I don't know why, but that's usually the way I like it on the gamepad. Hopefully it will allow alternate control schemes like the old R&C games did, though, so that everyone's happy.