General Nintendo sales/business discussion topic (previously: The Wii U Thread)

[Chooch]

Nintendo turning into the competition is good for the industry? Sorry, but this industry is a fucking mess. Nintendo isn't doing it exactly right either, but the last thing we need is for them to do exactly what most publishers are doing these days, it's killing the industry bit by bit.

I want less of "Nintendo needs to make another HD  Vanilla Gaming Box" mindset. Yes, they should up their hardware, but I'd rather see them fail then have them turn into another box like the PS4 and Xbox One, where it's essentially a hardware upgrade from the previous generation. I don't want them to completely fall in line because that partially takes away what Nintendo is, thinking outside the box (pun intended).

Yes Nintendo needs to pull their heads out of their asses, but not try to turn into another carbon copy of the other two systems.

Since when did learning from your mistakes and making competent decisions become something that compromises your integrity and sense of identity? Are you fucking serious?

 

This shit just reeks of pedantic fanboy nonsense. I can not believe what I am reading.

[The Kid]

Since when did learning from your mistakes and making competent decisions become something that compromises your integrity and sense of identity? Are you fucking serious?

 

This shit just reeks of pedantic fanboy nonsense. I can not believe what I am reading.

 

It's like you didn't even read my post. 

 

There is a difference between upping your hardware, fixing online, making a system easier to develop for, and all around becoming a similiar HD Box to the other 2 of the "Big Three."

Edited August 1, 2013 by The Kid

[Chooch]

I read it. Multiple times actually.

 

I am still utterly baffled.

[RisingForever]

The Gamepad being a gimmick? Too early to tell. All I can say is when it comes to the Gamepad, it unfortunately suffers from being a terrible concept to sell to the consumer, but it is a great one. It's true when people say you have to play with it for a while to get it, and that's the Wii U's biggest flaw. I have yet to see a marketing strategy that truly captures what the Wii U is all about, and some of it is from lack of trying, and others, it's just poor communication.

 

 

 I really think they should have gone back to those "Wii want to play" videos for the launch of the Wii U, but instead it would be "Wii want U to play." At that point they would specifically show the actual console being turned on to show its not an add-on, and then they would show off the unique uses of the gamepad in Nintendoland, NSMBU, and even ZombiU. The original ad campaign really was effective at showing what the Wii was and why it was different and would have been perfect for the Wii U.

Edited August 1, 2013 by RisingForever

[KrazyBean]

 I really think they should have gone back to those "Wii want to play" videos for the launch of the Wii U, but instead it would be "Wii want U to play." At that point they would specifically show the actual console being turned on to show its not an add-on, and then they would show off the unique uses of the gamepad in Nintendoland, NSMBU, and even ZombiU. The original ad campaign really was effective at showing what the Wii was and why it was different and would have been perfect for the Wii U.

 

Too bad that "Wii U" and "advertising" don't mix...

[Jacky]

No one's fucking saying to literally be a clone of Sony and Microsoft.


No one's saying that by wanting to have "AAA hard-hitting, inspired and memorable games" literally pump millions of dollars into a generic dudebro shooter, it's pretty obvious Nintendo's would be wayyyy better than that.



Also please don't even start with "the industry needs to crash" because that's a goddamn retarded idea and it would make the situation much more dire

Edited August 1, 2013 by Black Mamba

[Red Cap]

Dissident, I have to ask you a question: Why do you think Nintendo's games aren't memorable anymore? Because seriously, the only ones that I see people saying aren't memorable are M:OM, NSMB2 and PM:SS. Besides those three, almost every game that Nintendo's made in recent years has been amazingly received. From stuff like SMG2, DKCR, Pushmo and KI:U, to games that came out this year like LM:DM, FE:A and AC:NL.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Red Cap-Blue Spikes

[Milo]

Good news... Target are running a promotion.

 

 

When you see it...

 

Confusion? What confusion?

 

Ha ha, holy shit.

 

If the Wii U ever sees a re-launch, it needs more than a marketing overhaul and a (dramatic) price cut. I'd outright advise Nintendo to go as far as to give it a design overhaul and a new name. Call it the Nintendo Jackalope and have it shaped like a toaster, it'd probably be an improvement over it's current name and form.

[TrueBlue]

At the risk of entering into a discussion with slightly heightened tempers, I don't think anyone here is particularly wrong with their assessments of Nintendo. In the end, the big N need to strike a balance, which they simply haven't been doing for the last few years.

[Chili Dawg]

 I really think they should have gone back to those "Wii want to play" videos for the launch of the Wii U, but instead it would be "Wii want U to play." 

No.

 

Wii Would Like to Play

 

With U.

 

 

[Chooch]

There is a difference between upping your hardware, fixing online, making a system easier to develop for, and all around becoming a similiar HD Box to the other 2 of the "Big Three."

Those are just some of countless examples of things that can be done that could improve Nintendo's situation. Where do you get off implying that these "HD Boxes" (What a fucking riot) that you loathe so much, despite their similarities, do not have a distinct sense of identity? What did Microsoft or Sony do that has made you so laughably jaded towards their practices?

 

You are completely missing the fucking point. Not once have I suggested that Nintendo remove themselves from everything that makes them, well.. Nintendo. Nintendo is Nintendo because of independent properties like Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Star Fox, F-Zero, and Pikmin. Nintendo is Nintendo because of people like Shigeru Miyamoto and Masahiro Sakurai.

 

Better hardware specs and adherence to policies and such that actually work and make sense do not suddenly compromise Nintendo's image as a console manufacturer and game publisher / developer. If you'd rather them fail than not do what they need to in order to stay afloat, then I don't really know what to say to you.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Chooch

[SenEDDtor Missile]

They wanted to have third-parties not be shadowed by Nintendo's first-party games like the 3DS perhaps.

Um, completely off-topic, but why is it that every time I go into this topic, you always seem to have this exact post for the EXACT page that I somehow land on when I try to catch up on things? I'm getting serious deja vu everytime I come here that I think I've gone back in time or something.

[Milo]

No.

 

Wii Would Like to Play

 

With U.

 

 

 

 

You know what, fuck it. Rename the Wii U the "Reggie Entertainment Gamestation" (the "REG"). The REG will be available in black and white, and have two special editions-a Batman edition with Arkham City and Arkham Origins with a action figure of Reggie in a Batman suit; and a Non-Specific Action Figure edition that has a Non Specific action figure with Reggie's head and demos of Smash Bros. 4, Mario Kart 8, and Super Mario 3D World in it.

 

And I guarantee you that shit would start selling like hotcakes.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Yeow

[RisingForever]

Ha ha, holy shit.

 

If the Wii U ever sees a re-launch, it needs more than a marketing overhaul and a (dramatic) price cut. I'd outright advise Nintendo to go as far as to give it a design overhaul and a new name. Call it the Nintendo Jackalope and have it shaped like a toaster, it'd probably be an improvement over it's current name and form.

 

I agree, even with a name like Xbox One people aren't going to get confused because original Xbox isn't selling anymore, but Wii U doesn't sound like a new console and it doesn't help that there is stuff like the UDraw shovelware on the market. I like it when Nintendo consoles have unique designs and names that are easy to identify like the Gamecube or N64.

[The Kid]

Those are just some of countless examples of things that can be done that could improve Nintendo's situation. Where do you get off implying that these "HD Boxes" (What a fucking riot) that you loathe so much, despite their similarities, do not have a distinct sense of identity? What did Microsoft or Sony do that has made you so laughably jaded towards their practices?

 

You are completely missing the fucking point. Not once have I suggested that Nintendo remove themselves from everything that makes them, well.. Nintendo. Nintendo is Nintendo because of independent properties like Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Zelda, Star Fox, F-Zero, and Pikmin. Nintendo is Nintendo because of people like Shigeru Miyamoto and Masahiro Sakurai.

 

Better hardware specs and adherence to policies and such that actually work and make sense do not suddenly compromise Nintendo's image as a console manufacturer and game publisher. If you'd rather them fail than not do what they need to in order to stay afloat, then I don't really know what to say to you.

 

The XboxOne and PS4 are similar in how they present themselves. They both compete with each other and excluding extra features like Sony's Share feature and Microsoft's inclusion of Kinect, each system in the respective family is typically a hardware upgrade of the last. You jump from the Xbox to the XboxOne, or the PS2- PS4, and the system largely plays the same way.

 

Nintendo systems (for the last couple generations) have tried to redesign how you interact with the console in a much more drastic way. I feel that those "out of the box" moves are partially what makes Nintendo unique, besides just their IPs. 

 

My whole point is that while I advocate them making their hardware more comparable in terms of power and easier to develop for so that third parties have a better time with the system, I don't want them to get rid of this "out of the box" thinking. Nintendo simply making an HD console powerhouse with a simple controller and an online community similar to XBL and PSN would be taking away part of what makes them so special to me. They try to be different, they don't try to directly compete with everyone,it all has a certain charm to it.

 

And I am not jaded towards Sony or Microsoft. I buy all their consoles just like I do Nintendos, I love a lot of their IPs. But just because I like them both and each of their flaws and strengths, doesn't mean I can't comment on how similar the two systems seem. This was literally the thought I had when I was deciding to buy the 360 or PS3. I looked at all the games I wanted (mostly third party), and it really didn't matter which system I bought them on because the experience looked the fucking same from the outside. 

 

Nintendo needs to get their heads out of their asses, but not lose that "outside the box" thinking. That's my fucking point. I'm tired of this " make a PS4 system but just Mario HD on it"  and the "Nintendo should go third party" nonsense. 

Edited August 1, 2013 by The Kid

[Indigo Rush]

Would scrapping the Wii U and making a new Nintendo console even work? The feeling of having a fresh start seems tantalizing, but is it really financially feasible?

 

I seriously don't want Nintendo to pull a Dreamcast and absolutely fail despite having a line up of good games gone to waste, but is that even going to happen? 

 

I really want to see Nintendo make a come back.

[RK64]

The XboxOne and PS4 are similar in what they can do. They both compete with each other and exclusing extra features like Sony's Share feature and Microsoft's inclusion of Kinect, each system is typically a hardware upgrade of the last. You jump from the Xbox to the XboxOne, or the PS2- PS4, and the system largely plays the same way.

 

Nintendo systems (for the last couple generations) have tried to redesign how you interact with the console in a much more drastic way. I feel that those "out of the box" moves are partially what makes Nintendo unique, besides just their IPs. 

 

My whole point is that while I advocate them making their hardware more comparable in terms of power and easier to develop for so that third parties have a better time with the system, I don't want them to get rid of this "out of the box" thinking. Nintendo simply making an HD console with a simple controller and an online community similar to XBL and PSN would be taking away part of what makes them so special to me. They try to be different, they don't try to directly compete with everyone,it all has a certain charm to it.

 

And I am not jaded towards Sony or Microsoft. I buy all their consoles just like I do Nintendos, I love a lot of their IPs. But just because I like them both and each of their flaws and strengths, doesn't mean I can't comment on how similar the two systems seem. This was literally the thought I had when I was deciding to buy the 360 or PS3. I looked at all the games I wanted (mostly third party), and it really didn't matter which system I bought them on because the experience looked the fucking same from the outside. 

 

Nintendo needs to get their heads out of their asses, but not lose that "outside the box" thinking. That's my fucking point. I'm tired of this " make a PS4 system but just Mario HD on it"  and the "Nintendo should go third party" nonsense. 

 

The GameCube and N64 while each having there own unique functions (like the GC's pressure triggers or N64's analogue stick), they were basically traditional systems with standard controllers and similar horsepower compared to there competition, making multiplatform games a possibility outside of the small space the respected platforms had with their game formats (small carts and 1.5GB disks), not to mention groundbreaking games that defined games with the N64 like Ocarina of Time/Majora's Mask and really great games on the GC like Mario Sunshine and Wind Waker. I think Nintendo can have a traditional system that echo's the PS4/X1 but like those respective systems, there are great exclusives for each, and what system has better exclusives than Nintendo's

 

Would scrapping the Wii U and making a new Nintendo console even work? The feeling of having a fresh start seems tantalizing, but is it really financially feasible?

 

I seriously don't want Nintendo to pull a Dreamcast and absolutely fail despite having a line up of good games gone to waste, but is that even going to happen? 

 

I really want to see Nintendo make a come back.

 

While I think a potential back-up plain is in order for the Wii U (maybe a hybrid system or really steep price drop), Nintendo will be fine in the long run once the heavy hitters this fall to next year start coming and (hopefully) the Wii U will echo the Wii's second system role to the other platforms.  They wont pull a Dreamcast at all; Nintendo said themselves that they would rather flat out not make games anymore if there home consoles end, so don't expect the Wii U to lose Nintendo support anytime soon. 

 

If anything, the next Nintendo home console will just come out sooner (maybe 2015 rather than 2017) with Nintendo FINALLY getting out of there bubble and start being competitive again with Sony and Microsoft.

[Chaos Warp]

Oh for fucks sake, one thing I can say that just ditching the thing is not the solution. What needs to happen is a relaunch (complete with price drop) once the system's heavy hitters come out like Super Mario 3d World, Mario Kart 7, Wii Fit U, Bayonetta 2, X, etc ect the list goes on for awesome things (well Wii Fit isn't that awesome but hey it's a seller) coming to the console.

 

And you know what? If the thing does Gamecube numbers or lower, I don't give a flying fuck. Nintendo made a profit on the GameCube, and as long as there's lots of awesome Nintendo games on a Nintendo system, I'll be satisfied. And fuck it, the GC is one of my favorite systems for the many great Nintendo games on it! Nintendo systems since the N64 have always been best as companion systems, and I believe their first-party games are good enough to warrant buying a system.  Even if they do take losses on this thing, Nintendo will come out of it fine, they'd need like 20-30 massive failures to even come close to running out of money, and then they'll just attempt again next gen. So you know the fuck what? No matter how it turns out, as long as I have my games I won't give a fuck. All I ask of the Wii-U is great Nintendo games with some third-party here and there, so Nintendo can keep having their heads in their ass as much as they goddamn want as long as their heads are far enough out to make great games. I'll have my PS4 for everything else, just like I had my 360 for everything else this gen  .

[Chooch]

[E]xcluding extra features like Sony's Share feature and Microsoft's inclusion of Kinect, each system in the respective family is typically a hardware upgrade of the last. You jump from the Xbox to the XboxOne, or the PS2- PS4, and the system largely plays the same way.

I am not jaded towards Sony or Microsoft. I buy all their consoles just like I do Nintendos, I love a lot of their IPs. But just because I like them both and each of their flaws and strengths, doesn't mean I can't comment on how similar the two systems seem. This was literally the thought I had when I was deciding to buy the 360 or PS3. I looked at all the games I wanted (mostly third party), and it really didn't matter which system I bought them on because the experience looked the fucking same from the outside.

Once again I feel that you are making a huge generalization. There are more to these consoles than simple hardware upgrades. They have very distinct identities that resonate with different groups of people, much like Nintendo's consoles.

 

Nintendo systems (for the last couple generations) have tried to redesign how you interact with the console in a much more drastic way. I feel that those "out of the box" moves are partially what makes Nintendo unique, besides just their IPs.

 

My whole point is that while I advocate them making their hardware more comparable in terms of power and easier to develop for so that third parties have a better time with the system, I don't want them to get rid of this "out of the box" thinking. Nintendo simply making an HD console powerhouse with a simple controller and an online community similar to XBL and PSN would be taking away part of what makes them so special to me. They try to be different, they don't try to directly compete with everyone,it all has a certain charm to it.

Nintendo needs to get their heads out of their asses, but not lose that "outside the box" thinking. That's my fucking point. I'm tired of this " make a PS4 system but just Mario HD on it"  and the "Nintendo should go third party" nonsense.

Nintendo can continue to have their charming "out of the box" thinking while still following some industry trends and adhering to universally accepted policies that appeal to the broad spectrum of gamers. I'm also not sure why you put so much weight on recycled ideas (Yes, recycled) like motion control and second screens when it comes to "out of the box" thinking. That doesn't scream innovation to me, honestly.

 

I think it's far more important for the software to push the envelope and do things different rather than the hardware. There are far more memorable experiences that I can name that were played using a traditional control scheme rather than a motion control / multi-screen / touch based one. Several of these come from Nintendo, mind you.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Chooch

[tenchibr]

I keep saying this but what Nintendo needs to do is bundle one of their must-haves (Pikmin 3, NSBU, SM3DW, MK8, whatever) AND price drop on top of that.

 

That's what they have to do. They need to sacrifice one of their biggest titles so that once people have the system, they will feel inclined to buy the other ones.

 

Or even better: have customers buy a Wii U and get an online code voucher to download ONE FREE game of their CHOICE from the eShop. You want Pikmin 3? Go right ahead. Or maybe you would rather get WWHD? That works too.

 

They just need to eat the cost of one digital download and get the system in people's houses. The rest is win.

[PSI Wind]

"I always thought the Wii U and the Vita would be great targets for Doom 3:BFG. But there's not enough interest" Carmack says.

Carmack would love to develop for 3DS, Wii U, Vita ... but it's "extremely unlikely to happen."

http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=208894

Wait, who's publishing Doom 3: BFG Edition?

>Bethesda

[RK64]

Oh for fucks sake, one thing I can say that just ditching the thing is not the solution. What needs to happen is a relaunch (complete with price drop) once the system's heavy hitters come out like Super Mario 3d World, Mario Kart 7, Wii Fit U, Bayonetta 2, X, etc ect the list goes on for awesome things (well Wii Fit isn't that awesome but hey it's a seller) coming to the console.

 

And you know what? If the thing does Gamecube numbers or lower, I don't give a flying fuck. Nintendo made a profit on the GameCube, and as long as there's lots of awesome Nintendo games on a Nintendo system, I'll be satisfied. And fuck it, the GC is one of my favorite systems for the many great Nintendo games on it! Nintendo systems since the N64 have always been best as companion systems, and I believe their first-party games are good enough to warrant buying a system.  Even if they do take losses on this thing, Nintendo will come out of it fine, they'd need like 20-30 massive failures to even come close to running out of money, and then they'll just attempt again next gen. So you know the fuck what? No matter how it turns out, as long as I have my games I won't give a fuck. All I ask of the Wii-U is great Nintendo games with some third-party here and there, so Nintendo can keep having their heads in their ass as much as they goddamn want as long as their heads are far enough out to make great games. I'll have my PS4 for everything else, just like I had my 360 for everything else this gen  .

 

I never said that they need to ditch the Wii U, just thought that the need a back up plan incase this falls and next years line up of games don't sell or if they refuse to drop the price of the system. 

 

I don't care about the systems sales either and would love to pick one up for Lost World, the systems original 3d Zelda and maybe Mario Kart 8 (it honestly looks really impressive, and I hated MK Wii ) but I just don't want to get burnt out again like I did with my Wii. I HAD to get a PS3 just to play Generations when it was announced (same thing with Sonic 4 Ep. II and Sonic Transformed) and while I had no issue doing so because I love Sony's IP's, it just irks me that Nintendo is just fine living in there special little bubble and do what ever they want. 

 

They do make amazing games and they are worth the system price, but the Wii U is just 100$ cheaper than the PS4, and I know that I will be getting not just great Sony games but also great 3rd party games as well, so that investment is worth the extra 100$.  But why do I have to pay the steep Nintendo Tax of 299$ just to play Nintendo games that still aren't out yet when I could just pick up a 3DS and have my Nintendo fix with that?

 

I respect and love Nintendo for doing a lot for this great gaming industry, but they have no excuse to just hide in there shell and ignore everyone else.  They may be able to do this again with the Wii U, but they cannot do this again for there next system or people will just ignore them.

 

Just look at this E3; they had the best line up game quality wise and had a diverse line up for the next 2 years for the Wii U, but everyone was talking about Sony and Microsoft.  Of course people would say "that's because they have new systems coming soon" but remember E3 2005/2006 with Nintendo wow us with Twilight Princess, Prime 3, Mario Galaxy and just the general excitement to see what the Wii can do? There wasn't nearly the doom and gloom that the Wii U currently has with the Wii and it was a huge success. 

 

I just feel that no one respects Nintendo anymore, and the saddest biter truth of this is that they did that themselves.  They will be fine and still make great games, but that excitement for the next Mario or the next Zelda, is...not there anymore

[Chooch]

Just a little addendum here:

 

Hardware is fucking hardware. At the end of the day it doesn't fucking matter what you do with it. That's why I look at all this nonsense about motion control and second screens and think it's just that. Nonsense.

 

Software is what ultimately determines whether or not a game console or handheld is worth buying. Software is what allows a game developer to form some sort of recognizable identity among the several hundred thousand others fighting for attention in this ever-growing multi-billion dollar industry.

 

Lack of software is the #1 underlying reason why the Wii U is not fucking selling. The other issues are just secondary and tertiary.

 

I think I need a break from this topic.

Edited August 1, 2013 by Chooch

[Chaos Warp]

I never said that they need to ditch the Wii U, just thought that the need a back up plan incase this falls and next years line up of games don't sell or if they refuse to drop the price of the system. 

 

I was not addressing you in particular. I was just saying that in general. 

[The Kid]

Just a little addendum here:

 

Hardware is fucking hardware. At the end of the day it doesn't fucking matter what you do with it. That's why I look at all this nonsense about motion control and second screens and think it's just that. Nonsense.

 

Software is what ultimately determines whether or not a game console or handheld is worth buying. Software is what allows a game developer to form some sort of recognizable identity among the several hundred thousand others fighting for attention in this ever-growing multi-billion dollar industry.

 

Lack of software is the #1 underlying reason why the Wii U is not fucking selling. The other issues are just secondary and tertiary.

 

I think I need a break from this topic.

 

I never said that the only reason I thought Nintendo was distinct was because of their "recycled" ideas.  It is just part of the reason.  Sure software gives insanely memorable experiences, but I don't want that to be the only part of gaming that gives memorable experiences. I want that same feeling I had the moment I started up Wii sports, the moment I turned on the 3D in 3DLand, the moment I turned on the eyetoy with the PS2. I want that childlike wonderment that comes with a new experience like that. 

 

Software determines what people buy, but it doesn't make everything else meaningless.