Sonic Generations 3DS-bound?!

[Spooky Mulder]

Um... yeah. You're confusing gameplay and graphics engines now.

No, Blue. I'm very aware that gameplay engines have nothing to do with grahpics engines like the HE. My point was that Colors looked pretty awesome and because the power of the Wii is far closer to the 3DS than the PS3/XBOX, it might make sense to use that engine.

Colors looked awesome despite having an engine which is not nearly as graphically advanced as the HE.

[Blue Blood]

No, Blue. I'm very aware that gameplay engines have nothing to do with grahpics engines like the HE. My point was that Colors looked pretty awesome and because the power of the Wii is far closer to the 3DS than the PS3/XBOX, it might make sense to use that engine.

Colors looked awesome despite having an engine which is not nearly as graphically advanced as the HE.

I assumed you were talking about Colours DS.

[Spooky Mulder]

I assumed you were talking about Colours DS.

Ah, okay that's understandable. Sorry for the confusion Blue Blood, I'll go ahead and clarify my post.

[Skyward Sword]

I approve of this, but in all seriousness, the 3DS would be able to run the Generations if it was gimped. And we all know how terribad when SEGA released Unwiieshd.

[DarkLight]

Technically, "UnWiieshed" was developed by Dimps.

I consider Colors what Sonic Team would have done with Unleashed on Wii in terms of the day stages.

Edited May 11, 2011 by DragonSoul

[KrazyBean]

Win...pure absolute win!

[Tatsumaki]

Uh, no. The 3DS can't do the HE.

THANK YOU, WHAT I'VE BEEN TRYING TO SAY FOR THE LAST COUPLE OF HOURS YESTERDAY! THANK YOU! THANK. YOU!

Block quoting a specifications list doesn't do your argument much credence when it is clear that you have no idea what you are quoting actually means. For starters, ARM processors are exponentially more efficient than PowerPC processors, so I wouldn't be surprised if just one of the 3DS main processors could outstrip the sad thing the Wii has. Two of them makes it no contest. Keep in mind that even the PSP can outperform the Wii in terms of raw processing power.

No. Idea. At all. Its 2 GB, and it is incredibly easy to expand on that because DS game cards have always been, since 2004, modified SD cards. You also seem to be confusing cartridge storage space with (for whatever reason) on board flash memory.

Graphics, yes. Graphic engines, no. There is little to no chance that the 3DS could run the HE, or that the HE could be ported to run on the 3DS. It requires hardware power that the 3DS isn't even close to possessing. You can downscale all of the assets that you want from the big boy games to get it to a level that the 3DS could run them smoothly, but you couldn't use the HE to do it. You would need to program a new engine to run the assets, or run some variation of whatever was used on the Wii for Colours and Unleashed.

Uhuh. And your point of trying to counter-argument all this, creating a wall of text saying of how the 3DS is powerful, but then contradict yourself in the end, saying that this thing isn't as close of being able to run the HE, which is the very origin of my arguments about the hardware not being able to process the game is why?

[ProfessorZolo]

THANK YOU, WHAT I'VE BEEN TRYING TO SAY FOR THE LAST COUPLE OF HOURS YESTERDAY! THANK YOU! THANK. YOU!

Uhuh. And your point of trying to counter-argument all this, creating a wall of text saying of how the 3DS is powerful, but then contradict yourself in the end, saying that this thing isn't as close of being able to run the HE, which is the very origin of my arguments about the hardware not being able to process the game is why?

They weren't really contradicting themselves. Just saying that the 3DS is more powerful than you seem to be giving it credit for.

Yes, it probably can't run the HE, but what does that matter? As another forumer pointed out, the PS3 and 360 struggled to do it, and that was a cut down version of the engine.

But you know something? Forget the engine. You take the engine out a car, it'll still look the same, won't it? The 3DS may not be able to run the HD version of Generations with HE intact, but I'm reasonably sure, with a different lighting engine (and perhaps a slightly lower poly count), it'll run just fine. Especially with all that extra storage space the cart could have, it'll have the entire game on, no problem.

And can't you take this a little easier? There's no call to be at each others throats the whole time, y'know?

[Tornado]

Uhuh. And your point of trying to counter-argument all this, creating a wall of text saying of how the 3DS is powerful, but then contradict yourself in the end, saying that this thing isn't as close of being able to run the HE, which is the very origin of my arguments about the hardware not being able to process the game is why?

You'll note that I never said the 3DS could run the HE. Nor did I say that the 3DS wasn't capable of running a scaled down version of Generations (I even specifically explained how they could go about doing it). Keep in mind that your original argument was not "the 3DS couldn't run the HE," but in fact what essentially amounted to "Generations on 3DS would automatically suck because 3DS is only as powerful as the PS2."

The only thing I ever said was that you were wrong about how powerful the 3DS was (which you were), and were incorrectly using the specifications of the system to prove your point (which you did). That's not a contradiction. That's you being wrong but trying to change the subject so you look right.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Tornado

[Tatsumaki]

You'll note that I never said the 3DS could run the HE. Nor did I say that the 3DS wasn't capable of running a scaled down version of Generations (I even specifically explained how they could go about doing it). Keep in mind that your original argument was not "the 3DS couldn't run the HE," but in fact what essentially amounted to "Generations on 3DS would automatically suck because 3DS is only as powerful as the PS2."

The only thing I ever said was that you were wrong about how powerful the 3DS was (which you were), and were incorrectly using the specifications of the system to prove your point (which you did). That's not a contradiction. That's you being wrong but trying to change the subject so you look right.

Quoted from this very forum:

"I usually am in disagreement with Diogenes, but he's got a point here.

If what they're trying to do with Generations 3DS is a Port, it will be mediocre, since the 3DS IS a powerful handheld, it's impossible that it could have the processing power of a PS3. More like a PS2, if we're actually trying to exaggerate. In fact, I don't even think NGP can play a port of Generations, and everyone knows that the NGP is way more powerful than the 3DS. Perhaps close to Gamecube's power. It's that the NGP doesn't have 3D. Other than that, everything about it is better: Graphics, controls... Just by looking at the games and those analog sticks just make it better. Heck, they should have released Generations on NGP instead! (even though it isn't released yet, and isn't so powerful, it's at least better than the 3DS and can be waited for.)

As for a game on its own... I doubt it'll be anywhere near as good as the Console versions. I mean, any of the stages the Console wouldn't have but the 3DS would, well... It can be patched up with Updates and DLCs. Sure, 3DS is more online-based, but it's nowhere near as good in such tasks like PSN and Live are. And quite frankly, even though I'm not a graphics whore, I do not want to see our beloved Sonic looking all pixelated ,blocky, and looking like a blue piece of walking shit like in Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode One for the iOS and Android Devices."

Pretty much, everything I said here in just one post proves you wrong in just about every single aspect, except for the processing power. I guess I was wrong there, comparing them to processing. Nevertheless, it's still nowhere near a Wii. It can't produce polygons as well as a Wii, and utilizes shaders to make it look like a Next Gen console. What Nintendo could have used up of their processors on 3D, they could have used on better performance on their games, and perhaps better polygons and textures. And the processor still is a bit too nerfed, too.

And still, by being "stripped down", it's impossible for this thing to run the Hedgehog Engine. Just look at the people in this forum, they all think the same way. Isn't logic screaming at you right now?

I also think that a handheld being as powerful as a PS2 is indeed an accomplishment. But you can't really tell me it's as strong as a home console, I mean, come on. Have you played Unleashed on PS2? It's nowhere near as good as PS3. It doesn't have much stages, the gameplay isn't good, Sonic looks awkward... Everything about it is unsatisfactory because it's the watered-down port of an HD console game. And, since PS3 is the lead platform of this game, I can't really see a good Port coming out of this, because it will be like the PS2 Port for Unleashed. And an standalone game that's unrelated to the game that's pretty much the main attraction is just plain awkward.

They weren't really contradicting themselves. Just saying that the 3DS is more powerful than you seem to be giving it credit for.

Yes, it probably can't run the HE, but what does that matter? As another forumer pointed out, the PS3 and 360 struggled to do it, and that was a cut down version of the engine.

But you know something? Forget the engine. You take the engine out a car, it'll still look the same, won't it? The 3DS may not be able to run the HD version of Generations with HE intact, but I'm reasonably sure, with a different lighting engine (and perhaps a slightly lower poly count), it'll run just fine. Especially with all that extra storage space the cart could have, it'll have the entire game on, no problem.

And can't you take this a little easier? There's no call to be at each others throats the whole time, y'know?

Well, if the PS3 and 360 had problems, much less will the 3DS be able to deal with this.

When you take off the engine of a car, it may look the same, but it won't run the same. In fact, it may not run at all.

I dunno about you, but a fast paced game like this playing on a 3DS as the little handheld tries to struggle playing this without the Engine that will be used on a LEAD PLATFORM console game just makes me want to giggle like a little Japanese schoolgirl. It's beyond me. X)

Oh hell, dude, I am cool. I don't know any of you, so I'm chillz. I'm just explaining stuff to you guys. If you think I'm being all murderous on you, you guys are really wrong. If you think this is hostile, wait till you see my real hostility. I must be like a terrorist or something. xD

Edited May 12, 2011 by Tatsumaki

[Ekaje]

Just because it would be stripped down in the event of a port doesn't automatically mean it'll be mediocre. The reason the Wii/PS2 version of Unleashed (which wasn't a port, it had completely unique levels and different gameplay) was worse than the HD versions is because it was made by different developers (Dimps) who happened to make a worse game.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Ekaje

[Tatsumaki]

Just because it'll be stripped down doesn't automatically mean it'll be mediocre. The reason the Wii/PS2 version (which wasn't a port, it had completely unique levels and different gameplay) was worse than the HD versions is because it was made by different developers (Dimps) who happened to make a worse game. We can't judge the game yet because we don't have the slightest idea what it is, whether it's a graphically downgraded port, a "Rush" version like with Colors, or something different.

But wouldn't a Sonic Rush version of this game would be perfectly awkward?

I'd be slightly similar to Sonic 4 but created by SEGA, yes, but...

Will it really be good?

My answer.

It's possible.

But I can assure you, alongside with the versions that were specifically designed for home consoles, it will just look mediocre. If SEGA just wants to make a 3DS game commemorating Sonic's 20th, a port or original game based on Sonic Generations is not the way to go. They should might as well make a remake of Sonic Advance Series or Genesis Series. See, that is a nice little motherfucker I'd buy for the 3DS, not the shadow (get it? hahh.) of a PS3 and X360 game.

[goku262002]

*image*

I knew the difference you didn't have to negative rep me (not talking about you 'rush)!

Re-read my post i said a graphics engine LIKE COLORS not unleashed. If i remember correctly and i'm sure this is right Colors doesn't run on the Hedgehog Engine.

Edited May 12, 2011 by goku262002

[PSI Wind]

You know, now with Rayman Origins announced for the Wii, I'm thinking that the list was legit and, thus, Generations is coming to the 3DS. Just hope it isn't done by Dimps.

[Tobbii]

You know, now with Rayman Origins announced for the Wii, I'm thinking that the list was legit and, thus, Generations is coming to the 3DS. Just hope it isn't done by Dimps.

[Spooky Mulder]

I hope it is, played Colours DS last night, I thought it was really fun.

But Colors isn't supposed to play like C.Sonic. Ughhh why would any one trust Dimps w/ Classic gameplay after the atrocity that was S4E1?

[Indigo Rush]

That's a good point he brings up, Tobbii. Dimps is pretty good with the Rush-style gameplay and not much else. If they were able to make Classic Sonic play more like he did in Sonic Advance, that'd be one thing, but they have proven themselves to be pretty bad at the Unleashed-style of play. They could do it Sonic Rush style, but then that'd arguably destroy the purpose of Classic and Modern comparisons.

I mean, I wouldn't exactly mind if it was Advance vs Rush, but they'd both be 2D, and well, it's the 3DS.

[Tobbii]

But Colors isn't supposed to play like C.Sonic. Ughhh why would any one trust Dimps w/ Classic gameplay after the atrocity that was S4E1?

Because Sonic 4 was not an attempt at Classic Sonic controls? Didn't Sega themselves state that they are aware of the physics differences and stuff and that it was a design choice to le the series evolve?

[Blue Blood]

Because Sonic 4 was not an attempt at Classic Sonic controls? Didn't Sega themselves state that they are aware of the physics differences and stuff and that it was a design choice to le the series evolve?

There's nothing wrong with being different, but the differences in S4E1 are only the result of laziness. There's nothing evolutionary about it- it's all very regressive.

[Tornado]

Pretty much, everything I said here in just one post proves you wrong in just about every single aspect, except for the processing power.

If what they're trying to do with Generations 3DS is a Port, it will be mediocre,

Game. Set. Match.

Also ironic because the thing you are pretending that you initially said with your selective emphasis job is exactly what I've been saying from the start, so the best you could hope to achieve is proving me right.

And still, by being "stripped down", it's impossible for this thing to run the Hedgehog Engine. Just look at the people in this forum, they all think the same way. Isn't logic screaming at you right now?

Yes. The logic of things that I have already said, explained and agreed with is totally fresh and new to me.

Because Sonic 4 was not an attempt at Classic Sonic controls? Didn't Sega themselves state that they are aware of the physics differences and stuff and that it was a design choice to le the series evolve?

They started saying that after it became clear that no one was buying their bullshit anymore. Because until the PartnerNET thing happened, Sega was still happily playing the "plays just like the classics" tune as heavily as they could.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Tornado

[Tobbii]

Well I'll take your word for it, I never heard them actually say Sonic 4 was going to play like the original, I assumed it, but I never heard them say it.

[Tornado]

From the very first interview given for the game:

Old-school Sonic fans have long asked to see Sonic return to a more 2D style of gameplay. Many liked the daytime stages in Unleashed but wanted to see a game that plays purely similar to the early games of the Genesis. Project Needlemouse is that critical first step that brings Sonic back to his 2D roots.

Linky.

Ballough did another one in February that basically just repeated itself from the first one.

Then Iizuka did this interview.

Then he did this one in response to fan questions.

Of particular note was that both of the Iizuka interviews came out after the ParterNET leak (though it is possible that they were conducted beforehand), so they were both basically damage control to try to get people to believe the original story.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Tornado

[Marcello]

Well, to be fair, it does play similar to the classic 2D games, just not exactly the same

[Tornado]

That is a discussion for another thread.

[Tobbii]

From the very first interview given for the game:

Linky.

Ballough did another one in February that basically just repeated itself from the first one.

Then Iizuka did this interview.

Then he did this one in response to fan questions.

Of particular note was that both of the Iizuka interviews took place after the ParterNET leak (though it is possible that they took place beforehand), so they were both basically damage control to try to get people to believe the original story.