Sonic Mania (August 15th 2017, Christian Whitehead, PS4, Xbox One, PC, Switch) - The New Classic

[expansivelovestories]

1 hour ago, Mayor D said:

But my inner critic should really be crying out for more, because the Green Hill Zone special and Studiopolis Zone really shouldn't be cutting it, people have been burnt by both Sonic and non Sonic games doing this, we're not saying these people are not tallented or good enough to do it, but we need to see more than two stages, and yes I know about the desert stage but... really? We've barely seen that and has it ever been at a public demo?

I think they really do need to show something new and it needs to come a while before launch otherwise I think more people are going to either forget it's coming out or just get bored if they constantly show Green Hill and Studiopolis again.

Yes, it seems to me that the release may be far enough away (May somehow seems likely due to the connection with the word Mania) that to have released anything new too recently would have been just a bit too early. 

Now that they have set up the reoccurence of this streaming show, they will be able to at any time, include new footage or screenshots out of nowhere and accomplish both sharing the information/content while creating extra buzz/hype!! 

Taxman has mentioned in that one twitter post or reply, I can't remember which, basically getting the sense that they as a team do not want to reveal too many elements that will otherwise be completely surprising.  They have seemed to make public the "least special" elements that the game has to offer, though of course they are still really amazing, and Studiopolis, as well as Mirage Saloon, have many highlights/are certainly by being zones selected for preview, already becoming iconic parts of the series' ongoing history!

So thankfully, there are even some very interesting possible elements yet to be revealed that they can share that also won't really be significant spoilers, such as special stages, bonus stages, and if there is a 2P/3P competition mode, what that is and how it works!

[Chris Knopps]

@Dejimon11

...I know this is completely irrelevant to this discussion and thread but I really have to point this out. The picture in your signature, EVERY time I look at it I think it's Sonic getting smashed by a yellow wrench. I have to pay attention to realize/remember it's the Mega Man dude giving him a kick.

@expansivelovestories

Special stages... I don't know what I'm hoping for in Mania really when it comes to special stages. They've done so many different types already, but I suppose I wouldn't mind seeing something like the skydiving special stages in the first Advance game, or maybe some new kind of Sonic 3 and Knuckles sphere based special stages?

Although considering what huge fans of CD the staff seem to be, it will likely be special stages akin to the ones in that title.

[Ajavalo]

Well, if one stream every two weeks is now the norm, I don't really care for the lack of big news; I think they're a good way to entertain the public when there isn't anything to share. Both SEGA and the development team want to make sure to keep the game as fresh as possible for everyone, which is a good thing. Judging by this tweet from Taxman, we will be seeing something more before release:

https://twitter.com/CFWhitehead/status/791649036210098177

And all of the teasing Aaron and Sergio love so much is because many people ask them questions they clearly can't answer legally. It's all they can say. I personally like the cryptic stuff they were posting for the first half of 2016, it gets us to think.

Aaand... Is all of this hunger for news a result of the tendency of SEGA to release too much information on future titles in past years? I really notice the difference, but is it actually unusual for game companies and developers overall to stay quiet for long periods?

[TB100]

As soon as i found out it was about Mean Bean Machine, i knew from the gecko it wasn't going to be anything special. was it still disapointing to have nothing in the end, well yeah of course it was, but at the same time though, i wasn't expecting anything grand to begin with, and for what it was, it was a good stream, the Kazuyuki Hoshino interview was undoubtly the highlight of the stream, not only did we get some history on how he became a Sega employee, but we also got a little bit of history regarding Sonic CD's devlopment which is always swell to see. plus Big being one of his favorite characters was pretty hilarious. (This explains a lot of things actually, like why he continued to appear in Sonic games despite his negative reception from SA1?) and the Eggman plush taking over the stream for a few secs was a nice little bit of humor. i got to chat with some of the Twitch members there before it blew up which was fun, so overall, i enjoyed it, and i can't wait for the valentines day stream. 

So i have a question to ask just to get back to Mania discussion,

Now i know the chances of the Hyper Forms+Super Tails returning is pretty unlikely, given Sega's current stance on them, but does anyone want to see Super Knuckles again? it's not like he'll interfere with the already existing canon like the Super Emeralds would, given that he obtains it the same way that Sonic does, Yes i know there is that Hedgehogs only except for Blaze rule but considering his overall connection to not only Sonic himself but to both the Master Emerald and the Chaos Emeralds, it makes a lot of sense for him to have a super form compared to someone like Tails. (No offense bud.) so i want to know, does anyone want to see Super Knuckles return in Sonic Mania?

[Psychicmoose103]

34 minutes ago, BlueBlur91 said:

As soon as i found out it was about Mean Bean Machine, i knew from the gecko it wasn't going to be anything special. was it still disapointing to have nothing in the end, well yeah of course it was, but at the same time though, i wasn't expecting anything grand to begin with, and for what it was, it was a good stream, the Kazuyuki Hoshino interview was undoubtly the highlight of the stream, not only did we get some history on how he became a Sega employee, but we also got a little bit of history regarding Sonic CD's devlopment which is always swell to see. plus Big being one of his favorite characters was pretty hilarious. (This explains a lot of things actually, like why he continued to appear in Sonic games despite his negative reception from SA1?) and the Eggman plush taking over the stream for a few secs was a nice little bit of humor. i got to chat with some of the Twitch members there before it blew up which was fun, so overall, i enjoyed it, and i can't wait for the valentines day stream. 

So i have a question to ask just to get back to Mania discussion,

Now i know the chances of the Hyper Forms+Super Tails returning is pretty unlikely, given Sega's current stance on them, but does anyone want to see Super Knuckles again? it's not like he'll interfere with the already existing canon like the Super Emeralds would, given that he obtains it the same way that Sonic does, Yes i know there is that Hedgehogs only except for Blaze rule but considering his overall connection to not only Sonic himself but to both the Master Emerald and the Chaos Emeralds, it makes a lot of sense for him to have a super form compared to someone like Tails. (No offense bud.) so i want to know, does anyone want to see Super Knuckles return in Sonic Mania?

Yes Yes and Yes. His earthquake attack and fast climbing was awesome!

[CleverSonicUsername]

I think the probability of Super Knuckles is high. I'd even think Tails might get a little love if he collects all 7 emeralds. It seems like something Taxman would do.

That said, Izuka confirmed that the super emeralds will not be in the game a while back (it was during one of their streams IIRC), so hyper forms are likely not going to happen. He did say there would be a "new" item, but what exactly he means by that is still unknown.

[Chris Knopps]

1 hour ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

I think the probability of Super Knuckles is high. I'd even think Tails might get a little love if he collects all 7 emeralds. It seems like something Taxman would do.

That said, Izuka confirmed that the super emeralds will not be in the game a while back (it was during one of their streams IIRC), so hyper forms are likely not going to happen. He did say there would be a "new" item, but what exactly he means by that is still unknown.

The Super Emeralds are in every game, they're just shrunk down and act as normal emeralds now since the initial surge of power from changing shape has drained down. They never went back to their original shape/design.

(Head canon for the sake of keeping a mess a little cleaner)

[JezMM]

I think the fact that this is a digital release and lower-cost than a standard new game will negate the whole "there aren't enough trailers, people are gonna forget it exists!" concept.  I imagine the launch trailer will feature another zone for the heck of it, but overall that'll drop, all the news sites will (hopefully) be praising it, and all the people who forgot will be like "oh awesome that's out now!" and immediately go and impulse buy it since they likely won't even need to leave their seat to do so.

[Chris Knopps]

I HAVE A GREAT IDEA!!!!

(Nintendo Switch - Bundled With Sonic Mania)

[TheOcelot]

5 hours ago, BlueBlur91 said:

Now i know the chances of the Hyper Forms+Super Tails returning is pretty unlikely, given Sega's current stance on them, but does anyone want to see Super Knuckles again? it's not like he'll interfere with the already existing canon like the Super Emeralds would, given that he obtains it the same way that Sonic does, Yes i know there is that Hedgehogs only except for Blaze rule but considering his overall connection to not only Sonic himself but to both the Master Emerald and the Chaos Emeralds, it makes a lot of sense for him to have a super form compared to someone like Tails. (No offense bud.) so i want to know, does anyone want to see Super Knuckles return in Sonic Mania?

I wouldn't read anything into the Hedgehogs only rule because Mania is a continuation of the Classics canon and nothing to do with Modern. 

Based on the original canon of the chaos emeralds for Sonic 2 and 3&K (and "Knuckles in Sonic 2" lock-on); only Sonic and Knuckles had super forms, whilst Tails didn't get one (he needed the super emeralds). So, I'm 100% confident both Sonic & Knuckles will have a super form in Mania which will look pretty awesome in 32-bit. However, I don't believe Tails will get one. In the mobile remaster of Sonic 2 both Sonic & Knux got a super form which was true to the original canon. So, yeah I think this theory is water-tight.

There won't be hyper forms by the sound of it. So why not make the Super forms in Mania visually look like the hyper forms from 3&K?! You can expect Sonic's super-form to at least have the fast-shoes animation where you see three Sonic's running behind him, so they would want to make Super Sonic look even more spectacular, right?

59 minutes ago, JezMM said:

I think the fact that this is a digital release and lower-cost than a standard new game will negate the whole "there aren't enough trailers, people are gonna forget it exists!" concept.  I imagine the launch trailer will feature another zone for the heck of it, but overall that'll drop, all the news sites will (hopefully) be praising it, and all the people who forgot will be like "oh awesome that's out now!" and immediately go and impulse buy it since they likely won't even need to leave their seat to do so.

It's still a bit of a strange choice to only have two trailers. I was expecting three. Even the Sonic CD remaster had three; announcement trailer, gameplay trailer and launch trailer. Maybe they needed to save money so a third trailer wasn't an option (maybe Mania has gone slightly over budget), or maybe they are confident enough they feel two trailers are enough.

You could almost argue the Switch port announcement (which has a few minor differences) is kind of unofficially the second trailer, with the launch trailer being the third. 

I think Mania will do well in terms of sales. The media coverage has been overwhelmingly positive, so I'm sure when it gets to release date it's going to be big news. Hopefully it won't get released at the same time as another "triple AAA game", but even if it does it'll be cheaper to buy (as you said) so yeah, should do fine.

 

Another thought on the new Mania animation. Do you think it could be for grinding? Rail grinding for a zone in Mania??????

[Pawn]

1 hour ago, EllieBot said:

Based on the original canon of the chaos emeralds for Sonic 2 and 3&K (and "Knuckles in Sonic 2" lock-on); only Sonic and Knuckles had super forms, whilst Tails didn't get one (he needed the super emeralds). So, I'm 100% confident both Sonic & Knuckles will have a super form in Mania which will look pretty awesome in 32-bit. However, I don't believe Tails will get one. In the mobile remaster of Sonic 2 both Sonic & Knux got a super form which was true to the original canon. So, yeah I think this theory is water-tight.

As far as canon Super forms go; only Sonic's is really relevant to the story. Super/Hyper Knuckles, like Super Tails, just came across as a little bonus. I think that either they will both have it or neither will. I'm betting on the former, though, because why not?

(Super forms, I mean. I see no reason to bring back Hyper forms.)

[Chris Knopps]

1 hour ago, EllieBot said:

Another thought on the new Mania animation. Do you think it could be for grinding? Rail grinding for a zone in Mania??????

That's... Actually very possible. Nice catching that.

[Psychicmoose103]

If they are not gonna have hyper forms, give super tails the flickies, super sonic the jump boost screen nuke and knuckles the earthquake attack. Unless they are gonna have other forms with the "new item"

[Chris Knopps]

2 hours ago, Psychicmoose103 said:

If they are not gonna have hyper forms, give super tails the flickies, super sonic the jump boost screen nuke and knuckles the earthquake attack. Unless they are gonna have other forms with the "new item"

Given the story in the comics I'm kind of thinking these new items will be some sort of "time gears" basically. Maybe the idea of Mania is to somehow tie Classic Sonic and the Classic cast into Project 2017?

Robotnik is trying to rebuild the Time Eater using the parts still corrupted with its essence perhaps?

[CleverSonicUsername]

11 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

The Super Emeralds are in every game, they're just shrunk down and act as normal emeralds now since the initial surge of power from changing shape has drained down. They never went back to their original shape/design.

(Head canon for the sake of keeping a mess a little cleaner)

I mean sure, that headcanon honestly aligns with my own, but they won't be in the game proper according to Izuka. Which I'm honestly a little bummed about. When he says there's a new item, I hope it means there's something there to collect alongside the chaos emeralds.

Two rings per act seems like a good amount. I remember some Sonic 3 levels like Marble Garden made it stupidly easy to stock up on emeralds. I like it when they're a challenge to get, but not overwhelmingly difficult or arbitrarily hard. Curious to see what they've got planned.

On a somewhat unrelated note, I just realized we haven't seen the Master Emerald since like, what, Sonic Adventure 2?

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, CleverSonicUsername said:

I mean sure, that headcanon honestly aligns with my own, but they won't be in the game proper according to Izuka. Which I'm honestly a little bummed about. When he says there's a new item, I hope it means there's something there to collect alongside the chaos emeralds.

Two rings per act seems like a good amount. I remember some Sonic 3 levels like Marble Garden made it stupidly easy to stock up on emeralds. I like it when they're a challenge to get, but not overwhelmingly difficult or arbitrarily hard. Curious to see what they've got planned.

I think the "new items" are just going to be plot or "true ending/final boss" related ala the Gears from the Classic spin-off comics coming from Archie, that idea had to come from more than just the comic staff.

(I'd like to hope anyways, sounds pretty cool and great for continuity rebuilding in the franchise)

[SonicComicFanboy]

Adding the gears from the Megadrive specials would be a pretty neat/nice touch.  

[Chris Knopps]

9 minutes ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

Adding the gears from the Megadrive specials would be a prettt neat/nice touch.  

I'm going for a "re-building the Time Eater" kind of thing. Maybe because Robotnik thinks his future Eggman self is an incompetent madman and thinks he could do everything better since he's the "sane" villain I guess. lol

[SonicComicFanboy]

6 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

I'm going for a "re-building the Time Eater" kind of thing. Maybe because Robotnik thinks his future Eggman self is an incompetent madman and thinks he could do everything better since he's the "sane" villain I guess. lol

Haha, I could see that.  Leave it to Robotnik to not even trust himself to get the job done right! XD

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, SonicComicFanboy said:

Haha, I could see that.  Leave it to Robotnik to not even trust himself to get the job done right! XD

I only "assume" this plot because they're going back to all these old places and they look so warped, perhaps as a result of all the time and space meddling he and his older self did with the Time Eater in Generations leaving places still a little wacky looking afterwards.

It's a race to gather the Time Eater parts that still have its essence within them, leading to maybe the final boss Whitehead wanted to put in CD but was denied and will now use in Mania?

It was a boss focusing on traveling through time to defeat it.

[TB100]

The Plot to Sonic Mania

Eggman does bad things and Sonic & Tails must stop him. oh yeah and Knuckles somehow got tricked again, so you have to stop him as well.

[Jango]

The Plot to Sonic Mania

Eggman does bad things and Sonic & Tails must stop him. oh yeah and Knuckles somehow got tricked again, so you have to stop him as well.

Yeah. I don't think it would be that barebones. The Taxman himself said there's a reason why these old zones are being revisited, and it's not just because it's a "celebration" of Sonic. Even Generations tried to explain why we go back to old zones.

I wonder if the game will start with a cutscene. Damn, I wish they could have an animated intro, like Sonic CD.

[TB100]

6 minutes ago, Jango said:

Yeah. I don't think it would be that barebones. The Taxman himself said there's a reason why these old zones are being revisited, and it's not just because it's a "celebration" of Sonic. Even Generations tried to explain why we go back to old zones.

I wonder if the game will start with a cutscene. Damn, I wish they could have an animated intro, like Sonic CD.

I know, i was just joking. though a animated intro via Sonic CD would be amazing to see. 

[Red Hot Jack]

So has anyone watched this video?

Aaron said there's clues in it. At the beginning you can see 5 hedgehogs, then 3 Sonics, then 17 Sonics.

5/3/17

Plus there is a 21 in the middle, maybe 3/21/17 ? I still don't know how to interpret it, I'm trying.

Sorry if it has been discovered already.

[TheOcelot]

One of the members on Retro mentioned that a couple of years ago SEGA did a licensed remix which had Ice Cap included in two tracks:

Flexstyle – AntiFreeze [ Ice Cap Zone & Chemical Plant Zone ]

Phonetic Hero – Prow'd [Aquatic Ruin Zone & Ice Cap Zone ] 

Have any of you guys heard these remixes? Pretty good stuff.

If SEGA were able to allow this then maybe a remixed version of Ice Cap could be allowed to be included if this zone features in Mania?