Dragon Ball (Warning: Untagged Spoilers)

[Soniman]

Dragonball > Writing

 

Ahahahahaha, let's all laugh at the funny joke.

 

Seriously though, come on; we all know more or less exactly how this movie is going to play out overall. The villain will come along, start blowing shit up and killing people before one or two of the main characters turn up and start fighting. All the other characters will gradually turn up in a steady stream and get their asses handed to them one by one, whilst Goku is written out of the plot for a bit for some dumb reason so that everyone can get their asses kicked screentime. He'll then turn up after everyone is almost dead and win. The end.

 

You know, because it's not like that's how almost every DBZ plot is ever, or anything. 

Again the only time this tired ass formula wasn't used was during the Cell Saga, the ONLY Saga where they actually bothered to develop the characters and actually change up the goddamn formula.

 

Same thing with almost every movie with the exception of Bojack Unbound, and Broly's second and third movie.

 

And another thing, when has SSJ3 EVER been useful? Seriously? It was hyped up constantly to be something truly fantastic and it never ended up defeating ANYONE (well unless you count Wrath of the Dragon where he defeats the big bad with a completely made up un-canon mode while he just happened to be in his SSJ3 form).

Edited January 31, 2013 by Soniman

[batson]

I just thought of something that, if it happened in the movie, would actually make me forgive all that has been revealed about it:

 

Goku fuses with Gohan.

 

This would both create a super-strong brand new character (although one whose potential existance is something fans have of course speculated about since forvever) and it would to at least some extent give Gohan his due. And hey, since Goku would be in it as well, they could still technically poll of their apparently obligatory "Goku does some uber-strong meteor move that finally kills the villain"-crap.

 

But of course the actuall truth is that if anyone is going to fuse with Goku, it's going to be Vegeta. Because, you know, Vegeta is so the second strongest sayian in the series...

[Kuzu]

Well think about it; Goku's the most popular in Japan,and Vegeta is arguably the most popular in America of course they're going to get the biggest roles. Fact of the matter is, in regards to Dragonball as a whole unless your name is Goku or Vegeta you're going to get severely shafted to the point where they're the most marketable character.

[Yoko/葉子]

Dragonball > Writing

 

Ahahahahaha, let's all laugh at the funny joke.

 

Seriously though, come on; we all know more or less exactly how this movie is going to play out overall. The villain will come along, start blowing shit up and killing people before one or two of the main characters turn up and start fighting. All the other characters will gradually turn up in a steady stream and get their asses handed to them one by one, whilst Goku is written out of the plot for a bit for some dumb reason so that everyone can get their asses kicked screentime. He'll then turn up after everyone is almost dead and win. The end.

 

You know, because it's not like that's how almost every DBZ plot is ever, or anything. 

DBZ did trigger lots of not well put together storylines in anime after all

[batson]

Well think about it; Goku's the most popular in Japan,and Vegeta is arguably the most popular in America of course they're going to get the biggest roles. Fact of the matter is, in regards to Dragonball as a whole unless your name is Goku or Vegeta you're going to get severely shafted to the point where they're the most marketable character.

 

I dont understand why Gohan never took of in popularity more than he did. Granted, i can see why he isnt as popular as neither Goku or Vegeta since he has a much more normal and down-to-earth personality than they do. But at the very least, shoudlnt he have like a ton of fangirls for being the sweetest, most sensitive guy in the series? Of course, sweet male characters never seem to get quite as many fangirls as the badass assholes, but still, they usually get at least a fair amount. But with Gohan, it seems like there is about 50 Vegeta fangirls for every Gohan fangirl. But i guess maybe the ones who wants to fawn over a good hearted DB-character instead goes to Goku...

Edited January 31, 2013 by batson

[Kuzu]

I dont understand why Gohan never took of in popularity more than he did. Granted, i can see why he isnt as popular as neither Goku or Vegeta since he has a much more normal and down-to-earth personality than they do. But at the very least, shoudlnt he have like a ton of fangirls for being the sweetest, most sensitive guy in the series? Of course, sweet male characters never seem to get quite as many fangirls as the badass assholes, but still, they usually get at least a fair amount. But with Gohan, it seems like there is about 50 Vegeta fangirls for every Gohan fangirl. But i guess maybe the ones who wants to fawn over a good hearted DB-character instead goes to Goku...

 

 

You just answered your own question; Goku examplifies everything the Japanese love about a Shonen hero, and Vegeta was basically the first Anime badboy the fangirls fell in love with. You may as well call Dragon Ball Z the "Goku & Vegeta show" and you wouldn't lose much meaning. Everyone else is so insignificant to those two it's not even funny.

[Soniman]

Vegeta wasn't even THAT much of a main character in Z until the Buu Saga (where he underwent some legitimate development, the one thing I can give to that bad Saga), id still say Gohan and Piccolo were just as much at the forefront during that time.

[Kuzu]

Vegeta wasn't even THAT much of a main character in Z until the Buu Saga (where he underwent some legitimate development, the one thing I can give to that bad Saga), id still say Gohan and Piccolo were just as much at the forefront during that time.

 

 

From Namek onwards he's just as much a main character as Gohan or Piccolo, and considering he's the only rival to at least try to keep pace with Goku, combined with Gohan and Piccolo's shitty treatment Post-Android saga. Yeah...

[DaBatGuy]

I dont understand why Gohan never took of in popularity more than he did. Granted, i can see why he isnt as popular as neither Goku or Vegeta since he has a much more normal and down-to-earth personality than they do. But at the very least, shoudlnt he have like a ton of fangirls for being the sweetest, most sensitive guy in the series? Of course, sweet male characters never seem to get quite as many fangirls as the badass assholes, but still, they usually get at least a fair amount. But with Gohan, it seems like there is about 50 Vegeta fangirls for every Gohan fangirl. But i guess maybe the ones who wants to fawn over a good hearted DB-character instead goes to Goku...

It also doesn't help that immediately following his crowning moment of badassery where he surpasses his father and his ready to take his place as the defender of Earth he's turned into a goofy dork that gets upstaged by every other saiyan in the series, including his kid brother. If only History of Trunks Gohan was canon...

[Kuzu]

Woah, when was Gohan ever upstaged by Goten?

[DaBatGuy]

Woah, when was Gohan ever upstaged by Goten?

When Goten(and Trunks) achieve Super Saiyan forms( a legendary transformation that require years of training and a moment of intense trauma or tradgedy) as children without even trying then proceed to master both the fusion dance and SS3(completely skipping SS2 somehow) all within a single arc.

[-Robin-]

Goten did legitimately shock Gohan during the rock-throwing exercise, and then shocked him further by going Super Saiyan. Gohan and Goku also mentioned that Goten and Trunks would become stronger than the both of them if the didn't keep up with training themselves.

There was also mentioning about Goten being the hero of the Buu Saga, and not Goku nor Gohan, but backlash about a Goku-lookalike saving the day persuaded Toriyama to go back and make Goku the hero once more.

Just another What Could Have Been to put up alongside Android 19 and 20 being the real androids Trunks spoke of, Semi-Perfect Cell staying around a bit longer, and Piccolo becoming Majin instead of Vegeta.

Edited February 1, 2013 by Joshua

[Soniman]

And in the end Goten and Kid Trunks would amount to absolutely nothing as characters, because everything they did was either pointless or unfulfilled.

 

Gohan defeats Cell, Goku defeats everyone else, Goten? Fucking nothing, a complete waste.

[-Robin-]

Which is why the original draft Akira was going for is comparatively exciting.

Just imagine how the manga would have played out if Toriyama had absolute control of his story direction. 19 and 20 would be serious big bads, Cell would be around a lot longer, Goten would have an enormous part, Vegeta would be shafted due to being Toriyama's least favorite character he made, and Piccolo, Toriyama's favorite, would be right up there with the Saiyans in terms of worth and strength through all of DBZ.

Edited February 1, 2013 by Joshua

[Komodin]

Just another What Could Have Been to put up alongside Android 19 and 20 being the real androids Trunks spoke of, Semi-Perfect Cell staying around a bit longer, and Piccolo becoming Majin instead of Vegeta.

 

Wow, that could have been legitimately awesome. I mean, gosh, the return of the Great Demon King Piccolo - now with the power rivaling that of a Super Saiyan? The story practically writes itself!

[Soniman]

Id rather have that than what was the Sayian equivalent of a mid-life crisis (though I still like Vegeta's return to evil as well).

[Kuzu]

Id rather have that than what was the Sayian equivalent of a mid-life crisis (though I still like Vegeta's return to evil as well).

 

 

To be fair, it led to one of the best fights in the series for me.

[Soniman]

To be fair, it led to one of the best fights in the series for me.

 

I liked it mainly due to Vegeta's dialogue, the man is brilliant at giving passionate speeches.

[Kuzu]

I liked it mainly due to Vegeta's dialogue, the man is brilliant at giving passionate speeches.

 

That, and the fight itself was awesome. Most fights in DBZ are so one-sided, so it's kinda refereshing to see a fight that's mostly even for a change. Yeah Goku had SSJ3, but nobody likes it and it's an asspull.

[goku262002]

 

That, and the fight itself was awesome. Most fights in DBZ are so one-sided, so it's kinda refereshing to see a fight that's mostly even for a change. Yeah Goku had SSJ3, but nobody likes it and it's an asspull.

Besides storywise, if Goku did go SS3 he would've been dead quick it is an energy sucker and Goku was on limited life force (btw, I wonder if being alive and going SS3 means its sucking away age/life force? ponder that). he was getting some sick enjoyment out of having a rematch with the newly transformed SS2 vegeta even though he also knew the end result was feeding a super-powerful demon beast.

[Tori Himemiya]

Which is why the original draft Akira was going for is comparatively exciting.

Just imagine how the manga would have played out if Toriyama had absolute control of his story direction. 19 and 20 would be serious big bads, Cell would be around a lot longer, Goten would have an enormous part, Vegeta would be shafted due to being Toriyama's least favorite character he made, and Piccolo, Toriyama's favorite, would be right up there with the Saiyans in terms of worth and strength through all of DBZ.

Most of this does sound cool except for Vegeta being written off, mostly because he'll just be like Lunch/Launch.

Poor Piccolo though. He never once got any power boosts for the rest of the series. Sure he's stronger than the average Super Saiyan but he got outclassed quickly by pretty much everyone. Not only that he didn't had any fighting scenes what so ever, thanks to Dabura and Gotenks. Its a shame that when Piccolo's traits in Super Buu popped up Buu got a power drop thanks to Piccolo. Thanks for the sacrifice Piccolo.

Majin Piccolo would had been awesome and finally gave us focus on Piccolo since the Android saga, Majin Vegeta just feels more right however as Piccolo already went through too much character development that he absorbed his good half it would seem kind of random and Vegeta was always some kind of prick so Majin Vegeta showed Vegeta's true colors in the end.

[Nintendoga]

Anybody wanna take any guesses to how Goku's gonna kill the main villian?

Is it-

A. "Goku gathers energy from his (almost dead) friends to perform a Kamehameha/Energy Attack"
B. " Spirit Bomb"
C. "Goku Fuses with someone"
D. "Goku uses a new onlygonnabeusedonce attack that will make the viewer question why the fuck he didn't do this earlier"
E. "Goku actually doesn't defeat the villian, it's thanks to Gohan and Vegeta and Krillin who save the-pfffft as if"

Either way, it's gonna end with Hercule getting the credit for defeating the villian, and everything goes back to the way it was.
 

 

That, and the fight itself was awesome. Most fights in DBZ are so one-sided, so it's kinda refereshing to see a fight that's mostly even for a change. Yeah Goku had SSJ3, but nobody likes it and it's an asspull.

I kinda like SS3, it's just it comes the hell out of nowhere and is pretty much useless till the Kid Buu fight.
Better then SS4 though. Hell anything's better then SS4.
 

Edited February 1, 2013 by Nintendoga

[Soniman]

SSJ3 was useless even with Kid Buu, as all it was good for was wasting energy and being more trouble than it was worth.

[Kuzu]

Most of this does sound cool except for Vegeta being written off, mostly because he'll just be like Lunch/Launch.

Poor Piccolo though. He never once got any power boosts for the rest of the series. Sure he's stronger than the average Super Saiyan but he got outclassed quickly by pretty much everyone. Not only that he didn't had any fighting scenes what so ever, thanks to Dabura and Gotenks. Its a shame that when Piccolo's traits in Super Buu popped up Buu got a power drop thanks to Piccolo. Thanks for the sacrifice Piccolo.

Majin Piccolo would had been awesome and finally gave us focus on Piccolo since the Android saga, Majin Vegeta just feels more right however as Piccolo already went through too much character development that he absorbed his good half it would seem kind of random and Vegeta was always some kind of prick so Majin Vegeta showed Vegeta's true colors in the end.

 

 

Well the Buu Saga was the point when the Saiyans all but took over the plot; I mean it was like that in the Cell Saga too, but the supporting cast at least got to do something. Piccolo was the strongest for a bit and had a pretty damn good fight with 17, Krillin and Tien had their moments too. 

 

Another reason I don't like the Buu Saga, everyone not a saiyan doesn't do shit, at least before they tried to be useful, in the Buu saga they do fuck all.

[Vec]

And in the end Goten and Kid Trunks would amount to absolutely nothing as characters, because everything they did was either pointless or unfulfilled.

 

Gohan defeats Cell, Goku defeats everyone else, Goten? Fucking nothing, a complete waste.

 

Actually, if we look in the canon, Goku only defeated Buu in Z: Vegeta survived thanks to Goku's plea to Krillin (Preventing him from managing to defeat someone!) Freeza survived only to be killed with ease by Trunks.

 

Then in GT he gets to defeat the main villians himself, and in Dragon Ball I think he did too