Dragon Ball (Warning: Untagged Spoilers)

[Tani Coyote]

I assume they saw everyone planning to gang up on them, hence the choice of the center. We can recall that earlier on, the idea of being in the center was tossed out because it was assumed every other team would plan the same move. If everyone is against them, though, it has the most security.

Will be interesting to see what's going on... though it looks like Frieza isn't planning on fighting with them for whatever reason.

Actually, looking it over. The Androids, Goku, Vegeta and Frieza are not in that circle.

My assumption is they split their resources; the weaker team members stayed in the center under Gohan and Piccolo's protection, presumably on defense, while the stronger members went off to try and wreck some people. It's a good way to have a solid defensive core with serious strafing and flanking power at the fringes.

Also noteworthy: it sounds like only ki-based flight is disabled. Since 17 and 18's flight ability is not ki-based... that may explain why they're not in the center.

[GucciBurr]

i hope the new form is more than just a recolor this time

[Pawn]

1 hour ago, DiamondX said:

I don't think it's SSB Kaio-Ken. Both times Goku used it, he was already in the SSB form. Here he's in the base form.

It's possible that they're hiding the actual form and that he's mid-transformation. Maybe the red hair will return, but spiked up like a Super Saiyan's this time?

Whatever it turns out to be, I'd rather it wasn't his normal hair personally, as that's a characteristic of the "Mystic" form and Gohan made a point that it's a different path to Goku's.

[DiamondX]

This was found at Anime Expo:

Wierd to promote GT right now, unless they are remaking it.

[Pawn]

Someone on Reddit mentioned that it's coming to Hulu, so it may be promotion for that. I don't know anything about it though.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Since it's DB related, I'll mention it here. For anyone interested in the F2P Mobile DBZ Game - Dokkan Battle, the second anniversary is upcoming and there is going to be a crap ton of stuff to help new players. If anyone has an interest in starting the game, I definitely recommend giving it a go here because of all the things given. 

I also made a guide to it if again, anyone's interested.

On another note, I saw that DBZ 4D Poster for Universal JP, which I'm assuming is legit, and I guess we finally got our SSB Gogeta?

[DiamondX]

Actually, it's not SSB Gogeta.

It's Goku fused with the people watching. 

[Zaysho]

On 6/30/2017 at 5:54 AM, DiamondX said:

Oh my...

New Form?!

Random thought, but maybe Goku's pushed himself to the point he no longer needs transformations? Like in the new opening, he's shown primarily fighting in his base form and then when he's in his god form, he uses Kaio-Ken and is back in his base form. And, at the end of the manga/Z series, he doesn't use any transformation against Uub, though on the other hand Uub is untrained so I can't imagine Goku would have a reason to use his Super Saiyan powers.

[ThePrinceOfSaiyans]

3 hours ago, Pawn said:

Someone on Reddit mentioned that it's coming to Hulu, so it may be promotion for that. I don't know anything about it though.

GT is already on Hulu tho... 

[Ratcicle King]

35 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

Random thought, but maybe Goku's pushed himself to the point he no longer needs transformations? Like in the new opening, he's shown primarily fighting in his base form and then when he's in his god form, he uses Kaio-Ken and is back in his base form. And, at the end of the manga/Z series, he doesn't use any transformation against Uub, though on the other hand Uub is untrained so I can't imagine Goku would have a reason to use his Super Saiyan powers.

I think the whole ''Goku in his base form with SSJ hair'' is simply a placeholder, to not spoil whatever new form we'll get, and they'll update the intro with the actual form once it's revealed.

[Tani Coyote]

Woohoo, new episode was off to a fun start.

-Basil gets the first KO, knocking out a butterfly lady from Universe 10.

-It turns out the leak that fallen fighters get erased is false. You just appear next to your Gods in the bleachers. The odds of this whole thing being a massive Punk'd have just increased, at least until we see what happens when a whole universe is knocked out. Is there a grace period, or is erasure instant?

--I was terrified to see Zen-Oh using a "GodPad" to click on knocked out fighters. I was expecting the butterfly lady to get erased mid-sentence.

-Quitela tried to get one of his fighters to Sacrificial KO Goku. It didn't work, much to our little mouse villain's annoyance.

-Speaking of Quitela, we know for sure there's a rivalry with Beerus. Beerus absolutely does not like him, though he avoids a shouting match to Whis' amusement.

-Universe 3 tried to use Narirama (the robot dude with tons of modifications) to knock a bunch of people out spinning like a top, but Basil and Hit teamed up to crush his arms it looks like. Their confidence in victory swiftly turned to "OH SHIT."

-We've also got a new credits song and sequence.

-Universe 9 seems to have it out for Universe 7, for whatever reason. The Trio and 2 other fighters are already ganging up on Goku. They presumably know they must eliminate him if they want to win. A sound strategy; I always try to eliminate the strongest opponent in a battle royale in Smash Bros. first, knowing I won't stand a chance one on one.

Tournament is looking fun so far! We still know nothing of Universe 4's 3 opening credits fighters.

[GucciBurr]

47 minutes remain in the tournament ...

how long is that in freeza minutes

[DiamondX]

37 minutes ago, GucciBurr said:

47 minutes remain in the tournament ...

how long is that in freeza minutes

47 episodes.

They really want us to belive that most of the episode happened in 1 minute.

[Pawn]

It's nice to see 18 actually fighting and with a Pride Trooper no less! Hopefully she features more heavily in at least one episode.

[Tani Coyote]

New ending by the way.

...Universe 9 is the only Universe with no representation.

Odds are they're going to be knocked out next episode. We get to see if erasure is instant or delayed until the end.

On the other hand, after the fakeout with Buu, don't look too much into what the opening and credits show. Though the fact the Trio de Dangers, the strongest fighters, are all ganging up on Goku indicates that Goku's Plot Armor is likely going to be the end of Universe 9.

Speaking of fighting Universe 9.

They literally ripped the scene from the credits but gave Goku an aura and changed the background ahahaha. Reminds me of how we get to see two of the same clip of Vegeta punching whoever this episode.

Super's a fun series but I like how the varying quality of animation seems to be something it will never live down.

[DiamondX]

People think that Goku and Gohan will be the final fighters based on the ending.

I can see it happening.

[Tani Coyote]

Meanwhile, more images of the Universe 4 fox/wolf fighter. Now we get to see their legs.

The fact his eyes are closed in all of his appearances except the intro seems to be building up to the idea it'll be really creepy when he finally ends up opening them.

Universe 9's canids might go down easily, but I get the feeling their counterparts from Universe 4 won't be such easy pickings.

[DiamondX]

This might sound crazy, but I think that Freeza will become a good/neutral guy at the end of the saga.

The ending shows him standing with the rest of the team looking at the sun. 

Another thing is that the team is mostly made of Goku's old enemies:

Tien

Piccolo

Vegeta

Freeza

Android 17

Android 18

[Tani Coyote]

1 hour ago, DiamondX said:

This might sound crazy, but I think that Freeza will become a good/neutral guy at the end of the saga.

The ending shows him standing with the rest of the team looking at the sun. 

Another thing is that the team is mostly made of Goku's old enemies:

Tien

Piccolo

Vegeta

Freeza

Android 17

Android 18

I... am not sure I would buy this.

While Vegeta was evil at his peak, a lot of it's because he was never given a chance to be anything else (I think the Trio de Dangers are similar in this way). His father was killed early and he was molded into a soldier by Frieza. Even the "lol kill all the Earthlings" thing Goku had going for him was probably a result of Frieza's oversight of the Saiyans, rather than some innate biological malice. It was only after he left Frieza's service that he started to show slow signs of softening up.

Frieza has been at the top of the world his whole life. He could have easily been like Frost's public persona and been a galactic hero. Instead, the only reason he hasn't slaughtered just about everyone is because even Beerus felt he went too far. His exchange with Sidra and Roh even reaffirms how evil he is; there is nothing that he cares for besides himself.

The only way I can see Frieza being redeemed is if he somehow fell in love with someone. Legitimately, truly in love. That would be a path to redemption, as he would give a shit about someone besides himself. The only two candidates I see for such are Goku, which will 1) never happen and for 2) it's more of a Joker affection than love, and Frost, which probably would never go far because they're both sociopaths.

Let's think here. As horrible as they were, Future 17 and 18 still cared for each other at least. 18 even spared a few people she could have killed. We have not seen any such indication of redemption in Frieza.

Frieza's friendly traits are ultimately only materialized when you serve him (observe how he was towards Ginyu), and he'll quickly turn on you if you disappoint him.

I just don't see any avenues he can take towards being good. Most villains who are redeemed show some positive trait, however small, in their behavior. Frieza has basically none other than his tendency to murder you with a smile.

[Zaysho]

42 minutes ago, Lord Liquiir (Ogilvie) said:

While Vegeta was evil at his peak, a lot of it's because he was never given a chance to be anything else (I think the Trio de Dangers are similar in this way). His father was killed early and he was molded into a soldier by Frieza. Even the "lol kill all the Earthlings" thing Goku had going for him was probably a result of Frieza's oversight of the Saiyans, rather than some innate biological malice. It was only after he left Frieza's service that he started to show slow signs of softening up.

When I read this I mostly think of the early part of FUNi's in-house dub where Vegeta says... exactly this when I don't think either the Japanese version or the manga indicates that Vegeta ever had a problem with being a warrior or killer (hell, the dub contradicts itself later when he gives his "You are number one!" speech). What he hated was being under Freeza's heel, and once Dodoria spilled the beans about Freeza exterminating the Saiyans (the anime has some contradictory material, but Vegeta was in the dark about this) it cemented his desire for revenge and wanting Freeza to be dead at the hands of a Saiyan (go figure his son eventually fulfills this, ha). He would eventually come around simply because he realized he just wants to be stronger than Goku and prove why he's better. Finding people to fight for besides himself probably helped, too.

Goku--I don't know if there was any real programming per se. He was just a baby with a violent streak, but he was molded due to being raised as an Earthling. You can also argue that aspects of his nature are because of his mother, though I don't really like this explanation because it undermines the "nurture over nature" idea that Kamese'nin preached when Raditz came trying to recruit Goku (much as I love Gine as a character and concept, I don't see her as a factor at all because she never had a direct hand in raising Goku anyway--he was in incubation for three years without her intervention if you accept "Dragon Ball Minus" as Goku's origin). But I don't really know how this "infiltrator baby" business works. Are they given orders? Or are they just expected to make everything go boom on the first full moon they see and somebody comes to pick them up later and formally add them to the army?

That said, I don't see Freeza turning over a new leaf. Even when he's given a chance or shown a shred of mercy, he always responds with cruelty and spite. And, honestly, I like that about him. I have no problem with Goku making friends of his former enemies, it's one of the great things about Dragon Ball, but I'm fine with a few lost causes here and there.

[Tani Coyote]

1 hour ago, Zaysho said:

When I read this I mostly think of the early part of FUNi's in-house dub where Vegeta says... exactly this when I don't think either the Japanese version or the manga indicates that Vegeta ever had a problem with being a warrior or killer (hell, the dub contradicts itself later when he gives his "You are number one!" speech). What he hated was being under Freeza's heel, and once Dodoria spilled the beans about Freeza exterminating the Saiyans (the anime has some contradictory material, but Vegeta was in the dark about this) it cemented his desire for revenge and wanting Freeza to be dead at the hands of a Saiyan (go figure his son eventually fulfills this, ha). He would eventually come around simply because he realized he just wants to be stronger than Goku and prove why he's better. Finding people to fight for besides himself probably helped, too.

I'm drawing it less from the dub's choice of word and more from the nature of things. Had Vegeta tried to be heroic, he would have been snuffed out very quickly. He only got out of the Namek fiasco because of the main cast's involvement, or else he'd still be dead.

He could either be a devil and live, or be a saint and die. In fact, take away the Dragon Ball element, and the message we get from anywhere in the series is most good people don't get to live long.

We can say what we want about GT, but I did like the part where he berated Nappa's continued insistence on destruction. Given he no longer had to serve Frieza, not to mention the cruel nature of his death, you'd think Nappa would have used his time in the afterlife to better himself. Nope!

1 hour ago, Zaysho said:

But I don't really know how this "infiltrator baby" business works. Are they given orders? Or are they just expected to make everything go boom on the first full moon they see and somebody comes to pick them up later and formally add them to the army?

Given King Piccolo was able to have Piccolo have preset instructions on what to do, I'd imagine the Saiyans somehow embedded the baby with instructions during their time in space. Subliminal messaging, possible alterations to the brain matter, etc. Such instructions mean little if one knocks one's head and forgets them all.

I assume a Great Ape wouldn't destroy the whole planet in one go, and provided a strong enough warrior came around, a single Saiyan child would be easily disposed of (we know Goku had his fair share of evenly-matched enemies growing up, after all). There's most likely some sort of brainwashing during incubation so that though they are biological, they'll have a strong inclination to destroy as if they were a robot.

1 hour ago, Zaysho said:

That said, I don't see Freeza turning over a new leaf. Even when he's given a chance or shown a shred of mercy, he always responds with cruelty and spite. And, honestly, I like that about him. I have no problem with Goku making friends of his former enemies, it's one of the great things about Dragon Ball, but I'm fine with a few lost causes here and there.

Basically yeah. Batman can't save the Joker, Goku can't save Frieza.

[GucciBurr]

i think goku and gohan will be the u7 stars of the tournament, given this shot

Spoiler

[DiamondX]

People are already making fun of the re-used animation:

https://youtu.be/5C0BU7BOT50

[Tani Coyote]

I mean, yeah.

If you're not a Saiyan yet want to be the hero of the franchise, take a number.

It's why I was legitimately happy the Gods of Destruction, Zen-Oh, etc. all showed up and smacked Goku and co. off their high horse. They're nothing compared to the Gods, and probably never will be anything but.

1 minute ago, DiamondX said:

People are already making fun of the re-used animation:

https://youtu.be/5C0BU7BOT50

I will say. While it is humorous, I will cut the animators some slack for this episode. It was almost all combat scenes when they could have easily chosen to just make it filler, like the Goten and Trunks fighting poachers scene I'm sure is coming soon.

[DiamondX]

I agree. It's not that obvious with most of them and it helps them make other scenes better.

I just thought it was funny.