Zelda Topic

[Chaos Warp]

How come Ocarina, Wind Waker, and ATTLP are allowed sewuels (spirtual or otherwise) but MM is somehow a sacred cow that had no room for expansion whatsoever?

Do you want that perfect masterpiece to get fucked up?

 

No but seriously there's not much else you could do with Termina. 

Edited July 29, 2013 by Chaos Warp

[Remy]

How come Ocarina, Wind Waker, and ATTLP are allowed sewuels (spirtual or otherwise) but MM is somehow a sacred cow that had no room for expansion whatsoever?

 

What would a theoretical sequel even be about? The moon is falling again? SKULLKID RETURNS? The Mask takes another host? None of those ideas are particulalrly compelling. And it's not because I suck at ideas (alright maybe it is shhh) just more that I can't think of anything that even needed to be said.

 

Don't return to Termina. Majora's Mask was an open and closed type story- everything that had to be told in that world, in every single place within it was told during those three days in the game. From it's ancient history to minute details about day to day life. It was done. Covered. Finished. Returning would be like pissing on the grave.

 

Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to another, new isolated world like Termina, tho not Termina itself. Even if being set in Hyrule is a Zelda staple.

[Diogenes]

Man I know Termina. I know it because I spent 3 days in it dozens of times over. I know its places because I traveled to each of its four corners. I know its people because I inserted myself into their lives to help them with their problems. And I like Termina, but I also want to move on to new places and meet new people.

 

Trying to do MM again would be to go against part of why I loved MM to start with; it changed the rules, it was new and interesting in ways I had never seen before.

[Solly]

This is probably all fake, like most Zelda rumors. The red flags here, to me, are the big details they usually wouldn't give out early (like number of dungeons) and the fact that it's practically an interview, loaded with alleged statements from staff, which is the type of thing that would come with a big, formal reveal-- not a leak.

 

And a world as big as Skyrim's? Voice acting in a made-up language? Talk of DLC? Yeah, I don't think that's happening.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Solly

[Octarine]

Even with the weird precedent set by A Link Between Worlds, it seems beyond weird that the Wii U's big original Zelda title would be a direct sequel to anything, never mind Twilight Princess. I know TP did pretty well here, but didn't it underperform in Japan?

 

I dunno. We already know that Zelda Wii U's going to be open-ish, and a return to a grittier art style after Wind Waker HD doesn't seem unlikely, but if they really were trying to rope in the Skyrim crowd, why not have the game be a fresh start? It's not like the series hasn't carried art styles between unrelated games before, and there wasn't much about Twilight Princess that demanded continuing.

[Sami]

And a world as big as Skyrim's? Voice acting in a made-up language? Talk of DLC? Yeah, I don't think that's happening.

... :C

I should have known it all sounded too good to be true. Oh well, then. Back to not giving a shit about what they do with these games.

[Candescence]

This is probably all fake, like most Zelda rumors. The red flags here, to me, are the big details they usually wouldn't give out early (like number of dungeons) and the fact that it's practically an interview, loaded with alleged statements from staff, which is the type of thing that would come with a big, formal reveal-- not a leak.

 

And a world as big as Skyrim's? Voice acting in a made-up language? Talk of DLC? Yeah, I don't think that's happening.

Yeah, this whole thing reeks of fake, as the article itself notes.

 

Don't really care about voice acting, and to be perfectly honest, the less like Skyrim the next Zelda game is, the better. Vanilla Skyrim is boring as fuck, completely overrated. The last thing I want is a massive, bland overworld and dungeons that mostly all look the fucking same.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Shirou Emiya

[Blue Blood]

That rumour sounded awesome, apart from the bit about "no more motion controls". I would love for at least one more game in the series to include the 1:1 motion controls before going back to buttons. That's not to say I never want them to go back to regular buttons and I would like to see how they can use the GamePad well in Zelda games, but the motion controls in SS were just so enjoyable that I'd be hugely disappointed if they ended up being a one-time thing.

 

It's so likely fake anyway that it's nothing to get worried about just yet.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Blue Blood

[Sami]

I want to apologize in advance if I become a ranting mess if they go for motion controls again. The rumor of their removal is just too sweet. It's like dangling a carrot in front of a rabbit and then snatching it away.

That's just not right, man. :c

[Soniman]

Seeing as how Skyward Sword handled the motion controls, you will forgive me if im not a bit peeved by the potential for expansion on said concept possibly thrown away.

[SuperLink]

I liked the motion controls and they were well-done imo (though they coulda been way better and smoother), so I hope they return someday. Keyword someday, not now, I want to see how they can genuinely evolve traditional Zelda in a direction besides what we're used to.

 

Also on the Skyrim comparisons, Skyrim is Skyrim and Zelda is Zelda and they have hugely different game-design philosophies despite any similarities they may share in fantasy tropes. Even if Skyrim isn't my kind of game I recognise it's good, but I also recognise that Zelda should absolutely not have to become another game that already exists. Not many games like Zelda exist even after all this time, I genuinely don't think anyone would benefit if Zelda tried to become a Skyrim-like game.

 

Like, Skyrim already exists. The fans of Skyrim have Skyrim, and the fans of Zelda would be left with something that isn't Zelda at all. Everyone kinda loses?? Before I get called out for being a Skyrim hater, I'd make the same argument to anyone who suggested Skyrim become more like Zelda. The industry doesn't benefit from game a being more like game b, it benefits from game a and game b doing their own thing, and then game c coming along and also doing its own thing while also offering new ideas that inspire competition and ideas in other games. Inspirations, yes.

 

But Zelda can evolve endlessly without becoming another game that already exists, certainly. If you don't like Zelda as it is, it's better to accept you don't like it than force it out of its critically acclaimed modes of game-design because a lot of people find it sublime, with good reason, even if that reason isn't yours.

 

Sure I feel like I'm losing out for not enjoying games like Skyrim sometimes, but if it was something I enjoyed, the people who like it for what it is would possibly lose that.

 

Seeing as how Skyward Sword handled the motion controls, you will forgive me if im not a bit peeved by the potential for expansion on said concept possibly thrown away.

I'm not worried about it vanishing, I don't think Nintendo are going to drop those kinds of ideas for good even if they take a fresh break from them.

Edited July 29, 2013 by SuperLink

[Kuzu]

Can't they just have depending on how you want to play? The GameCube version of Twilight Princess had this if you played it on the Wii.

[Solly]

I'm honestly not expecting motion controls to return, because I think the focus is going to be on what they can use the gamepad for. But if they do return, they'll probably be a lot more accurate. Hardware limitations sorta held Skyward Sword back, in that department. 

Can't they just have depending on how you want to play? The GameCube version of Twilight Princess had this if you played it on the Wii.

The motion controls in Twilight Princess were entirely based around using waggle to substitute a button.

 

In Skyward Sword, the game's built around you being able to move your sword in a specific direction. They can't easily replicate that with buttons or traditional control methods.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Solly

[Wraith]

I doubt they'll use motion control. They have a controller that could work perfectly with Zelda with the gamepad. To build it around motion would be a waste of potential.

[Kuzu]

I'm honestly not expecting motion controls to return, because I think the focus is going to be on what they can use the gamepad for. But if they do return, they'll probably be a lot more accurate. Hardware limitations sorta held Skyward Sword back, in that department.

The motion controls in Twilight Princess were entirely based around using waggle to substitute a button.

In Skyward Sword, the game's built around you being able to move your sword in a specific direction. They can't easily replicate that with buttons or traditional control methods.

God I hate being on my phone. But Im saying, if the game doesn't revolve around motion control like SS is it possible.

[Solly]

God I hate being on my phone. But Im saying, if the game doesn't revolve around motion control like SS is it possible.

I don't think the people who are asking for motion controls want a game where they don't contribute enough to be mandatory. It's kind of a "go big or go home' situation.

 

After re-reading this thread, I noticed this hasn't been posted. A statement from Aonuma, earlier this month. Unlike the current rumor, he actually said this.

“It’s not that anyone is telling me we have to change the formula. I want to change it. I’m kind of getting tired of it. If I’m getting tired of it, then I’m sure other people are getting tired of it. There is an essential ‘Zelda’ I feel we need to stay true to. We are still testing things, exploring our options. We haven’t landed anywhere at this point. We’re still seeing what we can do.

 

What I want to do, not specifically with Link but with the ‘Zelda’ franchise, I’m always striving to make something no one else can, something that is so distinctly ‘Zelda’ that it can only be done in a ‘Zelda’ game. There are times when I hit walls and I can’t come up with new ideas and I think maybe I should just give up and quit, but eventually a new idea comes along and I’m proud of myself. It breeds new life into the creative process.

 

I go through these phases, over and over again. I hope those high points keep on coming.”

I know it's such a vague statement that I shouldn't be getting excited, but my imagination gets the better of me. 

Edited July 29, 2013 by Solly

[Sami]

*Five minutes ago*

"Nope, back to not caring..."

*Reads interview*

> Aonuma is tired of the formula

> Testing new ideas

> Wants to be unique and recognizable

Oh, fuck me. I care again. Somebody snap me out of this, I don't know how much more my heart can take.

The first part in particular makes me very, very happy. I'm tired it it too, Aonuma. I loved it a few years ago, but I'm tired of it too. :'D

[SuperLink]

Oh another thing that I'm not sure was noted here yet is the fact that Nintendo have heard the fans who want a game with Zelda as the protagonist. http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/06/interview_zelda_producer_eiji_aonuma_talks_dlc_missing_dungeons_and_majoras_mask

 

It may not happen any time soon but.. Nintendo are considering it and seem quite proud of promoting their female protagonists lately, and that very thought makes me excited.

Edited July 29, 2013 by SuperLink

[Diogenes]

In Skyward Sword, the game's built around you being able to move your sword in a specific direction. They can't easily replicate that with buttons or traditional control methods.

What if it was like Metal Gear Rising? Using the right stick, that is.

[Rinzler]

I love how everyone is acts ng like Zelda is a mediocre series.

[SuperLink]

I love how everyone is acts ng like Zelda is a mediocre series.

I don't think anyone is, I think Zelda fans just have understandably ridiculously high standards.

We criticise it because we love it <3

[Solly]

What if it was like Metal Gear Rising? Using the right stick, that is.

That could work. I haven't played MGR yet, so I haven't experienced that for myself yet, but if they weren't doing motion controls, I'd honestly rather have a fully controllable camera. 

[Diogenes]

That could work. I haven't played MGR yet, so I haven't experienced that for myself yet, but if they weren't doing motion controls, I'd honestly rather have a fully controllable camera.

Hold a button to toggle between sword control and camera control?

[Solly]

I love how everyone is acts ng like Zelda is a mediocre series.

Nah, Zelda fans just hold the games to a really high standard, and wanna see the series go in new directions.  

Hold a button to toggle between sword control and camera control?

That could also work. Actually, it would also free up a lot of buttons on the face of the gamepad, which is one of my main gripes with the Wii remote. If they could make that feel good to control, I could dig it.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Solly

[Sami]

They could have a Rising-esque "Ninja Mode" button where time slows down and you use your finger to swipe in different directions to slash your sword. Obviously not something the entire combat system should be based around (Rising has a very intuitive, fun combat system outside its cutting mechanics), but it could be neat.

Actually... come to think of it, I'd rather have the items play a bigger roll in normal combat. Something like... oh! How about having the clawshots work something like the Werehog's arms in Sonic Unleashed? Yank small enemies toward you, pull yourself towards large ones, shoot the chains out for ranges attacks, and so forth? Or the boomerang... uh, maybe something like the boomerangs in those Ty games, but less powerful? You could throw a boomerang from afar to stun an enemy, quickly switch to the clawshot to yank yourself towards it, and then finish it off with your sword.

I'm just tossing ideas around here - I haven't played any games with weapon variety as crazy as what Zelda would have if they used the items in interesting new ways. There's a lot of potential there. Zelda's a puzzle-adventure game after all, and while the puzzles are as good as ever, it's no longer the cream of the crop when it comes to "adventure". Not even close, haha. Make combat and movement more fluid (full camera control please), and I'm sold.

Also better storytelling plz.