New Smash Bros?

[Tornado]

No, I didn't.

Your point was a strawman because I never once claimed that MLP was a fighting game. The difference here is, my argument isn't a strawman. My argument seems to be the only one getting misrepresented, because up until remy's recent post, no-one seemed to have a goddamned clue of what it was, and even when there was hope that my argument had finally been realised, it just devolved back into crap.

Try harder.

I don't even think you know what that word means considering how much you throw it out whenever someone dares question the infallible logic of bringing up immaterial facts in a specific debate just so you can get the last word in.

Hence me bringing up a perfectly valid definition of the word combo to intentionally invoke a strawman, with the reasoning that I did it (perhaps not surprisingly, in hindsight) going right over your head as you fell over yourself at the chance to respond by yelling "strawman" once again.

Edited July 12, 2011 by Tornado

[Facehugger]

Your statement is correct providing we actually bother to use the literary definition, but it is still entirely irrelevant to what we are discussing. We are discussing fighting games and as such, the fighting game definition is what is applicable and reasonable to use. It is the definition that is actually relevant to what we are discussing

That is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. It is not irrelevant, as I have pointed out numerous times, it is most definitely relevant to this argument. Also, the logic behind something is not invalidated on a basis of 'can't be bothered'. Simply because you do not wish to use that definition, that doesn't mean the logic of the statement is voided.

Yes you are. In fact you are the main one who is.

No, I am not. You and Blacklightning are the primary culprits of this, (At least Blacklightning outright acknowledged my viewpoint) You've spent god-knows how much time formulating posts, still refusing to contest my primary argument properly. (For the upteenth time, saying it isn't relevant to fighting games doesn't invalidate the notion as a standalone statement.)

You still have not made a proper response to those.

Actually, if you care to double-check, I did respond. In fact, I believe I stated several posts ago that I was somewhat off-base with that claim.

You've entirely ignored the majority of the post that I am referring to and keep harping on a point that isn't relevant to the one that was the core of said post.

Baring in mind what I've just said, who is the real ignorant one? You're the one harping on about a point I've already admitted I was out of line in making, and since then have responded to it again. Also, my point is completely relevant, as I have said before. It's the core of my goddamned argument, for goodness sake.

If that's the case then that means you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

Not entirely, but by this point, amusement is the primary driving force.

I don't even think you know what that word means considering how much you throw it out whenever someone dares question the infallible logic of bringing up immaterial facts in a specific debate just so you can get the last word in.

I know what the term means, and use it as appropriate. The main example being, when a strawman is made. (Weird, I know.)

with the reasoning that I did it (perhaps not surprisingly, in hindsight) going right over your head as you fell over yourself at the chance to respond by yelling "strawman" once again.

I did not 'fall over myself'. I identified and explained the strawman clearly and concisely. Seriously, what was the purpose of this? It hasn't actually done anything detrimental to my case, or done anything to support anyone else's. Edited July 12, 2011 by Facehugger

[Carbo]

Okay - enough. Drop this argument. It was tolerable while you guys were still discussing the actual game but now it's devolved into figuring out who is pulling strawmen and trying to prove each other's superiority through massive multi quotes and nitpicking. If you guys are insistent on taking this bullshit further several parties have already suggested the best solution of all; take it over PMs, but the entire last goddamn page is a fucking broken record and it's just embarrassing to read. Seeing this go any further is outright exhausting.

[w00tkins]

The wait for this game is going to kill me.

I hope we see some good Earthbound representation this time, specifically Giygas.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

The wait for this game is going to kill me.

I hope we see some good Earthbound representation this time, specifically Giygas.

You can't comprehend how something like that would work out unless you're going with his alien form instead of his "evil embodiment" form.

[#EndyGate]

You can't comprehend how something like that would work out unless you're going with his alien form instead of his "evil embodiment" form.

Well even as an assist or boss it'd be pretty epic

[speedfreak]

They really don't have too many "big" Nintendo characters to pull from. At this point I feel a few more big third party characters are a must. Sure there are a good amount of cool Nintendo characters they could use, but very few of them are "big", if you know what I mean.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

They really don't have too many "big" Nintendo characters to pull from. At this point I feel a few more big third party characters are a must. Sure there are a good amount of cool Nintendo characters they could use, but very few of them are "big", if you know what I mean.

Or they could surprise us with the Nintendo characters that aren't big and make some use of them for this game. Seriously, take Peach and Captain Falcon: none of them had any kind of moveset that was present in their respective series and yet Smash Bros gives them some combat use from scratch. Heck, even Fox McCloud deserves a mention here, as his combat was mostly shooting from his Arwing. So they give us a reflector, a fire fox, and in Melee they give us the Fox Illusion.

I could go through each respective Nintendo series and pull out a number of characters they could use. They may not be big, but they can definitely be put in this fighting game.

[speedfreak]

Or they could surprise us with the Nintendo characters that aren't big and make some use of them for this game. Seriously, take Peach and Captain Falcon: none of them had any kind of moveset that was present in their respective series and yet Smash Bros gives them some combat use from scratch. Heck, even Fox McCloud deserves a mention here, as his combat was mostly shooting from his Arwing. So they give us a reflector, a fire fox, and in Melee they give us the Fox Illusion.

I could go through each respective Nintendo series and pull out a number of characters they could use. They may not be big, but they can definitely be put in this fighting game.

That's all well and good, but honestly I WANT at least some new "big" characters. It's not very exciting to get a new game with only second or third tier Nintendo characters being added. There are some pretty big characters Nintendo could add, but they don't have any new characters left to add that would be as cool as Megaman would be for example IMO.

[#EndyGate]

I'd love it if the Duck Hunt dog was playable, maybe even the Balloon Fighter, or a character from Animal Crossing

Also do you think there might be a few characters exclusive to the 3DS version or Wii U version?

Edited July 15, 2011 by Cero

[Thirsty Pocket]

Well even as an assist or boss it'd be pretty epic

I was always hoping for Giygas to appear in Smash Bros as a stage, called the Devils Machine, that appears to be Giygas's lair with the Devil's machine in the background, but in the middle of the fight it gets shut off, and the background goes dark to reveal the red, smoky evil looking face in the background. Maybe occasionally it would attack the stage with a pink wave, similar to, but not as powerful as, Tabuu's instant kill wave that you had to side step to dodge.

Of course if Giygas's alien body was playable and functioned similar to Mewtwo, I wouldn't be complaining either.

It's true that Nitnendo hasn't really had any new IP's that could work well in Brawl since Pikmin, but there is still plenty of untapped potential in the older games.

Joy Mech Fight ( Nintendo's ONLY other fighting game by the way )

Panel De Pon

Punch-Out!!

Devil World

Magical Starsign

Shin Onigashima

Nazo no Murasame Jō​

For the Frog the Bell Tolls

Muddy Mole

Custom Robo

Chibi Robo

Animal Crossing

Mach Rider

Balloon Fight

Nintendo Wars

...I'm sure I'm missing quite a few. And if he put his mind to it, Sakurai can make a character from each one of these series work.

And aside from that, there's still plenty of iconic characters left in the Mario, Donkey Kong, Warioware, Metroid, MOTHER and Fire Emblem games that could be used. ( I don't get why 9-volt, wasn't at least referenced in a game like Smash Bros... )

[Marcello]

It won't happen, but I want Amaterasu in SSB4.

[Blacklightning]

After we got Dedede in Brawl I'd say it's only fair we at least got King K.Rool and Ridely in some form next up, it's certaintly been fairly overdue. Besides that, MOTHER could definently do with a lot more representation, preferably of the less PSI-oriented brand. If I don't see a playable Jeff or Flint in the next game I just might cry. Same again for Metroid - not that it's particularly surprising we only have one playable character from it so far, but something between a choice of Dark Samus, Gandrayda or Sylux would be pretty nice.

...I'm also trying REALLY hard not to view Smash Bros as nothing more than a playable fanwank at this stage, but after Brawl it's kinda hard not to. It's like franchise representation is all that matters to us anymore.

[Remy]

What about Poo, man!! Although I have to admit I'd still prefer Flint over him

[Blacklightning]

About the only thing Poo ever really had over Ness was PK Starstorm, and they've already given that to Ness anyway, so unless they switch his FS to PK Rockin or something I'm not entirely sure what could make Poo stand out terribly well. A transformation move might not be a bad start though.

[w00tkins]

Yeah I didn't mean Giygas as a playable character, I don't think that would work. Just some acknowledgement of him. He is a major villain after all and I don't think he's even been mentioned in smash.

How about the Masked Man? I always thought he looked kinda cool. And he has lightning. o3o

[Sean]

Ness vs. Mewtwo is the closest we'll ever get to a Giygas battle in an SSB game... if you pretend that Ness is Ninten.

[Thirsty Pocket]

I almost forgot about Flint. Don't I feel bad. But I honestly see Duster or masked man being more likely than Flint. You know who else might be neat? Yokuba/Fassad ( I'd so laugh if they actually used the name Fassad for localization. ) and Salsa as a sort of team thing, not like the ice climber, Fassad is the one you control first and formost, but you can have Salsa do some of the monkey's specials, use an electric attack by pressing the shock collar when someone is near you ( I'd imagine Salsa can't stray too far from Fassad unlike the Ice Climbers ) They could let Fassad do a bum rush and throw bombs too. But... at the same time, I'm just not sure I could see this happening.

As for series representation being more important than anything smash bros... perhaps the same could be said for any crossover game. Not that I agree that it should be this way.

[Muscle Man]

I want Kirby's final Smash to be Mass Attack. He clones into 10 Kirbys, and then they all go on a rampage.

[Thirsty Pocket]

I want Kirby's final Smash to be Mass Attack. He clones into 10 Kirbys, and then they all go on a rampage.

Something tells me if he does get a new FS, it's gonna be the really big sword from Kirby Returns to Dreamland.

I don't care either way, I love Kirby, but I don't play as him.

[The drunkard from space!]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but how would you guys feel of Sonic's Final Smash was the Werehog? Background goes black and everything lol.

[null]

I just thought of this last night; Whatever the Subspace Emissary replacement would be, it should be an open-ended Metroidvania environment, where the power-ups are replaced by the fighters. Think about it; You start off with Mario, and at some point you encounter a door that needs power to open, or a walkway that's too hot to walk on. Mario obviously can't do anything about those, but once you find where they're hidden, Pikachu can open the door, and Ice Climbers can use their Ice Shot to cool down the walkway.

Add in familiar Nintendo enemies, bosses, and worlds, and we might have a winner.

[Thirsty Pocket]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but how would you guys feel of Sonic's Final Smash was the Werehog? Background goes black and everything lol.

I wouldn't mind a change in Final Smash for Sonic. But not the Werehog. All that would really do is make him into a slower stronger character, like Bowser. More of a transformation than a final Smash, but I don't want Werehog to be playable. I think some air support from Tails in the Tornado would be cool.

[Solly]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but how would you guys feel of Sonic's Final Smash was the Werehog? Background goes black and everything lol.

Super Sonic feels like the only logical choice for Sonic's Final Smash.

Also Kirby should have the microphone ability. Why is that not the first thing they thought of in Brawl? The chef pot thing is so easy to dodge too.

[Kamicciolo]

Maybe they gave him the Cook power over the Mike because it'd be too similar to Donkey Kong's Final Smash. Though really they might have been better off giving Kirby the Crash ability or something like that.

Since we're talking about movesets though, one thing I kinda hope to see is maybe for the movesets of the veteran characters to be mixed up a good bit, since by now they're bound to be getting a little stale . Cheif among them I'd like to see both Bowser and Wario's Smashes and Special moves recieve some changes. With Bowser I'd wanna see him gain moves influenced by Inside Story (so maybe change his forward smash to the punch attack, or have his Upwards Special be the Spikeball in that minigame). And with Wario, I'd like it if his moves would better reflect his appearances in Wario Land (since it was pitifully under-represented in the last game).

Also, I'll definetly be looking forward to seeing what remixes get included though this time around (heres hoping for another version of the Dedede Theme :V).