Sonic Frontiers Leaks & Spoilers Thread - PLEASE READ OP

[The Deleter]

A lot of people getting concerned of the impressions others have in terms of length here.

I also estimate it will take less than an hour to finish the first overworld, for any experienced Sonic player. The cyberspace stages are fairly obvious to find. The key requirements are also insanely low iirc, and should be easily unlocked with the stages we have seen already. The bar to complete the first island is insanely low, and looks 100% doable in a short time for any player focused on progress itself.

If you don't think it will be a short time for you to complete, that's fine, but let others be worried about their impressions of how much the game requires of them if they want. They're a better judge of what the game can offer them in terms of content than you are.

8 minutes ago, Shaddy Zaphod said:

The titan fight looks really repetitive, but I'm not sure if that has anything to do with Sonic's combat skill being level 1, and thus maybe not doing much damage.

Difficulty selecting also increases the health of enemies as well; could be a factor in why the attacks did so little damage

There's also the possibility of more Super specific skills not being utilized, considering how they need more experimental button presses to activate, like stomping after a combo

[light-gaia]

57 minutes ago, Ratcicle King said:

There's a reupload on youtube, tho' it'll definitely get nuked soon

  Hide contents

The intro cutscene looks good, however, it's sad that's not CGI.

The Super Sonic boos fight looks incredible. Super Sonic combat looks like Bayonetta

[A super No.1 washedupgamer]

Awww...

Spoiler

They broke up the tradition of the famous faceplant.

 

[ZinogreVolt]

From a presentation standpoint, that Super Sonic boss fight looks spectacular. Giving him Wicked Weaves is cool, and I think him being able to make so many afterimages at once is a logical endpoint for a character's whose whole gimmick is to do the go fast. The attacks of the titan also look like they have an appropriate amount of weight, and him bitchsmacking Super Sonic away if you mess up is cool.

I feel like the fight should be a bit more involved given how long this fight takes, but I think the risk of a fight potentially taking too long (and you subsequently running out of rings) is also an interesting trade-off for making a beeline for the boss without upgrading strength at least a few times beforehand.

[light-gaia]

2 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

A lot of people getting concerned of the impressions others have in terms of length here.

I also estimate it will take less than an hour to finish the first overworld, for any experienced Sonic player. The cyberspace stages are fairly obvious to find. The key requirements are also insanely low iirc, and should be easily unlocked with the stages we have seen already. The bar to complete the first island is insanely low, and looks 100% doable in a short time for any player focused on progress itself.

If you don't think it will be a short time for you to complete, that's fine, but let others be worried about their impressions of how much the game requires of them if they want. They're a better judge of what the game can offer them in terms of content than you are.

Difficulty selecting also increases the health of enemies as well; could be a factor in why the attacks did so little damage

There's also the possibility of more Super specific skills not being utilized, considering how they need more experimental button presses to activate, like stomping after a combo

It's still better to finish the first island in 1 hour than finishing the whole game in 1 hour (Forces). However, I think it's possible to finish the island quickly if you just rush to the main objectives

[The Deleter]

3 hours ago, The Deleter said:

Absolutely flabberghasted (MASSIVE STORY SPOILERS)

Spoiler

 

So I know some people on twitter are already losing their mind over this, and how it looks

But I am here to tell you, if you did look at this spoiler, do not get your hopes up... (ALSO MASSIVE SPOILERS)

Spoiler

There is a koko in the middle of the body lol

The kokos are the aliens/spirits

 

[Shaddy Zaphod]

9 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

Difficulty selecting also increases the health of enemies as well; could be a factor in why the attacks did so little damage

It does? Ew. This is just universally a bad decision in pretty much all games; I hate how prevalent it is in gaming. It makes sense that enemies should do more damage, but turning them into HP sponges will literally never be fun, it just makes it more tedious if the actual process of fighting them isn't any more involved (maybe it makes sense for more numbers-based games? I don't play any of those, action RPGs are the most I've got and it definitely still sucks in those). Guess that puts me on the wait list for the inevitable rebalance mod.

3 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

But I am here to tell you, if you did look at this spoiler, do not get your hopes up... (ALSO MASSIVE SPOILERS)

  Reveal hidden contents

There is a koko in the middle of the body lol

The kokos are the aliens/spirits

Spoiler

Gonna go ahead and guess whatever this thing is is being part-Coco a takeoff on Chaos being a mutated Chao. This is a similar-but-different demigod

 

 

[azoo]

To give a more thorough take on the Titan fight;

Spoiler

That is maddeningly repetitive, that health bar takes ages to drop, and the constant camera movement and flashes make this look almost unplayable in how disorienting it comes off. It doesn’t look easy to aim for a specific spot on the titan, and the moves on offer when you make a connection are incredibly low in variety, leading to a lot of repeating combo animations. That combined with the multiple (again, repeating!) QTE button mashes makes it feel like we’re gonna be fighting a Perfect Dark Gaia tier boss at the end of every island. Which is awesome! Because that was the worst part of Unleashed bar none! WOO!

Even if it’s made quicker by leveling up, this looks extremely unfun to play, and I can hardly tell what’s going on when the camera (not the cam recording, the in-game one) is violently thrusting everywhere.

I was honestly wondering where the classic Sonic Team jank would raise its head full force and test the patience of the player, and here it is. Yikes and a half. That’s fuckin rough.

 

[Nuggets]

13 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

Yes they are. They are explicitly speedrunning the game. The people who played in the "6 Chaos Emeralds in 15 Minutes" video were speedrunning the game. The description of the video even explains the best known way to get all the emeralds. It was a speedrun. The people who are leaking the boss are also speedrunning the game--they didn't even level Sonic up. 

They are not playing the game normally, they were explicitly trying to see how far and how much they can get in 15 minutes--and in the latter's case, it is impossible for them to do all seven stages and the boss and all the things they would have had to do in the Open Zone in 15 minutes.

Ok. Then they spent maybe 30-40 minutes with the game learning it and then were able to beat 1/5 of it in maybe 40 more minutes. 

You ignored everything else in my other post so I won’t rehash it at length - It takes most games longer than 30 minutes on the first try to break like that, broken demo or no. This doesn’t sound like a 30 hour game. 

[ZinogreVolt]

Just now, Shaddy Zaphod said:

It does? Ew. This is just universally a bad decision in pretty much all games; I hate how prevalent it is in gaming. It makes sense that enemies should do more damage, but turning them into HP sponges will literally never be fun, it just makes it more tedious if the actual process of fighting them isn't any more involved (maybe it makes sense for more numbers-based games? I don't play any of those, action RPGs are the most I've got and it definitely still sucks in those). Guess that puts me on the wait list for the inevitable rebalance mod.

I think it depends heavily on the game. More boss HP can make it so that the player has to think of creative ways to whittle down their HP (which can be fun for action RPGs like Kingdom Hearts, it's why stuff like Lv. 1 runs are so popular). But there usually has to be driven by intrinsically fun elements involved to help that along, like how fun it is to build combos up and the like. Frontiers' combat looks fun, but it doesn't strike me as being particularly combo-driven. It's driven by enemy interaction, where I feel enemies just doing more damage would be better, since it would emphasize learning patterns. I'm not sure how much leveling up will smooth this over, though.

[Sega DogTagz]

14 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

Ok. Then they spent maybe 30-40 minutes with the game learning it and then were able to beat 1/5 of it in maybe 40 more min

I don't consider leaving half of the first island virtually untouched as beating 1/5 of the game - but whatever.

 

You can "beat" horizon zero dawn without clearing the fog of 2/3 of the world map... No one is bemoaning a lack of content there. If you choose to do the bear minimum, you can't then slide turn and claim the game is too short. 

No one is saying you have to go for 100% completion, but if your running past perfectly good objective markers and points of interest to reach the handful of missions that you know dish out emeralds, and then choose to leave the first island before you even explore it ... That's not a lack of content. That's not something the masses should be concerned about. 

 

Quite frankly, the second they put a grind gate in to discourage people from doing that, unleashed memes will probably kick them in the balls. So lose lose for Sonic Team. Lol 

[Ratcicle King]

19 minutes ago, The Deleter said:

So I know some people on twitter are already losing their mind over this, and how it looks

But I am here to tell you, if you did look at this spoiler, do not get your hopes up... (ALSO MASSIVE SPOILERS)

  Hide contents

There is a koko in the middle of the body lol

The kokos are the aliens/spirits

Spoiler

Ah yes, plot twist, the kokos are just canon seedrians and the villain is their metarex.

 

I feel like Forces got people downright traumatized here when it comes to game length. I don't expect this to be 30 hours long, by far, even on 100%, but I doubt it'll be 5 hours long in people's first time, not because you won't know what to do or where to go, but because this looks like a fun game to fuck around. You're gonna get lost exploring, gonna waste time in combat leveling up, gonna do missions for the hell of it. Forces isn't bad because it's short, Generations is a short game too but it has stuff to play around with, level replayability, missions, collectibles, achievements, all that jazz.

Forces' length is a point of contempt because the game is devoid of any substance beyond its levels, the extra stages were just as short and not even fun to play, the collectibles were three tiers of the same exact thing and gave you nothing beyond an achievement, the extra wispons showed 0 change, the cosmetics were pretty basic, all in all, you had no incentive to ever go back to that game once done. 

Generations on the other hand, not only had fun levels filled with extra routes but had plenty of side content to keep you coming back either to 100% it or just fuck around and I feel like Frontiers is aiming for that, It's supposed to be a game you keep returning to regardless of how long the main campaign is, testing movement tech, messing with the combat and collecting stuff because with the level up system, collectibles actually give a sense of proper progression.

Plus people need to realize whoever did that guide DID in fact optimize his route because he chose the easiest ways to collect all emeralds, avoiding combat, picking the quickest cyberspace stages, doing missions here and there once that well dried and abusing the freedom to choose the method of picking the chaos emeralds, he HAD to have some previous understanding here, you're not just gonna trip and find five emeralds on your first run, this was a planned route, it's the difference between someone getting all red rings on their first try on a Generations stage by optimizing their route and someone playing the stage the first time and finding like, 2 by accident..

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

30 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

Ok. Then they spent maybe 30-40 minutes with the game learning it and then were able to beat 1/5 of it in maybe 40 more minutes. 

Not really by the looks of it. 20% completion implies actually beating that much of the entire game. 

Given the min-maxxing and corners cut to get to that point, that looks to not be the case you think it is.

[The Deleter]

All respect to the leakers and the doubters of the Super Sonic boss but I'm better, built different.

I can avoid the jank because I use my eyes and know my enemy's weakness.

Do I feel sorry for those who aim for the body and get disorientated?

No; the head will always be the fastest way to knock an opponent unconscious, and any player still in the game who attacks the chest instead deserves to fail in life.

Do I have pity for those who dislike mashing a button fast enough their fingers break out in a sweat?

Also no; everyone on this green earth has the ability to move their fingers; stop being lazy and apply yourself.

While they are out here complaining about methods of attack being repetitive, I acknowledge my growth potential and implement new ways to do that task, as there is never only one way to do things.

You are given a wealth of options in life.

Realize this, and the world is yours.

Stop trying to blame your problems on anything but your lack of perspective.

- TD

 

Spoiler

No I cannot commit to the bit entirely, there definitely needs to be accessibility options for the QTEs lol

 

[Kuzu]

34 minutes ago, azoo said:

To give a more thorough take on the Titan fight;

  Reveal hidden contents

That is maddeningly repetitive, that health bar takes ages to drop, and the constant camera movement and flashes make this look almost unplayable in how disorienting it comes off. It doesn’t look easy to aim for a specific spot on the titan, and the moves on offer when you make a connection are incredibly low in variety, leading to a lot of repeating combo animations. That combined with the multiple (again, repeating!) QTE button mashes makes it feel like we’re gonna be fighting a Perfect Dark Gaia tier boss at the end of every island. Which is awesome! Because that was the worst part of Unleashed bar none! WOO!

Even if it’s made quicker by leveling up, this looks extremely unfun to play, and I can hardly tell what’s going on when the camera (not the cam recording, the in-game one) is violently thrusting everywhere.

I was honestly wondering where the classic Sonic Team jank would raise its head full force and test the patience of the player, and here it is. Yikes and a half. That’s fuckin rough.

Spoiler

Yea that was...bad lmao. I can't even sugarcoat it. I didn't even know what was happening for most of it.

 

[Voyant]

52 minutes ago, azoo said:

To give a more thorough take on the Titan fight;

  Hide contents

That is maddeningly repetitive, that health bar takes ages to drop, and the constant camera movement and flashes make this look almost unplayable in how disorienting it comes off. It doesn’t look easy to aim for a specific spot on the titan, and the moves on offer when you make a connection are incredibly low in variety, leading to a lot of repeating combo animations. That combined with the multiple (again, repeating!) QTE button mashes makes it feel like we’re gonna be fighting a Perfect Dark Gaia tier boss at the end of every island. Which is awesome! Because that was the worst part of Unleashed bar none! WOO!

Even if it’s made quicker by leveling up, this looks extremely unfun to play, and I can hardly tell what’s going on when the camera (not the cam recording, the in-game one) is violently thrusting everywhere.

I was honestly wondering where the classic Sonic Team jank would raise its head full force and test the patience of the player, and here it is. Yikes and a half. That’s fuckin rough.

 

As an avid bayonetta fan, I'm gonna have to hard disagree here. If you think this is "disorienting" then more than likely you never played a bayo boss. I would like to know more about how this boss works mechanically though. QTE don't bother me (as doing a dodge at the right time in a bayo game to trigger witch time is basically that to some extent.)

It doesn't look that bad man. You're over exaggerating especially since beloved games have that kind of craziness with their boss fights. 

Of course I don't expect Bayonetta tier depth from this game at all but I love the spectacle attempt here. Good stuff. 

[ZinogreVolt]

A lot of the Emeralds on Kronos look like they can be found in the immediate area after the tutorial island. The fact that so much of the island can be left unexplored while you still grab all the emeralds doesn't strike me as bad design per se, since it's the starting area and they want to ease new people into the format. But that being said, I hope (and expect, based on footage of Ares and Island 3) that emerald collection is more involved and prolonged. I wanna feel like I've really gotten to know an island's layout once I've cleared it.

[Voyant]

Oh to add the one thing I do find pretty Jank though is when Sonic does the after image attack on the head and the titan goes goes flying. I wonder if they are struggling with that due to the sheer size of that thing in comparison to Sonic. That camera can most def be better though but at least the boss resets to neutral. It would be a major issue if it kept being aggressive afterward. 

That said this thing is fucking huge. Like... Sapientia big.

It being bi pedal can sure cause some problems too. I hope some of the others are kinda like the above. Be a lot easier to handle. 

[Nuggets]

2 minutes ago, Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon said:

Not really by the looks of it. 20% completion implies actually beating that much of the entire game. 

Given the min-maxxing and corners cut to get to that point, that looks to not be the case you think it is.

 

21 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

I don't consider leaving half of the first island virtually untouched as beating 1/5 of the game - but whatever.

You can "beat" horizon zero dawn without clearing the fog of 2/3 of the world map... No one is bemoaning a lack of content there. If you choose to do the bear minimum, you can't then slide turn and claim the game is too short. 

No one is saying you have to go for 100% completion, but if your running past perfectly good objective markers and points of interest to reach the handful of missions that you know dish out emeralds, and then choose to leave the first island before you even explore it ... That's not a lack of content. That's not something the masses should be concerned about.

I don’t really see the point in splitting hairs like this. They did a bare minimum run, sure, but they completed the objectives you need to get through to the second island and did so in under an hour (again, being generous. It looks possible to do in under 30). It doesn’t matter if you didn’t get every ring in a stage in Sonic 3, or even skipped a whole alternate path - you beat the stage. 

the way they play isn’t how I or most normal people would play. but with the cyberspace stages being as short as they are, I can’t imagine it’d take that much longer - double the time maybe. And that’s okay! I never said this game was going to have a lack of content - it looks to have a lot of fun stuff to do, especially on a 100% run. But based off of these guys being able to break it after so little time (something you can’t do in these other open world games mentioned - the mechanics have to kick your ass for a few hours first) it just doesn’t look as long as Iizuka said it was going to be. and i’m fine with that, just wish it wasn’t promoted as such is all

[StellarBlur]

I don't have a problem with the seemingly short critical path. Do you guys know that Super Mario Odyssey can be beaten in less than 3 hours if you just beeline objectives and go for Talkatoo to tell you where the extra Moons you need are ? That's without doing any fast movement. Just playing the game casually but doing the critical path. We're not even talking speedrun times here. Most of you must've played for longer than 3 hours right? The structure of this game allow for something similar. It's not a sign of lack of content. It's a sign of freedom.

[Sega DogTagz]

25 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

 if you didn’t get every ring in a stage in Sonic 3, or even skipped a whole alternate path - you beat the stage. 

 

That's not the problem here. The problem is your stance is being presented as talking out of both sides of your mouth. 

 

You can't claim to "concerned" by the by how fast some demo players were chewing through content toward the endgame while also acknowledging that it can only be done by choosing to skip over huge swaths of content in the first place.

35 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

 

 (something you can’t do in these other open world games mentioned - the mechanics have to kick your ass for a few hours first) 

And you absolutely can break other openworld games in a heartbeat. You can obliterate Skyrim almost from the word go with no skill required. Abuse crafting and deconstructing to continuously make daggers (which back in the day could be deconstructed for 100% value) rince repeat until you were in level 100 in smithing. Then you could double enchant all your weapons and one shot half the enemies in the game. Bosses included. Zero skill. Busted. 

Elden Ring is a big boy pants game and you can still watch a 10 min vid on YouTube, hop on your horse, abuse the freedom of the open world to skip every enemy on the map, pick up the sword of night and flames, stab a giant dragon in the back of the knee where he can't hit you back and get enough exp in 2 hours to build a specialty class capable of felling endgame bosses. 

 

One of the things that comes with the freedom of this kinds of games are exploits like this. 

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

49 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

it just doesn’t look as long as Iizuka said it was going to be.

See, the reason we "split hairs" is to avoid misinformation. Like, it wasn't even Iizuka who said this.

When you get details blatantly wrong, that doesn't help your case.

51 minutes ago, Nuggets said:

I don’t really see the point in splitting hairs like this. They did a bare minimum run, sure, but they completed the objectives you need to get through to the second island and did so in under an hour (again, being generous. It looks possible to do in under 30). It doesn’t matter if you didn’t get every ring in a stage in Sonic 3, or even skipped a whole alternate path - you beat the stage. 

Condemning the game and what devs promised, doesn't work if you're applying it to the wrong context, and on incomplete information as it is.

Kishimoto did suggest a certain runtime on average, but you're putting that against a bout of taking up a section of the game. Not even necessarily that big a portion of the game done legit at that.

It comes off as phoney or severely misguided,  especially since it's not really a good representation of the idea you have there.

[azoo]

Why is this the conversation when we literally have footage of the intro, the Super Sonic fight, and what follows afterward.

[Razule]

12 minutes ago, azoo said:

Why is this the conversation when we literally have footage of the intro, the Super Sonic fight, and what follows afterward.

What's there to say about it? We already knew about the intro. He's Super Sonic, beats the boss, flies to the next island, and loses the Chaos Emeralds.

[Jango]

That Super Sonic boss appeals to my raw animal nature. It's mindless, flashy and explosive. It's doesn't look as fun as it looks cool.