Sonic Frontiers Leaks & Spoilers Thread - PLEASE READ OP

[GentlemanX]

36 minutes ago, Hidden04 said:

From the list there, it looks like the race of the islands (or at least one island) are literally called Kodama! That's certainly interesting, and a neat thing for Sonic to adapt. Interested to learn more about them.

[light-gaia]

11 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Obviously Zelda didn't invent this tropes but be honest: Do you think that they would have landed on this on their own? Lol. If BOTW hadn't come out or hadn't been as warmly received, do you think Sonic Frontiers would exist? The entire Japanese side of the industry has been studying this game and what it managed to pull off and for good reason.

My problem isn't that they ripped off BOTW, it's that they did it in a completely thoughtless way.  What do slow paced puzzles and extensive combat sequences have to do with what made the previous Sonic games good? What does miles and miles of empty field to cross through add? Wasn't the strength of the original series it's dense, packed level design? Why go in the opposite direction?

Do they have these elements for good reasons or do they have them because Zelda had them?

Since BOTW is the comparison here...they managed to steal Ubisoft towers and made them work in a way that fit the Zelda series pretty perfectly. Instead of telling you where everything is, their guidance is much more subdued and the act of climbing them is treated more like a classic Zelda movement/navigation puzzle.

There's no such thing as a completely original work of art, but BOTW combined disparate elements with some unique ideas of it's own to create what felt like an original experience that still fit the identity of the series.

Sonic Frontiers feels like the opposite. It's cribbing from other games but not in a way that really makes sense or feeds into what I think are Sonic/Sonic Team's strong points. Like, there are a few decent puzzles in Sonic Adventure 1 and Sonic Colors, sure, but combat? Have they ever gotten that right? Does anything about this game show that they're going to get it right this time?

I'll be honest: I've wanted a Sonic: Breath of the Wild for a long time, but I was thinking more about the approach Nintendo took when developing the game instead of copying it's surface level elements. A game about rediscovering the roots of the series without losing sight of the good things they managed to find when they went off track.

Zelda Breath of the Wild wouldn't exist if Skyrim wasn't well receive either.

[Wraith]

5 minutes ago, light-gaia said:

Zelda Breath of the Wild wouldn't exist if Skyrim wasn't well receive either.

Okay?

[Sonikko]

Skyrim and Dark Souls wouldn't exist if Zelda OOT was never made in the first place.

Art is always inspired by something else, that's not an issue and shouldn't be.

Saying Frontiers isn't literally ctrl+c ctrl+v of BoTW tho is kinda delusional, it's extremely clear that's what they were going for, just like they did with Galaxy -> Lost World, at least in a very superficial way.

4 Island, 4 champions to save, Sonic suffers from Amnesia, the overall aesthetics, the music style is reminiscent as well, like, come on.

[light-gaia]

3 minutes ago, Sonikko said:

Skyrim and Dark Souls wouldn't exist if Zelda OOT was never made in the first place.

Art is always inspired by something else, that's not an issue and shouldn't be.

Saying Frontiers isn't literally ctrl+c ctrl+v of BoTW tho is kinda delusional, it's extremely clear that's what they were going for, just like they did with Galaxy -> Lost World, at least in a very superficial way.

4 Island, 4 champions to save, Sonic suffers from Amnesia, the overall aesthetics, the music style is reminiscent as well, like, come on.

Well, people who actually played the game said it felt more like Mario Odyssey than Zelda. From the gameplay, it doesn't play like Zelda at all. So, I don't see the point in making Zelda BotW comparison like Nintendo owns the copyright of grass and amnesia.

[Sonikko]

I literally said the inspiration is very superficial, that's exactly what I meant.

It lifts from BoTW in the most superficial way, it just looks like it and has a similar game structure in terms of general objectives, I wasn't talking specifically about game feel or level design.

[NoKaine]

It's so superficial in lifting from Breath of the Wild it sometimes feels like it didn't lift from it at all!

The game structure is not the same at all. Breath of the Wild has one huge open world that is always loaded and available. Shrines except a few are completely optional. You can go directly to the end without interacting with any other part of the game, including the story.

Frontiers has several big open zones. The zones open up the more you complete the tasks. The "shrines" are absolutely necessary and are used to progress the story. Frontiers is closer to Skyward Sword in design, honestly, if that game was less railroady.

The latter sounds infinitely closer to Odyssey or Bowser's Fury but apparently having grass and piano music is a more significant source of inspiration?

[Diogenes]

Skimming that pastebin of Frontiers-related strings...

There's a bunch of references to fishing (which we've already heard about) and one that might be referring to Big by name (FishingBigFirstTalked), given it's formatted similar to strings for (what appears to be) meeting two not-Korok npcs (KodamaElderFirstTalked and KodamaHermitFirstTalked). There's also a few uses of "Sage", one of which matches up with it being an npc name (KodamaHermitSlept and SageSlept), which matches the retracted synopsis which mentioned Eggman having an AI called SAGE. Tails and Amy get referenced but (aside from abovementioned possible Big) no other recurring characters show up in these strings. This isn't necessarily everything that was left in Origins, and absolutely not the entirety of the text in Frontiers, so I wouldn't worry about that at this point; we do know Eggman's involved after all, despite not showing up here. Not much else I can glean from it.

 

Also Frontiers can be ripping off both Mario and Zelda. It doesn't have to be just one or the other.

[Razule]

I can't believe it. Big is going to be the first non-Sonic clone to be playable in 16 years.

[light-gaia]

38 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

It's so superficial in lifting from Breath of the Wild it sometimes feels like it didn't lift from it at all!

The game structure is not the same at all. Breath of the Wild has one huge open world that is always loaded and available. Shrines except a few are completely optional. You can go directly to the end without interacting with any other part of the game, including the story.

Frontiers has several big open zones. The zones open up the more you complete the tasks. The "shrines" are absolutely necessary and are used to progress the story. Frontiers is closer to Skyward Sword in design, honestly, if that game was less railroady.

The latter sounds infinitely closer to Odyssey or Bowser's Fury but apparently having grass and piano music is a more significant source of inspiration?

Exactly.

Frontiers took inspiration from a lot of different Adventure games, including Zelda. There are more differences between Frontiers and Zelda than similarities.

Frontiers doesn't have the same aesthetics as Zelda. Breath of the Wild has a cell shading art style with cartoony-looking enemies.

Zelda Breath of the Wild enemies:

Frontiers enemy:

Frontiers enemies look more similar to Kingdom Hearts nobodies or Phantasy Star Online enemies (another Sega IP) than anything from both Mario and Zelda.

• Frontiers has a level up system and skill tree, Breath of the Wild doesn't.
• Frontiers combat doesn't have anything to do with Breath of the Wild combat.

But people keep saying that Frontiers "copied" Zelda like this is a demerit. When in reality, Sonic Frontiers is inspired by other games just like Zelda is.

The only similarities I see between Frontiers and Zelda are:

• Grass and piano
• Open fields and not having to do things in a specific order

 

Edited June 22, 2022 by light-gaia
Grammar checking

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

39 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

It's so superficial in lifting from Breath of the Wild it sometimes feels like it didn't lift from it at all!

The game structure is not the same at all. Breath of the Wild has one huge open world that is always loaded and available. Shrines except a few are completely optional. You can go directly to the end without interacting with any other part of the game, including the story.

Frontiers has several big open zones. The zones open up the more you complete the tasks. The "shrines" are absolutely necessary and are used to progress the story. Frontiers is closer to Skyward Sword in design, honestly, if that game was less railroady.

The latter sounds infinitely closer to Odyssey or Bowser's Fury but apparently having grass and piano music is a more significant source of inspiration?

Pretty much.

While initial marketing didn't really do the game much favors and had it look a bit BOTW-esque.

The more context we get, the more it seems to be inspired by Odyssey in a more Sonic-oriented form.

[GeAr-DX]

8 minutes ago, light-gaia said:

Exactly.

Frontiers took inspiration from a lot of different Adventure games, including Zelda. There are more differences between Frontiers and Zelda than similarities.

Frontiers doesn't have the same aesthetics as Zelda. Breath of the Wild has a cell shading art style with cartoony-looking enemies.

Zelda Breath of the Wild enemies:

Frontiers enemy:

Frontiers enemies look more similar to Kingdom Hearts nobodies or Phantasy Star Online enemies (another Sega IP) than anything from both Mario and Zelda.

• Frontiers has a level up system and skill tree, Breath of the Wild doesn't.
• Frontiers combat doesn't have anything to do with Breath of the Wild combat.

But people keep saying that Frontiers "copied" Zelda like this is a demerit. When in reality, Sonic Frontiers is inspired by other games just like Zelda is.

The only similarities I see between Frontiers and Zelda are:

• Grass and piano
• Open fields and not having to do things in a specific order

I think that Kingdom Hearts and Skyrim are more of inspirations than BOTW in Frontiers, I can see even more Assassin's Creed than BOTW, it's also clear that the main inspiration is Shadow of the Collosus even in the setting, that melancolic and loneliness. And of course, Phantasy Star Online affected it, since it's most of the same team.

People only thinking of BOTW because, of course, "Nintendo must invent everything" and thanks to that everytime we see a character on a hill in the actual days it will become "Hey, a BOTW clone".

[light-gaia]

2 minutes ago, ART-DX said:

I think that Kingdom Hearts and Skyrim are more of inspirations than BOTW in Frontiers, I can see even more Assassin's Creed than BOTW, it's also clear that the main inspiration is Shadow of the Collosus even in the setting, that melancolic and loneliness. And of course, Phantasy Star Online affected it, since it's most of the same team.

People only thinking of BOTW because, of course, "Nintendo must invent everything" and thanks to that everytime we see a character on a hill in the actual days it will become "Hey, a BOTW clone".

Sometimes I think Nintendo fanboys only play Nintendo games, so Breath of the Wild is their only reference.

[Dummy Bear]

I don't it's a fair assessment to make of Nintendo fans, but I do find it weird how other companies' contributions to gaming go out the window the second Nintendo gets involved for some people.

Try telling the average fan that Atari made consoles before Nintendo.

[Shiny Gems]

1 minute ago, Slash said:

I don't it's a fair assessment to make of Nintendo fans, but I do find it weird how other companies' contributions to gaming go out the window the second Nintendo gets involved for some people.

Try telling the average fan that Atari made consoles before Nintendo.

Not to mention, if I recall correctly, Nintendo made games for their console, long before they made their own.

[Zaysho]

Now some of you are just being obtuse for the sake of it about originality when that isn't the argument people are making. Stop and actually read what people are saying instead of making up an argument, or I'm locking this thread making you stop.

[Dummy Bear]

I'm gonna get back on topic.

So how about that leaked file list?

[Shiny Gems]

1 minute ago, Slash said:

I'm gonna get back on topic.

So how about that leaked file list?

It is interesting. I wonder where exactly it came from?

[DaBigJ]

I'm literally floored by the fact that SEGA didn't double check Sonic Origin's files to make sure Sonic Frontiers data wasn't in it. How does this even happen? How does data from a completely different project end up in a collection of remasters? 

Bruh.

[Shiny Gems]

Just now, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

I'm literally floored by the fact that SEGA didn't double check Sonic Origin's files to make sure Sonic Frontiers data wasn't in it. How does this even happen? How does data from a completely different project end up in a collection of remasters? 

Bruh.

If I recall correctly, there was a piece of Mega Man 11 art in a Mega Man games collection, so I can say it is probably safe to say that Sonic Frontiers and Sonic Origins is not the first time something like this has happened.

[Cosmos Rogue]

The hardcore fanbase already knows about the cyberspace levels and the people who Sega is still trying to persuade to buy Frontiers aren't paying close enough attention to hear about some files relevant to Frontiers being discovered in Origins. They'll find out about the cyberspace levels on Sega's marketing schedule. This "leak" if you want to call it that doesn't really matter much.

[VO.SUPER]

It kinda feels like an intentional leak as it doesn't seem to be telling us anything easy speculation couldn't get us. 

Then again, maybe not. But it just feels like a pretty miniscule leak. 

[NoKaine]

7 minutes ago, Jake_LeOFFICIAL said:

I'm literally floored by the fact that SEGA didn't double check Sonic Origin's files to make sure Sonic Frontiers data wasn't in it. How does this even happen? How does data from a completely different project end up in a collection of remasters? 

Bruh.

This literally happens all the time lmao. Super Mario 3D All-Stars has files from Super Mario 3D World + Bowser's Fury.

Frontiers' files are in Origins because the part of Sonic Team that worked on Origins to do the 3D models and stuff used the Hedgehog Engine 2. They likely just ripped all of the necessary files and data from Frontiers and put it into Origins. 

The files they did get "leaked" (assuming that paste bin is all, but the person who posted it implies there are more) are very inconsequental.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

It's not that this is an unprecedented situation or anything, but it's hilarious given that these were the people moving furniture and potted plants to hide the action stages, and then their own fucking game spoils them.

[NoKaine]

With the sole exception of Big's existence, these text strings don't even spoil anything that wasn't already said by SEGA, by IGN, or by people who played the demo.

Again, if more shows up, yeah, but right now, no.