Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[Mark1]

5 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Hubs need to be someplace interesting enough to chill out in and fool around with some optional content, but more than just the design of the hubs, you need a game with the right sort of pacing and...maybe "philosophy"?...that doing so feels like a proper part of the game and not something in conflict with it. So to get hubs to work right in Sonic might take a different approach to the series than any we've seen before.

Agreed, while some have done it better than others. No game has set the perfect hub world standard for Sonic games yet. 

Until they find an ideal 3D controlling Sonic design, hub worlds will never be done properly until that time comes.

(Or maybe Sega should hire the Sonic Utopia team and flesh that game out more  please make it happen. Perfect setup for levels and hubs (if there is even need for one, maybe a Zelda BoTW scenario??)

[Wraith]

One idea I've been thinking about is having small towns be something you just visit a few times in the game in between levels. Like, in story the characters say they want to rest a while, and you can hang around there for as long as you want before progressing. 

Something similar happens in Uncharted 2, when Drake gets injured in a battle. You can hang around the town he wakes up in for a little bit before progressing. The game was still linear like I'd imagine a Sonic game would be, but this is just a way the game gives the player a "breather" before going back to the action. I think, instead of having a hub for every level or a hub you have to visit repeatedly after everyone, maybe a few small hubs spread throughout the games when appropriate would be the answer? 

[blazefan519]

Maybe have the Hub Worlds so you can interact with the other Sonic Characters. Talk to them and see what's going on. Maybe see them plan out attacks,or a mission to go help some people, make it feel like it's a resistance.

[RictalRose0]

Just now, blazefan519 said:

Maybe have the Hub Worlds so you can interact with the other Sonic Characters. Talk to them and see what's going on. Maybe see them plan out attacks,or a mission to go help some people, make it feel like it's a resistance.

That would be great! A nice way to integrate the characters into the plot and flesh them out even if they're not playable.

[NegaMix]

I have a basic idea for a hub world. After finishing a level, you could be given two options:

- Continue to the next stage immediately (with cutscenes inbetween) like the option you get in Sonic 4: Episode 2.

- Or, head to the main 'hub' (for example, Tails' Workshop or something) where you can access a Level Select, purchase and apply Upgrades (akin to Generations), and maybe access Missions in each previous level. Basically a 'White World'-esque area.

That way, you can choose whether to have a breather before the next stage, or just go from beginning to end.

[DonWaffleleven]

3 minutes ago, Mark1 said:

Not saying that was perfect either, a good game at best. But man is it more fun than previous 3D games. Gens is more fun for me due to the reasons you actually say. Less blocky platforming specifically. Not perfect either, but better.

Fair enough, I just prefer the Adventure games because... I find them fun for my own reasons. No stiff no-turning car controls when at top speed is a big one. Have Sonic control like he did in Adventure for when he ISN'T using boost and bring on the stiff control for when he IS. problem solved?

8 minutes ago, Mark1 said:

For the record I refer to the overall tone of these later games too. Simple or not, they aren't convoluted messes with plot holes with other games.

No offense but I'd rather have that over... whatever the hell this is...

 

[HywelAtTheMoon]

Sounds like Sanctuary from Borderlands 2. Sounds like a good idea to talk to fellow resistance members, but you have to find it first. 

[SonicDude]

38 minutes ago, Dejimon11 said:

I honestly couldn't tell if you were being serious or not

37 minutes ago, Mark1 said:

Sorry really going to disagree here. Those models were (in my eyes) poorly made and the expressions have been made better in later games like Generations.

Like this. They were well designed here. Especially Classic Sonic with his serious look

I was joking lmao.

[The Deleter]

I just don't understand why the two things have to be seperate; hub worlds work best when they have some sense of platforming and direction to them, and levels feel best when they feel like they're connected to a world overall. Why not just combine the two seamlessly and have all the sidequest, collectors and stuff be optional? It's not like anything is lost selecting a level by running towards it compared to selecting it on a screen.

[Shadowlax]

12 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

Maybe have the Hub Worlds so you can interact with the other Sonic Characters. Talk to them and see what's going on. Maybe see them plan out attacks,or a mission to go help some people, make it feel like it's a resistance.

They still feels like cheerleader status to me. 

Maybe i'm in the minority , but i'm " If they aren't doing anything, I don't care if you don't have them around" that's just me. 

[Mark1]

8 minutes ago, DonWaffleleven said:

No offense but I'd rather have that over... whatever the hell this is...

 

As cringy and awfully written scenes like that were, Still beats this:

Still keen to see if the same director responsible for that can right his wrongs with Sonic Forces.

[SonicDude]

Just now, Mark1 said:

As cringey and awfully written scenes like that were. Still beats this crap.

Still keen to see if the same director responsible for that can right his wrongs with Sonic Forces.

06 was so bad it was funny though. Lost World's cutscenes were just depressing.

[blazefan519]

1 minute ago, Shadowlax said:

They still feels like cheerleader status to me. 

Maybe i'm in the minority , but i'm " If they aren't doing anything, I don't care if you don't have them around" that's just me. 

I'm not saying that's the only thing they should do, but it's something that I feel makes them more involved

[Nepenthe]

A little late but if we're going to engage in the same tired arguments about story and its integration in the franchise, mayhaps don't characterize the other side as being dumb or exasperating, especially if you're actually participating in the discussion at all and thus contributing to how much of a dead horse it is, yeah? You don't have to be presumptuous and up your own ass to disagree with folks.

[Spooky Mulder]

25 minutes ago, Kintor said:

The thing about Sonic 06 is that it's overall art style is still actually visually appealing, especially for an early PS3/360 game.

I still remember this initial trailer:

I still get hyped up when I see this. If we could've actually played this version Sonic 06 it would've been hailed as one of the greatest Sonic games of all time and a worthy successor to the Adventure era.

 

Overall, I still think that Sonic games should be aimed closer to the tone in this trailer, rather then what we've been getting ever since Sonic Colours. A mistake made over a decade ago shouldn't prevent future Sonic games from embracing bigger and more epic stories one again.

Speak for yourself. The graphics in that trailer are better than the final product, but the art style is not visually appealing for a Sonic game to me. It's overly realistic and bland. Those robots show none of the character of classic badniks or even modern Egg Pawns.

I can agree that this looks better than the game we got, but the problem with Sonic 06 has always been threefold. 1.) The developers didn't have time to finish the game. 2.) The developers didn't have the skill to execute their vision. 3.) Their vision was fundamentally flawed and it shows even in this teaser.

I have no problem with bigger, so-called epic stories for Sonic, but emulating the tone of this trailer would be another disaster. If we're lucky, we'll finally get something closer in tone to the opening of Sonic Unleashed which is "epic" without forgetting that it's still about a talking speedy blue hedgehog.

[Shadowlax]

4 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

I'm not saying that's the only thing they should do, but it's something that I feel makes them more involved

I would argue it wouldn't?

Story telling, at least effectively a lot of the times is show not tell, and in video game where showing usually equals playing, their efforts much like generations would at least from what I would imagine would see paramount to much of nothing. You can tell me knuckles did this, but unless you show me knuckles doing it or make me participate via gameplay of said doing of thing. It doesn't really mean much , yeah telling me works for an eventual lore discussion but that isn't really the coolest thing in the world. And given there are extremely capable characters on the roster, it just devalues them as a whole. Why are they even , there at this point?

Its like the end of generations, there are 3 people in the room, who aren't sonic, who could have just gone super, one with time powers who could have just chaos controlled the damn thing. Why didn't they do anything? They are capable of doing something, if they aren't doing anything. Why are they here? All you are doing is making them look useless.  And if that's your intent, why try and make them look valuable in the first place, if they are in fact useless. 

[DonWaffleleven]

 

7 minutes ago, Mark1 said:

As cringy and awfully written scenes like that were, Still beats this:

Well, sure, that's ONE poor moment.

Depends on what you like: (lack of) Quality or Quantity?

[RictalRose0]

I still don't find the kiss in 06 to be that scandalous or Elise to be the most terrible character ever. 

[Diogenes]

2 minutes ago, DonWaffleleven said:

Well, sure, that's ONE poor moment.

*snip*

Depends on what you like: (lack of) Quality or Quantity?

I would gladly take all of those scenes a dozen times over rather than have anything like '06 happen again.

[RictalRose0]

Well yeah but you also don't really like Sonic as a character or it's setting/story so like, you don't even care so...

[Nepenthe]

Using love to revive a dead one- even if that loved one isn't a human- is basic cliche' fairy tale bullshit and thus doesn't bother me on that level, but the issue is that Elise and Sonic's relationship and subsequently the entire game's story is so scattershot and terrible that it makes moments like this stand out more as being weird and awkward. There's inkling of themes and repeated statements in Sonic 06 that could've been done justice under a better writer, but we didn't get a better writer so nyeh.

However, this doesn't mean I'd take Colors. I'd rather we leave both on the cutting room floor for Unleashed's plotting and tone. Who was the writer for that? Can we get that motherfucker back?

[Kellan]

Just now, RictalRose0 said:

Well yeah but you also don't really like Sonic as a character or it's setting/story so like, you don't even care so...

I don't think that's what Diogenes was saying.

[RictalRose0]

I'm just saying, I have never seen them say a single positive thing about any character or story within the Sonic universe.

[Diogenes]

Just now, RictalRose0 said:

Well yeah but you also don't really like Sonic as a character or it's setting/story so like, you don't even care so...

I do, actually, when it's not shit. Problem is that a lot of it has been shit, and a lot of people's suggestions for "fixing" it sound a lot like going back to what made it shit.

[Shadowlax]

Just now, Nepenthe said:

Using love to revive a dead one- even if that loved one isn't a human- is basic cliche' fairy tale bullshit and thus doesn't bother me on that level, but the issue is that Elise and Sonic's relationship and subsequently the entire game's story is so scattershot and terrible that it makes moments like this stand out more as being weird and awkward. There's inkling of themes and repeated statements in Sonic 06 that could've been done justice under a better writer, but we didn't get a better writer so nyeh.

However, this doesn't mean I'd take Colors. I'd rather we leave both on the cutting room floor for Unleashed's plotting and tone. Who was the writer for that? Can we get that motherfucker back?

No, you can't have anything cool. 

You thought that teaser was cool, NOPE. Classic sonic

You though the game play was coo. NOPE. Wisps.