Detective SSMB & The Case of the Sonic 25th Anniversary "P.g. 100 is the best... food discussion started."

[Nepenthe]

Uh-uh, we're not gonna do this whole thing where we diverge into talking about Nintendo yet again.

[SSF1991]

30 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

SEGA really doesn't need to have any involvement whatsoever for Sonic Team's projects. They just need to give them the money and shut up, that's my two cents after their whole Nintendo/Mario blow fest they forced Sonic Team into. Hell even NiGHTS suffered thanks to SEGA and the whole Wii worship fiasco.

Well, Sonic Team is part of SEGA. SEGA is their bosses. They kind of have to be involved. They just need to not rush them.

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It's happened three times beforehand: SA2 (10th anniversary), Sonic 06 (15th anniversary), and Sonic Generations (20th anniversary).

I don't recall them making a big deal out of his 10th anniversary other than some statue thing, if I recall corectly. That's just based on memory though, so yeah, if I'm wrong I'm wrong on that.. lol

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The panel from yesterday is a good example. There was no faffing about beforehand about what was going to happen. It was an upfront panel where Aaron breezed through Sonic history with interesting and funny interjection from key players. The smallest, most boring panel you could imagine these guys hosting actually made me smile, laugh, and have fun, and you know why? Because Sega and the people close to them didn't surround it with cryptic bullshit whose only purpose is to generate hype that is unnecessary for the thing being hinted at. 

To be fair, SEGA hasn't been faffling about a new Sonic game either. They haven't confirmed anything for a reason. Just that Big's Big Fishing Adventure 3 running gag thing.

Also, Aaron said he doesn't do the teasers to generate hype. He said in the SEGA retrospective on Twitch's stream that it's to entertain people.

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I don't think I'm being unreasonable when I say I'd just like any bits of upcoming news to be properly telegraphed to us versus being made out to be more than they were, and then people coming back and pointing at me and saying I'm being unreasonable or ungrateful or entitled (I read Twitter) when this mystery thing that's being teased is just some normal-ass thing or a joke.

I'm not labeling you as one of those. My tweets weren't directed towards you or on the SSMB in particular. Like I've said, I understand completely if people don't like the teasers. I will respectively disagree, so long as you do the same, but it's not like I have a mission for people to think the way I do or anything. I'm just debate-happy about how and why people make that opinion, mostly because I just prefer to understand why people feel the way they do. lol

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What the hell even is their 2015 mindset?

The interviews they've been conducting have been giving us an idea, but it's mostly about getting themselves sorted out, regaining fans' trust, bringing out high-quality products, continuing their focus on mobile, et cetera.

Whether you agree with that mindset or not, i can't really say. But they've been talking about their mindset going forward for this year.

29 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

You know how many games are in no where near a state that can be shown to the public but are given a generic press release or some general confirmation of existence? If this game is not ready to be shown at all, and we assume it's coming out this year for the anniversary, I would actually say we're in some big fucking trouble.

Then just say "expect shit in June." This isn't that hard.

That's the thing. I highly suggest not assuming anything right now, because we don't really have room to do so. We just don't know much to make any kind of conclusions at this time.

Like I said, it's really difficult to compare SEGA's PR with other companies, as very few companies have been in the situation SEGA is in right now. If it weren't for that restructure or the Boom disaster that led up to it, I'd definitely see your point more.

8 minutes ago, Hyper Enesephus said:

Uh, yeah, I do need a game to celebrate an anniversary for my video game franchise. I'll celebrate when I actually have a goddamn game to celebrate. It's also Crash Bandicoot's 20th birthday this year, but I'm 99% sure we're not getting a new Crash game this year (we haven't since 2010 if you count the mobile games), and nobody's throwing him any parties.

No, no you don't.

You don't need cake to celebrate a birthday. You don't need to get gifts to celebrate Christmas. Sonic's anniversary is about the brand as a whole and not the hottest, newest game he has coming up. Even Sonic Generations, an anniversary game, made that point. It's about Sonic's legacy.

Crash is not a good example, mostly because that franchise hasn't recieved any kind of attention, let alone a new game, in years. Still even then, people will find a way to celebrate. I mean sure, they'll wish things were better with the brand, but that doesn't mean they're not going to enjoy the Crash trilogy again.

Honestly, what you said came off very demanding to me. Which wasn't necessary.

[Dee Dude]

So, what are we talking about now?

It's been a while since I posted on this thread due to the long wait until July so I guess I got bored of talking about the 25th anniversary due to the lack of any info. 

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

10 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

Quoting glitch.

 

10 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

What are you talking about...?

 

 

6 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

Uh-uh, we're not do this whole thing where we diverge into talking about Nintendo yet again.

Nep's pretty much got it summed up. 

Anyway,  my 2 cents on the matter is that SEGA, while they may be on a righteous recovery road of some sort,  in the process are taking it a bit too safe for their own good.  They best step on the gas of they'd like to get a sweet hit of acceleration for hype and opportune segment of time to process  feedback. 

 

[GeneHF]

10 minutes ago, SSF1991 said:

You don't need cake to celebrate a birthday.

Can confirm. Celebrated a few birthdays with a small pizza and vidya only.

Insert sad party horn here.

[FriendBot]

2 minutes ago, GeneHF said:

Can confirm. Celebrated a few birthdays with a small pizza and vidya only.

Insert sad party horn here.

Sounds like the past birthdays I had, guess you can insert that gif of Boom Eggman with celebration hat.

[Nepenthe]

@SSF1991 It should be pretty obvious why people here are upset. Regardless of Aaron's intentions, his attempts to entertain people have instead heightened the anticipation of a new game within an environment that is beset with anniversary marketing which has traditionally marked a new game for that year. Furthermore, people have been told, in ways both near-sighted and outright insulting, that their being impatient for a new game within such an environment is completely unwarranted, totally their fault, and being a bummer on the "fun," which is only going to make people defensive and subsequently shorter with subsequent attempts on Aaron's part to "entertain" people than they probably would have otherwise.

On top of that, it has been reiterated that Sega is trying to get their shit together, to not blow their load on something that is unfit for public consumption, to regain trust, but it has not been demonstrated why people who are skeptical of their ability to do that should ignore that skepticism in light of Sega basically doing basically the same thing they did the last few Sonic anniversaries. Again, they've kicked the party into gear without telling anyone the whereabouts of the guest of honor, and we apparently shouldn't in any way be curious about why that is. Furthermore, after all of this typing I still don't know why a press release is completely impossible to do even with the restructuring that happened a year ago. Heroes got announced in the midst of Sega declaring bankruptcy and almost flaming out of the damn business entirely.

Indeed, on top of all of this, we still don't know about the game. It could be the best thing ever, outright horrible, or anything in between, meaning all of this celebrating might not actually be worth it in the end anyway. It's difficult to be optimistic when A.) We celebrate, allude to, and use Sonic's history as a general marketing crutch way too often for me to be as excited anymore, and B.) The elephant in the room of whether or not this franchise even has that much of an interesting future left still lingers as a result of the complete ambiguity surrounding the next game.

Honestly, this current anniversary isn't doing it for me. If you're having fun, then great. I'm not trying to stop anyone from enjoying themselves. However, it's getting pretty irritating to have to constantly explain the same thing people have been explaining for about a month now about why they're not so gung-ho about Aaron's hints or the gaping hole that is the lack of a game within the overall anniversary celebration.

[Enesephus]

23 minutes ago, SSF1991 said:

No, no you don't.

You don't need cake to celebrate a birthday. You don't need to get gifts to celebrate Christmas. Sonic's anniversary is about the brand as a whole and not the hottest, newest game he has coming up. Even Sonic Generations, an anniversary game, made that point. It's about Sonic's legacy.

Crash is not a good example, mostly because that franchise hasn't recieved any kind of attention, let alone a new game, in years. Still even then, people will find a way to celebrate. I mean sure, they'll wish things were better with the brand, but that doesn't mean they're not going to enjoy the Crash trilogy again.

Honestly, what you said came off very demanding to me. Which wasn't necessary.

Uh, I don't know what you mean by "demanding." What am I demanding of you?

[Guest]

I think people wanting early reveals haven't seen the usual reaction to early reveals, or know much about how those early reveals are done.

Usually when a game is revealed early, the actual game isn't shown. Instead you get a target render, or something like this: 

You don't actually get to see the game. You get to see a small bit made specifically to be shown off at a press conference that if you'd play any other way than is shown would just break. Then when the game comes out people complain because the gameplay demo set expectations too high and had better graphics than the final game.

Development time would be spent on something meant to overhype you instead of the actual game. This happens to pretty much every AAA game like The Witcher 3, Bioshock Infinite, Watch Dogs, The Division etc. and usually they don't deliver on those original demos and while they do seem to increase sales, they're also not representitive of what the actual game is like. And you'd probably get mad about that when the game is released instead of the game not being revealed earlier.

So unless you want to be overhyped and eventually disappointed, you probably don't actually want an early game reveal.

[Enesephus]

1 minute ago, TimmiT said:

I think people wanting early reveals haven't seen the usual reaction to early reveals, or know much about how those early reveals are done.

Usually when a game is revealed early, the actual game isn't shown. Instead you get a target render, or something like this: 

You don't actually get to see the game. You get to see a small bit made specifically to be shown off at a press conference that if you'd play any other way than is shown would just break. Then when the game comes out people complain because the gameplay demo set expectations too high and had better graphics than the final game.

Development time would be spent on something meant to overhype you instead of the actual game. This happens to pretty much every AAA game like The Witcher 3, Bioshock Infinite, Watch Dogs, The Division etc. and usually they don't deliver on those original demos and while they do seem to increase sales, they're also not representitive of what the actual game is like.

So unless you want to be overhyped and eventually disappointed, you probably don't actually want an early game reveal.

Don't tell me what I do or don't want. SEGA could easily just let us know a game is on the way, or release a teaser image or something, which I'm sure would hardly take focus away from making the actual game great.

[Nepenthe]

On the other hand, this is generally a problem Nintendo has seemed to have avoided with their game reveals, limiting it to just verbal or written confirmation (which again, I don't see why that's a large issue; please explain it to me like a child why a written press release is out of the question), or actual early, in-game footage versus a prettied-up RoL-esque target render that doesn't represent the game in any real capacity. I mean, Sonic ain't a AAA franchise anymore. He doesn't need nor can possibly even afford to revel in in the marketing tactics that more relevant franchises can, and indeed pretty much every Sonic game aside from 06 to an extent and RoL have basically shown themselves off like Nintendo games- frankly and honestly- so it doesn't seem all that accurate to compare the franchise to the likes of CoD or Bioshock.

[Guest]

And then you'd complain about the game not being shown yet. :V

I was also more talking about people naming Witcher 3 and stuff as examples of games being revealed early.

[Nepenthe]

Just now, TimmiT said:

And then you'd complain about the game not being shown yet. :V

Don't tell me what I'd do! D<

Regardless, it's the solution to the problem I'm outlining. The fact that someone else would complain about there not being any visuals doesn't mean anything to me. Hell, people complain about everything regarding this franchise. I guess it's time to kill it off and stop the pain?  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[GeneHF]

1 minute ago, Nepenthe said:

Hell, people complain about everything regarding this franchise. I guess it's time to kill it off and stop the pain?  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Prep the cocktail.

[Indigo Rush]

My question is, in Sonic Generations 2, will the "Meme" Era get as much representation as the "Adventure" or "Classic" Eras? 

[Neo_Fire_Sonic]

Just now, Indigo Rush said:

My question is, in Sonic Generations 2, will the "Meme" Era get as much representation as the "Adventure" or "Classic" Eras? 

That would mean they would force you to play that fishing game thing again

[GeneHF]

3 minutes ago, Indigo Rush said:

My question is, in Sonic Generations 2, will the "Meme" Era get as much representation as the "Adventure" or "Classic" Eras? 

It's the only era.

Classic Sonic, Modern Sonic, and Aaron Sonic. It's really just Aaron in a Sonic suit for all three.

There's also a dating sim.

[FriendBot]

1 minute ago, Indigo Rush said:

My question is, in Sonic Generations 2, will the "Meme" Era get as much representation as the "Adventure" or "Classic" Eras? 

Well I was surprisingly told that Generations 2 will just be Big's Big Fishing Adventure 3 and it'll be playable during the 25th Anniversary Party and the fact when Roger van der weide made that video on the game, the game will be just like that. And they'll also bring in major members of the True Sonic Spirit people to bring in the Adventure 3 everyone really wants.

[Guest]

The problem with just sending out a press release or a teaser is that it doesn't make as much of an impression on its own. If something is teased, it has to be followed up with something worthwhile not too long after or people will either lose interest or they'll get tired of the teases. See people getting sick of Ruby's number teases.

That's kinda how Sega handled the reveals for Generations and Lost World. They put out some small teasers and then soon after actually showed the game.

[GeneHF]

Go to bed already, Tim

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, GeneHF said:

Go to bed already, Tim

I'd be sleeping right now if neighbours weren't being loud. :V

[Tailikku]

1 minute ago, TimmiT said:

I'd be sleeping right now if neighbours weren't being loud. :V

One of those wild Spring Break parties?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Tailikku said:

One of those wild Spring Break parties?

Someone coughing incredibly loudly in a bathroom. Like, ridiculously loud.

Kinda feel bad for the guy but shit I want some sleep.

[Nepenthe]

Ruby's number teases are tiring because they're being given in a contextual vacuum and hinting towards things that are again secondary to the one thing people actually care about. If we were gleaning actual context from these things beyond "vague date" they would be more tolerable.

I also don't subscribe to the belief that a teaser can't have any impact. Send out some concept artwork of a character and you can generate excitement that way, and it doesn't even involve having to spend billions of marketing on a trailer or video or something. I also don't think that people losing interest in the interim is actually a bad thing, by which I mean I don't think there's really a thing where a person who was originally grabbed by something and then forgets about it due to silence is more likely to abandon that thing at a full reveal than to regenerate their own interest in it. Fans of movies, particularly the superhero genre, seem to do just fine with this kind of spaced out marketing. And yes, I'm aware that games aren't movies, but I don't see why the medium changes the psychology apparent in how this kind of marketing has worked before.

 

[Enesephus]

17 minutes ago, TimmiT said:

The problem with just sending out a press release or a teaser is that it doesn't make as much of an impression on its own. If something is teased, it has to be followed up with something worthwhile not too long after or people will either lose interest or they'll get tired of the teases. See people getting sick of Ruby's number teases.

Oh, haha. I wouldn't mind teases if they actually had anything to do with the game. 

For the record, Ratchet and Clank for the PS4 was announced a full year before we got our first trailer. We didn't get any teaser images or anything. Insomniac just said, "Hey, we're making a 'reimagining' of the original R&C, and it will release alongside the movie. Chew on that awhile." Sure, it was a long time before we learned anything else about the game, but that simple reveal alone was enough to give us something to talk about, and just knowing a game was on the way generated excitement. Of course, that excitement died down over time before the trailer, but that doesn't seem to have hurt the game any. 

(I know, I'm aware I keep bringing up Ratchet and Clank. I really only follow one or two games a year, and, since last E3, I've been following Ratchet and Clank, so it's my main frame of reference.)