Sonic Lost World @ Gamescom

[Willsy]

Did you like those areas in Sonic Rush where you HAD to destroy all enemies to proceed?

 

Yes. Because they were quick and easy. The werehog sections? Hated them.

 

Except it's a SONIC platformer but it's not only slow but also forces you to stop often making it even slower than it already is.

 

It doesn't force you to stop. It depends on the player's decision. Stop trying to barricade other's thoughts out Art, it's like you're desperate to prove Lost World is a bad game. It's like drinking lemonade in hopes that it will taste like ice-cream. 

Edited August 27, 2013 by Wil348

[StaticMania]

Its common in any Platformer(even Sonic)that no matter how quickly you(try to)go through the level, you will always have to go through atleast one slow section of the level(which can be made somewhat faster upon further practice). These "slower" sections will either slow the speed down a bit for a slower-paced platforming section or Completely "stop" the speed for an even slower obstacle dodging section(for challenge). You can make these go by quicker with your pace being un-broken with more and more practice.

[edvedd]

 

Yes. Because they were quick and easy. The werehog sections? Hated them.

 

 

It doesn't force you to stop. It depends on the player's decision. Stop trying to barricade other's thoughts out Art, it's like you're desperate to prove Lost World is a bad game. It's like drinking lemonade in hopes that it will taste like ice-cream. 

 

Unless you're eating lemonade flavoured ice cream. 

[Faseeh]

Snowball level is cool only if you used it as a pun. It's garbage. You litarelly play as a friacking snowball the whole level. Who asked for this? Heck, even on result screen you see the snowball! It's slow, it's boring and I see absolutely no fun in that level.

As for the spiders sections.. Yeah, ok, we'll see if they can be avoided nce the game comes out.

 

Me.

 

And everyone who likes change. 

 

For goodness sake, it's damn obvious where Sonic Team is getting inspiration for this.

 

FELLOW SEGA GAMES.

 

What, skating on ice with parkour can be a JSR reference (wat I love JSR), then the obvious NiGHTS DLC, and now Super Monkey Ball. And honestly we never know, this stage is just an one time thing. Honestly if the next stage involves us, in Tropical Coast, skating along the rinks, grinding on the railways jumping here and there and even spraying grafiiti I'm okay.

 

I'm even okay with a car.

[VGamer]

Except it's a SONIC platformer but it's not only slow but also forces you to stop often making it even slower than it already is.

 

You say that like there was never a Sonic game before where you had to stop, or at least slow down. The Adventure games had the mech shooting stages (which were slow enough as it was), you had Gamma and Amy's gameplay, you had the rooms in Heroes where you had to beat up enemies, you had to always backtrack in Shadow, and basic 2D platforming in Colors.

Why are we now saying this is a terrible thing as if it's never been done before in the series?

Edited August 27, 2013 by TheVGamer

[Willsy]

Unless you're eating lemonade flavoured ice cream. 

 

[Lady Soniko]

It's hardly doing any harm at all having to destroy 5 spiders on a small spherical planetoid to move on, II don't see what the fuss is all about here, I agree that Unleashed day had flow, but that wasn't the case in Generations most of the time, Rooftop Run comes to mind which is awful in terms of flow compared to the original stage. 

[Indigo Rush]

Except it's a SONIC platformer but it's not only slow but also forces you to stop often making it even slower than it already is.

 

 

Okay, you know what? 

 

I want you to go and find a Sega Genesis. If you can't, go ahead and find one of the hundreds of ports of Sonic 1, 2, CD, etc. Found one? Good.

 

Now I want you to go as fast as possible through them. Complete each game within an hour. It's possible, there are achievements for it. Are you having a difficult time? Are you doing well? 

 

I guarantee you that if you are doing well, it is because you have already played through the game at least 3 or 4 times to go through the game at a relatively brisk pace. I can finish Sonic 1 and 2 each in under an hour, but that is only because I have played each of them hundreds and hundreds of times, and no, I'm not joking.

 

Now I want you, when Sonic Lost World comes out, to find a Wii U (or 3DS, whatever floats your boat) and pick up the controller and then I want you to blaze through the level as fast as you can while people are behind you holding a camera or while talking about what you're doing. Heck, I'll do it right beside you.

 

Not so easy, is it? You know why? Because you have never played Sonic Lost World before. Neither has anyone else who has uploaded game footage aside from Aaron Webber himself, and even then he is hideously distracted by showing everyone what all is in the levels and is showing off all of Sonic's different moves. Had he been tasked with completing the levels as fast as possible, you would have shut your trap a long time ago about "flow" because he would have "made" the levels look much speedier than you seem to be able to pick up on.

 

It is absolutely astonishing how much effort you are putting into trying to dismiss this game for one reason or another. At least with your cartoony visuals argument you had some backing. It was a subjective matter and we can respect that opinion. But here? You're talking about an objective aspect of the game and you have provided NO solid evidence to indicate how SLW lacks flow besides "oh but it has platforms and it is not fast like SONIC SHOULD BE BECAUSE SONIC IS SUPPOSED TO BE FAST." No dip Sonic is supposed to be fast! But how you control that speed tends to change with each game, and just because Sonic isn't running forward in skinny corridors at the press of a button does not mean that Sonic is a Mario clone.

 

Heck, I didn't even go in depth about the other variables in SLW: How does the parkour affect how Sonic travels across the "blocky" levels, how the spindash can be used on flat or curved surfaces, how Sonic's bounce attack can aid platforming, how the double jump can be an exploit for hopping gaps, etc. 

 

Flow is part level design, part player input.

 

 

Oh man, look at that lack of flow. How could you ever use Sonic Unleashed as an example. :|

 

Consider the skill level of people playing the game, my friend, before making a judgement.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Indigo Rush

[Gatestormer]

Where has this sudden obsession with flow come from? 

 

LW isn't really handling flow than any other standard Sonic game as far as I can tell. I can think of a number of times I've had to stop for something when playing my Megadrive which you could argue 'stops the flow' or whatever.

 

-The blocks in Marble Zone to cross the lava

-The multi-layered platform puzzles in Spring Yard.

-Waiting for the arrows to disappear in Labyrinth

-Waiting for air bubbles

-Waiting for the bomb badniks to explode before moving on in Star Light

-Activating the stair mechanisms in Star Light

-Nearly every trap in Scrap Brain

 

-Burrobot in Aquatic Ruin who jumps out from nowhere. 

-The charge springs in Casino Night.

-The zipline platforms in Hill Top.

-Activating bridges in Mystic Cave

-Waiting for the right time to jump on the pipe cover platforms in Oil Ocean.

-The spinning cog platforms in Metropolis

-Pretty much every badnik in Metropolis at some point. 

 

-The big hands that rev Sonic in Hydrocity 

-Destroying the arrow-shooting faces in Marble Garden

-The barrel in Carnival Night

-The vine things that trap you in Mushroom Hill

-Waiting for the missiles to destroy the ground in Flying Battery

-Opening the doors in Sandopolis by pushing the switches.

-Activating the lights in Sandopolis

-Waiting for the fire flumes to disspear in Lava Reef

-The springs in Hidden Palace that look like they'll send you above the steps but actually send you into the top one, stopping you dead.

 

That's what comes to my mind off the top of my head. All of those obstacles, traps, puzzles or whatever force the player to slow down, wait, or stop completely. Lost World is doing nothing different from what we've seen. 

 

This is always what happens when a new game is coming out. People analyse the shit out of it and make problems out of nothing. 

 

As someone who spent a good 45 minutes with the game at SoS and played all the stages multiple times, I found a great sense of flow throughout the game and in stages like Windy Hill and Frozen Factory, I was able to be very creative with how I progressed. I felt much more in control of Sonic than I have for many many years and had a whole load of fun. 

[ArtFenix]

Chill out guys. I'm not trying to start holy wars or something or make the game worse in YOUR eyes. I'm just pointing out the flaws of the game but every time I do so, you're going crazy. I'm not forcing my opinion. Discoid can choose better words to argue with you. I can't. Maybe it's language barrier, I don't know. I'm only using the words I know to say what I want to say.

Other than that, if you think the game is flawless, you might just be too much of fanatics. No Sonic game is perfect (OK, S3&K is almost perfect) but every single time I say something "bad" about this game, you think it's your duty to argue with everything I say.

That's OK. I said what I wanted to say on the matter. No need to heat this topic.

Edited August 27, 2013 by ArtFenix

[Komodin]

Other than that, if you think the game is flawless, you might just be too much of fanatics.

 

Who here actually thinks this, though? Just because we don't constantly harp on about the game's flaws, doesn't mean we think it's "flawless". Perhaps we just don't wanna be a bunch of Negative Nancies all the dang time.

[Indigo Rush]

Chill out guys. I'm not trying to start holy wars or something or make the game worse in YOUR eyes. I'm just pointing out the flaws of the game but every time I do so, you're going crazy. I'm not forcing my opinion. 

 

Ah, the opinion shield.

 

*pop*

 

The problem is you are saying there are flaws there where there are not flaws.

 

If you're going to criticize the game, take a potshot at the abundance of 2D levels! That is a legitimate issue for some people! Or how about the color powers? They could have been implemented better, or not at all, some say. Those are real complaints, and few people would be jumping at you like this had you been talking about that. 

 

But that's not the case. Nu-uh, you're talking about something that's either totally subjective (overall tone, art style) or something that isn't even a problem to begin with (gameplay flow, not fast enough), so you darn well better expect some opposition.

 

It's not like criticizing Colors' blocky platforming because that is very clearly evidenced and many people here (including myself) have played the game ourselves. Sonic Lost World though? Nope, the footage we have shows that if a player knows what he's doing, they can blast through with ease. Otherwise, you are going to make the game look tedious on your first run.

[Milo]

Other than that, if you think the game is flawless, you might just be too much of fanatics. No Sonic game is perfect (OK, S3&K is almost perfect) but every single time I say something "bad" about this game, you think it's your duty to argue with everything I say.

 

If you're going to the extent of labeling those who disagree with your opinions (that tbh you're at times stating as a fact) as "fanatics" for merely engaging debate with you on differing opinions, I think you may be the so-called "fanatic" here.

 

Pages ago I disagreed with Blitz on whether SLoW's artstyle had any connections to the artstyle of the Genesis games, but I didn't call him a "fanatic" or anything like that.

[Zavok the SpinningSilver]

*opens door to topic, sees following discussions...*

 

*points finger in the air*

 

"Um... guys? Can we... can we go back to trying to guess at some possible material from the game through the footage and screenshots? I'm scared of throwing my two cents in, I need them for later. Besides, all of this discussion is making me think that everyone doesn't like the other games anymore because of the boost gameplay. It's probably not true (well, in most cases anyway) but my mind is spiraling in a weird path of negativity right now.

 

I really want to drag this guy out of the clouds

 

 

....and for all of us to discuss the game and be happy while doing it. The sun's doing a good job at it.

Like.... how about there was a weird face in Desert Ruins, and now in Tropical Coast there is a strange looking Tiki head! Could there be a pattern? Is it just a setpiece thrown in because the artists wanted to give the levels a little more pizzazz?"

[Abominal SnowTaz]

....and for all of us to discuss the game and be happy while doing it. The sun's doing a good job at it.

Like.... how about there was a weird face in Desert Ruins, and now in Tropical Coast there is a strange looking Tiki head! Could there be a pattern? Is it just a setpiece thrown in because the artists wanted to give the levels a little more pizzazz?"

I was actually wondering about that. It's really interesting and yes does add more pizzazz.

 

There we go. Nice and calm.

 

 

Settle....settle down sir...

[Blitz 'n Burst]

so I was playing through Sonic 2 and I came across a platforming section. I had to slow down to go through that shit. Sonic 2's level design is so slow and not like a Sonic game at all.

And don't even get me started on Sonic 1.

Edited August 27, 2013 by Blitz 'n Burst

[___-_]

Yea, it's funny how with all the flow stoppers you had to deal with in Sonic Heroes (Egg Fleet Copy/Paste robot endurance anyone?), Shadow the Hedgehog (Colony Ark anyone?), Sonic 06 (Homing Attacking in itself is a flow stopper, let alone the legions of bots before a goal ring shenanigan), THIS is the game that crosses the line? 

 

Art, not only are you ignoring beginners getting their hands on a new game admittedly significantly different from past Sonic games control scheme wise, you're not considering the many paths one can take to potentially skip certain sections (So how could you possibly know this game doesn't flow well as it should when you don't even know the best routes yet?), and the wisps one can equip with to make the quickest succession though normal means or through Miiverse.

 

And I find it funny how you mention the Spider section when this happens: @ 1:11 - 1:16

Edited August 27, 2013 by StriCNYN3

[edvedd]

I hope we get more 60fps trailers like the gamescom one. That really shows off how NICE this game is in motion. 

[Jolt_TH]

The thing is, flow isn't about just going fast and not stopping, a Mario game can flow well, a Zelda game can flow well. Flow is all about how the speed Is handled and the ebb and increase in said speed, Werehog stages are an example of this, there was far TOO MUCH stopping and starting for the flow to fit, some people still enjoyed it (myself included) but I can see the problem with the flow, to times when I can be bothered to play it. The classics and some levels in the adventure games have great flow and its not because you go fast and don't stop or change speed, it's because the frequency and way the pace is changed works, like someone before mentioned there are tons of times you have to stop or slow down in the classics and even the adventures you have things like the icicles in icecap the rockets in sky deck and the swing bars all the way through SA2 aswell as the multiple parts where you have to stop to do a bounce attack. Having to stop to do something doesn't mean the game has bad flow, more the transition into that part and the frequency they appear (although sometimes this can be pulled off!)

With that spider part, ok you have to stop...but do you? You stop moving forward yes but Sonic doesn't actually stop, you have to homing attack a spider and then bounce attack while its down, that's a pretty fluid motion there, then you can run/homing attack to find the next one, I imagine if you were to watch Sonics path around that planetoid destroying the spiders it would look like a piece of art or even dance.

[edvedd]

Sonic: Lord of the Dance!

[Lady Soniko]

Sonic: Lord of the Dance!

 

To be fair Sonic loves dancing it's why he incorporates break dancing into his fighting, parkouring and over all attitude.

[edvedd]

That's the third exclusive. It's a rhythm game.

[Narukami07]

 

Does this look like the face of mercy??

It even has the Third Eye......

Isn't that kind of selfless thinking in the end though? Would you rather they keep they same sort of thing going in the same direction as Colours/Generations and stick to the formula so it becomes Stale, or continue to try new things and evolve as a series even more? Sonic isn't just a "gotta go fast" series, if I'm honest, Sonic fits into a lot of genres snugly, he fits as a platformer sure, he fits as a high speed action game, he even fits as a kart racer and a racer in general, Like Mario, Sonic fits into multi genre selection.

 

Hell SEGA just do what they want in hopes of pleasing everyone when they really can't, it was clear that Unleashed had a phenomenal budget from the amount of detail put into the game and it's promotion too, including spawning a mini CGI movie, and Generations also had a huge budget and a great promotional campaign, but what makes you think SLW doesn't have a large budget? For one it's being made for one console only so they can put all their effort and time into exploiting the full potential of the Wii U's hardware, not to mention that they're throwing in more than mere cameo's from their other franchises, we're getting 6 fully fleshed out boss battles and a new stage, as FREE DLC, the game looks huge in terms of variety, it has CGI cut scenes, it has in-game cutscenes, it has a full new score with new material and not remixes of songs from earlier in the series, the gameplay and platforming has been amped up to 10 from anything Generations could offer, it has Multiplayer as well as 2 player co-op etc. The list goes on and on, and this all adds to SEGA's costs even if it looks like nothing to us, it probably takes a high end amount of money to develop and design this stuff as well as programme it.

 

Yeah Multiplayer is just re-skinned Sonic bots, but can I also mention that we'll be racing in actual LEVELS in the game? Not that virtual level crap from Colours.

100% Agreed. It makes the "LW looks so low budget, gives us our next TRUE Sonic game" look ridiculous in hindsight.

Edited August 28, 2013 by Narukami07

[StaticMania]

Multi-Player is improved from Colors. You can no longer be off-screened because now they programmed the game to use the game-pad for a fair extra screen for player 2. That is the kind of idea/concept I was hoping that any game with multi-player/Co-op developed for the Wii-U would have. Sega(Sonic team)actually thought of doing this before Nintendo. Also there's no Sonic simulator substitute meaning these levels won't be lame and bland, have actual 3D level design, and will be long&enjoyable(depending on the player). What a plus, also if the Chaos Emeralds aren't part of the plot, they can be brought back for being Special stage only.

[jords]

Terrible memories from colors multiplayer. Two sonics cannot share a screen. Me and my bro will like this multiplayer! if that is my bro can gain skills at parkouring. This game might take time to get used to. at least it's actually levels.