Sonic 4: Episode 2 Screens & Media Topic

[Jeffhog]

I just realized something else.

Ladies and gentlemen, I would like to add just one more thing.

Fucking.

CALLED IT.

Edited February 15, 2012 by VizardJeffhog

[KHCast]

Lets see here, Sonic and sega all stars racing 2, Maybe Generations DLC, Sonic 4 episode 2, Yes. Lets hope that makes 3 great things to not be disappointed in! Also episode 3....Sunset based?

Edited February 15, 2012 by The Amazing Spiderman

[Blue Blood]

I just realized something else.

Ladies and gentlemen, I would like to add just one more thing.

Fucking.

CALLED IT.

[Nintendoga]

One last thing I wanna mention though, that one pic that Xbox had with the release date being 5/16/12.

Here's from Sega's SOS'12 announcement.

This will be the fifth anniversary of Summer of Sonic – and we’re determined to make it the biggest and best show yet! SoS is an all-day event that celebrates all aspects of the Sonic franchise. ‘Zoned’ areas offer a range of different activities – budding artists can sit down at the fan art tables and compete in competitions, speed runners can challenge each other at the retro gaming pods, and the latest Sonic titles are available for fans to try before they’re even released.

[Indigo Rush]

I kinda want them to tone down on the 3D games for a bit. We don't need one every year. Sonic 4 and ASR2 are enough on their own, y'know?

[Soniman]

I kinda want them to tone down on the 3D games for a bit. We don't need one every year. Sonic 4 and ASR2 are enough on their own, y'know?

[Red Cap]

Was just talking to Neon about this, and to us it looks like the carnival and ice stages are in fact separate. Look at how none of the carnival area is snowy, and the northern lights only show up in the snowy area.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Red Cap-Blue Spikes

[Blue Blood]

Erm, the northern lights DO show up in the carnival area (you can see them quite clearly if you look to the top left), and if you look at the trees at the bottom you can see they're covered in snow. They could very well be seperate levels, but I'm just pointing that out. Though there have been other Carnival/Snow levels in the series.

Edited February 15, 2012 by HYDROCITEE

[sonfan1984]

I kinda want them to tone down on the 3D games for a bit. We don't need one every year. Sonic 4 and ASR2 are enough on their own, y'know?

[Red Cap]

The northern lights ONLY show up in that area that's snowy. The rest of the stage, which clearly isn't snowy, doesn't have the northern lights in the sky. It's only that one part, which could very well be the start of the stage acting as a transition from one stage to the next.

[Aquaslash]

As of right now, I think it's only with the Super Emeralds. Unless Tails's Heroes transformation counts as a super form.

[-Robin-]

Fucking.

CALLED IT.

I've been calling a Christmas themed Zone, a Carnival Zone that activates in the second act, and SPECIFICALLY an Oil Refinery Zone in the status updates for months. :V All that's missing is my Diamond Quarry Zone.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Professor Westwood V

[Big Boss (legendsneverdie)]

I just noticed not one of those pictures has a speed booster in them. Dimps, explain this!

I don't see any speed boosters in the pictures.

[-Mark-]

Bleh, seeing these screens makes me wish that SEGA will one day release a 2D Sonic game with as many levels/worlds as, say, New Super Mario Bros. Wii or Donkey Kong Country Returns. I don't expect the level design to be even half as good, but to have a huge 2D Sonic game that can/must be beat in multiple sittings that's actually good would be splendid, especially with these visuals.

I will never, ever get the argument of 'Sonic games should have as many stages as Mario games'. Sure, more levels would be nice, but when you look at it from a technical perspective it's just not reasonable. Sonic and Mario stages are so wildly different in their structure that it's really not fair to compare them.

I mean seriously, take a typical 2D Mario stage and compare it to a typical 2D Sonic stage. Where to start?

Most (if not all) 2D Mario stages are basically linear, left-to-right affairs with very little in the way of alternate routes. Heck, half of the time they're just a bunch of floating, spinning blocks. With Mario 3D Land recently (which, let's face it, is closer to a 2D Mario in design than a 3D one, despite the title), my brother and I joked; "I bet sometimes Miyamoto just knocks a box of Lego on the floor, looks at the designers and says 'Make a stage out of that'." Sonic stages on the other hand have a lot more going on. They're much livelier and don't just feel like a bunch of random objects making up an obstacle course. They feel more like actual environments.

Regardless of opinions on stage quality, it's really not very hard to see that, at least from a design and structural standpoint, a Sonic stage takes many times more effort to build than a Mario one. Also bear in mind that most Mario stages are quite short, whereas even at relatively high speeds, Sonic stages tend to last around 2-3 minutes. They're much bigger. As such it's really quite unfair to compare them, when you think in terms of development time and cost. Besides, I'll still make the argument that most 2D Mario games (and even a few of the 3D ones) have wildly forgettable stages. There's so many of them, and they're all just sort of... there. Most 2D Marios feel like a string of generic, unmemorable obstacle courses to me.

Also, people are still complaining about 'only four zones'? Have you guys all been spoilt by Sonic 2 or something? Four zones with three acts each is already technically as long as Sonic 3 was (6 zones/ 2 acts) and about the same length as Sonic & Knuckles, too. Okay, Sonic 1 had 6x3 acts, but still. Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were full-price retail games back in the day, and people are complaining that they get a game of similar length game for a fraction of the price? Yes, times have changed, but still. I think some people are forgetting that this is a download game that's going to cost under a tenner.

[Big Boss (legendsneverdie)]

Never mind, I misread your post.

[Tiller]

You know I kept getting the feeling that this is in retaliation to Sonic Fan Remix. That grass is nearly in the same style at least. But when I kept looking closer at it I realized that it was the sky that was drawing my attention. It really reminds me of Brawl's level art. Especially that first shot. The sky and the lighting really make the screens pop, just like Brawl's stages and subspace story mode.

Can't say that's a bad thing.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Tiller

[Detective Shadzter]

Just noticed that there appears to be another one of those tutorial monitors at the bottom of this screenshot where Sonic and Tails are flying up from.

If the Aquatic Ruin Zone stage is the first stage, then could this mean you gain combo moves as you progress through the game?

[JezMM]

Besides, I'll still make the argument that most 2D Mario games (and even a few of the 3D ones) have wildly forgettable stages. There's so many of them, and they're all just sort of... there. Most 2D Marios feel like a string of generic, unmemorable obstacle courses to me.

I think it depends on familiarity. D= With the exception of Sonic 3 & Knuckles, I find all Classic Sonic stages as pretty unmemorable, repetitive obstacle courses. On Sonic 1 and 2 especially, I still tend to never have any idea how far I am through a stage until right near the end.

I do just wanna say though that I don't think for a second Mario stages are any easier to design, and I love that every stage has a unique gimmick to it (especially in NSMB and Mario 3D Land's normal mode - NSMBWii and Mario 3D Land's special mode do reuse stuff but I'm okay with that since they're intended to be more challenging, and there's nothing wrong reusing a gimmick for such a thing if you're using it in a way that'd be way too mean first time round).

A unique gimmick on every stage is something Sonic 4 Ep 1 had and I'm really hoping we'll have again here (looks like we will though if the act-based aesthetics are anything to go by).

Edited February 15, 2012 by JezMM

[Marcello]

Was just talking to Neon about this, and to us it looks like the carnival and ice stages are in fact separate. Look at how none of the carnival area is snowy, and the northern lights only show up in the snowy area. On top of that, it doesn't sound likely to me that there'll be underwater ice caverns in the same stage as the carnival. There's crossing tropes, and then there's that. Seems like a stage transition, ala the start of Launch Base 1 being covered in snow.

You can see the Christmas trees and Northern Lights here:

[OlenJimi]

The tutorial boxes show that you can fly with Tails and that you can do the combo thing.

[Detective Shadzter]

The tutorial boxes show that you can fly with Tails and that you can do the combo thing.

I know. I was just pointing out that it's weird that there is one later in the game teaching you how to fly together, so I'm wondering if maybe you have to unlock combo moves as you go through the game.

[ArtFenix]

The tutorial boxes show that you can fly with Tails and that you can do the combo thing.

I just hope they won't turn out to be things forced down your throat like in one of sonic shorts episode

"You got lightspeed shoes! You got a ring! You got another ring!". Gamers should find out themselves where it is possible to fly and where you should take another route and stuff like that so the game wouldn't look automated or predictable.

At the very least, make these things optional like Omochao in Generations.

Edited February 15, 2012 by ArtFenix

[krazystitch]

I know. I was just pointing out that it's weird that there is one later in the game teaching you how to fly together, so I'm wondering if maybe you have to unlock combo moves as you go through the game.

That could be true.

Though, I find it pretty odd myself that they would make you stop midway through a level, especially one with the stature of something like a classic game, in order to be able to tell you how to execute a move. Maybe it's just a screen telling you what you need to do to use the co-op move, like some kind of button combination or something, and the sign being there to let you know. Just another thought.

Edited February 15, 2012 by krazystitch

[Salamander]

Ah, these are very nice! Much improved on the recycling of Episode 1. I'm having a hard time figuring out the architectural style used in NotAquaticRuins - it mostly looks very much like Aquatic Ruins and Marble Garden, but there are bits that look more medieval. Maybe the level will progress through more castle-like areas, in the same way the ice carnival has both ice and carnival segments? It also looks like they're making more use of lighting changes, which as I recall were only used in Episode 1 in the sunset act of Splash Hill. Good move - it helps to differentiate the levels from another. I see interesting use of tropes here - Aquatic Ruin was already a mingling of ruins and water and hopefully Episode 2 will make more of both elements. Christmas Carnival looks great - there are a lot of ways you could combine those two tropes, like having slippery rollercoaster slopes, for instance. The desert level is a modern, mechanised desert - again, lots you can do there, including employing oil elements. There's a lot of potential in these combinations, and they have three and a bit acts to make use of them. I'm inclined to say we've only seen the first three zones so far, although of course if the level select is in place again then there isn't actually any real chronology.

I wonder if the plane screenshot is from an opening cutscene, or if in fact it's from a level transition at the end of the level? Probably the former. Tails and Sonic fly in to an area where Eggman's been sighted, or something like that. Level transition cutscenes would be great, though - they made Sonic 3&K's levels feel like they were more part of one world rather than just being a bunch of arbitrary episodes. Metal Sonic stealing the rocket, on the other hand, looks like a boss fight to me. Theory: Two Eggman boss fights, two Metal Sonic boss fights, and the final boss fight is both - at once, or one then the other. Oh, of course! It's Episode 2, and like in Sonic 2, you'll fight the Sonic robot before you fight the Eggman robot. Which will probably take place on the hijacked Death Egg planet, or possibly on some kind of space elevator or orbital platform leading to it.

The monitors are probably just tutorials or reminders for how to use combination moves, when they first show up. I doubt they unlock those moves or anything. The apparently increasing mechanisation of the planet in the sky across the levels is the sort of subtle detail that helps to establish a plot in the player's mind without the game having to dictate much to you.

Still, these leaks show exactly why Sega should quit the dribs-and-drabs marketing style. There are always leaks of more interesting things long before they plan to show them to us. If Sega were smart they'd let us have a trailer with brief glimpses of these new levels and new features early on, and then the leaks wouldn't spoil anything except for a bit more detail. Meanwhile they could still run Concept Art Fridays and things like that on the understanding that small reveals come between bigger ones. I hope they rethink this for Episode 3, given that this is two failures for technically the same game to not have fairly huge details spoiled. Oh, and speaking of which, Episode 3 plot: Eggman goes after the Master Emerald again and our heroes call on Knuckles to help deal with the situation. Something like that, probably, judging from the tone of the plot this time.

[Milo]

........well, I said that I would stay entirely pessimistic about the game until screenshots/gameplay is released, and (unintentionally in leaked form) the former has.

The good :

Graphicwise,this makes Episode I look even more like a fangame. It's literally 10x better and is on par with Sonic Fan Remix's graphics, and the models don't look too shabby. I'm happy they scrapped the cel-shading for Episode II, and overall the artstyle looks consistent. So all-in-all, thank goodness the Wii platform was dropped.

They also got more creative this time around with level tropes, by combing multiple variants of them this time and (for the most part) making sure they aren't total rehashes of pre-existing classic levels. The combo-move Sonic and Tails are preforming seems rather interesting, apparently it looks like a huge spin attack. And local and online multiplayer co-op? Hot damn, I thought that wouldn't see the light of day for a long time (if not ever)....

And a early summer release dateof May 16th? Sure, as long as the final product is good. Otherwise I wouldn't mind another delay as long as it actually fixes signifigant problems instead of making tweaks to them and adding things such as "Sonic now actually able to move off the level screen."

The bad :

This is mostly information based, but eh. I'm getting really concerned about how much content this episode will have. Four (main) zones again? *sigh*....I can only hope that there are a lot more acts for each zone than just "three acts and an act that could had worked on as an entirely new act but we got lazy again and decided to put the boss a few yards away from the starting area."And although I am happy to see local/online co-op, I'm kinda dissapointed there's no local/competitive competitive co-op. And in addition to more content, hopefully we'll get much better level design. But unfortunately, that placement of a Bubbles HA chain in one of the screenshots pretty much indicates one thing: Dimps.

Damn it, Sega. Sometimes, it's like you half of the time is actually listening to what the fans have to say about the game and the other half of the time they still don't give a shit. You put these clowns in charge of developing Sonic 4 again? Haven't you seen the reviews for Generations 3DS? Haven't you seen the quality of these games drop as of recently? Or are you still just looking at how much money their half-assed portable editions of Sonic Team's console games have been making. Speaking of Generations 3DS, it just shows proof that better physics still doesn't matter much if you have shit level design. I can only hope Dimps will not have a large hand in developing this game, and that the majority of the game's development will be by Sonic Team (the people who SHOULD be developing this game. By themselves.).

Dimps rant aside, one level (namely the ruins level) also bears a bit too much resemblance to Aquatic Ruin Zone in both artistic design and use of badniks (in addition to Chop Chop, we, and of course we're getting Sonic 2 Special Stages again. No surprise here.

And we still have yet to see the game in motion. Physics, more level design, animations, and more still are yet to be revealed (although considering that this was just recently leaked, I guess we don't have to wait long in order to find out).

The interesting :

Most of it is simply just based on background observement. It looks like a floating planet can be seen in "Carnival Blizzard Zone" (as of right now, that's what I'm calling it.) At first, I merely assumed that this was an abandoned Death Egg Zone. Until I saw another picture of it in "Aquatic Ruin Zone Ver. II" floating in the air. As some others have said, it could be Little Planet from Sonic CD. However, the planet bears some resemblance to the Death Egg, as the exterior of the planet has some of the telltale signs of the Death Egg. Maybe the Death Egg (or an successor to it) is being rebuilt or mechanizing the planet? If the planet is indeed Sonic CD's Little Planet mechanized, it would be that this is happening for a second time.

Considering that Episode II is supposed to tie some knots with Sonic CD and feature Metal Sonic as the antagonist along with Eggman, it does make sense. But here's the thing: Little Planet apparently appears "one month out of the year." Now here's some fridge logic: Take note that Sonic 4 took place directly after Sonic &K, which took place directly after Sonic 3, and that took place after Sonic 2. Sonic 2, 3, and &K all form the "Death Egg Saga." This could be implying that Sonic CD couldn't had taken place shortly before or shortly after the Death Egg Saga and Sonic 4 saga if the planet in Episode II is indeed Little Planet, because it only appears once a year in one month.

In one of the screenshots, Metal Sonic is riding on the same type of rocket Sonic used to access the E.G.G. Station Zone in the previous episode. So maybe Eggman did build the rocket for Sonic to access for Episode I? If that's the case, then why did he put Tails's insignia on the logo? Maybe to trick him?

And last but not least, if the Little Planet and/or the Death Egg is/are involved, it's a very far stretch, but I hope it could be a hint that Amy Rose, Mecha Sonic, and/or Knuckles could be in Sonic 4.

Long story short: Although I'm still weary of this game in terms of who's developing it (which overall is in charge of developing the gameplay, physics, level design, etc.) and the game's content, I'm rather pleasantly surprised about the graphics, co-op multiplayer, and hints of creativity and storyline. Sega's won back some of my optimism for this game and Sonic 4 as a whole. Hopefully they don't do something stupid enough to make me flush it down the toilet.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Zinos