Sonic Generations: GameWorld (IgroMir) and ComicCon /PAX, GamesCom, TGS, and GAMEfest/ Special Topic [ARCHIVE]

[sjmaster92]

So far Chemical Plant has yet to impress me with either stage. Both versions seem really barren at this point.

[ChikaBoing]

To me it looks great, I dunno what your peeps are really talking about. The use of Areas is alot more varied than GHZ. And not even that much worse than CE.

At first you're on a 3D Pipe with 3 Routes to take, then you drift 2 Times, do quick-step. then Grind, then you run along the pipes in 2d...after that there is the waterslide, do free fall and then you're underwater.

Seems pretty engaging to play trough to me. Also let's not forget how the orginal CPZ was.

Edited August 23, 2011 by ChikaBoing

[EXshad]

So what if Chemical Plants have a few narrow segments? So did Chun Nan and Aquarium Park, and if I remember correctly, those are some of the more expansive stages in Sonic Unleashed and Colors. Besides, remember the gameplay? how expansive THAT looked?

Yeah, I wouldn't flip out over that one semi-automated session that we already knew about when the pics of Chemical Plant were first revealed.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Classic EXshad

[Koopalmier]

What ? There are new CP screenshots ? Did I miss anything ?

[Scar]

There are many different routes to go, and one route even requires you to use physics (OMG) by jumping at a high speed to reach.

Other than that it looks like....well a bunch of pipes. However, considering what Chemical plant zone was and is, I'm not really surprised. Besides, I'm wondering why so many people are surprised and dissappointed, we saw those iconic pipes when the screenshots came out. This is nothing new, we just got to see where those pipes lead to.

I'd say they're doing well with the source material. Made it far more complex than they could have.

[Marcello]

The pipes aren't the only hallway segments.

[EXshad]

The pipes aren't the only hallway segments.

What other ones are there? The waterslide segment doesn't count, and after that is a pretty expansive-looking water segment. I don't see why there's griping, seriously. The original Chemical Plant, with the classic momentum-based platforming and all, had segments where Sonic ran really fast on those pipes without the option of taking another route. It's just how the level was designed. Granted, those segments were few and few in between, but the level is being translated to Modern Sonic's gameplay, so what do you expect?

[Marcello]

Looking at everything we've seen of Modern CPZ, we've got the level starting with a whole bunch of hallways, with alternate roads and possible alternate routes and a grind section. Later come the slide and a free falling section, followed by another hallway where you have to slide under a wall. So far, little to no platforming in 3D.

In 2D it looks a bit better, with an alternate route depending on what pipe you jump on early in the stage. Later we get a glimps of a minor platforming segment before Sonic jumps into the slide. The underwater section we've seen has some very basic platforming, but it's something.

[EXshad]

Looking at everything we've seen of Modern CPZ, we've got the level starting with a whole bunch of hallways, with alternate roads and possible alternate routes and a grind section. Later come the slide and a free falling section, followed by another hallway where you have to slide under a wall. So far, little to no platforming in 3D.

I'm sorry, but how the fuck is that new?! The 3D portions of Modern Sonic's levels are not platform heavy; they focus on constant movement and having a quick reaction time, purposely in direct contrast to Classic Sonic's gameplay. And this has been a fact since Sonic Unleashed. In fact, Sonic Colors, the most platforming-heavy main console Sonic game since Sonic 3 and Knuckles, had little to none of it in the 3D segments. The 3D segments are fast-moving speed-based areas for the most part, while the platforming is handled in the 2D areas, as shown in practically all the footage. Sometimes the 2 styles criss-cross, but essentially, that's the gist of it. Besides, it's not like these 3D areas aren't expansive, either: just look at City Escape. Essentially, it boils down to 3D being speed-based, 2D being more platforming heavy. I thought this was well-established a long-ass time ago.

In short, I can KINDA understand your complain with the lack of multiple routes, but complaining about the lack of 3D platforming now is... well, you're a bit late, to say the least.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Classic EXshad

[Marcello]

I'm sorry, but how the fuck is that new?! The 3D portions of Modern Sonic's levels are not platform heavy; they focus on constant movement and having a quick reaction time, in purposely direct contrast to Classic Sonic's gameplay. And this has been a fact since Sonic Unleashed. In fact, Sonic Colors, the most platforming-heavy main console Sonic game since Sonic 3 and Knuckles, had little to none of it in the 3D segments. The 3D segments are fast-moving speed-based areas for the most part, while the platforming is handled in the 2D areas, as shown in practically all the footage. Besides, it's not like these 3D areas aren't expansive, either: just look at City Escape. Essentially, it boils down to 3D being speed-based, 2D being more platforming heavy. I thought this was well-established a long-ass time ago.

In short, I can KINDA understand your complain with the lack of multiple routes, but complaining about the lack of 3D platforming now is... well, you're a bit late, to say the least.

So what? It's still a problem and just because it's been like this for while, doesn't make it ok. I'll complain until they fix this..

[Detective Shadzter]

I'm sorry, but how the fuck is that new?! The 3D portions of Modern Sonic's levels are not platform heavy; they focus on constant movement and having a quick reaction time, in purposely direct contrast to Classic Sonic's gameplay. And this has been a fact since Sonic Unleashed. In fact, Sonic Colors, the most platforming-heavy main console Sonic game since Sonic 3 and Knuckles, had little to none of it in the 3D segments. The 3D segments are fast-moving speed-based areas for the most part, while the platforming is handled in the 2D areas, as shown in practically all the footage. Besides, it's not like these 3D areas aren't expansive, either: just look at City Escape. Essentially, it boils down to 3D being speed-based, 2D being more platforming heavy. I thought this was well-established a long-ass time ago.

In short, I can KINDA understand your complain with the lack of multiple routes, but complaining about the lack of 3D platforming now is... well, you're a bit late, to say the least.

Just because it's well-established that there is barely any platforming in this style of 3D Sonic gameplay, it doesn't mean people can't and shouldn't post their complaints about it. MarcelloF is entitled to his complaints.

Anyway, this is one of the reasons why I say I don't like this style of 3D Sonic gameplay. I want to be able to explore and do some platforming in 3D. Boosting down corridors all of the time and occasionally changing direction isn't my idea of fun. The 2D platforming sections are fun in both Classic and Modern styles, but I personally just don't like the 3D sections and all of this recent footage isn't winning me over either.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Shadzter

[Invictus Ordo]

I've spotted more but I'm in a rush to get to class so i'll post them later...

Edited August 23, 2011 by Omnis Doc Invictus

[Neon]

Just because it's well-established that there is barely any platforming in this style of 3D Sonic gameplay, it doesn't mean people can't and shouldn't post their complaints about it. MarcelloF is entitled to his complaints.

Anyway, this is one of the reasons why I say I don't like this style of 3D Sonic gameplay. I want to be able to explore and do some platforming in 3D. Boosting down corridors and occasionally changing direction isn't my idea of fun. The 2D platforming sections are fun in both Classic and Modern styles, but I personally just don't like the 3D sections and all of this recent footage isn't winning me over either.

While i respect what you say, Shad. Then why do you prefer the 3DS version of all things? It's so shallow in comparison to the console versions. You complain that modern gameplay is 3D hallway boost-fest, yet Modern Sonic in the 3DS is objectively much worse.

The console version pretty much destroys it in all departments.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Neon

[EXshad]

So what? It's still a problem and just because it's been like this for while, doesn't make it ok. I'll complain until they fix this..

But you missed my point. Modern Sonic isn't solely about platforming. In fact, Modern Sonic's gameplay has evolved into being a hybrid of platforming and fast-moving, reaction-time based gameplay. His primary focus is moving really fast with an unbroken pace, occasionally slowing down to tackle some platforming, like we've seen in a few portions of all the levels. However, these platforming segments, like Sonic Colors, are mainly in 2D, to give the 3D segments a sense of being really, really fast, like it's practically been this way since.. well, Sonic Adventure, I guess. Yes, I do admit; I like some 3D, Chun-Nan-style platforming, but the primary focus of his gameplay is very different than that of Classic Sonic. Classic Sonic's gameplay is primarily platforming, while Modern's is more or less focused on moving really really fast, while maintaining that movement by having a quick reaction time. And this was done on purpose, to make each version of Sonic feel quite different from each other.

Just because it's well-established that there is barely any platforming in this style of 3D Sonic gameplay, it doesn't mean people can't and shouldn't post their complaints about it. MarcelloF is entitled to his complaints.

I'm not saying he isn't entitled to his complaints. Complain away! I do it all the time The point I'm trying to make is simply that Modern Sonic isn't generally about that, that's all. The complaints about the lack of platforming would hold a lot more ground if that's what Modern Sonic was meant to do, that's all I'm trying to say.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Classic EXshad

[ChikaBoing]

Anyway, this is one of the reasons why I say I don't like this style of 3D Sonic gameplay. I want to be able to explore and do some platforming in 3D. Boosting down corridors all of the time and occasionally changing direction isn't my idea of fun. The 2D platforming sections are fun in both Classic and Modern styles, but I personally just don't like the 3D sections and all of this recent footage isn't winning me over either.

Still it's how the orginal was, spare plattforming, changing direction from time to time.

[Detective Shadzter]

While i respect what you say, Shad. Then why do you prefer the 3DS version of all things? It's so shallow in comparison to the console versions. You complain that modern gameplay is 3D hallway boost-fest, yet Modern Sonic in the 3DS is objectively much worse.

The console version pretty much destroys it in all departments.

The 3DS version doesn't have 3D gameplay and thus doesn't have the Modern Sonic 3D gameplay problems. It has the fun classic 2D gameplay and the fun 2D gameplay from the Sonic Rush games. That's why I prefer that version so far.

The 2D Classic Sonic gameplay in the console version looks fun and so do the 2D Modern Sonic sections, but the 3D sections are so dull, hard to control and just not fun in my opinion.

I'm not saying I don't like 3D gameplay. I just want some exploring and platforming in 3D.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Shadzter

[frokenok3]

I agree with Shadzter and MarcelloF and EXshad on this. I think hey are both right in this one. You see something you don't like or something you don't have fun with then you have to say it doesn't matter how old it is.

On the other hand i agree with EXshad too that modern Sonic's gameplay since Unleashed is about moving fast in 3D and slow down for 2D platforming + some quick 2D platforming.

Personally i don't like the gameplay of Sonic adventure and i don't like too much exploring...and that's why i like the SU formula because it gives me breath taking speed in 3D with quick reaction and emphasis to Sonic's speed while the 2D gives me what made me love Sonic 2D platforming...quick and slow.

[Neon]

The 3DS version doesn't have 3D gameplay and thus doesn't have the Modern Sonic 3D gameplay problems. It has the fun classic 2D gameplay and the fun 2D gameplay from the Sonic Rush games. That's why I prefer that version so far.

The 2D Classic Sonic gameplay in the console version looks fun and so do the 2D Modern Sonic sections, but the 3D sections are so dull, hard to control and just not fun in my opinion.

Whatever, man. Have fun playing this. I'd much rather play Modern 3D stages than this crap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W85i4qN0X7E

Modern 3DS gameplay looks so bland. There's nothing there. On top of that, Classic Sonic's level design is just copy and pasted. There's nothing new at all.

Anyway, according to most people, it's been significantly improved from Unleashed/Colours.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Neon

[EXshad]

The 3DS version doesn't have 3D gameplay and thus doesn't have the Modern Sonic 3D gameplay problems. It has the fun classic 2D gameplay and the fun 2D gameplay from the Sonic Rush games. That's why I prefer that version so far.

The 2D Classic Sonic gameplay in the console version looks fun and so do the 2D Modern Sonic sections, but the 3D sections are so dull, hard to control and just not fun in my opinion.

I'm not saying I don't like 3D gameplay. I just want some platforming and exploring in 3D.

But you could make them same complaint with the 3DS version: it's a boostfest in the Modern areas, only in 2D instead of 3D. The HD version looks more varied, with the switches in 2D to 3D perspective, some areas where you slow down and tackle platforming, the branching paths..

Again, I can honestly understand many of these gripes you have with the HD version, but at the same time, it seems like a double standard. It's okay for Sonic to based on forward movement with minimal exploration in 2D, but in 3D, then it's bad? I'm confused about that.. and forgive me for disagreeing dude, but I really think the 3D, while not exactly brimming with open-space, is plenty expansive, given Modern Sonic's gameplay goals. The only thing I'm miffed about are the invisible walls that limit that exploration in some areas of levels like Green Hill zone, but that's a debate for another time

[Indigo Rush]

The Modern Sonic gameplay as it is now keeps the feel and flow of a traditional Sonic game, and I love it.

[Detective Shadzter]

I'm not saying he isn't entitled to his complaints. Complain away! I do it all the time The point I'm trying to make is simply that Modern Sonic isn't generally about that, that's all. The complaints about the lack of platforming would hold a lot more ground if that's what Modern Sonic was meant to do, that's all I'm trying to say.

Oh, I see what you mean now I understand Unleashed, Colours and Generations aren't designed with that in mind, but I still think people who don't like that should still post their complaints about it, even though we know it's not going to change.

I'm glad with this game that there's still the Classic Sonic 2D gameplay, so people like me who don't enjoy this style of 3D gameplay but enjoy the 2D stuff, will still find something they can enjoy in the game.

[Scar]

The 3DS version doesn't have 3D gameplay and thus doesn't have the Modern Sonic 3D gameplay problems. It has the fun classic 2D gameplay and the fun 2D gameplay from the Sonic Rush games. That's why I prefer that version so far.

The 2D Classic Sonic gameplay in the console version looks fun and so do the 2D Modern Sonic sections, but the 3D sections are so dull, hard to control and just not fun in my opinion.

I'm not saying I don't like 3D gameplay. I just want some exploring and platforming in 3D.

I can understand the possibility of dullness in the 3D sections, but from what I played of Modern Green Hill, it certainly wasn't hard to control. In fact, in spite of the blistering speed, I'd say it was actually pretty brilliant to control. The movement is tight, but not so tight that your turning radius is equivalent to a SR-71 Blackbird. Also the Spindash Drift is beautifully programmed and works nearly perfectly.

[EXshad]

Oh, I see what you mean now I understand Unleashed, Colours and Generations aren't designed with that in mind, but I still think people who don't like that should still post their complaints about it, even though we know it's not going to change.

Well, I have my own gripes with 3D Sonic. 2 things right now, honestly: 1) Invisible walls, and 2) the lack of camera control. But again, Generations is meant to showcase 2 very different styles of how Sonic has played in his history, and that's why I'm perfectly fine with a lot of this.

If I had my way and there was just one Sonic however, yes, I'd do things differently. In fact, I wrote a little blurb about this in a topic here..

[Marcello]

Going away from this discussion, one thing in that sort of bothers me in the new interview is Iizuka saying, "This game is supposed to show the whole history of Sonic, that's why it's not important to implement new ideas."

Although it is sort of funny. Another quote showing Iizuka's great interviewing skills.

Don't get me wrong, I know what he means and we have known it for a while, but it's still an odd thing to say.

Edited August 23, 2011 by MarcelloF

[Detective Shadzter]

Whatever, man. Have fun playing this. I'd much rather play Modern 3D stages than this crap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W85i4qN0X7E

Modern 3DS gameplay looks so bland. There's nothing there. On top of that, Classic Sonic's level design is just copy and pasted. There's nothing new at all.

Anyway, according to most people, it's been significantly improved from Unleashed/Colours.

I've not seen the Modern Sonic Green Hill Zone stage from the 3DS Gamescom demo, but the Classic Sonic stage has received lots of updates, even though it's still the same copy and paste stage. The copy and pasted Classic stages are disappointing as I've said before, but they still appear to be as fun as ever and look much better. The Modern stages, especially Mushroom Hill Zone look brilliant to me. It's cool that you don't like them, but I'm pretty excited.

But you could make them same complaint with the 3DS version: it's a boostfest in the Modern areas, only in 2D instead of 3D. The HD version looks more varied, with the switches in 2D to 3D perspective, some areas where you slow down and tackle platforming, the branching paths..

Again, I can honestly understand many of these gripes you have with the HD version, but at the same time, it seems like a double standard. It's okay for Sonic to based on forward movement with minimal exploration in 2D, but in 3D, then it's bad? I'm confused about that.. and forgive me for disagreeing dude, but I really think the 3D, while not exactly brimming with open-space, is plenty expansive, given Modern Sonic's gameplay goals. The only thing I'm miffed about are the invisible walls that limit that exploration in some areas of levels like Green Hill zone, but that's a debate for another time

It's not as simple as a change of perspective to me. I find I can't see what's coming ahead in this style of fast-paced 3D gameplay, while in 2D I can. Also in 2D there's lots of platforming, while in 3D there isn't. Whether it's in Classic style or Modern Rush style, there's always some platforming or other fun things to play with to advance in a stage. In Unleashed and Colours it's just bland boosting down corridors and occasionally homing attacking enemy chains or grinding a rail. That's about as interesting as it gets. Again, just my opinion, though.

I can understand the possibility of dullness in the 3D sections, but from what I played of Modern Green Hill, it certainly wasn't hard to control. In fact, in spite of the blistering speed, I'd say it was actually pretty brilliant to control. The movement is tight, but not so tight that your turning radius is equivalent to a SR-71 Blackbird. Also the Spindash Drift is beautifully programmed and works nearly perfectly.

I've been hearing that the controls and drifting have been tweaked a bit compared to Unleashed and Colours, so I'll reserve judgement on those until I get my hands on the demo at GAMEfest and the final game, but in Unleashed and Colours I just had trouble controlling Sonic. The drifting was especially bad for me, no matter how much I practiced. If the controls are much better, then I'll be glad, but that alone won't make the 3D sections much more fun for me.

I'm happy you guys are happy with the 3D sections. I'm sorry if I'm coming off controversial or something by not liking them myself, but I can't change the way I feel :-/

Edited August 23, 2011 by Shadzter