New Smash Bros?

[Gregzilla]

Well, what more do you want? He's got finger bullets, lasers, walkie-fingers and a flick, grab and crush, rocket punch, swats, probably more I'm forgetting, plus Crazy Hand has some unique moves and there's team-up attacks when both are there. Not that I'd mind a few new moves but he's already got some neat tricks.

That's what I'm getting at. There's nothing wrong with his current moveset, but why not add a few more moves to spice things up? They didn't give him any new moves from Melee to Brawl, and it'd be boring if they gave us pretty much the same fight once again.

Not trying to sound ungrateful here, I'm just always looking for potential improvement.

[LunarEdge]

That's what I'm getting at. There's nothing wrong with his current moveset, but why not add a few more moves to spice things up? They didn't give him any new moves from Melee to Brawl, and it'd be boring if they gave us pretty much the same fight once again.

Not trying to sound ungrateful here, I'm just always looking for potential improvement.

I'd say give Master Hand a whole new moveset just so he does seem like a refreshing character/concept to any future Smash Brothers. His moves have been copy > paste throughout 64 to Brawl with one or two things added here or there.

Although, I'm more of a fan of MH than Tabuu. Fuck it... just make Miyamoto the boss and like Crazy Hand, have Sakurai be his partner XD

Edited August 7, 2012 by LunarEdge

[Chaos Warp]

Also, still vying for more Melee-like competitive physics......

[Blacklightning]

To me, the focus with Master Hand should be less about "give him more moves" and more about "make his AI not dumb". Is it wrong that it absolutely gets on my tits the way Sakurai designs boss battles? Every single last one of them that I can possibly think of, not just Master Hand, not just the bosses of Brawl in general, but every damn game I can think of that he's ever made, all consist of "dodge attack selected completely at random, wail on him while he stands completely still afterwards like a retard, repeat", and not once has he ever caught any shit for it. I just don't understand it. Why wouldn't you want some AI that can think dynamically, especially in a fighting game where battles shouldn't come down to nothing more than basic pattern recognition?

Another big reason I've never really liked MH is that to me he just seems like a completely arbitary defiance of the game's established mechanics. Why, in a game that revolves around softening up enemies enough to be able to whack them right out of the arena, would you establish enemies and bosses restricted to health bars? Why not make it a challenge of fighting against his weight and permanent floaty-ness to knock him into the sunset?

[Remy]

Another big reason I've never really liked MH is that to me he just seems like a completely arbitary defiance of the game's established mechanics. Why, in a game that revolves around softening up enemies enough to be able to whack them right out of the arena, would you establish enemies and bosses restricted to health bars? Why not make it a challenge of fighting against his weight and permanent floaty-ness to knock him into the sunset?

Why because it's practically videogame tradition for final bosses to cause the game to suddenly have a bunch of new mechanics or be in a different genre, or require the player to fight using arbitrary tactics not needed elsewhere

Ex. http://tvtropes.org/...dGameplayChange

I agree with you though. XP

Making the final boss ludicrously heavy and requiring like 1000% damage to KO, via launching off the stage, would actually be pretty awesome I think.

[JezMM]

I think Master Hand is too set in it's ways (I think the idea of a Stamina match is kind of like Super Sonic battles in the Sonic games, it's something "different" for the finale. The real "traditional" final boss in Brawl Classic would be the random three opponents you fight on Final Destination beforehand I guess).

But the final boss for story mode being like that would be pretty cool yeah, especially if they made it a sort of scripted moment where it prompts you to finish him at 1000% with a Smash Attack (I love games where the final action done before the credits is the most iconic one from the game as a whole).

Don't forget though, Giga Bowser in Melee was somewhat what you're asking for. He was pretty neat.

I agree though, while I'm fine with Master Hand staying traditional to the previous entries, the Subspace bosses were really blah. Though slightly because far too few of them had that f'awesome Subspace Boss Battle music.

Edited August 8, 2012 by JezMM

[-Robin-]

The Galleom/Duon Boss Battle theme is all kinds of sexy.

Funny how the objectively "slowest" Smash game in the series got all the adrenaline-pumping tunes.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Bobbyjosh

[MegaMan_EXE]

Well, as you all know, it would be awesome if Capcom did manage to get Mega Man in there. After all, he had a high chance of being in Brawl, but our other blue friend, the badass himself, Sonic, got in

For moves, Mega would have moves from Marvel VS Capcom 1 and 2.

His Special Standard move will be the Mega Buster. 3 shots at a time, hold the button to charge it for extra damage

His Special Side move will be a one of 3 Robot Master weapons, the Metal Blade, Fire Storm , and Laser Trident

His Special Up move will be the Rush Coil to help him get back up to the field (like Sonic's Spring)

His Special Down move will have Eddie come down and give you a Robot Master weapon for the Side move (Metal Blade, Fire Storm and Laser Trident)

His Final Smash will be either the Super Mega Man adapter from Mega Man 7 where Rush and Mega Man combine to fly in the air with a Rocket Punch, or Hyper Mega Man from MvC1 and 2 where Rush, Eddie and Beat form with Mega Man to have a multi hit combo.

Plain and simple.

EDIT: Oh wait, Capcom's being a bunch of idiots, so this is a dream. Unless we petition! XD

EDIT 2: This is purely for Special Movesets. Alternate costumes, stage, Assist Trophy, gallery trophies, music pieces, and other coming later.

Edited August 8, 2012 by Sparklefur Fox

[LunarEdge]

Well, as you all know, it would be awesome if Capcom did manage to get Mega Man in there. After all, he had a high chance of being in Brawl, but our other blue friend, the badass himself, Sonic, got in

Would be nice if the two made it in though. Given it has nothing to do with Nintendo, Mega and Sonic are having a crossover comic soon, so what better way to actually have them duke it out? Real shame Capcom doesn't like the little guy anymore.

[MegaMan_EXE]

More on Mega Man:

Next are his Basic and Smash moves:

Standard moves will be a simple punch, kick, and then a uppercut

Side move will be the Donkey Kick that Sonic has, and Mega had in the Marvel VS Capcom series.

Up move will be the Pharaoh Shot, a fire ball, aimed straight into the air

Down move will be the Search Snake, which moves along the ground

Smash Side will be the Leaf Shield, a shield made of leaves that do multiple hits

Smash Up will be the Tornado Hold, a spinning tornado that goes along the ground and does multiple hits, as well as move.

Smash Down will be the Mega Ball, a soccer ball that can be kicked

[LunarEdge]

I thought we agreed on no speculating/posting possible movesets!! D:

[Chaos Warp]

I thought we agreed on no speculating/posting possible movesets!! D:

We did? I was not aware of this.

[LunarEdge]

We did? I was not aware of this.

It might have been years back before brawl was out XD

[-Robin-]

It's come to my notice that player guides, particular Nintendo Power, for Melee gave names to every attack the fighters in Melee had. Mewtwo, for example, had these names for its moveset:

Weak Attacks

1-Multi-Hit: Dark Flash, Dark Flame

Strong Attacks

Upward: Flip

Forward: Tail Whip

Downward: Tail Sweep

SMASH ATTACKS:

Upward: Galaxy Force

Forward: Shadow Blast

Downward: Shadow Bomb

Dash Attack: Dark Torch

Aerial Attacks:

Center: Body Spark

Front: Shadow Scratch

Back: Tail Flick

Up: Somersault Kick

Down: Meteor Kick

Special Attacks

Standard B: Shadow Ball

Foward B: Confusion

Upward B: Teleport

Downward B: Disable

Grapples and Throw Downs

Pummel: Dark Shock

Front: Shadow Cannon

Back: Telekinesis

Up: Psychic Whirlwind

Down: Tail Slap

It's very minor, but I would like Smash 4 to have official names for attacks beyond Special Attacks and Final Smashes. It would add flavor and appeal to each of the Smash 4 characters in different ways.

It would be fun to use Mewtwo and "Galaxy Storm" the battlefield once again, at any rate.

[LunarEdge]

Wouldn't it be safe to assume that a majority of the moves' "names" were the same for returning characters though? Although I agree... it would be a nice little add

[Gregzilla]

I'd like that. Maybe in training mode it could have a little optional text scroll on the side of the screen that displays the name of the move you just used.

Speaking of moves, I'd like to see how returning characters' movesets will be altered. I'd personally like Mario to get a different down-B attack, whether it be the return of the whirlwind move or just anything that isn't FLUDD. Perhaps the spin move from Galaxy.

[LunarEdge]

I'd like that. Maybe in training mode it could have a little optional text scroll on the side of the screen that displays the name of the move you just used.

Speaking of moves, I'd like to see how returning characters' movesets will be altered. I'd personally like Mario to get a different down-B attack, whether it be the return of the whirlwind move or just anything that isn't FLUDD. Perhaps the spin move from Galaxy.

As much as I didn't like FLUDD... I can see it working if it did more than push the opponent slightly. Maybe some damage? Maybe a better recovery depending on how long you charge it? Maybe just add more to it's push back to make it more threatening and harder for those to recover.

[Blacklightning]

If you gave it the ability to aim down (or hell, just gave it more vertical spread overall), you could give Mario some more edgeguarding ability without even requiring him to leave solid ground first. I'd be fine with just that, personally. The pushing power is fine as it is as long as you've got your timing right.

Honestly though, if anything about Mario needs a buff, it's gotta be his normals. A lot of them feel disproportionately wimpy and useless, and I swear his fsmash and fair are the only moves he has that can even kill anyone. It seems really wierd to have characters in the game that are so much more nimble than Mario yet can still KO things several times more reasily.

[JezMM]

Mario's Galaxy Spin would make a pretty cool new Side-B, especially if it had recovery properties similar to the original. You could also keep the Cape's forced about-face on the other player too.

Agreed on replacing FLUDD. It was bizarrely random, Sunshine didn't really need any move representation. Though the question would be what to replace it with seeing as the Galaxy Spin would be very similar to his original Down+B.

[Johnny Boy]

I think Ganondorf should use a sword for his side+b. It's about time he stopped being a clone of captain falcon.

[Diogenes]

Agreed on replacing FLUDD. It was bizarrely random, Sunshine didn't really need any move representation. Though the question would be what to replace it with seeing as the Galaxy Spin would be very similar to his original Down+B.

The Ground Pound comes to mind, although Yoshi and Bowser already have it.

Maybe put the spin on down, and something else on side. Maybe a hammer? He's used one in more than a few games.

[-Robin-]

Honestly though, if anything about Mario needs a buff, it's gotta be his normals. A lot of them feel disproportionately wimpy and useless, and I swear his fsmash and fair are the only moves he has that can even kill anyone. It seems really wierd to have characters in the game that are so much more nimble than Mario yet can still KO things several times more reasily.

Funny enough, Mario's Fair is the weakest spike in Brawl. Or at least second weakest, if you want to count the sourspot of Zelda's Dair.

But the lack of power in Mario's moves is compensated somewhat by the speed of which they come out. I think Mario has the second fastest moveset in the game - beaten out by only Sheik (even Meta Knight's moveset is slower overall, due to the starting lag of his Fsmash, Down Special, and Side Special) - so if Mario and the opponent are both in a neutral position and up close, Mario has the more reliable to get his attacks in first.

Lack of power can be tolerated if the moves are so fast that they can disrupt everything else, and can be used to deliver the final hit before people can react. Mario can use his own moves to defend until the time comes to kill with a Stutterstepped Frame 12 Fsmash, his invincibility-frame packing, high-priority Usmash, or his Jab 1 -> Jab 2-> Dsmash combo. On the other hand, Sonic will continue to struggle to kill below 200% as he has a Frame 17 Fsmash, a Frame 13 Back Air combined with a meh fall speed and air speed, and a Frame 15 Dsmash to kill with otherwise, and Ganondorf will continue to struggle to kill anything that is not read hard due to having no hard-hitting moves that kill before 110 that are faster than 15 or so frames.

The severe lack of range in Mario's attacks really, really hurts him though.

[-blank-]

You know what they need to do?

Have Luigi use the Poltergust 300 in some way. I'm not even a fan of Luigi's Mansion and I would STILL love to see that. Don't know how they would implement it, but if they could figure out a way...hell yeahz.

[Johnny Boy]

Luigi using the poltergust 300 in his move set would be cool. I wonder if Wario will have some of his moves from Wario land shake it. And on top of that, Kirby having some of his super moves from Kirbys return to dreamland as his final smash would be awesome.

Edited August 18, 2012 by Dark Energon Johnny

[Kuzu]

If Mario does get a ground pound as his new Down-B, it should be on fire and probably somewhat slower than Yoshi & Bowser's.