Megathread Sonic Origins | MT | General Discussion

[PSI Wind]

I'm buying it first on Steam and will buy the Switch version when it hopefully gets a physical release

[Sean]

I'm picking it up on Switch, I don't have much reason to play on PC due to its DRM and having access to previous fan ports. I'll still play it a ton on release but yeah I feel like getting Origins on PC would be redundant for my needs

[Blue Blood]

At an absolute worst, the Switch version of Origins will have a lower resolution and framerate on its menus than the other versions. It's absolutely negligible, and with the added bonus of portability it just makes the Switch version the best one by default. 

[TheOcelot]

Triple dipping; PS5, Switch & Series S. I've waited 17 years for 3&K to get a new release on a PlayStation console. I'm not waiting any longer!

[Willsy]

40 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

At an absolute worst, the Switch version of Origins will have a lower resolution and framerate on its menus than the other versions. It's absolutely negligible, and with the added bonus of portability it just makes the Switch version the best one by default. 

Yeah I may just get Switch for now and double dip on Xbox later. I would imagine Switch won't really have any cutbacks. 

[LegoFedora]

I'll probably just grab it on Xbox, since I have unleashed/fighters/etc on there anyways. May as well make it the dedicated sonic machine at this point.

If denuvo ever gets removed from the pc version, I'll grab it there too just because I want to watch the playtime skyrocket from how often I play sonic 1 out of boredom.

[Tenko]

It's a tough one, I think they will get me triple dipping like with Sonic Mania. I want it on Switch for the portability and it's got most of my "retro" titles on it due to Switch Online and other companies collections. But the trophies and potential higher resolution for the PS5 version will probably make me get another copy (plus it helps me feel like I'm personally helping support the release, vote with your wallet and all that). Then later on down the line when they ditch the DRM I'll grab the PC version in a sale or something as I'm sure the music mods putting the release music back in etc and potential game mods (adding Knuckles to CD) will be worth the third purchase. 

[Spin Slasher]

I want it on Switch also for Portability, Even though I don't like the Lower Resolution of the game, I will buy it

[Sonicka]

49 minutes ago, Spin Slasher said:

I want it on Switch also for Portability, Even though I don't like the Lower Resolution of the game, I will buy it

I wouldn’t worry too much about resolution - it’s going to be practically impossible to tell any difference between console versions with this collection of games (apart from maybe the menus… but even that’s unlikely to be really noticeable).

I got my copy downloaded and ready to boot up in a week when the thing goes live. Don’t let me down SEGA. Do well and you’ll get a second purchase if this eventually goes physical.

[Slashy]

I am thinking about getting it on PC as I expect all the modders to move to this version for future releases.

[Sean]

6 hours ago, Slashy said:

I am thinking about getting it on PC as I expect all the modders to move to this version for future releases.

I can tell you right now that this isn't going to ever happen.

There's a reason modding for Mania hasn't advanced much lately, and that's because its code is a royal pain in the ass to work with; it's written in C++ so if you want to add anything to it you need to use .dll injectors, which is no simple task. The modding scene for Mania has stagnated for this very reason, not to mention the extremely unlikely chance of a decompilation happening for RSDK v5 anytime soon. Compare this with the decompilations for Sonic 1, 2, and CD which are open source and entirely script-based. You can literally turn them into completely different games if you wanted to, that's how easy it is to mod them now that RSDK v3 and v4 have been decompiled. Along with that, Sonic 3 AIR's Oxygen engine is open source as well. People are even starting to add brand new characters without replacing existing character slots, like Mighty.

Origins is using a slightly updated version of Mania's v5, particularly S3K which doesn't use the aforementioned scripts. Why would everyone abandon the decomps for Origins when the easily moddable, open source ports are right there? Adding onto that, it's completely unfair for people to rely on modders to fix up and improve the game - this is something they do out of passion for their free time, and some games on PC have few to no mods at all. Remember how long it took for any breakthrough for Sonic R and SA2 mods to happen? That came about from years of dedicated fans who cared deeply about these games and poured countless hours into fiddling with their code without any of the original code to work with. When Colors HD was coming out everyone was like "Oh well I'll just wait for mods to fix it up" which is a poor mindset to take when it comes to products that this company is selling you, and it's not on the fans to fix up what Sega puts out.

I'm telling you all right now, if you're buying Origins on PC specifically for modding, you are going to be disappointed or to have to wait a long while before advanced progress is made. Don't base your platform of choice on the POTENTIAL for mods which may not even happen and wouldn't be able to supersede the previous fan ports' modding scenes. If you actually care about mods then download Sonic 3 AIR and the 1/2/CD decompilations. Buy Origins on whatever platform you prefer if you want to play the vanilla remasters. I'm not saying there won't be mods for it, but don't expect huge modifications out the gate.

[Slashy]

3 hours ago, Sean said:

 

I can tell you right now that this isn't going to ever happen.

There's a reason modding for Mania hasn't advanced much lately, and that's because its code is a royal pain in the ass to work with; it's written in C++ so if you want to add anything to it you need to use .dll injectors, which is no simple task. The modding scene for Mania has stagnated for this very reason, not to mention the extremely unlikely chance of a decompilation happening for RSDK v5 anytime soon. Compare this with the decompilations for Sonic 1, 2, and CD which are open source and entirely script-based. You can literally turn them into completely different games if you wanted to, that's how easy it is to mod them now that RSDK v3 and v4 have been decompiled. Along with that, Sonic 3 AIR's Oxygen engine is open source as well. People are even starting to add brand new characters without replacing existing character slots, like Mighty.

Origins is using a slightly updated version of Mania's v5, particularly S3K which doesn't use the aforementioned scripts. Why would everyone abandon the decomps for Origins when the easily moddable, open source ports are right there? Adding onto that, it's completely unfair for people to rely on modders to fix up and improve the game - this is something they do out of passion for their free time, and some games on PC have few to no mods at all. Remember how long it took for any breakthrough for Sonic R and SA2 mods to happen? That came about from years of dedicated fans who cared deeply about these games and poured countless hours into fiddling with their code without any of the original code to work with. When Colors HD was coming out everyone was like "Oh well I'll just wait for mods to fix it up" which is a poor mindset to take when it comes to products that this company is selling you, and it's not on the fans to fix up what Sega puts out.

I'm telling you all right now, if you're buying Origins on PC specifically for modding, you are going to be disappointed or to have to wait a long while before advanced progress is made. Don't base your platform of choice on the POTENTIAL for mods which may not even happen and wouldn't be able to supersede the previous fan ports' modding scenes. If you actually care about mods then download Sonic 3 AIR and the 1/2/CD decompilations. Buy Origins on whatever platform you prefer if you want to play the vanilla remasters. I'm not saying there won't be mods for it, but don't expect huge modifications out the gate.

 

There were still character, graphical, music, level design mods for Mania though right? I am not sure what Mania is missing in terms of modding. You will have to show me the extensive character mods for Sonic 3 AIR as not even Amy seems to have all of her usual abilities present yet.

I remember seeing a Twitter post where some modder said everyone was gonna move to Origins as the base for future projects but now apparently that is not going to happen.

[Sean]

27 minutes ago, Slashy said:

There were still character, graphical, music, level design mods for Mania though right? I am not sure what Mania is missing in terms of modding.

Let's see, among the stuff Mania is missing and modders are unable to do currently are, but not limited to, the following - New stage gimmicks. New boss battles. New cutscenes. New zones that don't replace existing zone slots. New characters that don't replace existing character slots. Characters that don't require .dll injection for their new abilities. Menu overhauls. Additional game modes. Sonic 3 Complete/AIR-like menu toggles for minor tweaks like character abilities and object behavior. All of this is hard to do in Mania because nobody has the source code for it other than the developers. Something we have for the decompilations, which can do all of this plus more.

Quote

You will have to show me the extensive character mods for Sonic 3 AIR as not even Amy seems to have all of her usual abilities present yet.

Shadow: https://gamebanana.com/mods/363396
Metal Sonic: https://gamebanana.com/mods/330930
Mighty: https://gamebanana.com/mods/54268
Chaos: https://gamebanana.com/mods/312851
Ray: https://gamebanana.com/mods/54261

Have fun while you wait for people to mod Knuckles into Origins' Sonic CD. We've already had that for a while.

[Slashy]

1 minute ago, Sean said:

Let's see, among the stuff Mania is missing and modders are unable to do currently are, but not limited to, the following: New stage gimmicks. New boss battles. New cutscenes. New zones that don't replace existing zone slots. New characters that don't replace existing character slots. Characters that don't require .dll injection for their new abilities. Sonic 3 Complete/AIR-like menu toggles for minor tweaks like character abilities and object behavior. All of this is hard to do in Mania because nobody has the source code for it other than the developers. Something we have for the decompilations, which can do all of this plus more.

Shadow: https://gamebanana.com/mods/363396
Metal Sonic: https://gamebanana.com/mods/330930
Mighty: https://gamebanana.com/mods/54268
Chaos: https://gamebanana.com/mods/312851
Ray: https://gamebanana.com/mods/54261

Have fun while you wait for people to mod Knuckles into Origins' Sonic CD. We've already had that for a while.

People can make new level gimmicks?

[Legendary Emerald]

19 hours ago, Son-icka said:

I wouldn’t worry too much about resolution - it’s going to be practically impossible to tell any difference between console versions with this collection of games (apart from maybe the menus… but even that’s unlikely to be really noticeable).

You generally shouldn’t speak about other people’s perception, because everyones eyes and TVs are different. I can absolutely notice the resolution difference in Sonic Mania on Switch compared to PS5, for example. The bigger the TV you own, the more important a high resolution will be. Xbox 360 games that look great on the smaller tv I own look terrible on my 70 inch.

[Sonicka]

30 minutes ago, Legendary Emerald said:

You generally shouldn’t speak about other people’s perception, because everyones eyes and TVs are different. I can absolutely notice the resolution difference in Sonic Mania on Switch compared to PS4/PS5, for example. The bigger the TV you own, the more important a high resolution will be. Xbox 360 games that look great on the smaller tv I own look terrible on my 70 inch.

Really? Either you have a very keen eye or this could just be me stemming from my own ignorance on the matter. 

To give an example... I have played Mania on a 50" TV between my PS4 and Switch (and handheld) and they are identical (as far as I can tell). Where I'm coming from is from the perspective of this being a retro / pixelated title between systems. If you so go super hard on a large television and it pulls the game screen beyond the native resolution settings then yes, that's a fair enough argument to make. 

I'd suppose maybe I'm examining it from too simple an idea... I measure this in the same light as Sonic Forces or Team Sonic Racing between systems - with these titles there are very noticeable visual downgrades in multiple areas as well as resolution. But I genuinely don't understand how this same logic could apply with Sonic Origins (let alone Mania). 

...Unless the Switch version has a lower Resolution output than the PS/XB versions? I was of the understanding this is just the same across all platforms. Is that not actually the case then?

[Legendary Emerald]

1 hour ago, Son-icka said:

Really? Either you have a very keen eye or this could just be me stemming from my own ignorance on the matter. 

To give an example... I have played Mania on a 50" TV between my PS4 and Switch (and handheld) and they are identical (as far as I can tell). Where I'm coming from is from the perspective of this being a retro / pixelated title between systems. If you so go super hard on a large television and it pulls the game screen beyond the native resolution settings then yes, that's a fair enough argument to make. 

I'd suppose maybe I'm examining it from too simple an idea... I measure this in the same light as Sonic Forces or Team Sonic Racing between systems - with these titles there are very noticeable visual downgrades in multiple areas as well as resolution. But I genuinely don't understand how this same logic could apply with Sonic Origins (let alone Mania). 

...Unless the Switch version has a lower Resolution output than the PS/XB versions? I was of the understanding this is just the same across all platforms. Is that not actually the case then?

Sonic Mania runs at 2160p resolution on PS4 Pro & PS5, and I believe the same goes for One X and Series X. On Switch, it runs at 1080p docked and 720p undocked. All of these resolutions are upscaled from the game’s native resolution of 240p, which is what the pixels were drawn to accommodate. This upscaling leads to a slight blurriness of pixels when the Switch version is played on a large screen.

This is all extremely first-world problems, of course. But it’s still accurate to say that, if Mania is a reliable indicator, Sonic Origins will output a crisper resolution on PS4 Pro, PS5, Xbox One X, and Xbox Series X consoles. Whether that matters or not is up to the individual.

[TheOcelot]

On 25th June SEGA (not 23rd) SEGA Jp is doing a live-stream of all games in Story Mode:

Quote

The popular "Sonic Origins" is a live broadcast program that aims to clear the story mode in 6 hours and 23 minutes after Sonic's birthday, June 23!
Can the variety of guests who take turns be cleared within the time limit !? Please take a look.

 

I think it will take about 5 hours and 30 minutes to beat all games in Story Mode just by doing a casual playthrough.

[DaBigJ]

....

Wait are we gonna hear the tracks in the stream?

[Shaddy Zaphod]

Well yeah, but it happens on the same day the game comes out.

[Cornelius Fudge]

This is really annoying. I've never experienced any of these classics so I was actually very interested in Sonic Origins. However, due to Sega's poor marketing, I was almost immediately turned off by it when they revealed five different images in an EA-style promotional image. I'm so glad Sega actually properly communicated and conveyed how the Digital Deluxe Edition encompasses all of the features of the game. The Speed Strat video in particular is what really sold me on the game because now I know exactly what we are getting and the presentation looks really clean. I'm not sure what's up with Sega's miscommunication or lack thereof as of late. It's pretty mindboggling when some simple proper communication would go a long way in addressing people's concerns.

I did notice the Speed Strat didn't showcase the Hard Missions so I'm curious what that's all about. I'm still deliberating on what platform I want to get the game but since I'm mostly playing on PC nowadays, I'll mostly get it there. If there's a physical edition at some point later down the line, then I'm definitely down to grab it on Switch for a proper portable experience. 

[LegoFedora]

I wonder how the story mode will handle the chaos emeralds. If it's one long connected adventure (bar the cutscenes), will the chaos emeralds you gather in sonic 1 be there when you start sonic 2?

Will story mode have it's own stage select that pans all 4 games? If it does, would hyper sonic be backported into the other games?

[Diogenes]

8 minutes ago, LegoFedora said:

I wonder how the story mode will handle the chaos emeralds. If it's one long connected adventure (bar the cutscenes), will the chaos emeralds you gather in sonic 1 be there when you start sonic 2?

Well if you got all the emeralds in Sonic 1, the ending has them fly off/vanish, and we saw what looks like the animated version of that in the Speed Strats video. So canonically he's not supposed to have any at the start of Sonic 2.

That does make me wonder, though, how they're going to handle not collecting the emeralds. We've seen the game's videos menu and it doesn't have separate good and bad ending animations. If you beat Sonic 1 without collecting all the emeralds, do you still get the same animation that assumes you had? 3&K already assumed Sonic had collected them in the previous game; that's fine when they're separate games, but it'll be a little odd to do a no-emerald run of 2 that segues directly into having them in 3&K's opening. And what about Doomsday? Do you still "complete" story mode if you get the bad ending, do you have to go back and get the emeralds and go through Doomsday to properly finish the game, do you just get dropped into Doomsday regardless of your emerald collection?

[LegoFedora]

3 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Well if you got all the emeralds in Sonic 1, the ending has them fly off/vanish, and we saw what looks like the animated version of that in the Speed Strats video. So canonically he's not supposed to have any at the start of Sonic 2.

That does make me wonder, though, how they're going to handle not collecting the emeralds. We've seen the game's videos menu and it doesn't have separate good and bad ending animations. If you beat Sonic 1 without collecting all the emeralds, do you still get the same animation that assumes you had? 3&K already assumed Sonic had collected them in the previous game; that's fine when they're separate games, but it'll be a little odd to do a no-emerald run of 2 that segues directly into having them in 3&K's opening. And what about Doomsday? Do you still "complete" story mode if you get the bad ending, do you have to go back and get the emeralds and go through Doomsday to properly finish the game, do you just get dropped into Doomsday regardless of your emerald collection?

Didn't even think of doomsday, that'll be interesting. Maybe doomsday depends on emerald collection throughout the entire adventure if they carry over, with the excuse being "You've had 4 games up to this point to get them".

Now I also wonder, what will the time stones be used for? If we assume the emeralds do actually carry over across each game (maybe super sonic is just disabled for use if you have all 7, and they're only there to guarantee a good ending/doomsday), then will the time stones be changed to chaos emeralds to give the player even more chances to get them all?

[G-Force]

I can pretty much guarantee that the emeralds won't carry over between games, as the games themselves have cutscenes that prevent this from working.  Sonic doesn't get to keep the emeralds in Sonic 1's good ending, so naturally he couldn't have them at the start of CD or 2, and Knuckles always takes the emeralds in Sonic 3's opening.