Characters you don't want to return

[VGamer]

'k, now we're on the same page. But there's still a few irks here.

 

For one, Shadow does have an actual personality: stoicism (to shield himself from trauma like he had 50 years ago), ruthlessness (is far more willing to resort to less morally ideal choices to get a job done), sardonic (contrasting Sonic's more playful mocking), and all around has his own sense of right and wrong that clashes or blends with other characters. It's kinda how he'll fight Sonic at one point before siding with him the next, no different from Jet in that regard.

 

Now whether it's interesting is up for you to make out, but all that is in fact an actual personality.

 

Eh... I guess in SA2 and Heroes that does apply to Shadow, but in Shadow and '06 I didn't see it really. Although in Free Riders, even though it's a spinoff, I think they did a good job of giving Shadow a personality, or at least giving him the one he had in his first two outings back to him.

 

 

 

 Why not? I'd kinda like to see it as a place where there were more weapons of mass destruction hidden in them, just like there are more secrets of the Chaos Emerald, more places in the world, and all around new elements that we haven't seen before to flesh the universe out.

 

Again, eh... I'm not sure whether I'd want to see the ARK used more than it's already been, and I can't think of any way Sonic Team could make it work. I mean, it could work, but I just don't want to see more of it as THE "weapon", but maybe as more of a setting? I like the idea of finding other weapons up there, that could work. As long as we don't get more history on Gerald/Maria/Black Doom, and make their story more convoluted as it is.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Eh... I guess in SA2 and Heroes that does apply to Shadow, but in Shadow and '06 I didn't see it really.

You didn't see any kind of stoicism or his own sense of right or wrong that clashed with the other characters in ShTH or Sonic 06? I'm not saying it was good, but you do know what these things are, don't you?

 

Again, eh... I'm not sure whether I'd want to see the ARK used more than it's already been, and I can't think of any way Sonic Team could make it work. I mean, it could work, but I just don't want to see more of it as THE "weapon", but maybe as more of a setting? I like the idea of finding other weapons up there, that could work. As long as we don't get more history on Gerald/Maria/Black Doom, and make their story more convoluted as it is.

Given that everything about the ARK has Gerald's involvement it's gonna have history or namedrop him at the very least, so that's not going to be easily avoided. But I don't see how that'll convolute things anymore than what was already brought up on the guy. And again, that convolution of their story was the result of bad writing, not the numbers of times they were mentioned; if the writing was actually good, you likely wouldn't be saying that or even been eager to know more if it was really great.

 

It can be a weapon, containing old weapons, or a setting, but there are ways to go about using it more than once. It's not about how many times you use it or mention Gerald, but about how you use or mention it.

Edited August 25, 2013 by ChaosSupremeSonîc

[VGamer]

You didn't see any kind of stoicism or his own sense of right or wrong that clashed with the other characters in ShTH or Sonic 06? I'm not saying it was good, but you do know what these things are, don't you?

 

Yeah I do lol. Forgot about ShTH so yeah it does apply there, but not at all in '06. Whether it was due to bad writing or not, I refuse to admit that there was any stoicism (in Shadow's case at least) in '06.

 

 

Given that everything about the ARK has Gerald's involvement it's gonna have history or namedrop him at the very least, so that's not going to be easily avoided. But I don't see how that'll convolute things anymore than what was already brought up on the guy. And again, that convolution of their story was the result of bad writing, not the numbers of times they were mentioned; if the writing was actually good, you likely wouldn't be saying that or even been eager to know more if it was really great.

 

It can be a weapon, containing old weapons, or a setting, but there are ways to go about using it more than once. It's not about how many times you use it or mention Gerald, but about how you use or mention it.

 

Yeah the writing does matter, but after playing ShTH I'm honestly just tired of Gerald and Maria being brought up at all. I'd rather they do something new with the ARK itself than Gerald. Because after playing SA2, ShTH, and even Sonic Battle, one gets a bit tired of the explanation for almost everything to do with Gerald that "he discovered/invented it". I don't know, maybe say that the government took over after the ARK was shut down, but then something cause them to leave? SOMEthing other than Gerald inventing something.

[TailsTellsTales]

Give the characters a chance and judge them fairly!

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Yeah I do lol. Forgot about ShTH so yeah it does apply there, but not at all in '06. Whether it was due to bad writing or not, I refuse to admit that there was any stoicism (in Shadow's case at least) in '06.

If you know what stoicism is, and his behavior in the game matched its definition, you can't refuse it simply because you don't like it. That's being in denial, dude.

 

Yeah the writing does matter, but after playing ShTH I'm honestly just tired of Gerald and Maria being brought up at all. I'd rather they do something new with the ARK itself than Gerald. Because after playing SA2, ShTH, and even Sonic Battle, one gets a bit tired of the explanation for almost everything to do with Gerald that "he discovered/invented it". I don't know, maybe say that the government took over after the ARK was shut down, but then something cause them to leave? SOMEthing other than Gerald inventing something.

Then go beyond just "he discovered/invented it"; show us what it is he discovered or invented and flesh it out from there over what he did with it, why he did so, and how others benefited from it.

 

If we can go on for 22 years with the same general premise Sonic kicking Eggman's ass in this series and give it depth, we can do the same with just about anything else this series can add. Not that I would do that with everything, but it's not like we can't make old things fresh again.

[VGamer]

If you know what stoicism is, and his behavior in the game matched its definition, you can't refuse it simply because you don't like it. That's being in denial, dude.

 

I think I worded that part pretty badly, what I meant to say if that I fail to see what stoicism again (again, in Shadow's case) in '06. There could have been stoicism, but the whole time Shadow just seemed to not care about everything and move on. Whether it's because of the bad animations, bad writing, or just because they wanted Shadow to not care about the situation in that game, I just fail to see any sort of stoicism in that game.

 

 

Then go beyond just "he discovered/invented it"; show us what it is he discovered or invented and flesh it out from there over what he did with it, why he did so, and how others benefited from it.

 

If we can go on for 22 years with the same general premise Sonic kicking Eggman's ass in this series and give it depth, we can do the same with just about anything else this series can add. Not that I would do that with everything, but it's not like we can't make old things fresh again.

 

You've got me there, I guess they could make it work really well. I just want them to do something new (if they go back to the ARK), no more eclipse canon and Shadow clones since those things bombed (to me at least), and I'd rather they do something new with the ARK as opposed to going back to what didn't work and fixing it.

[The Chairman Of The Board]

Black Doom and for some strange reason I want to see Big return

Nah I like Big he should be back

[Ristar]

Orbot and Cube.

 

I wasn´t very fond of Orbot in Unleashed, he was just there for sarcasm and...being "funny". I think Eggman can do well on his own, thanks.

 

Cube is just...stupid. Unnecesary. 

 

But what annoys me is that they are coming back in Lost World. I fear that they are slowly being given a mayor role and start appearing in next games. I personally think they are unnecesary, they just make Eggman look stupid.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Ristar

[Harley Quinn]

Orbot and Cubot. Unnecessary 'humor' robots when Eggman can do it just fine flying solo.

 

"One-shot" characters, i.e. Chip, Black Doom, Elise. It'd be unnecessary and moot to bring back characters such as those.

[Diogenes]

Orbot and Cubot. Unnecessary 'humor' robots when Eggman can do it just fine flying solo.

If Eggman's alone, who's he supposed to talk to?

[Harley Quinn]

If Eggman's alone, who's he supposed to talk to?

Bounce off Sonic and Tails and the rest of the cast. Work with/against the current Villain of the Week. If they're not there, amp the mad scientist aspect and have him talk to himself. In my head I can totally see Eggman as the type of villain to build upon his egotism with conversations with himself.

[InfinityAlex]

He did that in Generations. That didn't work out too well, in the end.

[Aquaslash]

This fandom as a whole is way too bloodthirsty.  There isn't a single character in this series that can't be salvaged an improved upon.  Even Elise can be reworked under the right conditions.

[Tara]

This fandom as a whole is way too bloodthirsty.  There isn't a single character in this series that can't be salvaged an improved upon.  Even Elise can be reworked under the right conditions.

Well, yeah, if you rework anything properly, it could work.  But in a series as overcrowded as Sonic, there are plenty of characters fans would rather see reworked than others.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Akito

[Blacklightning]

He did that in Generations. That didn't work out too well, in the end.

Only because the Eggmen talked, like, three times over the entire course of the game. The final boss was the only real time they got any decent interation in, too. I'm not against having more interaction if it means giving Eggman two cronies to work with, but singling out Generations as an example of how he works without it is... kind of unfair, frankly.

[Alice Twilight]

Yacker, don't even know why, I just don't like him. He's done nothing wrong but when I found out he's coming back Lost World I did not like it at all.

[InfinityAlex]

Only because the Eggmen talked, like, three times over the entire course of the game. The final boss was the only real time they got any decent interation in, too. I'm not against having more interaction if it means giving Eggman two cronies to work with, but singling out Generations as an example of how he works without it is... kind of unfair, frankly.

I was kind of joking about the end scene where the Eggmans just can't get along. It's not bad writing or anything, I'm just saying Eggman didn't have the best of times.

[FalconKick]

Hmm before I go ahead and make myself a whole bunch of enemies, I've been wondering: how do you get those tiny little links on the bottom of your sigs. Is there like a thread where you can learn all the intricacies of this site?
 
Ok then, let's do this!! Characters who can go choke on a chilli dog and never return:
 
 EDITOR'S NOTE: Until i find a bloody way to reformat images from the internet without fiddling with them, I won't be posting images. This will most likely be a w.i.p.

• Babylon Rogues: I didn't mind the Rogues in their initial appearance but they worn out the welcome magic carpet when their entire backstory was cluck-cluck-clusterfucked over two games. They're a bunch of toolbag surfers who happen to be toolbag pirates, how is that so hard SEGA?! It doesn't help that they are limited to their transportations and have very grating voices. Too much style, not enough substance. A damn shame, because they had so much promise.
   
• Anyone who has died a noble death: Gamma, The other E-Series, Tikal, Chaos, Maria, Gerald, Emerl, etc. Pretty much all except Chip: Chip isn't dead, he's asleep. In the center of the Earth.
  
  He will return when we need him the most...and there will be much chocolate.
  
  However, there was one guy who should have never returned
  
  [iNSERT ORIGINAL THE CHARACTER HERE]
• Shadow The Hedgehog: He died a hero's death and went out on a high note. Before that, all he was doing was aping Sonic's gameplay while showing off his plot device powers for the cutscenes. He was saved by the fans who grew to love his animu-like mannerisms and powers. But then after that, SEGA just doesn't know what to do with him.Someone here suggested Silver, but at least Jack The Ripper-hog has a personality that can be played for laughs or used for drama and he has a very unique gameplay mechanic.  Unlike Tails, Knuckles or Metal Sonic, Shad here doesn't bring anything new to the table gameplay wise...oh, i'm sorry, he had guns and can ride a motorcycle. On top of playing exactly like Sonic and his powers of convenience. Sure, you can probably nerf him to have more streamlined abilities, but that invites people to post meaningless discussions about his power levels like he was some spikey-haired monkey! Then SEGA will just undo it to keep the money going.
  
  You know what, maybe he deserves another chance? Maybe there is still an actual function to this walking cliche. But he really needs to make a change. It doesn't have to be monumental, it can be a very small thing. Get sunglasses. Take up a hobby. Engage in some witty banter. Write a journal. Learn GunKata!! SMILE!! Anything but this morose, boring, generic anime rival bulls$*%. Because if that all Shadow is good for these days, then let him die another good death...and let him finally attain peace.... Hey, that's another good idea. Have him seek out death! It's great character development!!
  
  I think there is more, but I really need to learn how to use this place so, ta-ta for now.

[Shadowtheepic]

Ya know people that say Shadow or any new characters, are the lamest excuse for fans of this series everywhere. I mean, from what sort of iota does he does he garner the boot, the twin thing of the main character both character and gameplay has been done since the first super mario brothers aka Luigi(there are more examples but I'm lazy to list them). If it's his personality, that's subjective I can easily spin how stagnant Tails or Amy is and they contribute nothing fun to Sonic's world but pure adorableness plus there not as fast as Sonic. Keyword fast, they would not be fun if they're not fast, Shadow is fast and he unlike others doesn't suck as a multiplayable option since he can share Sonic's gameplay.

 

In this series, everyone almost everyone uses Sonic's basis for gameplay even the so called hardcore classics Tails and Knuckles. It's baffles me how people complain about these new characters like the series was so much more fun when it was about a trio of sonic clones before. In fact, the guy above me already fucked his argument to the ground when he said Shadow of all people is a direct clone and yet he has more differences(chaos powers and warp abilites) now from Sonic than in SA2 and the game sonic and the black knight emphasizes that.

 

PS: Dude the whole series is an anime shoutout. I thought the whole concept of Sonic was every shonen hero with a super eccentric villain everywhere and the whole DBZ emeralds/dragonballs thing.

 

If I want anyone gone, it's Metal Sonic though. Shadow is better in everyway.

Edited September 2, 2013 by Shadowtheepic

[Live-Hedgehog]

[Deleted]

[Kuzu]

Ya know, despite the fanboyism in that post; that's brings up a damn good point. Why is it that Shadow gets derided for being a clone and playing like Sonic, when everyone claims Tails & Knuckles` best gameplay appearances are when they play like Sonic, and their most hated is when they aren't? 

 

You can hate Shadow all you want, but he's probably played the most like a Sonic character since his debut than any other main character aside from Blaze.

[Diogenes]

Tails and Knuckles have had meaningful variants of Sonic's gameplay. They share the same core gameplay, but Tails' flight, and Knuckles' gliding and climbing, offer new ways to get through the levels. Shadow has usually either been too much of a clone, too different to be a proper variation of the core gameplay, or simply not very fun. I wouldn't doubt that you could do something S3&K-ish with him, but he's yet to prove himself in that area.

[Kuzu]

Whether he was fun or not is besides the point, throughout the years Shadow has; been given the ability to slow down time, destroy all enemies around him, use firearms and use vehicles to proceed while still retaining all the basic Sonic moves at the time and his objective being the same of getting to the end. 

 

So its kinda baffling to me how everyone claims he's "boring" and use reasons like "He plays like Sonic" as an excuse when that's what almost everyone's been wanting out this series since it went 3D, especially since he got more differentiated later on.

[Diogenes]

Whether he was fun or not is besides the point,

No that's actually kind of the most important point.

throughout the years Shadow has; been given the ability to slow down time, destroy all enemies around him, use firearms and use vehicles to proceed while still retaining all the basic Sonic moves at the time and his objective being the same of getting to the end.

But this has never coalesced into something coherent and fun that relates to Sonic in a way similar to Tails and Knuckles did in S3&K.

So its kinda baffling to me how everyone claims he's "boring" and use reasons like "He plays like Sonic" as an excuse when that's what almost everyone's been wanting out this series since it went 3D

You're reducing the complaint to a parody of itself. There are more options than the two extremes of "literally identical" and "not at all the same"; there is a sweet spot where they share the same core mechanics but have a few interesting variations.

[Chaos Incarnate]

Ya know, despite the fanboyism in that post; that's brings up a damn good point. Why is it that Shadow gets derided for being a clone and playing like Sonic, when everyone claims Tails & Knuckles` best gameplay appearances are when they play like Sonic, and their most hated is when they aren't? 

Shadow doesn't usually get derided for playing similar to Sonic, it's for being a lame steryotype and needlessly dark character since his own spinoff  game. Variety is the spice of life, what's the point of making Shadow playable if he's similar to Sonic? If you're going to make him playable, you've got to give him his own unique abilities( no guns please) that make us feel like he isn't a waste of space being there. Tails and Knuckles don't get crap for not playing similar to Sonic, it's for straying to far from the formula of platforming and getting to the goal ring on foot. I don't see how they play similar to Sonic, aside from playing on foot, and Tails just being a re skin of Sonic in Sonic 2. Knuckles has always felt the most unique of any playable character, having a limited jump and glide ability to hang onto walls. Tails getting the ability to fly in almost every game makes him pretty unique to Sonic, in my mind. Being forced into a mech suit and destroying hordes of enemies can get boring for a while, and you have no idea how frustrating it can be being forced to look for emerald pieces for Knuckles and being stuck on that last shard. If it's those two gameplay styles you're referring to, I agree with the hate for them.

Edited September 2, 2013 by Chaos Incarnate