Official Sonic 2006 topic

[Chaos Incarnate]

Why don't you just not come to the thread, then? :U

Because he has a right to get tired of seeing this game get discussed to death after nearly a decade, and has just a right to complain about us as we do over the game.

 

I'll admit I feel bad over feeding into this drawn out argument that's already ran its course, but 06 is a topic that's hard not to get outspoken about. Still, I get where he's coming from, the game's been out forever and its been discussed to death, I really don't know what there is to add to it. It does get kind of annoying how people still won't shut the hell up about it, but hey, when an argument comes up, it'd pretty much our duty to counter it... right?

[JAiRO]

Did you not even read my post? I DO want to avoid this topic. What I DON'T want to do is avoid the Status updates.

 

REgardless of the purpose this thread serves, this isn't the only place on the forum this stupid game pops up.

 

I read it, but that doesn't mean anyone is going to stop talking about it.

 

It is a significant part of Sonic's history, it nearly killed the fucking brand for god's sake. It's a controversial topic, and maybe you're tired of hearing it, but it's so deeply ingrained into Sonic's history that asking us to stop discussing it, is like asking us to stop discussing Sonic all together.

 

It's the Sonic game non-Sonic fans know, and is arguably the most important part of Sonic's history.

Edited February 28, 2014 by JAiRO

[Blacklightning]

I'd just like to say in my defence that I find Sonic '06 a facinating study in game design in much the same way one would consider, say Jekyll & Hyde on the NES. The simple fact that '06 is a terrible game goes without saying, but there's actually a lot to learn by deconstructing and analysing its mistakes and actually rationalize what exactly this game has done wrong - something, as individuals, not all of us have done. If anything, games like this are better guides to making great games than actual great games are. All you really have to do is not do what Sonic '06 did and you're relatively safe.

 

More to the point though, this is a fucking huge thread, and most of us will find it incredibly painful to dig through years of forum history to link back to a discussion that has already taken place. =V

 

EDIT: Actually now that I think about it, I think I'll bow out of the conversation for the time being. I'm on holiday right now and while some elements of the conversation intrugue me, there are more practical uses for the time I've earned.

[Nepenthe]

I just felt I needed to add that because goddammitiidon'tknowstoplookingatme

Akito pls. xD

Anyway, I understand you and agree; I don't think anyone should always be forced to admit that something they like is bad in all contexts, but I think that has more to do with the usual forum environment rather than the nature between subjective and objective conversations. Simply put, we have fostered an environment where there's certain things you're not supposed not say about certain properties, manifested in the whole "you can like x but you can't say it's good" rule. To this day I can't be the only one who sees the irony in this ridiculous rule. Of course it comes down to context: "Sonic Unleashed is good" can refer to either my experiences or the composition of the game itself, but we have failed so thoroughly in making the distinction clear that people are effectively shamed out of speaking their feelings.

[Ratcicle King]

I could go on Tumblr, queue a post with the words "Well, at least this game was better than Sonic 06", set it to post in the year 2400, and I'm convinced no one would find it out of place because people will still spew about this fucking game 50 console generations later and 200 years after the gaming industry as well as Sonic are dead as shit.

 

I'm so tired of seeing this shit in the Status updates. I'm 8000% tired of this stupid circlejerking movement that goes on over this stupid fucking almost-decade-old game.

 

"but it's discussion!" discussion we've had since the game fucking came out. Seriously, pitch me some new info that I haven't already seen from numerous LP channels and rants. Tell me what the fuck left there is to salvage debate-wise about this shitty game. Nothing. Not a goddamn thing. All there is left is to mock the game or mock those that have a different view on it than you.

 

TL;DR I'm tired of seeing this shitty topic/game come up in the status updates and I need to go to bed before I pop a vein in my forehead.

The problem here is that we're not simply beating a dead horse, no, shit-talking the Werehog is beating a dead horse, poking fun at Shadow's guns is beating a dead horse, but this game is simply legendary, it's not a thing that you can and will simply forget, no, this isn't just a bad Sonic game, no, this is a fucking masterpiece of how to not make a game, It's not that we can't simply stop, it's that the game keeps surprising us up to this day with how much problems it has, this game had as much impact on the franchise, as, say, the Adventure series, hell, it had an impact on the gaming world overall, for the simple fact that the Sonic Franchise lost all of it's credibility and most of it's fanbase, look at how SEGA's playing safe now, look at how the only playable character is always Sonic, why is that? Because of 06, that's why. You can't simply ignore the fact that this game had a big impact on the franchise, heck, probably on the gaming industry itself, because just like good games are remembered for the changes they made, say, people to this day who talk about Super Mario World, or Ocarina of Time, or Super Castlevania IV, and how they inovated not only their own series but the gaming world in general, this game also did that, only on the other direction, it showed us just how wrong and misguided some decisions can be, and how rushing the shit out of a game will only end up creating a franchise killer, it also really shows how much powerful the franchise is, for the simple fact it managed to survive that game, and get back on it's feet after some good five years.

 My real point here is that, while I do think it's annoying when people define the franchise by Sonic 06 and they try to poke fun at the game all the time, you can't really ignore this game either, it was and still is as much a big deal as, say, a really good game like Sonic Colors, both got everyone by surprise for different reasons, and for those reasons, they will be remembered for a good time, if not forever, for the reactions these games got during their lifetime.

[Sonicstitch]

the beta cutscene was good, but I think the music is from some other movie.

I know I have herd it before.

One thing to note about that concept artwork is that it was put forth by Blur Studios, the group that did the beautifully rendered CG cutscenes in Sonic 06 and in Shadow.

Literally the best thing in Sonic 06 wasn't even made by SEGA themselves.

Also, here's the beta version of the intro cutscene:

Before they included the final music. It's much better than the soundtrack they ended up going with.

...another thing Blur Studios did better than SEGA.

EDIT:

Beta ending scene, if you're curious.

I think I found the first part.

Galaxy Quest Soundtrack 05 - Meet The Thermians

Go to 0:28

-Your posts were merged as double posting (making a post right after you made a post) isn't allowed. ~Kiah

[DBZHedgy]

 

Words

If that's the case then I guess my true stance is to question why people don't like it. 

A game being good or bad from the perception that you just gave doesn't guarantee it's critical acclaim to be bad or good.

Good games like DmC don't seem to sit well with it's fans, but it is by example, a good game.

Bad Games for example Your average FPS. Some of these titles are released with heavy amounts of glitches, yet people still enjoy them . Playing the game with very strange effects caused by glitches sometimes ruin the experience for them, but they always come back for more.

 

 

Oh, yes, of course.  As someone who typically likes a lot of things that people dislike, I think it's important to understand why and respect that a lot of people don't like it.  It's just that I don't like the mindset that occasionally surfaces here that people should have to "admit" something is objectively bad.

 

Fair enough, but my point of contention was not about people willingly acknowledging the problems, but people being pressured into saying that a game is outright horrible when to them it's not.  I love Sonic Unleashed and find it to be a good game while acknowledging its glaringly obvious flaws.  I don't "like it, despite the fact that it's bad."  Not to say there aren't games that I do like even though I think they're absolutely terrible, but that should definitely be my decision not something I should have to acknowledge every time I mention things I like about the game.

 

But yeah, that's beside the point.  I agree that the objectivity of its quality and the subjectivity are two separate things, so I guess we're on the same page here.  I just felt I needed to add that because goddammitiidon'tknowstoplookingatme

Yes, I know what you mean. I've played the game multiple times, and my opinion on the game has changed slighty every time I've played it. That didn't change my overall opinion though. Games can be terribly programmed and still be enjoyed by fandom. Whether it's due to nostalgia or not.

If you heard someone disclaim a game for something you thought was a good point, wouldn't you assert your point in order for it to be taken into account when judging the game? I've stated countless times (or maybe 5...) that I don't think the game is perfect, and that it does have very obvious flaws. I've went on to state flaws in the game, but what honestly is the point of going about saying the negatives if it's been covered to death? 

If I said that Sonic Unleashed Daytime Stages Sucked because this that and the other, then someone would either go about defending it because reasons or just say "Yea, ok, I disagree, but whatever". I would take the latter stance, but many people including instructors that I've learned from tell me that without reasoning for liking it, that will lower your credibility as an average or normal person. Many have gone on to say that people who disagree with them for whatever reason is retarded, stupid, delusional, hallucinative and so on, and without proper reasoning this may weaken their idea of that person being the claims above, or it may change their idea of such entirely. 

If I liked the game because of these reasons I'm going to express it. Not just sit there, and say, I don't believe you because Bla Bla Bla. People say that I'm blinding myself, but am I really? I've stated that I was incorrect in some areas. RARELY, but still nonetheless. Rather than forgetting about the subject and changing it without addressing the last. 

[DBZHedgy]

 

I'm going to have to back up ChaosIncarnate on this one. Just because someone doesn't like a number of Sonic games does not mean their membership or allegiance should be questioned. I have no idea why you would even think this. 

 

In fact, I seem to recall your very first post saying that you're only a real fan if you like Sonic 2006.

 

Actually, let me dig that up...

 

Boom. The irony is strong in this one. This is a very myopic understanding of the dynamics of your average fanbase, let alone one as diverse as Sonic the Hedgehog. SSMB caters to Sonic fans of all kinds, not just fans who happen to like everything shoveled in their face with a blue hedgehog printed on the box. We're a bit more sophisticated than that. 

I didn't directly state that he couldn't be a sonic fan because he didn't like many of the games. I said that I ponder why he was a sonic fan.  

 

If you had read through the later responses you would see that I have rethought my assumption of this because of BlackLightning.

 

And when exactly did I say that I liked everything Sonic Related? Never, because I don't. If your going to question me and my ethics, then you should at least read through what else I've had to say on the matter. In fact, in that very post, (or later in the discussion) I've went on to say that I dislike Colors and Lost World. That's Sonic Related.

 

 

I have yet to laugh harder than I have watching this video. 

Either your exaggerating, you haven't seen that many funny things in your life, or gaming glitches are just your piece of pie. This sin't the first time the grumps have faltered in Control of a game, so I don't see why this generally make you laugh. There are quite a few more moments in which the game glitches worse yet this in particular makes you laugh harder? 

 

The controls in this game are so broken.

It can get worse. That can be seen as a compliment or an insult. There are games with controls that are much worse, so that doesn't really go on to prove anything besides just that. That the controls aren't as good as your average video game. Many games have broken controls with ample time to fix their game, but it doesn't, seeing as how Sonic 06 is incomplete, that would only increase it's credibility.

 

 

Again, the fact that people have different emotional responses to different works of art is another matter entirely, and frankly it's a slap in the face to pare down the work between good artists and hacks as being the same (e.g., meaningless) because "art is subjective."

If the two artists do something in common than any veiwer should be able to compare the two. Whether it was a perception that the artist followed, whether they used the same shades of colors overall, or any other example. 

And I'm a bit confused about Art being subjective. Both the Artist and Observer make/observe that art because of their emotions, feelings and opinions. I may be getting the wrong impression, if I am could you re-enunciate?

 

 

 

DBZ Hedgy, just regarding Lost World, I think you have completely missed many IMPORTANT plot elements, the Zeti want to suck the planet dry to obtain the energy to become more powerful. The game also shows you in cutscene that Eggman survives using a jetpack. Also the game never stated Eggman created the mech in that periodic time, we can assume he did what he always did through MOST of the previous games and create the robot in advance for a confrontation with Sonic if he penetrates his base.

When exactly did the game explain that the Zeti wanted to drain the planet for more power? 

Exactly, the game doesn't explain Eggman's making of the machine leaving room for people to make wild assumptions, the same thing Rusty Spy had made so clear to me. And Rusty Spy also went on to say that It's the game's job to inform the player about the going ons. 

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

 

 

 

If that's the case then I guess my true stance is to question why people don't like it. 

A game being good or bad from the perception that you just gave doesn't guarantee it's critical acclaim to be bad or good.

 

Quite simply put, Sonic 2006 earned its critical panning and title as such an awful game, because overall what was shunted out to release and given to players, tormented or greatly disappointed them in the end. And the game and only has itself and its makers to blame for that. 'Cause we certainly didn't train it.

[KHCast]

I didn't directly state that he couldn't be a sonic fan because he didn't like many of the games. I said that I ponder why he was a sonic fan.  

 

 

There are other ways to enjoy Sonic besides his games ya know. Music, Comics, the general feel of the series are just a few to name. So the idea that you have to like the games in order to be a fan is just ridiculous.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

 

When exactly did the game explain that the Zeti wanted to drain the planet for more power? 

Exactly, the game doesn't explain Eggman's making of the machine leaving room for people to make wild assumptions, the same thing Rusty Spy had made so clear to me. And Rusty Spy also went on to say that It's the game's job to inform the player about the going ons. 

It appears you have not played Lost World before. 

 

Explanations for the Deadly Six's agenda(s) can be found here:

 

and here: 

 

Both of which, explicitly state the Deadly Six's plans for revenge and how the machine can very well, make them stronger by sapping energy from the Earth.

 

There you go. *Sigh* If only Mephiles as a villain, had been treated at least as graciously as the Deadly Six, but what's done is done.

[DBZHedgy]

"for the simple fact that the Sonic Franchise lost all of it's credibility and most of it's fanbase"

"and how rushing the shit out of a game will only end up creating a franchise killer"

I'd like to point out AGAIN, that this statement isn't correct. Sonic Unleashed (The game that came after the time in which Sonic was the worst thing ever) sold more copies than almost any other Sonic Game WITH it's problems. Sonic and the Secret Rings, a game that came almost directly after Sonic 06 sold more copies than any other Wii Sonic game. How exactly does that make the Franchise or fandom decline in anyway? 

The fact that these games Sold well are the sole reason that 06 DIDN'T fall under this category. There are games that have done what you state, but people rarely talk about it. Because it actually succeeded in making their company fall into a black hole. I wish people would stop saying that...

Quite simply put, Sonic 2006 earned its critical panning and title as such an awful game, because overall what was shunted out to release and given to players, tormented or greatly disappointed them in the end. And the game and only has itself and its makers to blame for that. 'Cause we certainly didn't train it.

As Such, I've gone into questioning why that is. 

[Indigo Rush]

 

As Such, I've gone into questioning why that is. 

 

 

The fact that you're still questioning this despite the many refutations, arguments and facts we've given you honestly and truly scares me. 

 

So I'm done.  Again.

 

Bye~

[Rusty Spy]

As Such, I've gone into questioning why that is.

Go look at Clement's video about it. I don't think there's a single critique that WASN'T covered in that video.

[DBZHedgy]

It appears you have not played Lost World before. 

 

Explanations for the Deadly Six's agenda(s) can be found here:

 

Both of which, explicitly state the Deadly Six's plans for revenge and how the machine can very well, make them stronger by sapping energy from the Earth.

 

There you go. *Sigh* If only Mephiles as a villain, had been treated at least as graciously as the Deadly Six, but what's done is done.

I have actually played Lost World, I haven't beaten it though. Playing the game doesn't necessarily make a players opinion on the game's story change. There are special cases however. 

 

Either way, The Deadly Six and the Writers Fail to explain why they are present at all, or rather what they would do with the energy once they got it and destroyed eggman. The competant villain in 06 does a pretty good job at doing that. And if they didn't the other characters surely did.

 

The fact that you're still questioning this despite the many refutations, arguments and facts we've given you honestly and truly scares me. 

 

So I'm done.  Again.

 

Bye~

That's called persistence.

Just as many here including yourself are persistent to show me how wrong I truly am. 

It isn't to say that I haven't given refutations, arguments, and facts either. The difference between me and many is that I actually address the situation fully whereas many just brush off many statements in order to get a better perception and still act as if I'm dillusional or that I don't know what I'm talking about. 

Go look at Clement's video about it. I don't think there's a single critique that WASN'T covered in that video.

If I wanted to see another person rant about the game than I would, and I already have. But do you honestly think that I could discuss this with Clement? Even if I wanted to, he's busy making whatever videos he has coming up next. The reason for a Forum is discussion. Not Youtube. People clearly have time to discuss these things in this discussion thread otherwise they wouldn't be here or on this forum at all.

I'd just like to say in my defence that I find Sonic '06 a facinating study in game design in much the same way one would consider, say Jekyll & Hyde on the NES. The simple fact that '06 is a terrible game goes without saying, but there's actually a lot to learn by deconstructing and analysing its mistakes and actually rationalize what exactly this game has done wrong - something, as individuals, not all of us have done. If anything, games like this are better guides to making great games than actual great games are. All you really have to do is not do what Sonic '06 did and you're relatively safe.

That Last Statement is so mundane. That last statement is the reason why Sega is so sheltered as it is now. 

And it isn't to say that 06 is the only game that has done this. Every game after Adventure 2 has had this radical new take on Sonic's playstyle. Ironically, 06's playstyle is alot like that of a previous entry. Sonic Adventure. What's even more Ironic is that people see it as a heavy departure from the series when it's paying homage to earlier games, while improving on some.

And a statement that's even more ironic is that the next style of gameplay was another departure from the series. I guess Sega didn't learn their lesson after all. 

And ANOTHER statement worth noting is that very many games HAVE done what 06 has done, and their not terrible. That Statement was a fallacy in itself.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

 

The Deadly Six and the Writers Fail to explain why they are present at all, 

 

They're present because they inhabit the Lost Hex, plain and simple. Why you'd need that explained from the point of the game you're at, is beyond me.

or rather what they would do with the energy once they got it and destroyed eggman. 

 

AGAIN, they explicitly stated their revenge plots. They were going to drain the Earth of its energy and use it to kill Eggman and present company. Unless you're referring to what they were going to do afterwards, which didn't beg for exploring into, since their present goals are what mattered.

 

 

 

The competant villain in 06 does a pretty good job at doing that. And if they didn't the other characters surely did.

I don't know what "competant" means, but I know for certain that Mephiles was NOT a competent villain from how he got portrayed. And for that matter, no he doesn't do a sufficient, let alone good, job of explaining the fruition of his plans without making himself look like an idiot.

[DBZHedgy]

Literally the best thing in Sonic 06 wasn't even made by SEGA themselves. 

One big glaring mistake of this debate is the operating assumption that art is wholly subjective. This is wrong. The way an individual responds to that art is subjective, but that response is irrelevant to both the rules of a medium and the composition of a specific work. 

Ironic Considering you quoted this exact post yourself. 

The fact that the admins have stated several times not to be consdescending and respect the opinions of others you seem to be the only person who isn't doing this...

[Rusty Spy]

If I wanted to see another person rant about the game than I would, and I already have. But do you honestly think that I could discuss this with Clement? Even if I wanted to, he's busy making whatever videos he has coming up next. The reason for a Forum is discussion. Not Youtube. People clearly have time to discuss these things in this discussion thread otherwise they wouldn't be here or on this forum at all.

You wanted to know why people didn't like the game. Your posting in a topic specifically about Sonic 06, which, as you could probably guess has numerous posts of people giving reasons for not liking the game, several of us have given our reasons from this discussion alone. You can look pretty much ANYWHERE on the internet if you wanted to know why people don't like Sonic 06. This isn't some well kept secret.

[StaticMania]

I'd like to point out AGAIN, that this statement isn't correct. Sonic Unleashed (The game that came after the time in which Sonic was the worst thing ever) sold more copies than almost any other Sonic Game WITH it's problems. Sonic and the Secret Rings, a game that came almost directly after Sonic 06 sold more copies than any other Wii Sonic game. How exactly does that make the Franchise or fandom decline in anyway? 

The fact that these games Sold well are the sole reason that 06 DIDN'T fall under this category. There are games that have done what you state, but people rarely talk about it. Because it actually succeeded in making their company fall into a black hole. I wish people would stop saying that...

As Such, I've gone into questioning why that is. 

Just because people bought Secret Rings does not mean that all of them were Sonic fans and even Sonic fans who did buy the game actually still had some amount of hope that "That" game would be better than the the 2006 Rush Job...some fans would just wait for the next Sonic game that seems like it would have promise that it could live up to. To the fans who Despised '06 and didn't care for Secret Rings which was a spin-off made by only a portion of Sonic Team staff, that game was Sonic Unleashed and it gave them the willingness to come back to the series. Cannot blame the fans for coming back to Unleashed, it was the 1st game in a long time to be an almost completely Solid experience to the player, the game-play and level design were both fast and fun, the music was top notch, the story wasn't pretentious or melodramatic, and it felt like a Breathe of Fresh air to the games from 2007 back to 2003. While not many fans may like Unleashed as much as they used to, you can only sum up why they did in one sentence..."Its NOT Sonic the Hedgehog 2006."

 

Also wondering why people think the series fell into a bottom-less pit at that point, once again you can't blame them. Its not like they have any reasons for thinking Sonic Team could redeem themselves from the quality dropping from Sonic Heroes, to Shadow the Hedgehog, and finally to Sonic '06 at the very bottom. They had no reason to think that it could happen because it had been happening with each game release...the only way they could see otherwise was if Sonic Team actually proved themselves by making an enjoyable higher quality game than anything from 2003 - 2007. That's what Sonic Team did.

[Komodin]

And ANOTHER statement worth noting is that very many games HAVE done what 06 has done, and their not terrible. That Statement was a fallacy in itself.

 

No, it isn't. It's possible that they're just better programmed games than '06. Even if they were terrible, that still doesn't excuse '06 itself from being terrible.

[DBZHedgy]

They're present because they inhabit the Lost Hex, plain and simple. Why you'd need that explained from the point of the game you're at, is beyond me.

AGAIN, they explicitly stated their revenge plots. They were going to drain the Earth of its energy and use it to kill Eggman and present company. Unless you're referring to what they were going to do afterwards, which didn't beg for exploring into, since their present goals are what mattered.

 

I don't know what "competant" means, but I know for certain that Mephiles was NOT a competent villain from how he got portrayed. And for that matter, no he doesn't do a sufficient, let alone good, job of explaining the fruition of his plans without making himself look like an idiot.

 

And Why do they inhabit the Lost Hex? 

"Why you'd need that explained from the point of the game you're at, is beyond me"

Just like all of the reasons mephiles do what he does. It's a viable question that needs to be answered, just because you don't care about it in a particular moment doesn't mean that the story doesn't need it to be complete, or properly told.

 

"Their present Goals are what mattered"

So why is it that people are oh so curious of Mephiles and his future motives in the game? 

 

Competent

having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully.

 

"doesn't do a sufficient, let alone good, job of explaining the fruition of his plans"

 

 

and if they didn't other characters surely have.

 

Shadow, and Dr Eggman have done such. 

 

Eggman is a somewhat competent villain (In 06), Mephiles is a competent villain, the deadly six however are not. 

They fail to anticipate their threat's abilities (something Mephiles has done) they fail to properly establish themselves in the story, and they fail to actually defeat Sonic or Dr. Eggman. That shows that they lack the knowledge, skill, and ability to be successful, coupled with the fact that they fail at making their plans succeed add to this even more.

You wanted to know why people didn't like the game. Your posting in a topic specifically about Sonic 06, which, as you could probably guess has numerous posts of people giving reasons for not liking the game, several of us have given our reasons from this discussion alone. You can look pretty much ANYWHERE on the internet if you wanted to know why people don't like Sonic 06. This isn't some well kept secret.

I was referring to their stance on the game coupled with the arguments, facts and comparisons that i've made. Mainly because these counter their reasons for hating it.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

 

 

Shadow, and Dr Eggman have done such. 

 

 

 

You are literally putting YOUR words into my mouth. Stop that.

 

You have yet to give me a sufficient excuse to support your notion of Lost World's foes being "stupid" and incompetent at their roles, nor the very idea of Mephiles having sturdy competency.

[DBZHedgy]

No, it isn't. It's possible that they're just better programmed games than '06. Even if they were terrible, that still doesn't excuse '06 itself from being terrible.

Did I say that it excused 06? No.

I was saying that games that are as structurally unsound(Skyrim) have been recognized as good games, and games that have qualities that 06 has are considered good games as well, like the hub worlds and hub missions in Sonic Unleashed and generations, and the abilities shared with 06 and various later titles like sliding, bouncing, and moving at high speeds.

You are literally putting YOUR words into my mouth. Stop that.

 

You have yet to give me a sufficient excuse to support your notion of Lost World's foes being "stupid" and incompetent at their roles, nor the very idea of Mephiles having sturdy competency.

Oops, I was supposed to put my name in there. Sorry about that. I'd change it but the insert line won't go into that section of the quote for some reason...

 

As for the competency, I've lined them up with the very definition and that isn't enough? 

I didn't say that they were stupid, but they are certainly are incompetent.

[Komodin]

Did I say that it excused 06? No.

I was saying that games that are as structurally unsound(Skyrim) have been recognized as good games, and games that have qualities that 06 has are considered good games as well, like the hub worlds and hub missions in Sonic Unleashed and generations, and the abilities shared with 06 and various later titles like sliding, bouncing, and moving at high speeds.

 

In which case... so what? They're just better programmed games.

[DBZHedgy]

In which case... so what? They're just better programmed games.

Did you honestly read the quote that I brung up when making this statement? Not trying to be rude, I'm just a bit curious.

BlackLighting said that all games had to do to be good games was not to do what 06 has done.