Sonic 4: Episode 1 Impressions, Thoughts, & Help Topic

[Blue Blood]

You mean you don't like the levels, music and graphics. But at least those are better reasons to not like it.

[Tornado]

Alright FINE. The physics could be better. BUT THAT. DOESN'T. MAKE IT. A BAD. FUCKING. GAME!!

[Spector]

Am I the only one who has trouble getting into the goal rings at the end of the stage? I've beaten the game but I've only completed 2 special stages so far. What's the easiest way to get into them?

[Spooky Mulder]

I had fun with the game too and there was a time before I played the game that I defended the physics and underestimated problems with the physics but once I played the game they were pretty obvious. No question the game was fun but it doesn't play like a sequel to S3&K. It LOOKS like a proper sequel but it doesn't play like it. If SEGA is committed to making it a proper sequel the physics problems will have to be addressed. If not it will continue to be a good game but Sonic 4, as is, will never be a great game and that's the problem. Sonic 4 has wonderful potential to be more than a good game and it would be a shame to waste that potential.

[DistantJ]

Who are you trying to convince, here? Not everyone who has problems with the physics say that the game itself is bad (for example, Galaxy Man gave the game quite a glowing review and still tore into the physics).

[Spector]

I had fun with the game too and there was a time before I played the game that I defended the physics and underestimated problems with the physics but once I played the game they were pretty obvious. No question the game was fun but it doesn't play like a sequel to S3&K. It LOOKS like a proper sequel but it doesn't play like it. If SEGA is committed to making it a proper sequel the physics problems will have to be addressed. If not it will continue to be a good game but Sonic 4, as is, will never be a great game and that's the problem. Sonic 4 has wonderful potential to be more than a good game and it would be a shame to waste that potential.

[Blue Blood]

I just don't think it's a big deal and shouldn't be dominating all Sonic 4 discussion as if it's the only thing that matters. If you ask me the concern about all levels being rehashes is far more worthwhile.

[DistantJ]

The levels were rehased on purpose, the physics are just a result of laziness.

[Sean]

DistantJ... You're the only one who's making so much noise in this topic. Apparently people who have problems with things like physics is akin to a personal insult to you. You really, really need to take a chill pill. I've seen you call this a "stupid blue hedgehog" that people shouldn't be taking seriously, yet you're taking it the most serious of us all. And maybe you can learn to accept that people have problems with the game that genuinely affect them, or simply ignore what they say altogether.

I'm suggesting this to you as a fellow member. Don't make me demand it as a moderator.

[DistantJ]

As I said, I think I'm done with this topic anyway. Just this shit makes me want to tear my fucking hair out, everybody with an internet connection is so damn negative about everything, it just makes me sick.

Don't bother replying to this by the way because I'm seriously not coming back into this topic for a while, so I won't see it.

[Ekajra]

Well, I certainly found the game enjoyable (talking about the Wii version here, for future reference). Sure it may not be the most amazing game in the world, or play exactly like the classics (which, honestly, was anyone expecting?), but it's fun. And besides, it's only 1/X of the entire "game" that is Sonic 4. So the folks complaining can at least be glad they have a chance to fix things between episodes and it's not all coming out as one physical release.

But as for some more specific things... Well, I guess I can talk about physics since that's all anyone seems to be talking about. They didn't seem as bad to me as everyone was making it seem. Apparently Sonic will stop in mid air if you don't hold down a direction? I wouldn't know, I'm pretty much always pressing something, even during cutscenes where he's running (just a weird habit of mine). Also he seems kinda sluggish moving back and forth in mid air, but that was only something I noticed in Casino Street when I was bouncing around on the bouncers. Oh, and have to run about verticals instead of just spindashing (once again in Casino Street) on account of the uncurling was a bit irksome.

But really that's about as far as my complaints go. Everything else that was "bad" was more my own doing, since there were things I had to figure out how to do right, which happens with any new game. But I think the difference here was that I wasn't getting mad at the game being "cheap" (though I did use that word quite often regardless), but instead I was feeling challenged. I would have initial grumblings of anger as Sonic died and the screen faded, but the second the title card slid away I was excited to try it again.

Random closing comments: Graphics are really good, I like the vaguely cell-shaded look to them, and the music, as is most always the case with Sonic, is awesome. Though the normal boss theme could be a bit more menacing.

Also the Lost Labyrinth boss can go die in a fire. And then get crushed by giant pillars.

[Sean]

As I said, I think I'm done with this topic anyway. Just this shit makes me want to tear my fucking hair out, everybody with an internet connection is so damn negative about everything, it just makes me sick.

Don't bother replying to this by the way because I'm seriously not coming back into this topic for a while, so I won't see it.

[Ferno]

ARGH!!!!!

Whether or not you had fun with the game; whether or not the physics bothered you, bitching about it may get SEGA and Dimps to improve the game.

[azoo]

Purchased and played the Xbox 360 version today. Made it all the way to EGG Station so far. Already played the Wii version via Dolphin, and the iOS version beforehand.

The HD version seriously feels like the worst version out of all of the variations of Sonic 4. Sonic's motion blur when running is disorienting (looks better on the Wii where it instead has a slight afterimage), Sonic is too bright and blindingly cel-shaded, there are at least 10000 shiny spots in the game compared to what I remember from the other two versions, and the physics problems for some reason are all the more noticable when playing with an actual controller rather than a keyboard or touchscreen. Sonic also feels slower than usual, which is odd.

Complaint about the level art though. Why is everything so saturated and plasticy? I mean yes, I've always noticed it in all versions of Sonic 4 (most notably the saturation in MGZ and the plasticness in SHZ), but it's just so much more noticable in this version. May be because of the things about the reflecting light and cel-Sonic which I listed earlier.

I sorta feel bad for wasting $15 on this, since the PS360 versions feel worse than the other versions which I already had (for free), and I could've bought Rocket Knight.

[Tyranno]

As much as I've disagreed with Phos and Slingerland in the past, they've at least phrased their arguments in a manner that shows they're making an effort to prove why they disagree and why they believe the physics to be bad.

Distant J, no offense, but you haven't been really doing that, falling into the fallacy of decrying the attitude of the people you're debating with and not making the effort to prove your own assertions.

Of course, on the opposing side, people are insisting that we have to accept that the physics are bad, which is just as flawed, if not as desperate or mean-spirited.

This has become less a debate and more treating certain positions as though they're indisputable facts.

[Dummy Bear]

Purchased and played the Xbox 360 version today. Made it all the way to EGG Station so far. Already played the Wii version via Dolphin, and the iOS version beforehand.

The HD version seriously feels like the worst version out of all of the variations of Sonic 4. Sonic's motion blur when running is disorienting (looks better on the Wii where it instead has a slight afterimage), Sonic is too bright and blindingly cel-shaded, there are at least 10000 shiny spots in the game compared to what I remember from the other two versions, and the physics problems for some reason are all the more noticable when playing with an actual controller rather than a keyboard or touchscreen. Sonic also feels slower than usual, which is odd.

Complaint about the level art though. Why is everything so saturated and plasticy? I mean yes, I've always noticed it in all versions of Sonic 4 (most notably the saturation in MGZ and the plasticness in SHZ), but it's just so much more noticable in this version. May be because of the things about the reflecting light and cel-Sonic which I listed earlier.

I sorta feel bad for wasting $15 on this, since the PS360 versions feel worse than the other versions which I already had (for free), and I could've bought Rocket Knight.

[PC the Hedgehog]

Ruby already mentioned that he's going to adress that near universal complaint when they're going to have the next meeting regarding Ep 2.

[Carbo]

He did? That's interesting. I'd like to see where he said that, if you have the link handy.

http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.php?showtopic=23001&st=690&p=517498&#entry517498

[Kuzu]

At least they're addresing the problem, hopefully they fix the problems for Ep. 2.

As for the game, I'll say something a good friend of mine once said. The Physics aren't perfect, they just take getting used too" It doesn't make it a bad game, just not the sequel we were hoping for, its still a good game regardless.

[azoo]

Sonic 4's overall rating: about a 6. Graphics are good; if not a little too plasticy and saturated, speedrunning can be quite fun, but the physics are very bad (sorry, no way getting around it) and the plays-itself-syndrome is rather common in this game. It kinda kills all the fun I could be having with this game, and it's not just because the physics are "baww not liek the classics"; the physics just feel wrong in the general laws of momentum and gravity, and they need to be fixed BIG TIME before episode 2's design is even considered. That and like said, the game suffers that kind of "semi-automatic-movement" that Nextgen did, where the level design is constantly pushing you forward but you have to press forward for the physics to work with it, making the game feel like a chore pretty often. Will admit I like the special stages though.

Sonic 4 in comparison to each version:

iOS version: 7. Inferior graphics and the obnoxious screen-spinning around loops makes it worse; and that's not even bringing up the tilt controls being a pain for the special stages. However, the minecart and score attack stages are actually pretty fun and I like them; in fact moreso than the console version's levels that replaced them, even though I know they wouldn't have been as good on consoles.

Wii version: 8.5. Ironically it has better graphics than the other versions, HD versions included. Also the d-pad doesn't suck on here compared to the 360's. Music sounds pretty bad on here though, but that doesn't matter too much to me.

HD version: 5. Overly shiny and cel-shaded compared to the others, for some reason feels more awkward to maneuver as well. Graphics are also a bit more saturated, and the visuals are just not that impressive for an Xbox 360 / PS3 title (probably because I'm so used to seeing PS360 games look much better than their Wii versions). Special stages are more fun on this one though, since the analog stick makes it all the better.

http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.php?showtopic=23001&st=690&p=517498&#entry517498

That's right, and you better thank me for reminding him since I'm the one that brought it up. :V

Edited October 16, 2010 by Azukara

[Scar]

Of course, it's an opinion. I find everything to be a regression.

The graphics were intended to be a regression. Though I don't know why.

Its just they made Splash Hill look too much like plastic. LLZ, CSZ and MGZ all look much better.

[Blue Blood]

The graphics were intended to be a regression. Though I don't know why.

Its just they made Splash Hill look too much like plastic. LLZ, CSZ and MGZ all look much better.

What I mean is things like multiple light sources (check the chequers in SHZ for the easiest example), clashing art styles and that way that everything is just very, very basic. This is 2010. Why is there only one variation of palm tree in SHZ? They're all the exact same height and angle. And some more animations, especially from things reacting to Sonic (sunflowers have both normal and reaction animations) would have been great. If you compare the detail in Casino Night and Casino Street beyond just the fact that one was built using much more advanced technology, Casino Night had more detail. There's always so much more going.

It's like they just said "eh, that'll do" to the visuals and much else.

Edited October 16, 2010 by Blue Blood

[PSI Wind]

I'm gonna add fuel to the fire.

OK, we get it. Sonic 4's physics are horrible. But, I'm having a BLAST playing it. I've been with Sonic for about 7-8 years. While this doesn't seem long, in that time, I've played all the Sonic games I could. I've PLAYED the originals. The physics ARE better then S4, I'm not afraid to admit that, but, ever since day 1 of S4, I've played it as close to the originals I could, and it's great. Here's something to do: A Limited HA Run. Splash Hill Act 3, Casino Night Act 3, and Mad Gear Act 3 were the ONLY ones I was forced to use it. I love Sonic 1, 2 (My favorite), and S3&K, but I can't help but love this game almost as much. And about the physic glitches: I haven't encountered them because I have my finger on the D-Pad and/or not looking for them.

Edited October 16, 2010 by PSI Wind FTW!

[speedfreak]

I'm gonna add fuel to the fire.

OK, we get it. Sonic 4's physics are horrible. But, I'm having a BLAST playing it. I've been with Sonic for about 7-8 years. While this doesn't seem long, in that time, I've played all the Sonic games I could. I've PLAYED the originals. The physics ARE better then S4, I'm not afraid to admit that, but, ever since day 1 of S4, I've played it as close to the originals I could, and it's great. Here's something to do: A Limited HA Run. Splash Hill Act 3, Casino Night Act 3, and Mad Gear Act 3 were the ONLY ones I was forced to use it. I love Sonic 1, 2 (My favorite), and S3&K, but I can't help but love this game almost as much. And about the physic glitches: I haven't encountered them because I have my finger on the D-Pad and/or not looking for them.

That's basically what I've been saying all along. It's fun, but the physics suck when compared to the classics. Hence the complaints in the hopes that Sega will hear them and improve the physics for episode 2 and give us an even better game. I don't even care about the homing attack, it's fine with me.

[Gamer18]

I'm gonna add fuel to the fire.

OK, we get it. Sonic 4's physics are horrible. But, I'm having a BLAST playing it. I've been with Sonic for about 7-8 years. While this doesn't seem long, in that time, I've played all the Sonic games I could. I've PLAYED the originals. The physics ARE better then S4, I'm not afraid to admit that, but, ever since day 1 of S4, I've played it as close to the originals I could, and it's great. Here's something to do: A Limited HA Run. Splash Hill Act 3, Casino Night Act 3, and Mad Gear Act 3 were the ONLY ones I was forced to use it. I love Sonic 1, 2 (My favorite), and S3&K, but I can't help but love this game almost as much. And about the physic glitches: I haven't encountered them because I have my finger on the D-Pad and/or not looking for them.

I agree 100%