Sonic Lost World in PAX Prime 2013

[Scar]

Wow, people are really defensive about this game.

Now I know what Dio felt like in the Generations hype days.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

He moves Sonic in the direction of the enemy as he jumps towards them, even the camera moves in the direction of the enemies.

 

His intention was to attack them.

Well then maybe he's just never played a 3D Sonic game before? The homing attack is no different than in other 3D titles. How is this SEGA's fault? for not making the player go through a five-minute in-your-face tutorial level explaining in detail how to press the jump button twice to attack enemies? This wasn't an issue in past 3D Sonic games, how is it suddenly an issue now? What else do you expect them to do?

Edited September 1, 2013 by Blitz 'n Burst

[Indigo Rush]

Wow, people are really defensive about this game.

Now I know what Dio felt like in the Generations hype days.

 

We aren't being overtly defensive: we're being overtly critical of Hogfather's negative assertions. It is difficult to see what he's talking about. A player who's never played this game before doesn't get it at first. Big whoop? 

 

And Dio's criticisms were a different situation, so it's not comparable. That was a case of "well we haven't seen the whole game yet," when this one is "the game isn't user friendly."

Edited September 1, 2013 by Indigo Rush

[Balding Spider]

Dude did really well for being a newbie, and not knowing what was going on.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Balding Spider

[Autosaver]

Wow, people are really defensive about this game.

The thing is though, most of these complaints sound extremely silly.

 

The homing attack works exactly the same as it does in this game as it does in other games. Why are we trying to make it an issue now? It doesn't make a single lick of sense.

[Radrappy]

Wow, people are really defensive about this game.

Now I know what Dio felt like in the Generations hype days.

 

That goes both ways.  A lot of people are really on the offensive when it comes to this title.  

 

Part of it is that it's such a radical change from what we've seen for the past 5 years and part of it is that it's an exclusive for a platform that some people have a lot of serious resentment for.  Remember the fallout from Lost World's initial nintendo direct reveal?  This stuff REALLY grinds people's gears.  It's not even surprising given that after generations, many were hoping for an extremely graphically impressive unleashed styled game for the xbox1/ps4.  The Nintendo exclusivity and new tone for the series was completely out of left field.  

[Someguy]

I'm not trying to jump on either side here, but I'm curious. Does the new multi homing thing mean there's a different delay or timing for homing attack compared to the rest of the series? Say, doing a bigger jump before it starts locking on, being more or less sensitive than usual, or not working after a double jump since Sonic isn't in a ball?

 

I'm just curious if there's any small thing that might throw off a beginner that ties in to all the other things that have been overhauled, major or subtle?

[Radrappy]

I'm not trying to jump on either side here, but I'm curious. Does the new multi homing thing mean there's a different delay or timing for homing attack compared to the rest of the series? Say, doing a bigger jump before it starts locking on, being more or less sensitive than usual, or not working after a double jump since Sonic isn't in a ball?

 

I'm just curious if there's any small thing that might throw off a beginner that ties in to all the other things that have been overhauled, major or subtle?

 

In this game, you can't attack without being locked onto an enemy.  It's unclear at this point what the trick is to locking on as often times the attack will just hit every enemy in the area in an unspecified order.  It appears as if this change was to make the game a little more user friendly as attacking is partly automatic now.  I haven't seen it lead to any trouble or cheap deaths but it does appear to be a little finicky in that it doesn't always attack the enemy you intended to strike.  Also, it appears you need to be pretty close to an enemy to lock on now.    

 

Hope this helps.  

Edited September 1, 2013 by Radrappy

[Voyant]

Its almost like people are trying to convince themselves the game sucks because since they are never getting a Wii U and they don't want to feel like they are missing out on a game.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Voyant

[Badnik Mechanic]

Its almost like people are trying to convince themselves the game sucks because since they are never getting a Wii U they don't want to feel like they are missing out on a game.

 

Are you being serious with this?

[StrgAltEntf]

Are you being serious with this?

I actually can't blame him for saying this.

If you watch the Xbox and PS fanboys out there on the internet you can clearly seeing them flaming each other when there's a exclusive game on either side. It's pretty annoying and I can't really understand it, but this really exists. As I can tell the Sonic Stadium community is pretty nice, so you don't recognise flaming that often if you don't look closely or the whole thread gets out of control.

(Yes I'm pretty new here, but I'm reading through this forum for quite some time now. )

[Voyant]

Are you being serious with this?

 

I was speaking in general and yes I am being serious...its nothing new and i don't see why SSMB should be excused of it either. The only reason why people don't act crazy here is because the mods actually do their job. (and because most people here are Sony folk anyway)

 

 

I actually can't blame him for saying this.

If you watch the Xbox and PS fanboys out there on the internet you can clearly seeing them flaming each other when there's a exclusive game on either side. It's pretty annoying and I can't really understand it, but this really exists. As I can tell the Sonic Stadium community is pretty nice, so you don't recognize flaming that often if you don't look closely or the whole thread gets out of control.

 

This

Edited September 1, 2013 by Voyant

[Balding Spider]

Debated posting this preview since it tells us nothing new but what the hell.

 

 

“Going fast” has always been a staple of Sonic games, as has “hold right to win” pertaining to the 2D versions which focused more on both versus the path memorization that the first games required. After Sonic transitioned to 3D, there was a great deal of oscillation the Blue Blur experienced, with the “Sonic Cycle” taking full effect until recently with Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations.

Sonic: Lost World is a pleasant fusion of both old and new ideas, seeing a reduction in the well-known speed in favor of fantastic platforming that marries the pleasant ideas of Super Mario Galaxy and Sonic’s move arsenal.

Saying Lost World is similar to Mario’s 3D adventures on the Wii is both a service and a disservice to the speedster’s legacy. Having always been nothing short of rivals for years, seeing Sonic succumb to yet another idea that our famous plumber did first seems to be a blow. However, instead of the familiar circular worlds, Sonic’s latest venture opts instead for cylindrical areas of space, constantly rotating and offering new paths to take as they turn (or as you run to their other side).

 

As mentioned, Sonic’s speed is lessened to offer a greater chance to explore, but you actually do have the option to speed Sonic up by holding down a button and he’ll run at a greater pace. Faster still, you can spin dash for even quicker movement once you’ve memorized a path to jet through, as Lost World is focused on pathfinding. The homing attack is back and better than ever as it’s far less of an attack and more rooted as a navigational maneuver that allows you to explore higher areas all while bonking baddies into submission.

Outside of that, the game looks gorgeous, with vibrant colors populating each area Sonic ventures to. Even on the 3DS, Lost World oozes the same style that its console brother provides, so either way you play, you’re getting an excellent Sonic experience. And it handles great on both consoles, not bogged down with what could have been clumsy controls—very responsive and easy to understand.

Sonic fans won’t want to miss this.

 

http://www.savecontinue.com/2013/09/pax-prime-13-quick-look-sonic-lost-world/

 

[Shade Vortex]

I will say, that I agree, by now people should know how to homing attack in a 3D Sonic game by now. If someone doesn't know how to do it, they either haven't played a 3D Sonic game or only played Unleashed (where it wasn't Jump+Jump).

 

I am only saying not knowing how to do the NEW moves is understandable. The game itself doesn't really tell you how to do everything. I'm not making any excuses for the people too lazy to read the controls at the booth or the hint bubbles, what I am saying though is that other Sonic games have had more convenient, on-screen prompts just for those new players who don't have the controls labelled in front of them.

 

Also, I do not consider myself super defensive of the game personally, I'm just saying my experience, which, coincidentally, I mostly enjoyed. You can be free to hate the game, like the game, or have no strong opinion either way.

 

By the way, the normal single homing>multi-homing thing is also context sensitive and finicky, like the Bounce>Side Kick. It seems to be based on how close you are to multiple enemies, how close the enemies are to eachother, and what angle you're facing them all at, and what angle they themselves are aligned at. Both are quick and easy though.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Shade Vortex

[TrueBlue]

It keeps being said that people are being overly positive, negative, offensive, defensive and the like about this game. To tell you the truth, I think this is all quite tame in comparison to say, Generations. I think it's useful to remember that the majority of us are in the same boat: as in we haven't played the game yet. In the end, we're all seeing and perceiving things differently. I don't think there's any need to take sides or whatnot when it comes to this.

[Komodin]

At this point, I'm just gonna have to wait until I get the chance to play the game myself, seeing as it's clear that things are gonna be so divisive with this game that any individual opinion by itself is gonna obfuscate the full picture.

[Soniman]

They really just need to release a damn demo, it could seriously put a lot of qualms to rest before the main game comes along.

[Radrappy]

They really just need to release a damn demo, it could seriously put a lot of qualms to rest before the main game comes along.

 

Maybe.  But I get that feeling that the people who hated this game from the very first announcement will continue to hate it, while the people who have been excited by it will continue to be excited by it.  How you feel going into your first play through of the game is really going to have a big affect on your impressions.  If you were even slightly mad about it being an exclusive or dislike the visual changes, you are going to continue looking for things to dislike.  It's called confirmation bias and we're all guilty of it.  

[Blitz 'n Burst]

why would you be mad about it being on the wii u if you have a wii u

[Narukami07]

Anyone know how discussions with Generations fared around here compared to Lost World?

I actually can't blame him for saying this.

If you watch the Xbox and PS fanboys out there on the internet you can clearly seeing them flaming each other when there's a exclusive game on either side. It's pretty annoying and I can't really understand it, but this really exists. As I can tell the Sonic Stadium community is pretty nice, so you don't recognise flaming that often if you don't look closely or the whole thread gets out of control.

(Yes I'm pretty new here, but I'm reading through this forum for quite some time now. )

 

Let's just say that console exclusives of well-known AAA titles really bring the worst out of anyone initially.

Edited September 2, 2013 by Narukami07

[Mando-Whirl-Wind]

Anyone know how discussions with Generations fared around here compared to Lost World?

 

Let's just say that console exclusives of well-known AAA titles really bring the worst out of anyone initially.

you mean like the backlash at Bayonetta 2 which wouldnt exist if it wasnt for Nintendo

[Narukami07]

^That, including RE4 on GC, MH4 on 3DS (somewhat), etc.

[StrgAltEntf]

Maybe.  But I get that feeling that the people who hated this game from the very first announcement will continue to hate it, while the people who have been excited by it will continue to be excited by it.  How you feel going into your first play through of the game is really going to have a big affect on your impressions.  If you were even slightly mad about it being an exclusive or dislike the visual changes, you are going to continue looking for things to dislike.  It's called confirmation bias and we're all guilty of it.  

It could be possible that people who hated this game will start to like it. The other way around, people who liked it will start to hate it.

I can take myself as an example. If it's either a movie, series or a game. Most of the time I don't like what I see at first but when I get used to it I start to like it and sometimes I'll get a fan of it. Or if I like it because it got an aspect I like, I slowly start to dislike it. Just recently I experienced that with Wonderful 101. At a Nintendo Direct I liked what I saw. But when I played the demo it was like a slap in my face.. I was like.. What did I just play?

So you never know.

I think developers/publishers are unsure about this scenario, so they don't take the risk and don't publish a demo. Well at last not pre- release.

 

But they published 2 demos of Generations. It is possible.

[Agent York]

Some impressions I wrote for the game over 24 hours ago on NeoGAF, will add some more probably tomorrow as plan to play more tomorrow and have played Silent Forest and Dessert Ruin since I wrote this:

Sonic Lost Worlds for both WII-U and 3DS are playable at PAX right now, the 3DS version including 5 levels, and the Wii-U one with four levels. Any and all impressions are welcome, I think many people are both curious yet maybe weary to the franchise, and different impressions from those who played it may help give people a better perspective of the game, which is less than two months away from release.

I initially played one level from both versions of the game. The WiiU Game ran at a smooth 60 FPS with no drops I noticed, while the 3DS game ran at 30 FPS with no noticeable drops. For those who don't know, the WiiU and 3DS versions of the game both have completely different levels.

I felt both controlled more compently than any other previous 3D Sonic game, but with a learning curve. I admit I first felt Sonic was a bit janky. You choose between both his running speed and walking, holding down the right trigger to run, and charging up and releasing a spin dash by holding L and R. However, slow Sonic barely gets anywhere when jumpimg (even when double jumping, which returns from Colors), and fast Sonic at first seems a bit slippery. However, it's easy to come to grips with it after a few levels, and getting how to move around in the game feels great. Sonic also has the ability to kick and do a bounce attack now, which helps adds to an improved and increased enemy combat element in the game.

In most Sonic games, enemies almost feel like canon fodder.to me, but not so in Lost Worlds. There is the 'popcorn' badnik that goes down in one hit or are there for homing attack chains, but there are also tougher enemies, enemies that take multiple hits, enemies that can't be homing attacked, enemies with specific weak points, and some even almost mini-boss type enemies... And there seems to be a large amount of them. Everything from the penguin robot from Sonic 3 to these giant worms (that appear to be alien rather than robot) that shoot out purple gunk.

There's also a parkour system, but I've still not fully figured it out yet. You use it automatically when running, it allows you to dash up a wall a few meters or run across walls. There seems to be more skill to it that I haven't figured out yet as I wasn't able to reach certain shortcuts you're supposed to use parkour to reach. There is a great saving grace and relieving moment that comes with the system though, for if you come to barely miss a jump, Sonic will automatically run up the side of the platform and grab the ledge. This parkour system also seems to have attributed to more vertical stages in places.

In videos, I thought the tube stages might be nauseating, but they're surprisingly natural feeling while playing. I think being able to control your speed helps this.

I first played the 3DS version, and went straight for a stage I didn't recognize from the 3DS version press material, Frozen Factory. Sonic starts off on a snowboard, and commences to jump over snow piles and logs, go off ramps and do tricks for points, and you can lower and increase your speed just as you do running and walking as regular Sonic (though in these sections you hold back to decrease speed), with lower speeds being good for going around the tubes to collect items, but faster speeds being able to ram and automatically kill enemies without taking damage (signified by speed lines around Sonic as he boards down). Ultimately, Sonic ditched the board in favor of going on foot and opened up to big open snow fields full of motobugs. When Sonic is locked onto multiple enemies, he will automatically chain homing attack all targeted and get an extra bit of air time to lock onto the next group of enemies and latch onto them. Pulling this off in areas with more enemies rewards increasing score multipliers from what I could tell. I also found a wisp, known as Ivory Lightning, which took me a while to notice gets added to the touch screen. Wisps were in Somic Colors, and return here, but instead of only being able to carry one at a time, in Lost Worlds (both in the WiiU and 3DS versions) you carry one of a type and can use it whenever. They go into an inventory for you to use anytime in that stage (I ended up figuring this out fighting a miniboss type monster that looked like the giant worm enemy from Sonic the Movie... Yes, I saw that when I was a kid, and was kind of surprised they used it in the game as I don't actually think it was ever in any of the games; Who couldn't be homing attacked or bounced, and I ended up defeating him using the Ivory Lightning power).

The stage had a lot of paths but also more endless pits than I have seen in other stages, and had a fairly fun mechanic involving giant freezing machines and giant snowballs, using giant snowballs that got bigger as you grabbed and rolled it to block-up freezers or roll down things. Also there were capsules that you could open in the stage for shortcuts, lives, or other goodies by collecting the Flickies enemies dropped and leading them to the capsules to unlock Sonic 3D Blast style. The stage also had these giant turning gears that spun around the slopes, some of which had items in their hollow centers.

The stage ended with another snowboard section, though this one a lot more extreme and dangerous. It brought in the giant gears you could jump through for items, trickier pot placement, trees to run into, but it was actually quite fun and felt fair as opposed to cheap (which some Sonic games with high speed sections like this before have felt). Only other thing I can note about the stage was that the music was fantastic. It was catchy, but also gentle and beautiful.

Also observed someone play another 3DS stage in Desert Ruin involving around these giant worm enemies and the black hole power. I think those interested in the 3DS game will be pleased to hear it controls well and I felt was fun and well-designed.

I played the Casino stage on the WiiU version. I had seen someone play this stage previously, but playing it made me note several things. In this stage, you can beat it quickly like any other stage, but there's also a mechanic involving collecting silver coins to put into these "insert coin" holes which, if you have enough, will take you to a pinball table to play pinball. However, as if expecting my evil scheme to go slowly and collect coins at leisure, there's these giant purple dice around the level that will start spinning around crazily if you go slow next to them, and relentlessly chase you. They're easy enoigh to outrun, but it made getting coins trickier, and could get chaotic if you got a couple of dice on your tail. The stage also had these neon blue lasers that are stationary and seem easy enough to avoid on their own, but when near bumpers, could be a problem If they propelled you right into them.

The ranking system was tricky from what I could tell, though currently only in the 3DS version for the demo. Lowest ranking I saw gotten was a D, highest was a B. They were giving Sonic merch to anybody who could get a B rank or above on any stage. Rank is decided by score, which is effected by time, rings, Flickies collected, stage score, and deaths.

Overall I was left fairly impressed. While the game is obviously semi-inspired by Mario Galaxy, it didn't actually feel much like it. The game I was most reminded of was Sonic Colors (stage design style, environments, Wisps, etc.) but if I can be honest from the bit I played I think it'll be a much better game than Colors. If you have any questions, feel free to ask, I may give some other stages a whirl tomorrow.

[edvedd]

Thank you for that. 

 

And really, the only thing I'm getting out of all these differing impressions is that the game has a learning curve, and I'm going to have to play it to determine if any of these issues are actually issues, or just something you have to 'get' first.