Popular and unpopular Sonic opinions you agree and disagree with!

[Wraith]

I wouldn't go as far as to say Tails was only good twice. He's actually a perfectly fine, inoffensive character most of the time and sneaks his way into endearing under the right circumstances. The boy genius angle is just really boring to me and most of the stuff they've tried to do with him in the last couple of games was flat so I've grown less attached to him over time. I feel like he gets lot of undue emphasis due to his icon status so he gets to hang around even when they don't really have a lot of ideas for him.

[StaticMania]

They didn't even play up the boy genius angle...personality wise until recently.

He was always a genius, but he never had the attitude a typical boy genius had. Which as recent portrayals have shown was apparently a good thing, who knew?

[Wraith]

I'd also argue he was more prone to making mistakes in the Adventure games which made him feel a little more vulnerable/relatable. He was more like a kid, which is when I find Tails most endearing.

After that he kind of became the exposition/plot device guy. Nothing inherently bad or annoying about that but you're not grabbing me if that's all you're doing. 

[Dr. Mechano]

17 minutes ago, Wraith said:

I wouldn't go as far as to say Tails was only good twice. He's actually a perfectly fine, inoffensive character most of the time and sneaks his way into endearing under the right circumstances. The boy genius angle is just really boring to me and most of the stuff they've tried to do with him in the last couple of games was flat so I've grown less attached to him over time. I feel like he gets lot of undue emphasis due to his icon status so he gets to hang around even when they don't really have a lot of ideas for him.

I think the problem is that they're using his mechanical genius as a box to put Tails in rather than as an accessory to supplement his character.

In modern games, just about all Tails does is stand on the sidelines using his tablet and giving technical explanations for whatever might be going on. He's been pigeonholed as the smart guy, but isn't allowed to do much beyond that in recent games - barring exceptions like Mania, of course.

I think a good example is Tails Adventure. Tails uses his inventions throughout the game, and it's arguably the game that focuses the most on him using gadgets and weapons. But he's proactive and heroic. He himself gets out there, explores, and fights enemies. His mechanical aptitude supplements his character instead of confining it. That's how you can play the boy genius angle without making him painfully dull: Just let him actually get out there and do things again.

[Ivo-goji]

I love how in Shadow the Hedgehog Tails not only helps Sonic get into space using the Tornado III, but he also independently went out to fight Eggman and later to rescue the President from the Black Arms, Sonic nowhere in sight.

Then the Cyclone combat robot was replaced by a tablet and Tails is the guy who goes MIA for half a year if there's no Sonics around.

[Wraith]

11 minutes ago, Dr. Mechano said:

I think the problem is that they're using his mechanical genius as a box to put Tails in rather than as an accessory to supplement his character.

In modern games, just about all Tails does is stand on the sidelines using his tablet and giving technical explanations for whatever might be going on. He's been pigeonholed as the smart guy, but isn't allowed to do much beyond that in recent games - barring exceptions like Mania, of course.

I think a good example is Tails Adventure. Tails uses his inventions throughout the game, and it's arguably the game that focuses the most on him using gadgets and weapons. But he's proactive and heroic. He himself gets out there, explores, and fights enemies. His mechanical aptitude supplements his character instead of confining it. That's how you can play the boy genius angle without making him painfully dull: Just let him actually get out there and do things again.

No, I'd actually argue the opposite. The modern games is where Tails is allowed to flex more of his agency compared to before, where in games like Rush, 06 and my darling Unleashed he is definetly just the exposition guy and nothing else. Lost World and Forces mishandled him but the fact that they tried anything at all makes it a technical step up from what they were doing before. His personal feelings now influence his skill and ability to act on things instead of him just acting as a 3D printer. He's more annoying now just because he has more of a presence. 

And Tails chadding it up and showing off some agency in Adventure is a nice change of pace for me but an interesting player vehicle/power fantasy doesn't always translate to an interesting character. A lot of people rate how well their Sonic characters are portrayed by checking off a list of things they achieved during the story like some kind of dick measuring contest, but that's not me. My favorite Sonic character's arc is entirely reactionary as she's put in a situation she cannot do much of anything about about but the story and message clicked with me so there she is.

I think Tails might be a case where I mostly just have to accept something isn't for me rather than try and suggest ways to fix it. 

[Dr. Mechano]

8 minutes ago, Wraith said:

And Tails chadding it up and showing off some agency in Adventure is a nice change of pace for me but an interesting player vehicle/power fantasy doesn't always translate to an interesting character. 

Oh yeah, I agree, but in the interest of clarification, I was referring to the Game Gear game Tails Adventure, not Tails's story in the Sonic Adventure games; though yeah, I thought he was fine in those games, even taking into account what you're saying.

Mainly just getting at how I think Tails Adventure was a great mix of his "mechanical genius" attributes while still letting him get out in the field and go on an adventure himself. Even strictly from a gameplay stance, I feel like it does a great job at making Tails feel distinct from Sonic with its emphasis on gadgets while still giving him standard platformer mobility, flight, etc. Canonically, it even takes place before Sonic 2, which shows that Tails always had it in him to be a competent hero - even before meeting Sonic, which I liked.

[Wraith]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Mechano said:

Oh yeah, I agree, but in the interest of clarification, I was referring to the Game Gear game Tails Adventure, not Tails's story in the Sonic Adventure games; though yeah, I thought he was fine in those games, even taking into account what you're saying.

Mainly just getting at how I think Tails Adventure was a great mix of his "mechanical genius" attributes while still letting him get out in the field and go on an adventure himself. Even strictly from a gameplay stance, I feel like it does a great job at making Tails feel distinct from Sonic with its emphasis on gadgets while still giving him standard platformer mobility, flight, etc. Canonically, it even takes place before Sonic 2, which shows that Tails always had it in him to be a competent hero - even before meeting Sonic, which I liked.

Alright so how about I hit you with a genuinely unpopular opinion?

I don't like that Tails's Adventure is canon, or at least I don't like where it sits on the timeline(pre-sonic 2) I have a genuinely hard time believing that someone who did something like what Tails pulled off in Adventures would have any of the self doubt issues that Tails has throughout the entire rest of the series. I don't understand why someone who did something like that would need validation from Sonic to the degree Tails wanted it. Whenever I thought about it I would bump it up to after Sonic 2 but before Sonic Adventure, accepting the explanation that Sonic and Tails split up at some point in the American manual.

But that's just me being nitpicky. 

[Dr. Mechano]

20 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Alright so how about I hit you with a genuinely unpopular opinion?

I don't like that Tails's Adventure is canon, or at least I don't like where it sits on the timeline(pre-sonic 2) I have a genuinely hard time believing that someone who did something like what Tails pulled off in Adventures would have any of the self doubt issues that Tails has throughout the entire rest of the series. I don't understand why someone who did something like that would need validation from Sonic to the degree Tails wanted it. Whenever I thought about it I would bump it up to after Sonic 2 but before Sonic Adventure, accepting the explanation that Sonic and Tails split up at some point in the American manual.

But that's just me being nitpicky. 

Yeah, the English manual does place it after Tails and Sonic met, as you said; And I can understand preferring to think of it that way. 

I hear and understand your complaints, about how it may undermine some of Tails's later development. But does Tails really need validation from Sonic, or does he just look up to him as a friend and more experienced hero? 

Regardless of its place in the timeline - and I can totally accept it being later - I do still think it does a good job of mixing "action platformer Tails" and "mechanical genius Tails" in a pretty nice, harmonious way. Other games have tried this - like 2K6 letting him fly and also throw ring bombs, for example - but I just don't think they've ever quite hit the mark in the same way.

[Muscles Maximum]

Been thinking a lot about Eggman lately, and an unpopular opinion I have is that I would LOVE to see him perform more physical feats of strength. I always thought it was so cool to see him punch out cars and the like in the Riders series. And shorts like Man of the Year where he's blasting off (albeit on rocket shoes) and bouncing around the city destroying things with his sheer weight like it's nothing or probably most recently him shattering a wall of ice in Lost World.

Sometimes I wish he'd ditch the mechs and take care of things using his pure brute strength. 

[DabigRG]

3 hours ago, Wraith said:

I wouldn't go as far as to say Tails was only good twice. He's actually a perfectly fine, inoffensive character most of the time and sneaks his way into endearing under the right circumstances. The boy genius angle is just really boring to me and most of the stuff they've tried to do with him in the last couple of games was flat so I've grown less attached to him over time. I feel like he gets lot of undue emphasis due to his icon status so he gets to hang around even when they don't really have a lot of ideas for him.

This is more of the deal with him.

In conjunction with them going back to basics and then almost never breaking from that, they're using the safest, most obvious character alongside Sonic with the other characters not getting much focus if they even show up now.

Team Sonic Racing is about as close as we've gotten to doing so and that's because it's a spinoff consciously built with a bit of an ensemble. And even there, Tails still does a little more for the story than Knuckles, Amy, and maybe even Sonic himself.

3 hours ago, Wraith said:

. My favorite Sonic character's arc is entirely reactionary as she's put in a situation she cannot do much of anything about about but the story and message clicked with me so there she is.

 

She...who, Amy?

[StaticMania]

20 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

She...who, Amy?

Cream the Rabbi clearly.

[DabigRG]

6 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

Cream the Rabbi clearly.

That was my second thought, but that really only fits Battle off the top of my head.

[StaticMania]

3 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

That was my second thought, but that really only fits Battle off the top of my head.

And Cream's the only character in the series who can be classified as entirely reactionary character-wise.

Which is why she is currently in the top 5.

[DabigRG]

1 minute ago, StaticMania said:

And Cream's the only character in the series who can be classified as entirely reactionary character-wise.

Which is why she is currently in the top 5.

Eh, not really? 

Like I wanna say Big is a bigger example since he's just simply natural and Cream was geared towards support roles from inception.

[StaticMania]

A supporting character is usually meant to be reactionary, unless they get an arc about...not being that thing,

[Dr. Mechano]

2 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Cream was geared towards support roles from inception.

I mean, her first appearance - Sonic Advance 2 - was a major playable slot in a platform game. She then went on to be playable in mainline games Sonic Heroes and Sonic Advance 3, and then pretty much got relegated to support roles forever.

But initially, she seemed on track to being the "fifth main hero" alongside Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, and Amy. Then in the mid-2000s they pulled back on her big-time, and she's been in the side characters bin ever since.

[Ivo-goji]

Honestly it's not so much that Cream got dropped from the Big Five as it is the Big Five ceased to exist as a unit from Colors onward.  Like Knuckles and Amy are still there but the sense that they're main characters like Tails is completely gone.

[DabigRG]

32 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

A supporting character is usually meant to be reactionary, unless they get an arc about...not being that thing,

Uh, are they?

Like I'm sure not wrong, but I always think of a supporting character as, well, doing and saying things to aid and/or flesh out the main characters' side of things.

28 minutes ago, Dr. Mechano said:

I mean, her first appearance - Sonic Advance 2 - was a major playable slot in a platform game. She then went on to be playable in mainline games Sonic Heroes and Sonic Advance 3, and then pretty much got relegated to support roles forever.

But initially, she seemed on track to being the "fifth main hero" alongside Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, and Amy. Then in the mid-2000s they pulled back on her big-time, and she's been in the side characters bin ever since.

Okay, I said inception when it'd be more appropriate to say conception--she was initially intended to be a sidekick for Amy, but was designed around both beginner's & her demeanor and added to Advance 2 in order to make it fresher from the predecessor.

But yeah, it is kinda crazy to think that she once had a place among the Main clique of characters--there's a friggin Mcdonalds commercial that features here over Tails, Shadow, or Knuckles, for pete's sake!

[Dr. Mechano]

8 minutes ago, Ivo-goji said:

Honestly it's not so much that Cream got dropped from the Big Five as it is the Big Five ceased to exist as a unit from Colors onward.  Like Knuckles and Amy are still there but the sense that they're main characters like Tails is completely gone.

Sonic Mania did bring Knuckles back as a major playable character on equal footing with Sonic and Tails again, at least.

Amy, though, hasn't had a playable platformer appearance (outside of the Boom games, which I think of as spinoffs) since 2006.

[Ivo-goji]

I think Mania is the only actual game since Chronicles to feature the Master Emerald.

It isn't a juicy narrative role though; he's only on equal footing with Sonic and Tails because the plot gives them all mostly the same stuff to do.

[Dr. Mechano]

8 minutes ago, Ivo-goji said:

I think Mania is the only actual game since Chronicles to feature the Master Emerald.

It isn't a juicy narrative role though; he's only on equal footing with Sonic and Tails because the plot gives them all mostly the same stuff to do.

Eh. To Knuckles' credit, his story has some unique deviations, like a different Mirage Saloon act 1 and fighting Heavy King instead of Heavy Rider in Lava Reef.

It's small, but helps his story feel distinct from Sonic's and Tails's.

[Shadowlax]

9 hours ago, Wraith said:

I wouldn't go as far as to say Tails was only good twice. He's actually a perfectly fine, inoffensive character most of the time and sneaks his way into endearing under the right circumstances. The boy genius angle is just really boring to me and most of the stuff they've tried to do with him in the last couple of games was flat so I've grown less attached to him over time.

Wanna point out. I didn't say tails was bad, I said he was largely uninteresting. I stand by notion he was good two times, possibly three depending on how you feel about certain comics. He's not bad, right. There are plenty of characters I wouldn't pick over tails. But he's as you said, inoffensive, that doesn't really mean he's good at all either. He's just kinda there. In an era where everyone including sonic is just...kinda there, tails feels EXTRA kinda there

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I feel like he gets lot of undue emphasis due to his icon status so he gets to hang around even when they don't really have a lot of ideas for him.

I think a lot of people feel the same,

[E-122-Psi]

The problem is that a lot of the time Tails doesn't have many idiosyncrasies as a character, even with his niches and role being fairly unique. As many point out, his mannerisms often equate to him being the passive exposition speaker. Even in Adventure 1, where most of character development occurs, his general characterisation is kind of dull (though maybe that's helped by his VA). All they kind of have for a vice is that he's a bit timid, which goes anywhere from being a bit shy to a cowardly wimp it's that undefined.

Lost World onwards seem to be TRYING to click more of a quirk to him but are kind of floundering figuring a core for it. Boom Tails was the nearest to getting something that seemed workable with most previous incarnations while still being rather vibrant.

[knuckles20]

So SomecallmeJohnny released a review for Team Sonic Racing and the thing that bugged me is the whole: ”Sonic works best if no one ever talked”. I can understand this for the classic side but for modern, No just no.

Bad enough we got people wanting to eliminate anyone who isn’t Sonic or Eggman or what remains of actual 3D gameplay. But this is another step in the lazy route of throwing something out instead of improving those aspects. 

Yeah the dialogue isn’t great but there’s no reason that it improved on.