Sonic Generations: GameWorld (IgroMir) and ComicCon /PAX, GamesCom, TGS, and GAMEfest/ Special Topic [ARCHIVE]

[Diogenes]

Also, Generations has momentum based physics, but altering the Havok Physics engine to replicate pixel-based collision physics is not as easy as you may think. The physics in Generations are good enough in my opinion, if I want perfect physics I'll go play Sonic 3.

No one's asking for a pixel-perfect replica; the problem is that the gameplay is failing to replicate the originals at the concept level. And telling us to play S3&K is bullshit because we want new experiences based on that gameplay; it's as stupid as saying modern Sonic shouldn't exist because you can just play Unleashed.

[Kuzu]

Hackers only modify the level maps, sound, etc. They don't replicate or rewrite the engine at all. The classic Sonic physics engine is actually very complicated, Naka was a genius.

Then Iizuka(God bless his soul) obviously isn't if he can't replicate it despite working with Naka.

[Indigo Rush]

You know what?

The physics aren't up to par with Sonic & Knuckles.

They aren't even up to par for a Sonic fan game.

But they did improve on Sonic 4.

And they'll likely have improved on Sonic 4: Episode 2.

And they will probably have it to the point of near-perfection on Sonic 4: Episode 3.

So you could make the assumption that they'll get to a point to where it's perfect.

We don't know that it will, but oh well.

Why "oh well?"

Because while people have been letting these physics issues completely overshadow the fun, I'll have enjoyed playing another Sonic game.

But that's just me, I know that it won't matter to certain others.

The game is subpar to them.

That's fine.

Don't harp on them for it.

Just go back to enjoying the hype, and buying and playing Sonic Generations.

You'll feel less angry all the time.

It won't cure your halitosis, but it's a start to a happier, argument free life.

Edited August 18, 2011 by Indigo Rush

[Diogenes]

Because while people have been letting these physics issues completely overshadow the fun,

I'm not letting the physics issues overshadow the fun, the physics issues are preventing me from having fun. I can't just will myself into liking something that I currently do not.

[ハリネズミ]

Then Iizuka(God bless his soul) obviously isn't if he can't replicate it despite working with Naka.

Creating a physics engine for a game in 3D-space is much more difficult than replicating the same thing for a 2D pixel-based platformer. You need to have a great knowledge of vector theory. You can't just draw some slopes and hope they'll work, the slopes in the Genesis games are constructed via sine and cosine graphs and very complex equations for acceleration and de-acceleration based on angle and the speed at which Sonic lands on slopes. PS3 and 360 titles use the Havok Physics engine, it's hard to modify.

[CanofEpicSauce]

Well to tell you the honest truth, the overall scale of the level design has been bugging me. Everything looks so ginormous compared to Sonic in Generations. It all looks awkward.

[Indigo Rush]

I'm not letting the physics issues overshadow the fun, the physics issues are preventing me from having fun. I can't just will myself into liking something that I currently do not.

Sure thing.

Are you buying Sonic Generations?

[Diogenes]

Creating a physics engine for a game in 3D-space is much more difficult than replicating the same thing for a 2D pixel-based platformer. You need to have a great knowledge of vector theory. You can't just draw some slopes and hope they'll work, the slopes in the Genesis games are constructed via sine and cosine graphs and very complex equations for acceleration and de-acceleration based on angle and the speed at which Sonic lands on slopes. PS3 and 360 titles use the Havok Physics engine, it's hard to modify.

Short version, "They're too lazy and/or stupid to do it right".

Yes, Sonic physics are more complex than some other games. And for all I know they may have been top-of-the-line back in the Genesis days. But it's not 1991 anymore and there are games doing things a hell of a lot more complex than that. They've got no excuse.

Are you buying Sonic Generations?

Haven't decided. Maybe when the price drops. Edited August 18, 2011 by Diogenes

[i don't like pie]

No one's asking for a pixel-perfect replica; the problem is that the gameplay is failing to replicate the originals at the concept level. And telling us to play S3&K is bullshit because we want new experiences based on that gameplay; it's as stupid as saying modern Sonic shouldn't exist because you can just play Unleashed.

that's what hacks are for dio

that way you can have your retro physics and new experiences

Edited August 18, 2011 by i don't like pie

[ハリネズミ]

Short version, "They're too lazy and/or stupid to do it right".

Yes, Sonic physics are more complex than some other games. And for all I know they may have been top-of-the-line back in the Genesis days. But it's not 1991 anymore and there are games doing things a hell of a lot more complex than that. They've got no excuse.

Haven't decided. Maybe when the price drops.

Yeah, you raise a good point there. Just wish people would stop bickering and enjoy the darn game haha.

[Kuzu]

Creating a physics engine for a game in 3D-space is much more difficult than replicating the same thing for a 2D pixel-based platformer. You need to have a great knowledge of vector theory. You can't just draw some slopes and hope they'll work, the slopes in the Genesis games are constructed via sine and cosine graphs and very complex equations for acceleration and de-acceleration based on angle and the speed at which Sonic lands on slopes. PS3 and 360 titles use the Havok Physics engine, it's hard to modify.

Its 2011 dude, technology is better, so are still gonna tell me that its hard?

Yeah, you raise a good point there. Just wish people would stop bickering and enjoy the darn game haha.

Except he can't enjoy the game because it lacks what made Sonic fun for him in the first place.

[Indigo Rush]

Haven't decided. Maybe when the price drops.

Juuuust askin'. I hope you can find a way to enjoy it, despite the physics preventing you.

[KHCast]

Wait so shadic I can't tell but are you exited for the game or not? Are you fine with the gameplay?

[azoo]

I'm not letting the physics issues overshadow the fun, the physics issues are preventing me from having fun. I can't just will myself into liking something that I currently do not.

I'm just saying Sonic bounces around, can roll and Spindash, has varied and multitiered level design, has balanced speed and platforming all throughout the layout(s), multiple powerups, stage gimmicks, and momentum gameplay; and rolling not accelerating you down hills is why you think that it isn't good enough and Sega's too lazy/stupid to put in the effort needed to make a good Sonic game. I guess that's alright for you to not like the fact that rolling doesn't work the way it should (I don't like it either), but I'm clearly not on the same level as you with the rest of that, and I don't really understand the logic behind it. Just saying, mang.

Juuuust askin'. I hope you can find a way to enjoy it, despite the physics preventing you.

Hope so too.

Either way, I'm gonna drop out the convo, now. Things are getting hectic in this joint. Azubot, transform and roll out.

Edited August 18, 2011 by Azukara

[Eternal EX]

Juuuust askin'. I hope you can find a way to enjoy it, despite the physics preventing you.

In the past 3+ pages I think this is the best post anyone has posted. +1 me if you agree.

[ハリネズミ]

Its 2011 dude, technology is better, so are still gonna tell me that its hard?

Except he can't enjoy the game because it lacks what made Sonic fun for him in the first place.

I guess I just like Sonic a lot more than most fans. I look forward to each knew game and enjoy most new titles. The classic games will always exist so who cares if they can't replicate it.

[i don't like pie]

I guess I just like Sonic a lot more than most fans. I look forward to each knew game and enjoy most new titles. The classic games will always exist so who cares if they can't replicate it.

i like this, you got moxy

[Voyant]

Argument: "I wish they stopped showing Sonic speeding through his levels in trailers and actually show parts where he is platforming."

Most defining and a selling aspect for Sonic: Speed

Someone please tell me what fucking trailer has been revealed that talks or shows more emphasis the platforming aspects of Sonic? None of them.

Sonic's most important aspect of getting the word around is speed...so of course when they show a trailer of Sonic running fast...like they been doing since you know 1991, they are going to showcase it.

"Here is Sonic the HEDGEHOG! HE JUMPS FROM PLATFORM TO PLATFORM KIDS! HOW EXCITING!". Let's see how far he would have gotten with that kind of marketing.

***

Point? People piss me the fuck off when they judge a trailer and say "This is all speed" when they know damn well when more footage is shown or they get the game that they are going to be proven wrong...you get knocked down and get right back up to fall for the same shit. Its more annoying than a fly buzzing next to my ear.

Its like a crack head coming to my door begging money for rent when he knows damn well that he going to buy crack. Yet he keeps coming back with the SAME excuse.

They been doing it since since the old days...WHY IS IT A PROBLEM NOW!

Edited August 18, 2011 by Voyant

[CanofEpicSauce]

Well I said it from the beginning, and I'll say it again.  This should might as well be the DKCR of the Sonic series.  It may not play exactly like the classic titles, it may throw you off guard, but after time it grows on you.  When you get deeper into the game and realize and appreciate the level design and how fun it truly is, you'll love it to it's core.  Sure, the rolling might not be right, but don't let it get in the way of an otherwise great experience as a whole.  Hell, rolling might not even play as much of a core role as it did in the classics, maybe you'll be focusing too much on the level design, platforming, and speed later in the game to even take notice.

If you do not like Classic Sonic in Generations or the game in general, that's your opinion, but I'm just trying to encourage all of you to look a tad bit deeper.  If that didn't help, then, I apologize.

Edited August 18, 2011 by CanofEpicSauce

[Sean]

Christ this is so fucking off-topic.

Stop arguing.

[The-Master-Board]

Wow, how the hell did I miss this for more than 10 days!?!?

That trailer is amazing!! Thanks Woun!

First off Rooftop Run give me a very steampunk kind of vibe what with the hot air balloons and the flying airship (possibly Flying Battery?) and I've always thought a hot air balloon type zone would be cool for a level in a Sonic game! Hopefully they'll have some platforming bits where you get to jump on them in the level, but for modern that'll probably mean just homing attacking them so I'd prefer them used as maybe a top level route for classic. If that is Flying Battery Zone then that's pretty cool! I guess this time screw up could do pretty weird things so having Flying Battery turn up in Spagonia isn't all that odd. If it doesn't turn out to be that well then that's still cool, it looks awesome anyways.

Getting to see Chemical Plant Zone briefly again was nice too, mainly because it wasn't excruciating to watch like that terrible player from the previous vid for it.

Seaside hill looks amazing! And although I'd much rather have had any other level from Heroes in but that one, it'll still be an enjoyable experience. I do hope they didn't just pick it due to the "evil" rock chase section though. It seems like every level in Generations will have some kind of chase scene and I'd hate for Seaside hill to have been picked just for that especially when there could've been other great choices like the Giant Croc chase from Lost Jungle or a train chase from Bullet Station.

The CGI clips look great and I was wondering if the other characters would meet their classic dopplegangers so that was cool to see Tails and Tails show up! I was thinking it would end up only being Modern and Classic Sonic meeting modern Tails or Modern and Classic Sonic meeting classic Tails, this way is much better and makes for lots of cool interactions.

I wonder if when we meet Classic Knuckles if he's gonna be a jerk to Sonic and Tails?

And lastly that ending with the Eggman mech from Sonic 2! Epic!

I've seen people annoyed that it might be the Sonic 2 boss but I can't see why the need for anger? I think it's a fittingly historic and therefore logical inclusion to have in Sonic generations, plus hey maybe we'll get Silver Sonic!

The only reason I can think of for people annoyed by it is that we sorta had recently it in Sonic 4 and to that I say; Get angry at Sonic 4!

I never felt that was a real game anyway and just because they weren't original enough to come up with actual bosses for that game and had to reuse previous ones doesn't mean Sonic Generations should suffer losing an important boss fight from the game. (Kinda funny isn't it that Sonic Generations, a game that is actually replicating the levels from previous games, is actually still more unique than Sonic 4 - a game that had "all new levels")

The way the mech bleeps sounds very much like how it did during the Sonic 2 boss fight, plus it has it's spike arm raised almost....as if it was gonna fire it ala Sonic 2's final boss fight. Also

the leaked level list lists "Death Egg" as a boss fight. The only other time this mech shows up is in S&K, and that boss fight takes place outside not in the Death Egg at all.

Hey I could be wrong but it seems to make sense to me. Even if it ends up being the boss fight from S&K that'll still be cool. Or hey, include both of them!

The trailer has me thouroughly excited though!

Except it unbalances the rest of the gameplay.

I'm not angry at it, I'm just...disappointed.

edit: Though I am angry that every time I have a problem with the game I get lectured at by some smug so-and-so.

Ahaha. You go Diogenes!

Seriously though even though I don't share your viewpoint you are very much entitled to an opinion and I also hate idiots who think they can browbeat you just for having an opposing opinion to them.

Could have fooled me.

There is ways to present yourself without sounding duchebagish. Shadster is a great example of this. When you present yourself in a rude way don't complain when people are rude back. Not everyone in the world are passive and are going to brush you off when you speak as in I or other people are in bad taste for liking Generations.

And I suppose implying somebody is a duchebag douchebag (seriously I thought you were going to look into the spelling thing, you of all people I'd assume should know the spelling of that word) is presenting yourself as suuuuch a great not rude guy.

I'm not letting the physics issues overshadow the fun, the physics issues are preventing me from having fun. I can't just will myself into liking something that I currently do not.

I can empathise in a smiliar way I think. I like the Unleashed style of gameplay, hate the visuals and story. People call me an idiot saying gameply only matters but the truth is if something annoys you it annoys you. You don't just overlook it and have fun, if one thing is a big thing that matters to you it can genuinely ruin the fun of the game.

Personally I love the look of the game so far but if the physics are messed up well yeah I can see why it would annoy some people to whom that matters a lot. To me the throwbacks and nostalgia are what matters though so I am pretty happy. Gameplay has never been too much of a deciding factor for me.

Edited August 18, 2011 by The-Master-Board

[Woun]

Sonic Generations: GC Gameplay – City Escape Modern Stage:

http://scene.sonicth.ru/?p=1617

[KHCast]

Sonic Generations: GC Gameplay – City Escape Modern Stage:

http://scene.sonicth.ru/?p=1617

[HUNTER297]

Sonic Generations: GC Gameplay – City Escape Modern Stage:

http://scene.sonicth.ru/?p=1617

YAY ALTERNATE ROUTES! Yay 3D life icon! Sadly we dont hear music and we probably wont. Convention is busy right now. We got clear music yesterday because it was press day.

[Sami]

Hm... odd how they got rid of the truck chase. That was easily the most eye catching part of the level.

Anyhow, the game looks as fun as ever. Can't wait to get my hands on it and try it myself.

Edit: Also I love how I can hear Numa Numa in the background and not the song I was listening for. xP

Edited August 18, 2011 by Dissident