"Mediocre" Sonic games being de-listed

[DistantJ]

*points at the DS Sonic games* Though I will say I don't think Unleashed deserves to be on the list.

Yeah, I think Unleashed was the transition game though. The one that sealed it, proved that they can do Sonic properly but also proved that they need to stop with stupid, completely inappropriate, out-of-place ideas. Hopefully Colours should nicely take Unleashed's place, sporting everything Unleashed had going for it and none of the flaws.

I guess it is a good idea to avoid over-saturation and to clearly separate the unsatisfying stuff with the new stuff they hope to get right, sending them to the used shelves only, so that newcomers to Sonic Colours or whatever wanting to continue the series don't end up with a tonne of games to choose from which are only going to make Sonic look bad to them... But I dunno if metacritic is the best reference, reviews rarely reflect what the majority of the audience think, in any medium.

[Mangoaxe5]

I think that this is a stupid move on Sega's part. Yes the Sonic games of the last decade were not as good as the Sonic games from the 90's, and the Sonic Adventure games, but there are people out there that like Sonic Unleashed, Sonic and the Black Knight, and yes there are even people who like Sonic 06.

Sega's new direction for Sonic bugs me. It really seems like they are trying to reboot the series. I hope that they don't get rid of Shadow, Rouge, Blaze, and Shade.

I better pick up Sonic Rush Adventure before it's too late.

Edited October 7, 2010 by Darkfox

[SefHighwind]

Wow, didn't see that coming at all. I really think this isn't a smart move on Sega's part especially since some people do like Black Knight or Unleashed. Hell I don't know why The DS games are on that list since they were both well received by critics, and I don't think Unleashed should be on their list as well. I mean the game was a step in the right direction, but the only issue with the game was the Warehog.

Oh well this really sucks.

Edited October 7, 2010 by knuxthechao

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Sega's new direction for Sonic bugs me. It really seems like they are trying to reboot the series. I hope that they don't get rid of Shadow, Rouge, Blaze, and Shade.

Oh quit worrying about that. Sega's not going to cater to every anti-fan's wet dream and get rid of all other characters after Sonic through Knuckles, even if this is over the top. They're way too popular in and outside the fanbase to even consider that.

[Iceman Etika]

Well hell, if they made good games then people would buy them and SEGA wouldn't have to worry about store shelves being drowned with them.

You can't run from the truth Sega!

[Badnik Zero]

[snark]

So they're not releasing Free Riders?

[/snark]

[Frozen Nitrogen]

In Glorious Nippon, you vanish game. In Soviet Russia, game vanishes YOU!

Edited October 8, 2010 by Frozen Nitrogen

[Ferno]

Sega has durped.

I still want my Secret Rings and Black knight should I ever get a Wii Sega. :<

[Sega DogTagz]

Man, one of the few things the Sonic series had going for it in the last decade was profitability (even some of the worst games sold at a decent enough clip). Getting rid of those games gets rid of future sales. They must be really confident with where the series is headed if they want to slash and burn half of the back catalog.

[Badnik Zero]

I guess they're saying that games like Black Knight bring down the shelf worth of a title like Colors. It reminds people that Sonic is bad? I'm not sure I agree with this move, since some games were critic bashed but fan loved, like Unleashed. Most people around here like Unleashed, and kids don't even mind the Werehog.

[EXshad]

I agree with Sega's move to an extent. I mean, older games that got bad reviews, like Sonic 2006, should be shelved. They had their time, it's pretty much a thorn in the franchise's ass universally... etc. But taking newer games off the shelf, like Black Knight? Why? I mean, I hate the game, I know a lot of people do, but why wouldn't someone else love it? I mean, it's barely 2 years old, it's got a bit of selling power left, give it a chance.

Unleashed is a perfect example. It's a pretty good game, I think! And it's very high-quality, despite some design choices that brought it down. Why shelve something that clearly (unlike Sonic 2006) had a lot of effort and polish put into it? Especially seeing as Sonic Colors, in terms of tone and involvement of characters like Ergo Orbot, as well as gameplay seems like a continuation of what it started.

Overall, if the games truly got terrible rating and had it's time, can it. But if the game is less than 2 years old, or got reviews with an average of 6 or higher, why can it? One fans trash is another's treasure, after all.

[LATER BUDDY]

Sounds cool to me. I own all the games from the past decade anyways really, XD. The only thing I find hard to believe is maybe pulling more recent games. Unleashed still seems some what new to me for some reason, and I find it weird that it'll be pulled down. However, forgotten titles like Shadow and whatnot are totally understandable in my perspective. It's just weird to think that canon Sonic games won't be available as they normally are.

-Blur

[Phos]

I can't help but get the impression they're just putting some kind of spin onto these game's otherwise normal end-of-life. I mean, are they pulling SatBK from shelves? Are they actually buying back unsold copies from stores?

Okay, I know Megacritic is a pretty popular site, but you can't just eliminate all your games based on one website. That's completely idiotic.

Metacritic is a sight that bases its ratings off an aggregate of scores from other sights.

[Mike]

More than half of Unleashed is werehog combined with slippery controls and medal collecting. It was only decent.

As for Secret Rings and Black Knight I say good riddance. You won't be missed.

I look forward to seeing only Colors and the 2011 game on store shelves.

[SHAX Hedgefox]

I don't think this is terribly fair. The whole propaganda that makes some above average are just the reviews. Like most people didn't like Heroes yet reviewers loved it. I recently bought a wii and have played the so called sub standard black knight. I feel its as good as Secret Rings, will it be pulled too? No. It was adored by reviewers. Doing this will make reviewers feel like they have more power. This is not good if IGN find out....

Adored?! N Gamer and Official Nintendo Magazine fucking LOATHED Black Knight. It got about 20% and 40% Respectively from the two and you say reviewers ADORED it? Hell, I think even Good Game gave it 4 out of 10 rubber chickens as a rating........

Still, not all of those games are bad. Unleashed on the 360 was alright, Sonic 06 was a pile of crap, Secret Rings was......Mixed, And I'm going to be in the minority on this one, but I actually enjoyed the first Sonic Riders game. It was actually a decent racing game, the controls didn't suck (In a Sonic game? SHOCK AND HORROR) and the references to old SEGA franchises like Billy Hatcher and NiGHTS were awesome. SEGA are probably just trying to protect their image with this. They don't want people to be swayed from playing a good game (or half decent) like Sonic 4 and/or Colours when they notice the mentally deficient copies of Sonic Unleashed on PS2/Wii and Sonic 06 leering at them.

[Glenn]

To be fair it's one website that's composed of opinions from multiple websites.

A critic is still one individual. Bringing together the opinion of thirty individuals makes it no more valid than the opinion of thirty SSMB users, and I think I could scare up thirty of us who'd give Sonic the Hedgehog (2006) or Sonic Unleashed over 50% in a review.

Just because critics (who are often corrupted, misguided or just wildly unfair and, having to divide their time between every other game on the market, never get an accurate representation of the final product they're reviewing) are paid for their opinions doesn't mean they should be sainted figures of wisdom. In fact, most reviews I read about games I've completed? I find the reviewer talking out of his or her backside, and there's at least one or two fact-based mistakes in there.

In fact, I'd go as far as to say we fans have more valid opinions on Sonic's videogaming past than anybody else. We don't sit here comparing Sonic Unleashed to Call of Duty and making innacurate presumptions. And while we have our own problems (let's be honest) there is one universal fact about us... we know Sonic.

I'm not angry at SEGA for pulling titles they don't think will sell well. I'm angry at SEGA for basing their future business plan, with regards to Sonic, on critics.

[supersonikku]

Well here's a scenario:

Little Timmy is old enough to play computer games so mum buys him a wii, she goes with him to buy a game for the system and seems to remember Sonic was always popular with kids. Looking at "S" on the shelves there is Sonic Colours and Sonic and the Black Knight. She's not sure which is better but Sonic's got a sword on that one and its a bit cheaper. Kids like swords!

Timmy gets Black Knight then days later comes to the conclusion that he never wants another Sonic game again..

I'm not trying to justify it, I think thats the idea here - to make sure new fans come to only associate the series with quality and not get burned by a dodgy back catalogue. I don't think its a ploy to screw over existing fans by taking away "bad" games they havent had chance to play yet, I honestly think its a smart business move which means new fans who don't spend time looking at review sites and following the series end up with the better games.

[Marcello]

[snark]

So they're not releasing Free Riders?

[/snark]

I was actually curious about this. What happens if either of the Colors or Free Riders get bad ratings? I can't imagine them taking the games off the shelves.

[Vulpine]

Oh geez. Those Sonic games are not poor. People say that because they either don’t care, or they never played those games before and don’t know anything about them. Any game, movie or whatnot can have a poor-to-average review depending on different opinions, even that overglorified Kingdom Hearts (which I dislike).

And to be honest, not everyone is going to believe those negative reviews, and they might as well do the opposite: Write their own “positive” review that is the exact opposite what those negative reviewers say. Opinions do not equal facts, and of course, even Sonic 2006 has good points. Well, it may not be the best Sonic game in the world, but I liked it. Even so, no matter how much you say, it makes me sad when a bunch of people are putting too much hate on a game that I enjoyed.

[Bebe_theSaint]

*points at the DS Sonic games* Though I will say I don't think Unleashed deserves to be on the list.

So are you saying the DS games were good or bad? I really liked the DS games, so hopefully those are not on the 'going away' list O.O

[Bebe_theSaint]

Well here's a scenario:

Little Timmy is old enough to play computer games so mum buys him a wii, she goes with him to buy a game for the system and seems to remember Sonic was always popular with kids. Looking at "S" on the shelves there is Sonic Colours and Sonic and the Black Knight. She's not sure which is better but Sonic's got a sword on that one and its a bit cheaper. Kids like swords!

Timmy gets Black Knight then days later comes to the conclusion that he never wants another Sonic game again..

I'm not trying to justify it, I think thats the idea here - to make sure new fans come to only associate the series with quality and not get burned by a dodgy back catalogue. I don't think its a ploy to screw over existing fans by taking away "bad" games they havent had chance to play yet, I honestly think its a smart business move which means new fans who don't spend time looking at review sites and following the series end up with the better games.

Yeah I guess that is a good reason to pull games like 06 and Black Knight. I'm sorry I really tried to like Black Knight, but I just don't. Controls were awkward at best and delayed at worst, story was ok but the fact that I had to come to a full stop every 2 seconds and fight a bunch of baddies was annoying as anything. If this was a person's first impression of a Sonic game that would reflect badly on SEGA.

[Timper the Wolf]

Great! Now I have to go out and buy Sonic Unleashed before it's gone. It's bad enough I can't find it in GameStop. Now I have to really look hard for it before I have to go to VideoGamesNewYork and have to pay full price just to get the Sonic games I put off getting for 2 years now. At least I got a nice used copy of SEGA Superstars Tennis for $3.

[Tornado]

A critic is still one individual. Bringing together the opinion of thirty individuals makes it no more valid than the opinion of thirty SSMB users, and I think I could scare up thirty of us who'd give Sonic the Hedgehog (2006) or Sonic Unleashed over 50% in a review.

So?

Just because critics (who are often corrupted, misguided or just wildly unfair and, having to divide their time between every other game on the market, never get an accurate representation of the final product they're reviewing)

Because someone from the Sonic fanbase is sure to give an opinion that is more accurate and less biased.

In fact, I'd go as far as to say we fans have more valid opinions on Sonic's videogaming past than anybody else. We don't sit here comparing Sonic Unleashed to Call of Duty and making innacurate presumptions.

No, but an awful lot of us spend the couple of weeks after reviews hit but before the game ships bitching about how the game we haven't played and they have simply has to be better than they are saying it is. And then, those times when we play the game and find out that it is exactly as bad as they said it was (STH '06, for example), some of us stick our fingers in our ears and sing to ourselves until the detractors go away.

And while we have our own problems (let's be honest) there is one universal fact about us... we know Sonic.

That doesn't particularly make a difference, and it isn't particularly accurate.

I'm not angry at SEGA for pulling titles they don't think will sell well. I'm angry at SEGA for basing their future business plan, with regards to Sonic, on critics.

Very true. Because all critics have it out for Sonic; and only us Sonic fans, who spend the majority of the time trying to stab each other with knives, truly know what direction the series should go in.

Edited October 8, 2010 by Tornado

[Badnik Mechanic]

Sonic the Hedgehog 2006

Sonic Unleashed

Sonic and the Black Knight

Sonic Classic Collection DS

Sonic Chronicles: The Dark Brotherhood

Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games

Sonic and the Secret Rings

Sonic Riders: Zero Gravity

Sonic Rivals

Sonic Rivals 2

If that list turns out to be correct and those titles are indeed up for the chop. Then it pretty much proves what I've been saying in the Sonic Colours HD topic..

Segas research teams are shit. What they've done here is obvious, they've done exactly what they always do, instead of actually researching the product they've gone to a statistic site and said "Well according to this data it tells us this...." instead of actually looking at the bigger picture.

Lets be honest, theres some games on that list which you can't defend, no matter how hard or long you try, you can't justify the poor quality of them... then I see that it includes these titles...

Sonic Unleashed

Sonic Classic Collection DS

Sonic Chronicles: The Dark Brotherhood

Sonic Rivals

Sonic Rivals 2

Why are they getting the chop? Unleashed is a good game. Chronicles is a good game (if not easy), The rival games are also good games... the only possible blooper is if you don't play the DS collection on a DSi. The point here is that we talk to each other about various games, I played Rivals 2 as SOS 2008 and loved it. But it was originally a review by someone on this forum that convinced me to give Rivals a try at some point. Otherwise I would have passed it up because it didn't interest me. Not once did I look at a review for it, I just read what people on these boards were saying about the Rivals series, and the vast majority of it was positive. So I gave it a try and was very suprised at how good it was.

Unleashed is bad when you first start out, but once you level up the werehog it's quite a fun game. Same with Chronicles, the only real issue that has is the difficulty, it's too easy.

Had their research team actually bothered to do research instead of coming up with the ingenius idea of just googling metacritic, had they bothered to actually research their own product, they might have thought otherwise.

Edited October 8, 2010 by Gnasher

[Marcello]

Where is that list from?

It doesn't really make much sense. What's Mediocre to them? The only one of them to have a metacritic score under 50 is 06. Black Knight, Unleashed PS3 and Sonic Riders are close by with 54,54 and 56, but all others are in their 60's to 70's :-/

That the thing that disappoints me most is M&S2 being there.