Megathread IDW's Sonic the Hedgehog - Megathread

[Kazhnuz]

TBH, what's funny in all this I kinda liked Amy in IDW, because I really felt like it was the "same Amy" from SA and SA2, just a bit older (as she is less "noo the boys are leaving me behind again) and having to deal with more responsabilities. Her pouting to Sonic being annoying in issue 2 was really funny, the funny side of "genki character have to take responsabilities" (like when the chaotix ask her their payment) was funny, and seeing her going through so much was heartbreaking. And I loved that. Seeing her less energetic was what interested me, and I'm happy to see the change because I think that they made what was possible with that. I also loved the preview, because I really felt that burnout that we can get when we are trying something we aren't really

The crush being more subtle don't bother me, because that's what I liked with SA2 for instance, where she have only two "Sonic" moment (one with Shadow at the begining, and when she liberate him). Here too, the crush is used more to have funny parts. The crush was always a part of Amy, but it wasn't the most important part of her.

 

Something I like Flynn added to Amy too is the bit cookiness. Not for the "bird of a feather" that it give with Sonic, but more because I really see that as an evolution of her being a bit "bratty" in the Adventure saga.

All in one, i'm happy with the change, but because I felt that they really did something interesting with her, by making her dealing with a really new kind of situation. It's an interesting story in Sonic, and I'm really happy that they did it, and I'm kinda curious of what the exact conclusion will really be (and seeing her being with Rouge and Cream in the next arc interest me a lot, especially seeing her interact with Rouge, it's rare). And a thing I loved, is how we got some "Amy" flair in her way of dealing strategy sometime, like the "Tails ! Do something smart" that was just really fun.

 

So it's funny how our perception of something like that can be really different depending of how we see the characters and stuff. (and I don't think that people that like Amy's crush are inherently wrong or anything. That's mostly a difference of vision of the character, imo.)

[thumbs13]

6 hours ago, Titan Mecha Sonic said:

I am merely saying it is hard to depict crushes with the pressure to make shield maiden warrior/Wonder Women. I am not saying you cannot blend the two, I said that in the post you quoted, “girl power and love story.” I am just saying in this Battle of Sexed Resurgence, it is hard to allow Amy to be her old self. 

But the thing is Amy's new role is literally the thing stopping her from doing action stuff. So even if that was true, it wouldn't apply to Amy because she doesn't get to adventure. 

[Ellipsis-Ultima]

David Mariotte on twitter has stated that issue 31 should be out on September 16th-

 

[Shadow Chaos Control]

3 hours ago, thumbs13 said:

But the thing is Amy's new role is literally the thing stopping her from doing action stuff. So even if that was true, it wouldn't apply to Amy because she doesn't get to adventure. 

Ironically, old Amy who is obessed with Sonic and is chasing after him is feminist, because Amy is the one initiating.  

[Pengi]

Amy was a tired cliche even in 1993. She was pink because she's a girl, in love with the hero because she's a girl and had to be rescued because she's a girl.

[StaticMania]

Being "in love with the hero" isn't the same as being the "one who pines for affection"...

The hero being one who's shooting down affection in the 90's...it's some type of subversion...in Japan.

Maybe.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Interesting that of all the things Amy has done in both Archie and IDW that people focus most on the magnitude of her fan girl obsession.

[PublicEnemy1]

4 hours ago, Pengi said:

Amy was a tired cliche even in 1993. She was pink because she's a girl, in love with the hero because she's a girl and had to be rescued because she's a girl.

That's a gross underselling of her character.

[Shade Vortex]

I honestly am baffled. While I myself am not a comic book reader and thus never got into Archie or IDW Sonic- people are COMPLAINING that Amy ISN'T some stalker-like love-obsessed freak? Really? The fact that it's even been defended as an "iconic part of her personality" is what really gets me. Something being the status quo doesn't mean it isn't a problem. As somebody else pointed out, it was basically 90's Japanese chauvinism. Amy was pink because she was a girl, liked Sonic so obsessively because she was a girl, etc. Her being a love-obsessed fanatic was always the most annoying, most problematic part of her characterization- so for me, them moving away from it has done WONDERS for how I think about Amy Rose these days.

But maybe I'm the crazy one here, IDK.

@PublicEnemy1Since you posted while I was posting, I guess I'll edit to add: Don't get me wrong. Amy's had good moments. But they're far and few between, in between all her moments of being a super-flanderized, overly-cliche'd, 90's fangirl interpretation.

[Fire-N-Space]

18 hours ago, SBR2 said:

I really don't want to sound condescending but it's kinda hard to care about femininity during a zombie apocalypse and having cleaned up the world post-literal world war.

I care, and plenty of games/TV have a apocalypse or war in them while still using femininity.

[Sonictrainer]

Spoiler

...what zone is that in the background, that Silver is looking at?

 

[StaticMania]

45 minutes ago, Shade Vortex said:

...them moving away from it has...

Them moving away from it "would" be fine if they actually replaced it with anything...

Without it she's even more "the girl" in the games than she already was, in the comics she's been good.

[Kuzu]

5 hours ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

Interesting that of all the things Amy has done in both Archie and IDW that people focus most on the magnitude of her fan girl obsession.

To be fair, it is kind of her defining character trait. It makes sense kind if zero in on it.

[D.H]

2 hours ago, Shade Vortex said:

I honestly am baffled. While I myself am not a comic book reader and thus never got into Archie or IDW Sonic- people are COMPLAINING that Amy ISN'T some stalker-like love-obsessed freak? Really? The fact that it's even been defended as an "iconic part of her personality" is what really gets me. Something being the status quo doesn't mean it isn't a problem. As somebody else pointed out, it was basically 90's Japanese chauvinism. Amy was pink because she was a girl, liked Sonic so obsessively because she was a girl, etc. Her being a love-obsessed fanatic was always the most annoying, most problematic part of her characterization- so for me, them moving away from it has done WONDERS for how I think about Amy Rose these days.

But maybe I'm the crazy one here, IDK.

@PublicEnemy1Since you posted while I was posting, I guess I'll edit to add: Don't get me wrong. Amy's had good moments. But they're far and few between, in between all her moments of being a super-flanderized, overly-cliche'd, 90's fangirl interpretation.

No, people are not complaining that Amy isn't some "stalker-like love obsessed freak." People in this thread & many other threads in regards to this character that's been had over the last while have made it perfectly clear that all they want was to see an Amy Rose that is more bubbly, upbeat, passionate, involved in the action as well as open with her affection towards Sonic similar to her portrayals in SA1 or even Heroes, than what we've gotten over the last while with the games, which has taken the stance that Amy's current character stagnation somehow = "maturing her."  

And quite frankly, I never got how being "overly-cliched 90's interpretation" of anything in this series is somehow a negative, especially when it hasn't prevented Amy from having her fair share of character development & great moments in not just the games, but in the comics too.

As for the actual topic of discussion, I am very glad Amy is moving away from the Restoration stuff for (what seems to be) the time being . Yeah it made sense for her to be helping people out anyway she could, her crush on Sonic being downplayed due to the events of the Metal Virus taking precedence makes sense & she is one of the few characters that actually worked as head of the Restoration, but at the same time, her best moments in the entire comic so far had come from her actually being away from the Restoration HQ & actually getting physically involved (like her & Tails vs. Zomom,  her debut issue in #2 etc.) , so I am very excited to see her, Rouge & Cream together, especially since Amy & Rouge is a team-up we don't see very often. Hopefully we get a good amount of time to see Amy back to her usual self away from the Resistance/Restoration stuff, because I feel admittedly a bit tired of that whole setup.

[Shadowlax]

7 hours ago, CrownSlayer’s Shadow said:

Interesting that of all the things Amy has done in both Archie and IDW that people focus most on the magnitude of her fan girl obsession.

...i actually don't think she's been that interesting the whole book tbh

[Kuzu]

I'm starting to think some of y'all just have vastly different expectations from Amy.

[DabigRG]

Got some Bumbleking catchup stuff on the way.

 

In the meantime, let's expand the Amy back n forth to the whole cast: How do you feel about each character's portrayal/handling thus far?

4 hours ago, Sonictrainer said:

  Hide contents

...what zone is that in the background, that Silver is looking at?

 

.

Spoiler

Looks like Jewel is immediately regretting her decision. She and Shadow are the humorous parts of this cover

 

Anyway, I'm assuming he's returning to his future. That or the special zone

 

[Kaotic Kanine]

Thank you, @D.H! You've said everything that needed to be said, and did so far better than I could (if only because my response to all that would be passive-aggressive at best) 

So, the only other thing I'll say is that I actually liked Amy in Archie. Well, not so much Pre-Reboot, due to all the nonsense done to her before Ian took the writing reigns (but even then, he was not at all flattering with her until after Issue 200...). But Reboot was the best portrayal for Amy for the entirety of the 2010's. Literally, my only problems with Reboot!Archie Amy were how she was often the butt of harsh jokes and getting overshadowed by Sally in her few moments with Sonic (of course, everyone got overshadowed by that chipmunk whenever she was involved), but otherwise her characterization was perfect. Amy was very much a badass and respected hero in Reboot!Archie, but still very much herself: being enthusiastic, passionate, energetic, and openly in love with Sonic (whom she flirts with and even glomps when appropriate). That was a much more natural progression for Amy's character from her story arc from SA1 to Heroes

IDW, though, saw fit to characterize Amy a lot more like Sally, down to being highly organized and preoccupying herself with cataloging resources and other shit that really doesn't fit Amy's character  While others have made good arguments for IDW!Amy up to this point, at the end of the day it just came off a lot like Amy was being made into the new Sally. Not helped by the introduction of Tangle, who not only has the exact same role as Amy (being a mundane, ordinary girl with a thirst for adventure and making herself into an adventuring hero) but a LOT of Amy's personality; being an extremely energetic and passionate girl who is an excitable fangirl (just with the heroes in general, not just Sonic), loves to glomp people, has complete faith in Sonic's choices and ability to save the world, and a complete optimist even when things look most hopeless... So, yeah, in comparison to Reboot!Archie, IDW Amy was nothing short of disappointing to me. And I'm more than glad that we seem to finally be moving away from "Amy Acorn". Though I do wish Ian didn't insinuate that Amy can't lead in general: she can be an effective leader, as Heroes showed. But, like I said many times, Amy's in-character leadership would be the "charismatic" and "headstrong" kind, not unlike Sonic's own leadership style. IDW had her being the "levelheaded" and "mastermind" kind of leader, which couldn't be more opposite to Amy's character than you can get

[DabigRG]

Bumblekast answers from Augut 10th

Spoiler

 

Silver existed with no life due to Metal Virus in the future because Eggman found that plants rigid structure made it last longe and it was mutating to the point that it stopped being infectious. Further protecting him was his PK powers and how he time travels (blue skies future in 06 is the future with selective causality) also make him interfere with electronics.

The events that led to King Shadow killing Eggman and taking over aren't really. It was again a mandate for the 11 page each issues and so he had LaraSu defeat him due to her underserved character usage for her heritage. The issue was successful enough to get a sequel in Universe but Sega made it difficult to approve due to not really wanting those kind of stories anymore. He had to skip a lot of detailing what happened between those times, but wanted to focus on the characters anyway, so he just did what was necessary to move forward and tried to plant seeds to hint as to why he became that way as an aside.

There won't be a game of Preboot Archie because it is dead.

Wisps may or may not be infected with the Metal Virus: the fact that they're energy based and capable of possessing other things may make them immune or simulate a cellular structure, so he doesn't know.

Sally's multiple sacrifices leading into the Mecha Sally arc is something he isn't fond of as a death cheat but it was a necessary evil because of Genesis interrupting; he was originally excited beforehand due to changing, but it combined the underestimated reaction to Antoine's death led to Mecha Sally not having as much impact on things as he wanted per the editor's recommendation.He prefers it be obvious for the sake of chracters reactions, which is part of why he used GUN alongside Mayor Derado when ordered to kill off a major character for World's Unite.

In terms of past games, Tangle would work best in SA2 speed sections due to kinetic arcade energy. Whisper could fit Gammas shooting sections over the Tails/Eggman ones except more methodical; Shadow's game could still work due to the variety of weapons and mission objectives. Also, both can obviously be in Heroes alongside Jewel.

IDW Eggman is still related to Gerald(he doesn't remember saying otherwise) as far as he knows.

Cream is indeed sticking around for Year 3 as seen in solicits.

Two World's is not a mistranslation of something more metaphorical, as insightful as it is. He's even received a Bible that it is in fact two planets & dimensions near end of Archie and he double-checked when joining IDW.

The Witchcarters all had board gear because it is a more generally known type and staging action on them is way easier since they are basically standing in the air that way, though they did try basing them on their rides from Skypatrol. If they come back they'd be under Classic like the more recognized Hooligans and would likely be redesigned. 

He doesn't know much about One Piece so he can't compare his interest for globetrotting adventures to it.

 

.

On 9/1/2020 at 4:19 PM, Fire-N-Space said:

Watching this repressed Amy is getting to me where's Amy's love of cute things or her femininity traits like blowing a kiss are something.

Not to distract from the point here, but what is your profile?

23 hours ago, Kaotic Kanine said:

Fair enough. But then, Team Sonic Racing was a comparatively much more lighthearted and low stakes story, yet Amy still didn't even flirt with Sonic to my knowledge. 

Admittedly, she was pretty much her Boom counterpart in that.

23 hours ago, Kazhnuz said:

 

Something I like Flynn added to Amy too is the bit cookiness. Not for the "bird of a feather" that it give with Sonic, but more because I really see that as an evolution of her being a bit "bratty" in the Adventure saga.

Uh, as in kooky or cocky?

23 hours ago, Kazhnuz said:

All in one, i'm happy with the change, but because I felt that they really did something interesting with her, by making her dealing with a really new kind of situation. It's an interesting story in Sonic, and I'm really happy that they did it, and I'm kinda curious of what the exact conclusion will really be (and seeing her being with Rouge and Cream in the next arc interest me a lot, especially seeing her interact with Rouge, it's rare). And a thing I loved, is how we got some "Amy" flair in her way of dealing strategy sometime, like the "Tails ! Do something smart" that was just really fun.

 

 

3 hours ago, D.H said:

so I am very excited to see her, Rouge & Cream together, especially since Amy & Rouge is a team-up we don't see very often. Hopefully we get a good amount of time to see Amy back to her usual self away from the Resistance/Restoration stuff, because I feel admittedly a bit tired of that whole setup.

Its also interesting because she typically doesn't get along with Rouge any better than Knuckles.

 

3 hours ago, D.H said:

(like her & Tails vs. Zomom,  etc.) ,

Uh, wuzzit?

[D.H]

35 minutes ago, Kaotic Kanine said:

Thank you, @D.H! You've said everything that needed to be said, and did so far better than I could (if only because my response to all that would be passive-aggressive at best) 

So, the only other thing I'll say is that I actually liked Amy in Archie. Well, not so much Pre-Reboot, due to all the nonsense done to her before Ian took the writing reigns (but even then, he was not at all flattering with her until after Issue 200...). But Reboot was the best portrayal for Amy for the entirety of the 2010's. Literally, my only problems with Reboot!Archie Amy were how she was often the butt of harsh jokes and getting overshadowed by Sally in her few moments with Sonic (of course, everyone got overshadowed by that chipmunk whenever she was involved), but otherwise her characterization was perfect. Amy was very much a badass and respected hero in Reboot!Archie, but still very much herself: being enthusiastic, passionate, energetic, and openly in love with Sonic (whom she flirts with and even glomps when appropriate). That was a much more natural progression for Amy's character from her story arc from SA1 to Heroes

IDW, though, saw fit to characterize Amy a lot more like Sally, down to being highly organized and preoccupying herself with cataloging resources and other shit that really doesn't fit Amy's character  While others have made good arguments for IDW!Amy up to this point, at the end of the day it just came off a lot like Amy was being made into the new Sally. Not helped by the introduction of Tangle, who not only has the exact same role as Amy (being a mundane, ordinary girl with a thirst for adventure and making herself into an adventuring hero) but a LOT of Amy's personality; being an extremely energetic and passionate girl who is an excitable fangirl (just with the heroes in general, not just Sonic), loves to glomp people, has complete faith in Sonic's choices and ability to save the world, and a complete optimist even when things look most hopeless... So, yeah, in comparison to Reboot!Archie, IDW Amy was nothing short of disappointing to me. And I'm more than glad that we seem to finally be moving away from "Amy Acorn". Though I do wish Ian didn't insinuate that Amy can't lead in general: she can be an effective leader, as Heroes showed. But, like I said many times, Amy's in-character leadership would be the "charismatic" and "headstrong" kind, not unlike Sonic's own leadership style. IDW had her being the "levelheaded" and "mastermind" kind of leader, which couldn't be more opposite to Amy's character than you can get

Yeah, one thing I absolutely agree on is that there was some missed opportunities in Amy being a leader of the Restoration. Maybe it is just me having certain ideas for the character that may not jive with how SEGA actually sees her & I'm fine with that, but I always felt like Amy was more fitting as a "leading by motivation" type (for lack of a better word), constantly trying to keep the spirits of individuals in the Restoration high when things were going to shit, trying to find a positive in all the negative situations they'd fine themselves in, rather than spending time sending out orders etc. Like another poster mentioned, I would've loved a side story where we see Amy in a village searching for any displaced citizens, fixing up areas that were wrecked & we got a little bit of that in the issue where Vanilla got infected, but I feel like we didn't see enough.

Either way, I do at least appreciate the consistency of the Metal Virus bringing everyone to their lowest so I get why Amy wasn't as upbeat as she would be in other arcs since she was feeling the pressure more than most of the other characters, but at the same time, I think seeing Amy act more upbeat as Restoration leader *before* everything went to hell would've had more of an impact to me as a reader

[Shadow Chaos Control]

10 hours ago, StaticMania said:

Being "in love with the hero" isn't the same as being the "one who pines for affection"...

The hero being one who's shooting down affection in the 90's...it's some type of subversion...in Japan.

Maybe.

I think Amy ought to prusue Shadow the Hedgehog. He at least would be honest in his dismissal, Sonic just keeps running and ignoring Amy. 

[DabigRG]

59 minutes ago, Kaotic Kanine said:

IDW, though, saw fit to characterize Amy a lot more like Sally, down to being highly organized and preoccupying herself with cataloging resources and other shit that really doesn't fit Amy's character  While others have made good arguments for IDW!Amy up to this point, at the end of the day it just came off a lot like Amy was being made into the new Sally. Not helped by the introduction of Tangle, who not only has the exact same role as Amy (being a mundane, ordinary girl with a thirst for adventure and making herself into an adventuring hero) but a LOT of Amy's personality; being an extremely energetic and passionate girl who is an excitable fangirl (just with the heroes in general, not just Sonic), loves to glomp people, has complete faith in Sonic's choices and ability to save the world, and a complete optimist even when things look most hopeless... So, yeah, in comparison to Reboot!Archie, IDW Amy was nothing short of disappointing to me. And I'm more than glad that we seem to finally be moving away from "Amy Acorn". Though I do wish Ian didn't insinuate that Amy can't lead in general: she can be an effective leader, as Heroes showed. But, like I said many times, Amy's in-character leadership would be the "charismatic" and "headstrong" kind, not unlike Sonic's own leadership style. IDW had her being the "levelheaded" and "mastermind" kind of leader, which couldn't be more opposite to Amy's character than you can get

Unfortunately, that's a combination of most agreeing that Knuckles didn't fit the role of leader and possibly just him still having that default leadership style in mind(also, Metal Virus being planned for Reboot). I think it could've worked under the peer view of just being a role she's not cut out for personality wise, but I guess there's only so much you can do to convey that if you're even able to.

 

Add yes, when I (and previously J) brought up how the IDW cast is primarily designed around filling roles and archetypes that the game cast generally doesn't, Tangle was the exception. Which is totally not something I predicted early on, I swear

[StaticMania]

Tangle's ditzy and more fight happy attitude make her different from Amy already, not that Amy was all that much like that to since SA1.

And the "normal one" who wants to "get out there and help people" is too general of a thing to stick it with just one character.

Normal one just means citizen in this context because Tangle has an actual ability not a weapon.

[Slashy]

4 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

Tangle's ditzy and more fight happy attitude make her different from Amy already, not that Amy was all that much like that to since SA1.

And the "normal one" who wants to "get out there and help people" is too general of a thing to stick it with just one character.

Normal one just means citizen in this context because Tangle has an actual ability not a weapon.

How is Tangle different from Charmy?

[StaticMania]

She's not a hyperactive 6 year old...