Sonic Forces | PS4, Xbox One, Switch, PC "The Next Generations"

[JC_Mike]

I really hope we learn more about the character creation thing at e3, because I don't think I and several others really like how this is turning out to be.

Spoiler

It even be even worse if the leotard design for females become yet another restriction on the SegaSonic style. Can't wait for the redesigns of Sally and Sticks in leotards.

 

[StaticMania]

What else do you need to know about it? The thing we need to learn more about are the gadgetry....

[Chris Knopps]

I think this song perfectly reflects the relationship between everything being thrown into Forces, the folks heading the game, and the fan base.

They/We just keep going on and on in an endless cycle of indifference, intolerance, melodrama and skepticism with muddled mindsets, bewildered misdirections...

They've/We've been at it for so long to the point of madness and cynicism.

What are we doing? What are they doing? Why are we doing this? Why are they doing this?

That song is literally where all of us are now, employees and consumers alike along with the franchise.

[Zaysho]

2 hours ago, Diogenes said:

I don't oppose better writing. I oppose shouting "better writing!" as if that's a simple, obvious solution and not what we're trying to identify with all these arguments. I oppose certain things people think are better writing but that I don't think are better writing. I mean shit I go to bat for Pontac and Graff in spite of seemingly universal hate specifically because I think their writing is better than a lot of what's come before and it shouldn't be drowned out by people shouting "Baldy McNosehair!" a thousand times. I may not have the most mainstream of tastes but I'm certainly not saying "better writing? that's a bad thing actually".

Ignoring my issues with Pontac and Graff, and by extension, Sonic Team's current writing staff (I do not like P&G's localization efforts, nor did I like their script for Lost World, but I'm also aware it's not ALL on them, but it doesn't excuse what they do put out. They're also the ONLY writers for the games that have been given any publicity, so I can see why people refer to the current direction as "theirs"), but whenever I have seen you shoot down proposals for better writing, it's often with people bringing up specific points about characters. I've had arguments with you multiple times about Shadow in particular, and you always point to his past as if stories for Shadow require a focus on them, despite that arc in his development was already completed and opening up new possibilities for him. It's more than just people shouting "better writing!" and you know it. And nothing about this has to be particularly complicated, nor does it have to buck the levity or whatever it is people enjoy about the current direction (I see it, I'm just not fond of this particular style of writing).

2 hours ago, Diogenes said:

For now, wait. Get Sonic's shit in order. I don't consider the boost gameplay to be "in order" for a number of reasons, so we need something new for him. Ideally that something would be designed with foresight to better allow other playable characters later on; don't make it overly specific to where other characters' abilities can't fit in naturally (like, again, how the boost so severely dominates Sonic's gameplay). Obviously I'd aim for something focused on slope physics and momentum, rolling, wall running, etc; I think there's enough flexibility in that to incorporate most characters' signature abilities smoothly, given some thought. Once they've got a core gameplay style locked down, start small. One or two other characters alongside Sonic. Maybe Tails, maybe pull a Blaze and make it a new character, whoever they have a good idea or story for. Levels could be character-specific, remixed, or same across the board, though I think remixing the same set of levels to better match particular characters might give the game a longer life than the other options. Multiplayer's fair game to throw in everyone's favorites as skins, I don't really mind skins there. I'd keep the number of playable characters low in general, no trying to account for 9+ different movesets in one game, at least unless the series actually pulls itself out of the shit and becomes wildly popular to the point that they'd have the budget for it (though even then I'd lean towards fewer characters with more/more polished content).

I'm hitting thirty next year, and I've already been told to "wait until Sonic is in order" for the last six years, and I'm not terribly interested when my patience so far hasn't been rewarded. I'm stretched thin, man. I don't even disagree with your ideas for how Sonic himself can play or how levels can be arranged around specific characters, but I fail to see why a game designed with those mechanics in mind can't also incorporate a handful of characters at the start rather than waiting to see if it works out. I'm not advocating a large playable roster--my max is five, but I'm willing to come down because I think their appearances should be facilitated by the story rather than the plot being written because these characters have already been decided upon, and my shortlist usually includes Team Dark and Knuckles.

When I pointed to Adventure, like I said, it was a baseline, though I'd probably approach things differently, it just happens to be the easiest example for using them. My personal favorite examples for character usage are Sonic and the Black Knight (less for its actual gameplay and more for HOW the characters were presented) and Mario 3D World because in those instances, they are purely optional. The characters all function within a unified design and all behave exactly like the main character, but with their own unique and attributes movesets--which don't even have to have THAT much to them (the fact that the custom hero options do exactly do this shows it's entirely possible to do this without going overboard--each animal has their own attributes. It's not asking for much when applying that to existing characters). A simply different attack or way of navigating the level, basically approaching problems in ways different from Sonic, while still doing all the other things you proposed would suffice.

And then that just goes back to making them more active in the plots, but if you wanted, you could just power through the whole thing with Sonic and backtrack later to find other secrets with Tails, or Shadow, or whoever is included.

2 hours ago, Diogenes said:

Because ultimately I still see other playable characters as purely optional for the series. A Sonic game with only one playable character but that one character is really good? That's a good game. Not perfect, maybe. But certainly good. A Sonic game with many playable characters but none of them are very good? That's not a good game. That's not a game I'd spend my $60 on. That's not a game that I think is advancing the series in a positive direction. And after how much shit this series has gone through I don't believe in miracle solutions where Sonic Team wakes up one day and understands how to get everything right all at once. So what I'm going to argue for is what I think is the most direct route to what I want most and what I think the series needs most.

Neither do I, but I'd like to see something other than the constant experimentation and being put on hold because it's been arbitrarily decided this isn't the "right" time or whatever. If Sonic Team can't do it, find someone else who can. Y'all got Mania from them doing that.

[Lord-Dreamerz]

40 minutes ago, StaticMania said:

What else do you need to know about it? The thing we need to learn more about are the gadgetry....

Personally there be a lot more I want to know about the OC Maker.

Is there body options beyond just the standard male & female body? For example will there be a buff body for the males? Will there be a short and tall body option in general? Because so far all the OCs shown are taller then modern Sonic for some unknown reason. Will there be multiple different eye types? Will there be hair styles? To me these things matter much more then the gadgets ATM.

[-blank-]

1 hour ago, Detective Kaito said:

By spin-offs, I meant games like Sonic Mania. There will most likely be a Sonic Mania 2, maybe a new Sonic Riders game one day.

Can Mania even be classified as a spin-off game? I mean, it's basically a sequel to the classics and all.

 

As for the character customization feature....

 

 

Look, I want to play as the other characters, I really do. Hell, I'll be happy if they get decent roles in this game's story that amounts to more than acting like cheerleaders. And honestly, a custom character wasn't something I really wanted from the series, but let me tell you all something;

 

I'm a person who enjoys creating stuff, be it fanfics, or little avatars and signature banners. And yes, I have made fan characters. I'm a nerded, I know. So when I first saw the new trailer, my interest was piqued. And, I'm not going to lie; I honestly love this concept they've got going. It's a fun little idea and the gameplay shown in the trailer looks pretty damn fun. Also, the wolf they used to promote this looks like a fucking dork in those glasses and I'll be damned if I don't adore his goofy-ass design all the same.

 

Now, I have a feeling that the character isn't going to be super characterized in the story, which honestly does suck if that's true (though if I'm wrong, I'd be pleasantly surprised). However, this hasn't stopped a myriad of ideas from entering my head of basic character concepts, personalities, back stories, all that stuff. I've even gotten ideas for fanfics. I'd have to see more of how the game and its story are going to unfold, but for now, I'm all for this. This is something that I can most definitely get behind. It's a weird idea, but it does appeal to my creative side, and has re-lit the spark for that aspect of myself. For that, it has my support and I honestly cannot wait to see more of the game in general.

[blazefan519]

So let's talk about the "World Map" and "Mission" icon you can see on the character creator screen.

So could the world map be something akin to Colors, Unleashed, or SA2? And could this mean hubworlds, possibly?

And then the missions. Is it something like the Chaotix missions in Heroes, or Shadow the Hedgehog's mission levels? I'm honestly pretty intrigued.

What's your guys' take on it?

[Diogenes]

26 minutes ago, Zaysho said:

Ignoring my issues with Pontac and Graff, and by extension, Sonic Team's current writing staff (I do not like P&G's localization efforts, nor did I like their script for Lost World, but I'm also aware it's not ALL on them, but it doesn't excuse what they do put out. They're also the ONLY writers for the games that have been given any publicity, so I can see why people refer to the current direction as "theirs"), but whenever I have seen you shoot down proposals for better writing, it's often with people bringing up specific points about characters. I've had arguments with you multiple times about Shadow in particular, and you always point to his past as if stories for Shadow require a focus on them, despite that arc in his development was already completed and opening up new possibilities for him. It's more than just people shouting "better writing!" and you know it. And nothing about this has to be particularly complicated, nor does it have to buck the levity or whatever it is people enjoy about the current direction (I see it, I'm just not fond of this particular style of writing).

I've been in a lot of arguments over the years, I can't honestly say I remember the ones you're talking about specifically. But if I've disagreed with something, it's because...well, I disagreed with it. I didn't think it was a good idea. Not because I have some vendetta against better writing. Which is honestly kind of an insane thing to accuse someone of being against.

Quote

I'm hitting thirty next year, and I've already been told to "wait until Sonic is in order" for the last six years, and I'm not terribly interested when my patience so far hasn't been rewarded. I'm stretched thin, man.

Shit man who isn't at this point. If not for Mania I'd have nothing but contempt for this series myself.

Quote

I don't even disagree with your ideas for how Sonic himself can play or how levels can be arranged around specific characters, but I fail to see why a game designed with those mechanics in mind can't also incorporate a handful of characters.

It can. But what I'm saying is that I don't think it's best to shoot for that immediately. I would go for a Sonic-only game first, limit the number of variables in play to maximize the chances of them getting it right. And once they have it right, then add a few other characters.

Quote

I'm not advocating a large playable roster--my max is five, but I'm willing to come down because I think their appearances should be facilitated by the story rather than the plot being written because these characters have already been decided upon, and my shortlist usually includes Team Dark and Knuckles. When I pointed to Adventure, like I said, it was a baseline, though I'd probably approach things differently, it just happens to be the easiest example for using them. My personal favorite examples for character usage are Sonic and the Black Knight (less for its actual gameplay and more for HOW the characters were presented) and Mario 3D World because in those instances, they are purely optional. The characters all function within a unified design and all behave exactly like the main character, but with their own unique and attributes movesets--which don't even have to have THAT much to them (the fact that the custom hero options do exactly do this shows it's entirely possible to do this without going overboard--each animal has their own attributes. It's not asking for much when applying that existing characters). A simply different attack or way of navigating the level, basically approaching problems in ways different from Sonic, while still doing all the other things you proposed would suffice.

And then that just goes back to making them more active in the plots, but if you wanted, you could just power through the whole thing with Sonic and backtrack later to find other secrets with Tails, or Shadow, or whoever is included.

Most of this I've got no complaints about. I'd probably push for more distinct character abilities than this sounds like, but it's something I could live without. But I still don't see the need to do this now, so it's just not something I'd go to bat for myself.

Quote

Neither do I, but I'd like to see something other than the constant experimentation and being put on hold because it's been arbitrarily decided this isn't the "right" time or whatever. If Sonic Team can't do it, find someone else who can. Y'all got Mania from them doing that.

We're all burnt out, man. We all wish we could have the games we want now, or better yet yesterday. No one is happy. But we're all going to argue for the path we think is best for us and for the series.

[Chris Knopps]

23 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

So let's talk about the "World Map" and "Mission" icon you can see on the character creator screen.

So could the world map be something akin to Colors, Unleashed, or SA2? And could this mean hubworlds, possibly?

And then the missions. Is it something like the Chaotix missions in Heroes, or Shadow the Hedgehog's mission levels? I'm honestly pretty intrigued.

What's your guys' take on it?

That's the least they could give us to at least pad out the game and let us mingle with OTHER characters in some manner besides scenes.

I personally loved the hubs and missions structure in Unleashed that made you a part of the people and places in the world more than just running past them.

[Zaysho]

4 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

I've been in a lot of arguments over the years, I can't honestly say I remember the ones you're talking about specifically. But if I've disagreed with something, it's because...well, I disagreed with it. I didn't think it was a good idea. Not because I have some vendetta against better writing. Which is honestly kind of an insane thing to accuse someone of being against.

Maybe my wording is poor, but I'm not "accusing you of having a vendetta" so much as you're not down with whatever people suggest or just go straight for suggesting rebooting and hoping they get it right another time. But at this point this is just boiling down to preferences neither of us are willing to give on.

16 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

Most of this I've got no complaints about. I'd probably push for more distinct character abilities than this sounds like, but it's something I could live without. But I still don't see the need to do this now, so it's just not something I'd go to bat for myself.

It's just another baseline that can be explored and built up further as certain plots demand certain characters and they can be rotated out and whatever else. All I'm saying is that I want them back and I'm trying to find the least intrusive way to do it without putting everything on a timetable, because THAT hasn't worked out either from my view.

10 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

We're all burnt out, man. We all wish we could have the games we want now, or better yet yesterday. No one is happy. But we're all going to argue for the path we think is best for us and for the series.

True. And, hey, I like to think we're not so dissimilar, we just clash on very specific points. If I've been too rude or hotheaded about it at times, that's on me. I personally don't think the series is nearly anywhere in the shit as it's been made out to be at times, it's just been handled pretty poorly. I just want to see a bit of care put back into all aspects of it, especially neglected parts of it, even if I'm not as vocal about gameplay as I am about everything else (I think the ideas are there for the gameplay, it's just that no one at Sonic Team is working there that can pull it off, which goes back to the part this quote is responding to).

[LividOrca]

3 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

So let's talk about the "World Map" and "Mission" icon you can see on the character creator screen.

So could the world map be something akin to Colors, Unleashed, or SA2? And could this mean hubworlds, possibly?

And then the missions. Is it something like the Chaotix missions in Heroes, or Shadow the Hedgehog's mission levels? I'm honestly pretty intrigued.

What's your guys' take on it?

If we get hubworlds, I'm hoping for something easy to navigate but fun to explore if you want (like SA1), with interesting missions that aren't just fetch quests (06) and likeable NPCs (Unleashed).

I don't know if this was mentioned already, but I wonder how Sonic's World will be portrayed in Forces overall. If this is going to be another world adventure (post-Generations, where they basically un-retconned everything that came before Unleashed), will the characters travel to locations related to or inspired by past games at one point or another, or will every level be unique to this game? I think it'd be nice to see all these areas occupying space on a single map.

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Diogenes said:

We're all burnt out, man. We all wish we could have the games we want now, or better yet yesterday. No one is happy. But we're all going to argue for the path we think is best for us and for the series.

We're all suffering together in some manner of way. And the only way to deal with it is to share our plight with others it looks like. Some may be more understanding than others but on the whole frustration just begets more frustration while the overlords up on high don't cater to or try to sort out any of it. The fact that Mania is happening at all for the lovers of those classics I still consider to be something of a brief miracle.

None of this is our collective fault. I don't care how rowdy and messed up the fanbase is. It got that way for a reason. The people in charge are at fault and ultimately we've got no choice but to rely on them to sort this shit out if we're all going to be happy one day.

When it our Jesus Developer going to descend from up on high and break bread for all the starving Sonic fans out there? I dunno. 

[blazefan519]

5 minutes ago, LividOrca said:

If we get hubworlds, I'm hoping for something easy to navigate but fun to explore if you want (like SA1), with interesting missions that aren't just fetch quests (06) and likeable NPCs (Unleashed).

I don't know if this was mentioned already, but I wonder how Sonic's World will be portrayed in Forces overall. If this is going to be another world adventure (post-Generations, where they basically un-retconned everything that came before Unleashed), will the characters travel to locations related to or inspired by past games at one point or another, or will every level be unique to this game? I think it'd be nice to see all these areas occupying space on a single map.

So basically taking the best out of the hubworlds we have, I like it.

We might be going the Unleashed route again. We already know that park avenue is based off of Amsterdam, which I believe is in the Netherlands last I checked. So maybe more stuff based of the real world. Then we have Classic Sonic that sticks out like a sore thumb with Green Hill, but that may just be an introductory and all the rest of the stages are new.

[Writer's Blah]

16 minutes ago, Gabe said:

Since we're back on the topic of Boost gameplay and where to go with 3D gameplay in general, I'm just going to quickly chime in with my thoughts:

I understand boost gameplay has its fans, and I'm not fighting for it to be discarded. But I will disagree with the notion however that it's the ideal playstyle for 3D Sonic and should be the (sole) foundation going forward. If anything, I actually think Unleashed has the better-designed levels for the Boost gameplay compared to the others, because Colors and Generations' attempts to add platforming into the levels (especially in the 2D portions) break up the flow of constant speed, and the platforming itself is usually rather naff and nothing writing home about.

That's kind of the whole issue right there, actually. Let's stop and think for a second about the current state of affairs in the gaming industry, in its entirety.

This is the current face of AAA gaming right now. Notice the lush backgrounds, open design, visual fidelity, and to top it all off, a decently high frame-rate to boot. More importantly, it's what modern gamers have come to expect from new releases; to release anything lesser is commonly thought of as shovelware, an indie game, or a game catering to a very specific niche. Persona 5, for example, was able to get away with PS3 graphics just because the core gameplay and storyline were so strong, and it saw decent success. But Persona hardly counts as a system seller, and despite all the positive press its received online, it isn't breaking any sales records. That's just the way the game is played, but Atlus can afford that with the Persona franchise because they know they're catering to a relatively niche audience. SEGA doesn't have that luxury, because they're not developing Sonic for a niche audience. Sonic is supposed to be a cultural icon. So why not give him AAA-level production value? Really, the easiest way to wow modern audiences is with exactly what SEGA's been producing since 2008. The boost gameplay is exhilarating, feeding tremendously into the "gotta go fast" mentality while still providing beautiful-looking levels and visuals. This design, unfortunately, leads to a general shallowness in level design and mechanics. Note that I'm not saying that boost gameplay CAN'T have complexity to it (Sonic Unleashed speedruns are actually pretty impressive in that regard), but it detracts from a lot of the series' original strengths.

Now, this argument might seem like a load of crock to you. After all, SEGA has proved that they can, in fact, maintain visual fidelity with slower paced 3D stages.

Yeah, I'm going there.

This shows that it really wouldn't be too much of a stretch to dial back Sonic's speed a bit and go for some more interesting level design. Problem is, we already got that, and it was called Sonic Lost World. I think the problem is that SEGA's trying to bridge the gap between Nintendo's definition of AAA, and the definition that the rest of the industry uses. Sonic wants to be a combination of platforming charm and modern spectacle, and the slower paced design rarely cuts it. I'm very wary as to whether it would really impress anyone to return to an Adventure-inspired level design, except among the people who already hate boost gameplay, of which I think there's fewer than you'd think. To return to a mechanically rich 3D experience would be to scrap a lot of what SEGA's already developed, sunk their money into, and proven they have an audience for. Just trying to understand where the developers might be coming from.

Of course, Sonic is mainly seen as a laughing stock anyway, so I'm curious how strongly radically changing things up would hurt them in the end. Sonic already reinvents the wheel with every subsequent game anyway, so why not dial it back to something more financially feasible and potentially more mechanically interesting?

[TCB]

Reading fifteen pages of this made me think about my own standing as a fan, and I'm going admit, it feels like a rough one. Indecisiveness, apathy, annoyance is how I feel, not just about Forces, but Mania as well and the situation with each other among the fanbase.

Here, on SSMB, it's clear that reception for Forces is the most broken I've seen since coming here, and in some ways it's justified. Point is, there's a lack of core direction with Forces. I feel that correlates directly with Sonic Team themselves; they lost a core focus. A drive. Something is missing.

Knowing me, I'll get and play Forces (stupid me right), as well as Mania, because that's just who I am. But it's clear that even though I'm not the most vocal on the Mania Hype Train (for reasons I've already mentioned before) that clearly has direction. SEGA's current strategy of reaching out to devs to create new titles from their IPs is a good one. Maybe after Forces and some has passed SEGA follows up from Mania's approach and do the same with a worthy studio for a 3D title. Don't know the semantics but IDK I'm spitballin here. 

 

[LividOrca]

14 minutes ago, blazefan519 said:

So basically taking the best out of the hubworlds we have, I like it.

We might be going the Unleashed route again. We already know that park avenue is based off of Amsterdam, which I believe is in the Netherlands last I checked. So maybe more stuff based of the real world. Then we have Classic Sonic that sticks out like a sore thumb with Green Hill, but that may just be an introductory and all the rest of the stages are new.

I can live with that, but it'd be nice to see Sonic Team try. That's kind of related to one of my biggest complaints for Lost World: all those surreal bonus level and DLC stages and NOTHING referencing the Storybook games, which would have made so much sense for that game. But maybe that's just me!

[Chris Knopps]

 

1 hour ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

We're all suffering together in some manner of way. And the only way to deal with it is to share our plight with others it looks like. Some may be more understanding than others but on the whole frustration just begets more frustration while the overlords up on high don't cater to or try to sort out any of it. The fact that Mania is happening at all for the lovers of those classics I still consider to be something of a brief miracle.

None of this is our collective fault. I don't care how rowdy and messed up the fanbase is. It got that way for a reason. The people in charge are at fault and ultimately we've got no choice but to rely on them to sort this shit out if we're all going to be happy one day.

When it our Jesus Developer going to descend from up on high and break bread for all the starving Sonic fans out there? I dunno. 

Psssssst...

Bayonetta was the best 3D Sonic game since Sonic Unleashed...

High speed... Cinematic spectacle... Music... Plot depth... Great script...

Another pssssssst...

Lets have everybody that works on the Bayonetta franchise make the next Sonic game with no Sonic Team involved...

 

[Dejimon11]

Does anybody else feel as if that the OC thing was originally going to be Boom Sonic? With the use of gadgets and the grapple hook doesn't really seem out of place in a Boom game since he has an enerbeam and had used gadgets before in ROL. Plus as I've stated earlier it just seems really weird to have Modern Sonic, Classic Sonic and an Avatar. 

[Writer's Blah]

2 minutes ago, Dejimon11 said:

Does anybody else feel as if that the OC thing was originally going to be Boom Sonic? With the use of gadgets and the grapple hook doesn't really seem out of place in a Boom game since he has an enerbeam and had used gadgets before in ROL. Plus as I've stated earlier it just seems really weird to have Modern Sonic, Classic Sonic and an Avatar. 

I've actually been giving this some thought, and I think it might actually be plausible. I think SEGA was actually blind-sided with the absolute terrible reception Rise of Lyric got, and had been planning for Boom Sonic to be the third playstyle to round out Classic and Modern. However, when Sonic Boom finally came out and SEGA noted the, ahem, less than stellar reception, they had to backpedal HARD to not scrap all the levels they'd already made for Boom Sonic, thinking he was going to be a success. The grappling hook's similarity to the enerbeam, the fusion of 2D and 3D sections, slightly more enemy-heavy level design, and equipment-based gameplay all seems a little bit too familiar; even the proportions of the avatar bodies seem eerily similar to the background characters from Sonic Boom, so who knows?

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Dejimon11 said:

Does anybody else feel as if that the OC thing was originally going to be Boom Sonic? With the use of gadgets and the grapple hook doesn't really seem out of place in a Boom game since he has an enerbeam and had used gadgets before in ROL. Plus as I've stated earlier it just seems really weird to have Modern Sonic, Classic Sonic and an Avatar. 

The first thing that came to mind when I saw the grapple was the Espio mission with Classic Sonic from Sonic Generations. And that worries me a tad since I hated the control of that thing. Though it may function a bit better here.

[Jango]

5 hours ago, Blue Blood said:

I'm curious, if you don't mind saying, how old are you and your friends and when were you introduced to Sonic? I'm leaning towards the idea that is mainly younger fans that are the target demographic here and it will mostly (but not exclusively) appeal to them. I'm talking people who grew up in the 2000s. 

I see where you're trying to get with this.

Is it possible that we have, you know... grown up? Sure Sonic The Hedgehog is a franchise that appeals to all ages, but I guess SEGA has given enough hints that they want to deliver different games to different age demographics. The quote you brought before proves that. THEN AGAIN, Classic Sonic is in Forces, but it's not like ST gave much thought about his inclusion, ergo why the gameplay doesn't even scratch the surface of a true classic experience. He's just another character in the cast to them.

What is sad, tho', is the fact that we had Modern Sonic games aimed at all ages, like Unleashed, the two Adventure titles and Heroes. Things started to lean towards the younger age demographic side with Sonic Colors. Simpler mechanics, colorful new characters, easy-to-follow story... I've rolled with it while I could... but I guess it's time to maybe... face it? I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong if you like the CaC thing, nor that you can't enjoy it, but I personally can't. I kept moving, and I guess SEGA wants Sonic to stay young. It might sound contradictory when I say this, because Mania is nothing but a 1995 game made in 2017. The fact that Mania still appeals to me is the obvious nostalgia and the promise of a quality game, you know, solid, precise and to the point.

I still look forward to Forces, tho'.

And I love you guys.

[Kintor]

9 hours ago, Soniman said:

I can definitely see this as a game the general audience loves bit the fanbase loathes (if general impressions so far are anything to go by). 

Casual folk love modern Sonic and recognize him as the icon of "when the games became good again" , while most fans are tired of it or downright hate the gameplay 

Casual folk love Classic Sonic and care more about general asthetics then 1:1 gameplay like the fans 

Casual folk I'm betting will adore the CaC because lel memes and those types of features are big in games now. Again we have people outraged and leaving the fandom at this. 

I wouldn't be surprised if this games ends up on 70s metric yet within the fanbase will be mostly disliked but we'll see 

The Sonic fanbase is always changing as people come and go. Even so, I don't think dramatic threats of leaving the fanbase forever is going to have much of a demographic impact. A few leaving is more than going to be balanced out by the surge of new people being brought in by the character creator. Especially if the character creator gets picked-up popular YouTube and Twitch channel. I joked before about Sonic Forces being able to sell 10 million copies and that's probably not far off the truth. The positive buzz around the character creator is going to have a significantly boost the sales of Sonic Forces; the sky really is the limit here. Sonic Forces could end up as the best selling Sonic game ever made.

 

9 hours ago, Nepenthe said:

NeoGAF seems mainly off-put by it, either as an actual gimmick or out of ironic fascination due to the "bad OC" angle. I've told two people in real life about it and they both laughed it off. Outside of SSMB I don't get the most glowing impression. At best, it seems inoffensive, and at worst, people are deriding it as stupid.

No offense but I think you're being too self-conscious about this whole thing. Just because some people see the potential absurdity of the a character creator doesn't mean they hate the idea. On the contrary the kind of 'stupid' fun that people can have in a character creator is all part of the appeal. Being able to share these bizarre creations on the social media will further help to promote Sonic Forces in ways that Sega's marketing team would never be able to do on their own. That positive word of mouth building around the character creator has already done much to make Sonic Forces the topic of conversation across the internet.

 

[Dr. Detective]

1 hour ago, Jango said:

And I love you guys.

Awww~.

1 hour ago, Kintor said:

No offense but I think you're being too self-conscious about this whole thing. 

Oh come on man. Don't... everybody just made up. 

[Dejimon11]

31 minutes ago, Writer's Blah said:

I've actually been giving this some thought, and I think it might actually be plausible. I think SEGA was actually blind-sided with the absolute terrible reception Rise of Lyric got, and had been planning for Boom Sonic to be the third playstyle to round out Classic and Modern. However, when Sonic Boom finally came out and SEGA noted the, ahem, less than stellar reception, they had to backpedal HARD to not scrap all the levels they'd already made for Boom Sonic, thinking he was going to be a success. The grappling hook's similarity to the enerbeam, the fusion of 2D and 3D sections, slightly more enemy-heavy level design, and equipment-based gameplay all seems a little bit too familiar; even the proportions of the avatar bodies seem eerily similar to the background characters from Sonic Boom, so who knows?

There's a part of me that feels that the fan reaction would of been better if they had went with him. 

[Kintor]

5 minutes ago, Dr. Chaotix said:

Awww~.

Oh come on man. Don't... everybody just made up. 

I'm not criticising anybody - I'm saying that you shouldn't worry too much about this supposed negative reputation of the Sonic fanbase on the internet. Nothing good as ever come from trying to please those who will always hate Sonic fans regardless. Turning on each other, especially those with OCs, just hurts the Sonic fanabse and doesn't achieve anything. I'm glad that this character creator is part of Sonic Forces; maybe now people will stop giving OC fans such a hard time.