Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[Jason Berry]

Plot outlines is two words Biz. XD

 

But yeah, outside of Antione and Bunnie getting married (which any writer saw coming and could have easily have done) none of the other plot outlines match up in any way. Hell, a good chunk of Ian's first two years was cleaning up Ken and Karl's work.

 

It is interesting to see that he was finally going to focus on Sonic and that outside of one 25YL story there was a lot less attention on Knuckles and his family. Way too much focus on relationships though. 

[blazingsonic]

Ken just Tweeted this and

 

 

https://twitter.com/KenPenders/status/459558921359720448

 

I mean. Just. Hello, nurse?

O_O.....

http://youtu.be/ZvAES6Y9Kfw

 

[Tenko]

Out of curiosity do the re-prints in the Sonic/Knuckles Archives still have the info on comics sold etc in them? As much as I would love to go and unbag all my Knuckles comics I would rather take the easy way out and check my Knuckles Archives where I don't have to worry about damaging my old comics >.<

[Big Panda]

Out of curiosity do the re-prints in the Sonic/Knuckles Archives still have the info on comics sold etc in them? As much as I would love to go and unbag all my Knuckles comics I would rather take the easy way out and check my Knuckles Archives where I don't have to worry about damaging my old comics >.<

I don't follow...?

[Tenko]

I don't follow...?

The statement of ownership info they were talking about a couple posts ago. To find out the sales of the Knuckles series of comics so we can accurately compare them to the sales of the others.

[Your Vest Friend]

I assume the statement of ownership would be put on one of the non-comic pages, so the archives wouldn't contain them.

[Sunwalker]

I don't follow...?

See my post above

 

 

Out of curiosity do the re-prints in the Sonic/Knuckles Archives still have the info on comics sold etc in them? As much as I would love to go and unbag all my Knuckles comics I would rather take the easy way out and check my Knuckles Archives where I don't have to worry about damaging my old comics >.<

 

I looked at the 32 issues of the Knuckles' comic and there were no statements of ownership.

 

But I was able to dig from Comichron the direct sales numbers. Here is the sales comparison between Sonic and Knuckles' comics:

 

 

And here is a spreadsheet with the sales numbers:

http://goo.gl/rMkfPy

 

It is worth noting that Archie's sales are strong in the subscriptions, but they are not accounted on the above numbers. Remember that "direct sales" does not account for subscriptions, newsstand sales, sales outside U.S. or Canada, and digital sales.

[Tenko]

So its incomplete but still gives a good idea of what the sales looked like tho. So is there weight in that Knuckles then outsold Universe now?

Would be interesting to see what the spikes in sales corisponded to, special issues or landmark ones? Its odd that '97 had spikes in popularity since its so far from a main title release games wise. Adventure was '98 in Japan and '99 elsewhere if I remember right, and Sonic & Knuckles was back in what '94-'95. Was a pretty dark time for proper games from '96 to '98.

Sonic Jam while awesome was a compilation, then there was the likes of 3D Blast and R...pretty slim pickings to cause a Sonic comic rise in sales.

[Mauro Fonseca]

Any discussion of sales also has to take in consideration not only the economic state of the country but just a general downfall of sales throughout the industry. It may well be Sonic Universe sells less than Knuckles, but pretty much ANYTHING NOW sells less than ANYTHING IN THE 90'S (EXCEPT LOST ONES). :V

[Sunwalker]

So its incomplete but still gives a good idea of what the sales looked like tho. So is there weight in that Knuckles then outsold Universe now?

Would be interesting to see what the spikes in sales corisponded to, special issues or landmark ones? Its odd that '97 had spikes in popularity since its so far from a main title release games wise. Adventure was '98 in Japan and '99 elsewhere if I remember right, and Sonic & Knuckles was back in what '94-'95. Was a pretty dark time for proper games from '96 to '98.

Sonic Jam while awesome was a compilation, then there was the likes of 3D Blast and R...pretty slim pickings to cause a Sonic comic rise in sales.

On the spreadsheet I made I noted some of the most relevant events at the time. Basically the spikes happened at the beginning of a new story arc and in the milestone (Knuckles #25).

Since I usually hear people saying that Knuckles' comic decline started after artist Manny Galan left, I have noted that. I also hear that the miniseries and the next two arcs are what is mostly fondly remembered about Knuckles' comic. Notice that after these stories sales start declining.

If I have to guess what happened to Knuckles to be canceled should had been a decline on subscriptions. I find curious that there is no statements of ownership in the Knuckles' comic while there is in Sonic. Maybe they did not want to show for some reason? I also remember Penders saying that there were some distribution problems close to the cancelation, certainly it also did not help with continuing the comic.

[biznizz]

https://twitter.com/KenPenders/status/470794599955329025

https://twitter.com/KenPenders/status/470942113681924097

https://twitter.com/KenPenders/status/470942957726883841

https://twitter.com/KenPenders/status/470943620108156928

 

The Not-So-Slender Penderman continues his damage control.

[Tenko]

Who is that masked man berating Penders so?

[biznizz]

He's the hero we need. And the one we deserve right now...

[antyep]

...but not the one we need....because he's Batman!

[QuantumEdge]

What a fool...  Now he's just being spiteful for the sake of it in calling Ian a thief.  The man's egoism seems to know no bounds.  What really stumps me though is that some of he people he worked with (including those whose work he doesn't put in high esteem) helped with this case. 

[biznizz]

What a fool...  Now he's just being spiteful for the sake of it in calling Ian a thief.  The man's egoism seems to know no bounds.  What really stumps me though is that some of he people he worked with (including those whose work he doesn't put in high esteem) helped with this case. 

 

I think one of the people that supports him is Elliot S! Maggin, the famous DC writer from the 70's and so. In fact, I think he's Penders' greatest supporter (I have no idea if he actually likes him or not) because of bitterness of the comics industry, especially Archie which I think he's got a huge axe to grind with. I think he was the guy who created the superhero personas of the Archie characters (like Captain Pureheart), but was most likely mistreated by them back in the day.

 

Shame, because I get the feeling that he's so bitter, he'd continue to support Penders' crusade even if he knew just how awful of a person he really is (you'd think outright slander against another writer would've had him wise up...). Hell, I think that Maggin is Penders' go-to "Jewish friend" who told him that his use of the Holocaust poem wasn't offensive...

[QuantumEdge]

I didn't know he had such a supporter.  All I can say is that these guys are in desperate need of learning how to "let it go."  Heck, we might as well get these guys to listen to that Frozen number and see if it changes their tone.  

 

Seriously speaking though, Maggin seems perhaps more bitter than Penders if he'd really still support him if he knew exactly how much a jerk he was.

[Blacklightning]

Little late to the party now, but I think it says a lot about an individual and their projects when we hear more about the spin doctoring and damage control than the actual fucking project. Like seriously, speaking as an outsider I scarcely even know what the fuck this is about, just that Penders is being a cunt over it. I've seen Steam Greenlight scams handled with better finesse than this.

[Sunwalker]

And it is this sort of thing that makes me suspect that Penders is not acting alone. In order to do what he did you need a solid legal consulting and lawyers who are very knowledgeable in copyright laws. Nothing of this is cheap and it is odd that someone who supposedly was living on unemployment checks can afford all of it. Penders must be getting some support from someone.

Considering all the creators that he says who are on his side, my guess is that there is some kind of joint effort of creators supporting each other. Of course Pernders' case would not be the only case that they are helping, it is just that (for the good or for the bad) Ken speaks too much then his case is what gets more attention.

[Zaysho]

I think one of the people that supports him is Elliot S! Maggin, the famous DC writer from the 70's and so. In fact, I think he's Penders' greatest supporter (I have no idea if he actually likes him or not) because of bitterness of the comics industry, especially Archie which I think he's got a huge axe to grind with. I think he was the guy who created the superhero personas of the Archie characters (like Captain Pureheart), but was most likely mistreated by them back in the day.

 

Shame, because I get the feeling that he's so bitter, he'd continue to support Penders' crusade even if he knew just how awful of a person he really is (you'd think outright slander against another writer would've had him wise up...). Hell, I think that Maggin is Penders' go-to "Jewish friend" who told him that his use of the Holocaust poem wasn't offensive...

 

I think I recall reading Maggin's twitter feed some months back when the whole plagiarism of Niemoller's poem came to light and Maggin basically said no one should criticize Penders because he was on a "holy crusade to assert creators' rights" and then proceeded to rant about how badly the comics industry has treated creators (because this is news, apparently). Actually, he hasn't updated his feed in a while, so it's pretty easy to find.

 

The thing is, I sympathize with what they're saying, but what they're doing just makes me take a step back. It's really hard to look at this as anything other than Penders trying to relive his glory days and dragging everyone else's work down with him.

 

Also, how is it I spend so much time reading twitter feeds when I don't even use twitter?

[biznizz]

You aren't alone; I spent most of the last 3 1/2 years not using the twitter I barely set up before giving it attention on all this crap around Mid-March.

[Sunwalker]

In my humble opinion, Penders screwed his defense by lashing out at pretty much anybody who could be on his side, both fans and creatives.

While it sounded that what he wanted was being credited and paid for his work, it was perfectly reasonable to me and I was on his side. But then he started to insist that his characters, specially Scourge and Robo-Robotnik were original, while Sonic Chronicles' echidnas could not be considered original.

He also went ballistic to anyone who showed the flaws of his claims, which suggests that he is just making excuses and he actually should be doing all of this for less presentable reasons (like revenge) instead of the reasons he gives. Not to forget that he also already badmouthed pretty much everyone who worked on the book, which has nothing to do with "his rights".

Penders has also hindered the publishing of some reprints. If all he wanted was to be paid for his work then he could just have requested royalties instead of delaying the books. Not to mention the departure of the characters, he could had keep the royalities for the reprints and let the characters stay without making any conditions.

All of this shows me someone who is capable to hold a grudge for years and cannot be trusted. Needless to say, I am no longer on his side.

[Tenko]

Huh apparently he's waiting for some Super Con to announce his plans for the series. Dunno if that means in some kind of booth/official way or if he's just gunna be wandering around promoting it. Either way I can't imagine he will get that much attention >.<

[Zaysho]

Huh apparently he's waiting for some Super Con to announce his plans for the series. Dunno if that means in some kind of booth/official way or if he's just gunna be wandering around promoting it. Either way I can't imagine he will get that much attention >.<

 

Yeah, that con is near me actually and I considered going to talk to him, but I have a feeling I'd just piss him off. lol

 

I really can't imagine what the reaction will be like when there's a big cutout of his new Lien-Da or whatever else will be there.

 

But yeah, he's got a booth there, so I'm guessing he'll be unveiling more stuff then. The Super Con page actually mentioned the legal battle, but seemed to spin it in his favor (or maybe when Penders applied for the booth, someone wrote his bio like that).

 

EDIT: Ah, here's the bio. ...Penders worked on King of the Hill? Huh.

[Tenko]

Who wrote that? Aren't Lost Ones and Republic like...not even a thing? Filmmaker? Really?

Also his lore for the comics isn't used in the "present day" as it all got wiped a few months ago. Really does seem to be written to make him out to be far more important than he is.