So... What's so Bad About the Series' Current Direction?

[Vertekins]

I can't find it in me to see how any post SA2 or pre-Colors characterization of Sonic was anything but one note and boring, but okay (Storybook games are exempt before anyone says anything, and even then I didn't find it that great).

 

And I can't find it in me how Colours and Gens Sonic was anything more than obnoxiously exaggerated in the former and incredibly bland in the latter. They have bright spots but nothing especially remarkable or stand-out even when compared to previous portrayals. SLW Sonic was an improvement on those two but still had problem areas.

[Soniman]

And I can't find it in me how Colours and Gens Sonic was anything more than obnoxiously exaggerated in the former and incredibly bland in the latter. They have bright spots but nothing especially remarkable or stand-out even when compared to previous portrayals. SLW Sonic was an improvement on those two but still had problem areas.

 

Exaggerated or not, at least I gave something of a shit about Sonic's character and was milady entertained by his antics and found it charming. Which I hadn't seen in Sonic's character for years. Same with SLW Sonic, because he's a more then some infallible hero who always did the right thing and always in the right, never making costly errors.

 

 

 

Japanese:

(Zeena): "Fine then, now I'll get serious"

English:

(Zeena): "Just as soon as my nails dry"

 

Ehh, to me that just comes off as rather boring and uncharacteristic dialogue that could be used for anyone, at least in the English script you can pretty clearly guess who's speaking it.

[-Mark-]

Ehh, to me that just comes off as rather boring and uncharacteristic dialogue that could be used for anyone, at least in the English script you can pretty clearly guess who's speaking it.

 

Again, I'll happily take the Japanese (and this goes for the other characters as well) more arguably generic and inoffensive dialogue rather than one-dimensional, obnoxious and stereotypical.

 

The way Sonic is written in English from Colours onwards makes me genuinely dislike him as a character. He's annoying, juvenile and a jerk.

[StaticMania]

The way Sonic is written in English from Colours onwards makes me genuinely dislike him as a character. He's annoying, juvenile and a jerk.

Being a jerk and even juvenile are things that do come from being impatient and cocky/arrogant.

[Diogenes]

People can have personality, character and charm without being annoying, hateable one-dimensional stereotypes. You know, like Sonic actually does pre-Colours (and moreso in Japanese).

"Pre-Colors" Sonic is the unlikable stereotype, the flawless, lifeless hero, who does nothing but be a hero because hero.

Maybe not, but pretty much every bad joke - shock, surprise!- wasn't a bad joke in Japanese, just an ordinary piece of dialogue. How about we play spot the difference for a second, shall we?

 

Sonic Adventure:

 

Japanese: "You running away?" 

English: "Come on, ya big drip! Where ya goin'?"

 

Japanese: "It's you... Dr. Eggman!!"

English: "Hey look, it's a giant talking egg"

Hey, look at which lines actually have character and which ones are lifeless statements that communicate nothing about Sonic.

If the Japanese script sucks all the life out of the character, then fuck the Japanese script. No wonder Japan doesn't like Sonic if that's all they ever got.

And that's all I've got to say on this subject, I think.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

The way Sonic is written in English from Colours onwards makes me genuinely dislike him as a character. He's annoying, juvenile and a jerk.

Not what I've gotten from my experience. Why so for you?

[Krockhead]

I have quite a few issues with the series. For one, I'm sick of this waiting game that Sonic Team forces us to play every few years. Now I haven't played Lost World yet, so my credibility is shoddy, but I can tell that it's the experimental game like Unleashed was. Look at Unleashed, the boost gameplay was fine, but it took them a while to get it right. It was improved in Colors and perfected in Generations, but we shouldn't have to wait two games for the mechanic to work at its best. It's going to be the same thing with Lost World. Sonic 2 and 3K were both improvements over the first Sonic game, but Sonic 1 was still a great game with mechanics that worked. I'm spending money on these games, I want the developers to get their mechanics right on the first go.

 

Second, there's no reason we have to keep Solo Sonica. I don't want five billion playable characters, but we should at least have Tails and Knuckles. It's all because of the "Shitty Friends" complaint that people had that Sonic Team is paranoid about using other characters. What they don't realize is that Sonic 06 wasn't a bad game because it had multiple characters, it was a bad game because of everything wrong with the game. It's not like there's only one playstyle in these games, Unleashed had the Werehog, Generations had classic Sonic, and Lost World has a thousand and one different gimmicks. I can easily think of ways to incorporate Tails and Knuckles. Just make the parkour a Sonic-exclusive, let Tails fly, let Knuckles climb and glide, and keep every else the same. Boom, I just did Sega's job for them.

 

I actually think the writing is okay right now. The plot varies from acceptable to nonexistent, but the character interactions are great, which I'm fine with. My problem is that only some of the interactions are great, the others are plain shit. Just look at Amy and Knuckles in Lost World, they're completely useless. If you're not gonna do them right, just keep them out of the games. If you just shoehorn them in, then it just comes off as a missed opportunity for good jokes and interactions. Also, Knuckles' character is just wrong, and has been for many years now, but we all know that.

 

My biggest complaint is how much they are Mariofying the series. Come on, I like Sonic because it isn't Mario, Sonic's original purpose was to be different from Mario. Just keep your Mario out of my Sonic and I'll be happy.

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

Not what I've gotten from my experience. Why so for you?

Bottomline, I find myself more interested with the English script often and can pry more character from it off of what what's been written for this franchise anyway.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

But we have lost track of Sonic... the main character. He main character who has awesome moves and was an insperation to many in universe. Now we can see what Sonic is really made of without anyone else stealing the spotlight from him.

[spinny]

But we have lost track of Sonic... the main character. He main character who has awesome moves and was an insperation to many in universe. Now we can see what Sonic is really made of without anyone else stealing the spotlight from him.

 

The series is Sonic the Hedgehog, yes. But for crying out loud, have other characters in there too. Having him get every single frame of the spotlight, it gets boring eventually-- and, for a lot of us, myself included-- already has become boring and overused. This series has a massive cast with a lot of potential, the just need to unlock said potential and balance it all out with Sonic.

[MamboCat]

He's annoying, juvenile and a jerk.

 

Of course he is, he's a  teenager! hehehe

 

I really don't see the difference with early 90s Sonic, SA-era Sonic and Colours era Sonic in terms of attitude, here. If I'm honest it's one thing they managed to keep across the years. If you're a bad guy, Sonic's gonna sass ya!

[Vertekins]

But we have lost track of Sonic... the main character. He main character who has awesome moves and was an insperation to many in universe. Now we can see what Sonic is really made of without anyone else stealing the spotlight from him.

 

We've already seen that though.

 

When Sonic actually got the focus for once in years in the Storybook games and Unleashed, the games that set his portrayals firmly on the right track by showing how Sonic's personality and ideals about heroism affected characters around him and moved the plot along believably without consuming everything. Then Colours came along and derailed that, shoving him into an overwhelmingly obnoxious cheese-spouting role with little focus on anything else. SLW re-railed it though. With a few bumps on the rest of the 'journey'.

 

Sonic's had lovely focus before that did him justice and as much as I love the character, I would like to see some limelight delegated to others now. Not to the point of hugely overshadowing him, just having them contribute to the narrative, gain development and actually act like the characters they were established as instead of boring non-entities.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

Im sorry: all I wanted was for my favorite character so get the respect he deserves :[

[spinny]

Im sorry: all I wanted was for my favorite character so get the respect he deserves :[

 

I'm not saying it's bad that Sonic is your favourite character, you have nothing to be 'sorry' for.

 

I'm simply trying to say that he has got this "respect he deserves" being in the limelight-- from Secret Rings to Lost World-- that's 6 years of 'respect'. 

 

They've had so much time writing for Sonic (and Tails, Unleashed - Lost World, and Amy in Unleashed) that I think it's time they branched out to the other characters this series has to offer.

[Wraith]

Sonic being shafted in his own series for years was pretty awful on Sega's part so he did kinda need some time to shine again. The rest of the cast needs to make their way back in though. Lost World was taking good steps toward this, but at the very least Knuckles and Amy need to be more involved next time.

I also don't think they should pull a heroes and squeeze the entire fucking crew into one adventure. A small group is great, just cycle through them more often.

So many characters being underdeveloped and one dimensional and often fucking annoying is the quickest way for me to loose interest.

[E-122-Psi]

We've at least made some baby steps concerning Tails recently, he had some form of playability in Sonic 4: Episode 2, and had a bit of character spotlight in Lost World along with Sonic. It seems like they are at least starting to get round to him slowly but surely, so maybe after they feel he's got his fill, we'll get some good spotlight for another character (likely Knuckles or Amy). It's a bit too slow a process than it should be (almost a decade) but it does seem like they are at least considering focus on the other characters, and hopefully won't go overboard this time.

 

And EVERY Western writer portrays Sonic as a jerk to some degree. Games Sonic is arguably the mildest variant so far. I think Lost World may just stand out because it was meant to be a story specifically demonstrating his flaws, which was kinda necessary development as of recently, and even then I thought he was far more likable than most other Western medias portray him on a regular basis.

[Silver*]

Eh, Sonic team is playing it safe by doing Sonic only. Which means shoving Sonic's friends to the side. Like in Sonic the Lost World, Knuckles and Amy didn't do a thing in that game. Knuckles didn't say anything, I kid you not. Amy only said two lines. I hate to ask but why the hell were they there? And I've asked that about many other games.

 

Sonic Adventure 2: Amy was practically useless in that game and they only used her to that they can show fans how useless she was, which was a insult to the character. But what redeamed her was that she was the one who helped Shadow realize Maria's wish.

 

Shadow the Hedgehog: I have no clue why they added Sonic's friends in that game or why the hell they even added Sonic. Sonic was nothing more than an annoying background character who the writers messed up on royally. If this was supposed to be Shadow's interpretation of Sonic, they did a good job but other than that, the guy was useless and as annoying as Chip in Sonic Unleashed. Everyone else was just... there. The only characters that actually helped by a tin was Team Chaotix.

 

Sonic Rush: They introduced a new character which is fine. We love new characters! The problem was that the main characters didn't do a thing. Amy and Knuckles were reduced to background characters who didn't do shit. Cream.... the problem with her role was that it's a role that Amy had in both Adventure games. So, shouldn't have have used Amy rather than... Cream? Tails is debatable. Sonic and Blaze were the only main characters in the game that mattered. Eggman and Eggman Nega also mattered.

 

Sonic the Hedgehog 2006: Uggh do not get me started on this game. New character is introduced! Which is fine and guess what?! He's my favorite character. But the problem is Knuckles didn't do shit. Why the hell is he there? Just do you can play as him? Tails didn't do shit either. Amy didn't do a thing but she did make Silver thing twice about killing Sonic. Even Team Dark was more important than the main characters. Rouge and Omega actually did something. Blaze... I love Silver/Blaze but this shit.... Blaze didn't do a goddamn thing in that game. She was nothing more than Silver's "Tails". In fact, Silver was the only character in the game who she's had a normal conversation with. She didn't say shit to Mephiles or anything to fucking Sonic! It's like... they didn't know the other was there! Worst of all, Sonic.... poor Sonic. Sonic didn't do a goddamn thing. He was shoved also in the background. All he did was rescue the princess and he only mattered DEAD. Shadow, Elise, Eggman, Mephiles and Silver were all who mattered and Omega and Rouge helped along.

 

Sonic Unleashed: Tails does something but Amy does nothing

 

Sonic Rush Adventure: Marine wasn't allowed to do anything awesome and was only there to be Charmy 2.0

 

Sonic Generations: Sonic didn't say anything to his friends when he saved them, not even a thank you... they were all useless.

 

Sonic Lost World: I'll repeat. Knuckles and Amy didn't do a thing in that game. Knuckles didn't say anything, I kid you not. Amy only said two lines. I hate to ask but why the hell were they there?

 

Sonic 4 Episode 2: Tails was a wisp

 

Sonic Colors: Tails was.... useless actually. Sonic could have figured it out himself.

[Diogenes]

Sonic Lost World: I'll repeat. Knuckles and Amy didn't do a thing in that game. Knuckles didn't say anything, I kid you not. Amy only said two lines. I hate to ask but why the hell were they there?

They were there to show what was going on back on Earth. It's not a big role but it's a valid one.

[Silver*]

They were there to show what was going on back on Earth. It's not a big role but it's a valid one.

That's true. I was saying that maybe they could help Sonic or at least try to feed him more information. Knuckles didn't say a thing. Even most fans of his had to ask "Why is he there?".

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

i understand. for me, theres alot more that Sonic can do in gameplay and I think they should work on that instead of bringing everyone else so early.

 

I have other favorites other than Sonic and i wanna play as them, but I want to see all the wonderul things they can do with Sonic.

[Krockhead]

Reaching the full potential of Sonic's gameplay leads right into bringing back other characters. All you have to do for multiple characters is make slight differences to Sonic's gameplay, and add multiple paths that can only be reached by certain characters in the level design. The wonderful things they can do with Sonic are also the wonderful things they can do with Tails and Knuckles. Basically, they just need to take the 3K formula and adjust it to the modern gameplay.

[E-122-Psi]

Reaching the full potential of Sonic's gameplay leads right into bringing back other characters. All you have to do for multiple characters is make slight differences to Sonic's gameplay, and add multiple paths that can only be reached by certain characters in the level design. The wonderful things they can do with Sonic are also the wonderful things they can do with Tails and Knuckles. Basically, they just need to take the 3K formula and adjust it to the modern gameplay.

I'm mixed about the SK formula because even then they seemed like they were leaning a bit too much into 'here's a new character and they're even more awesome than Sonic'.This was a recurring problem with how they dealt with new additions, they were trying too hard to top the previous one than just make them unique. Sonic actually felt like the boring 'dud' character in cases such as Sonic Advance and the Genesis series.

 

Also the problem was as much they were putting these characters into fan's faces and FORCING them to play as them due to how obviously cool they are. It was taken to ludicrous levels in Next Gen where you could rarely play a level as Sonic without switching to some other addition.

[Uraraka]

What's so bad about the series' current direction? A couple of things came to mind:

 

Sonic's Friends: I know this has been mentioned already, but I would like to give my take on it. I absolutely HATE the way Sonic's friends aside from Tails have been portrayed. Aside from running their mouths non-stop, they haven't done anything useful in who knows how long. And I find their roles of cheerleaders both pointless and annoying. What's worse is Sonic's extremely minimal to non-existent interaction with them. It just really rubs me the wrong way as such really doesn't show that they are his friends. All of Sonic's friends have charm and appeal as well as potential to the story, gameplay as well as the series, and it irritates me to no end to see that brushed to the side again and again.

 

 

Seriously, SEGA brought this massive entourage on board, so the least they should do is use them in at least a decent manner, even if they aren't playable.

 

The storytelling: The stories in recent Sonic games have gone from incomplete to nonexistent. I know that gameplay is the most important thing in a video game, but I am one of those that genuinely enjoys the stories; I think it is a nice "bonus" to the game to enjoy along with the gameplay. If a story is going to be told, it should be told correctly. I'm not saying the plot should be extravagant, deep long and drawn out, but it should have an actual plot, one that is substantial with a the basics: a beginning, a middle and an ending-with some balance with humor and seriousness among other things. This hasn't happened in a while in a Sonic game, only to have an incomplete story with plot holes, unanswered questions, and blown potential for character interaction among other offenses. I personally don't have many complaints regarding characterization, on a positive note. The last thing I want to do is be sitting there wondering what happened in regards to the story with a bunch of unanswered questions due to the story being incomplete and halfway told and feeling dissatisfied about it. 

 

Effort and Dedication: I really don't like the fact that I have shelled out $50 on a Sonic game, and after doing so I feel as if I didn't get my money's worth from each Sonic game. Especially with the games being so short on top of other issues like questionable controls and physics, but the games being so short irritate me more than anything. The short length of games shouldn't exist. There should be plenty to do in the games-things that are enjoyable at that and not just filler that irritates the player. The last Sonic game I feel I didn't get cheated out due to having so much to do and well as a ton of effort and dedication involved was Sonic Unleashed.  

 

I honestly don't feel that I should ever be sitting there thinking whether or not it was worth spending money to buy the game as well as feeling dissatisfied. Sonic Colors, Sonic Generations, and Sonic Lost World have all left me feeing dissatisfied after playing each game to varying degrees. Having dedication and complete genuine effort providing an exciting and excellent experience for the player should be standard. I think these things even needing to be mentioned as they aren't standard in Sonic game is ridiculous to be honest. Basically, I'm not feeling this sweet, short, and simple approach the Sonic games have taken as of late. The passion really seems to be lacking.

 

Those things aside, I don't think the direction of the series is that bad. When I think of the things that keep me involved with the series (the gameplay [issues aside, I still find it fun], level design, music, cutscenes, and Sonic's personality among other things), they outweigh the things that I'm fed up with regarding the series. I only hope that things improve from here and in turn will make the Sonic series much more enjoyable than it currently is.

     I totally agree with you about the stories. To add to it,  I noticed that with Sonic colors onwards, the stories don't flow as well, meaning, from game to game. In Sonic adventure, there were references to events from the original games, and Sonic adventure 2 included references to Sonic Adventure . It was a continuing story.  but ever since colors, we have had short stories that end at the end of the game. I feel like I am playing a Mario game.

  With Mario games, The stories only continue within a certain piece of the series. Mario Galaxy and Galaxy 2 are connected, for example, but they are not story wise connected to Luigi's mansion or Mario Paper. In fact, they contradict each other. In Mario Paper, you read in Luigi's diary that he wished he could be the one on the top bunk, but in Luigi's Mansion, Luigi says he would never even dream of sleeping on the top bunk. That is a contradiction, but I expect it in the Mario series. I do not expect this kind of non continuing story in a Sonic game.

   I think the stories would have more meaning and mean more to me cannon wise if there was some kind of connection other than the same voice actors, Characters and Items.

  When it comes to the Characters, I agree as well. I feel as though the stories and the personalities of Sonic's friends have toned down to merely stereotypes and gags. This is something else that happens regularly in Mario's games, however, this is acceptable, because Mario has always been that way. The Sonic games have not. The characters in Sonic games have a permanent true story, and personality that is so Identifiable, they can be seen as real people. You can actually more or less get to know them, as you would a character in a book.  I feel that the personalities and stories were dumped so Sonic can just exist...nothing more.

  But I think that with some minor tweaking, the new games can be better. I feel in general the games are going well, and that the industry can grow, if they just throw in the missing Sonic-y elements

[Gabz Girl]

I just want Sonic Team to improve on two things with the series' current direction...story and characters.

The guys do a great job with the script, honestly they do. But we need MORE substance! Since Sonic Colours onwards they have been weak and have no epic feel like SA, SA2 and to an extent Sonic Unleashed. WTF happened? It doesn't help that the games tend to be really short nowadays so we definitely need more of a story in the next big Sonic title. And fuck the Japanese script. From those pieces of script I just read it sounds like it has absolutely no character or charisma. Yes I know the English script can be a bit cheesy but bloody hell, would you rather have an energetic, fun script or a boring, no character whatsoever script? Do you want go back to the way Sonic 06 was script wise? Thought so...

My second problem is the characters and by this I mean supporting characters but this has been a big issue of mine since Sonic Generations. I don't like how my favourite character, Knuckles, has been sidelined by Our Lord Sonic and His Brother Tails in every single game since Sonic 06. I'm sick and tired of all the attention Sonic, Tails and Dr Eggman are getting! I know Amy and Knuckles appeared in SLW but it was only for a few minutes screen time, they hardly did anything and they were pointless to the entirety of the plot! Like seriously, why were they even there. What a fucking waste.

The fact of the matter is that I'm losing interest in Knuckles because he's hardly relevant to the games now. That's a really big problem IMO and I hope Sonic Team does something about it in the near future. But knowing them, I doubt it. Damn.

[Celestia]

Yeah, cycling through the cast would be the best way to go about it rather than shoving everyone into every game like they were for a while. Even Tails doesn't necessarily have to appear in every game (though perhaps at this point it'd be jarring if he didn't...). The series is fairly episodic after all, even when there's a running arc like Shadow's past or the "Death Egg saga". If they're going to reintroduce other playable characters, they'll have to have the same mentality of the writers for ensemble TV shows, creating stories that multiple characters can contribute to equally even if Sonic'll most likely be the one to ultimately save the day.

 

Thinking about it, I'm mostly content with the current direction. There's certainly things I'd like to see more of, such as each level having an actual purpose rather than "okay let's just run through here for a while". I guess the boost games justified it a bit, since in Unleashed/Colours you were going to each location to find that game's important thingamajig (Temples -> planet anchor things), and in Generations you had no choice but to restore time in each location to access the Time Eater. Lost World just has the gang travelling from place to place, presumably heading towards Lava Mountain, but based on the in-game map they could probably just go straight there from any of the other locations...

 

Though it's very experimental and, assuming they stick with it, will hopefully be improved in future games, I do really like the ideas Sonic Lost World had for the gameplay. I think the main thing I'm hoping for is that the next game has more of a Sonic feel--granted, I think people exaggerate how "Mario" SLW was, but the run button alone just feels off at times. If anything, holding the trigger to slow down would probably be better for Sonic, since you rarely have to (but when you do, it's nice to be able to!).

 

Oh, and one thing I really hope doesn't become a thing is how Ohtani did SLW's soundtrack alone. We need more variety in composers. B| I like Lost World's soundtrack a lot, but it was no Unleashed/Colours/Generations. Though I do like how much variety there was in the soundtrack itself.  Funny how that works. XP