Have The Adventure Games Lost Credit Due To Other Gameplay Styles?

[Badnik Mechanic]

lol u can argue with me all day about it not being kid based.

Why would anyone do that? Nobody has said it's not kid based... the question was why you felt the need to make it a derogative?

sonic colours? corny jokes that would appeal to a 7 year old and not to mention corny looking alien creatures.. sonic unleached also a game created to grab the attention of a 12 year old by adding a werewolf?

u can seriously tell me a 18-25 year old can sit down and enjoy the sight of sonic turning into a werewolf if hes supposed to be the fasted thing thing alive?

... ... no... I can't be bothered... it's just too obvious...

Random forum memeber: Oh go on, what was you going to say?

Well if you insist.

I was going to say that 18-25 years old is a 7 year demographic which is a rather large divide in itself... however by the very nature of adding an end date to the year spectrum you suggest that people pre 18 years old and over 25 (which I am along with many of the other people on the forum including the senior staff) do in fact enjoy it, or that nobody over the age of 25 plays Sonic games. Furthermore, theres also the suggestion that people ages 15-17 are kids... something which I suspect many of them would greatly dispute, either way, it's a daft statement to make regardless as to how you try and spin the statement.

But not to mention that when one plays as the werehog one is not playing as Sonic, so the argument about it being all speed speed speed which is what the fellow was originally complaining about not only does not apply as that gameplay is about exploring levels, now he's saying it's too kiddy and therefore he doesn't like it, even though the majority of the game play which is what he wants is in fact found in what he's now complaining about.

sonic knights?! talking swords? knight? wii?

yea you cant possibly tell me a mature human being can sit down and play any off those saying "hmm reminds me of conkers bad fur day"

Whilst I think the Wii is kinda crap, I am curious as to the need to include it as a reason for why Sonic games have, in your opinion, little going for them because it's on the Wii...

But the main query has to be... What exactly does any of this have to do with what was asked or what you were going on about a few moments ago?

You were moaning about it being all speed speed speed. Yet now you're going on about the werehog the wisps and jokes. Why did you not bother to address the claim that Sonic games are about speed, that the idea is that you learn the stage in a bid to beat it as fast as possible, that exploring levels and taking time isn't really the point of a Sonic game, bar the hub worlds?

IK we can say the older sonic games were kids based to but at least they were good.

This makes about as much sense as a tiny mouse standing in a ditch holding an umbrella.

i said nothing about sonic generations so where did you get that idea?

IK we can say the older sonic games were kids based to but at least they were good.

Now you can explain why you feel Generations isn't a kids game.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Hogfather

[JezMM]

lol u can argue with me all day about it not being kid based. sonic colours? corny jokes that would appeal to a 7 year old and not to mention corny looking alien creatures.. sonic unleached also a game created to grab the attention of a 12 year old by adding a werewolf? u can seriously tell me a 18-25 year old can sit down and enjoy the sight of sonic turning into a werewolf if hes supposed to be the fasted thing thing alive?

sonic knights?! talking swords? knight? wii?

Those gameplay ideas were done to combat the difficulty of making lots of long, intricate level designs, not to appeal to the kiddies.

yea you cant possibly tell me a mature human being can sit down and play any off those saying "hmm reminds me of conkers bad fur day"

...Why would you want them to?

You also seem to misunderstand the arguement here. People aren't saying Sonic isn't appealing to kids. They're saying there's nothing wrong with the idea of them appealing to kids.

[HeroMystic]

I'm getting the vague idea this is the one of the frat boys who makes playing any FPS game online a nightmare to your ears.

If you aren't, apologies. But you can at least try to make a decent arguement.

[wadadouchbag]

ur blowing it all out off purpostion all i said was the game is way to fast (in my opinion) and that i didnt like the fact u can't explore the stages. as for the werehog? thats like me telling you, eggman is the main character and he fly's in his miniship or whatever but he goes alot faster then sonic.... exactly i want to play as sonic not a werehog.

as for generations i havent took time to look at the game seeing how all the others before it made me sick to my stomach thats why it wasnt included in my opinion....im not a die hard sonic fan so please repect my opinions. as it doesnt make much differences to whether or not the games would change.

and i do understand what ur saying about nothing being wrong with the kid based...

its just t000 kid based as in the titles and series Sonic X(american version)

i also stated that the older sonic games could be classified as kid based to BUT at least they were good.(my opinion)

Edited January 3, 2012 by wadadouchbag

[Bolt The Cat]

ur blowing it all out off purpostion all i said was the game is way to fast (in my opinion) and that i didnt like the fact u can't explore the stages. as for the werehog? thats like me telling you, eggman is the main character and he fly's in his miniship or whatever but he goes alot faster then sonic.... exactly i want to play as sonic not a werehog.

as for generations i havent took time to look at the game seeing how all the others before it made me sick to my stomach thats why it wasnt included in my opinion....im not a die hard sonic fan so please repect my opinions. as it doesnt make much differences to whether or not the games would change.

and i do understand what ur saying about nothing being wrong with the kid based...

its just t000 kid based as in the titles and series Sonic X(american version)

i also stated that the older sonic games could be classified as kid based to BUT at least they were good.(my opinion)

Wow, you're being ignorant. Look, a lot of people, including myself, like the intense speed, it makes the game more exciting. You can't ignore Generations just because you don't like it. And you should at least give it a try before bashing me.

[Carbo]

Chill the shit out here guys. We don't want any hostility, least of all name-calling and backtalking.

Also, wadadouchbag, I suggest you improve your way of typing very quickly. Proper grammar is a key rule of these boards.

[wadadouchbag]

Wow, you're being ignorant. Look, a lot of people, including myself, like the intense speed, it makes the game more exciting. You can't ignore Generations just because you don't like it. And you should at least give it a try before bashing me.

Well are you ganna buy the 60$ game for me? i told you its my opinion and it shouldnt have any type of effect over you what so ever..

The point is the game is to expensive(for me at least) to buy it and hate it. id rather play sonic06.

[HeroMystic]

ur blowing it all out off purpostion all i said was the game is way to fast (in my opinion) and that i didnt like the fact u can't explore the stages.

This much is a valid opinion and no one is showing aggression towards this. Your overall point is you dislike the boost system, and you're definitely not alone on this opinion. Many dislike the boost system, although for different reasons. You'll need to explain on "stage exploration", because when this was a hot topic back in 2006, Sonic 06 showed us that "Open World exploration" is not worth having if the entire area has as much life as a slaughterhouse.

Also, It would be a lot better for your favor if you did not use kids as a negative term against Sonic, when in all irony, up until Sonic Colors, Sonic games have been trying to stray as far away as possible from that demographic. In fact, what Sonic games have been trying to appeal to is the very opposite. Adults.

Shadow the Hedgehog was meant to appeal to the American/FPS fanbase due to the rise of the FPS genre in Western gaming.

Sonic 06 was meant to appeal to fans who liked the Adventure series or were introduced to Sonic via the Adventure series.

Sonic Unleashed was meant to appeal to the critics who were tired of multiple Sonic characters. Werehog was introduced in an (admittedly stupid) attempt to bypass the need for another character.

Sonic Colors was meant to win back the fanbase.

Sonic the Hedgehog 4 and Sonic Generations is SEGA/Sonic Team jumping on the Retro Pandering bandwagon to win back Classic fans and Classic purists.

If you were saying Sonic games became too simplified that would be a different story, but what you have been arguing is ascetics and content which outright contradicts your original argument on not being able to explore. You want to explore what the game has to offer, yet you don't like it anyway. This is the main reason why you fail to make sense.

Add on the fact you're not even attempting to make an effort to have proper grammar and you're in to be flamed.

id rather play sonic06.

And now I realize this entire post doesn't mean anything because you're trolling.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Marco

[Bolt The Cat]

Well are you ganna buy the 60$ game for me? i told you its my opinion and it shouldnt have any type of effect over you what so ever..

The point is the game is to expensive(for me at least) to buy it and hate it. id rather play sonic06.

Then buy the game used or something. Better yet, rent it.

[wadadouchbag]

This much is a valid opinion and no one is showing aggression towards this. Your overall point is you dislike the boost system, and you're definitely not alone on this opinion. Many dislike the boost system, although for different reasons. You'll need to explain on "stage exploration", because when this was a hot topic back in 2006, Sonic 06 showed us that "Open World exploration" is not worth having if the entire area has as much life as a slaughterhouse.

Also, It would be a lot better for your favor if you did not use kids as a negative term against Sonic, when in all irony, up until Sonic Colors, Sonic games have been trying to stray as far away as possible from that demographic. In fact, what Sonic games have been trying to appeal to is the very opposite. Adults.

Shadow the Hedgehog was meant to appeal to the American/FPS fanbase due to the rise of the FPS genre in Western gaming.

Sonic 06 was meant to appeal to fans who liked the Adventure series or were introduced to Sonic via the Adventure series.

Sonic Unleashed was meant to appeal to the critics who were tired of multiple Sonic characters. Werehog was introduced in an (admittedly stupid) attempt to bypass the need for another character.

Sonic Colors was meant to win back the fanbase.

Sonic the Hedgehog 4 and Sonic Generations is SEGA/Sonic Team jumping on the Retro Pandering bandwagon to win back Classic fans and Classic purists.

If you were saying Sonic games became too simplified that would be a different story, but what you have been arguing is ascetics and content which outright contradicts your original argument on not being able to explore. You want to explore what the game has to offer, yet you don't like it anyway. This is the main reason why you fail to make sense.

Add on the fact you're not even attempting to make an effort to have proper grammar and you're in to be flamed.

And now I realize this entire post doesn't mean anything because you're trolling.

Your obviously a Sonic die hard fan and most likely spends hours on end writting well organized paragraphs to make people like me seem ignorant.

All ive stated was i have a few issues with the newer games and im being blased(silent raged) by the sonic knowitalls like urself.

Ik my grammer is messy but that doesnt give you an excuse to (flame me without flame me) over games.

Edited January 3, 2012 by wadadouchbag

[HeroMystic]

Your obviously a Sonic die hard fan

Actually I'm not. My favorite series is Metroid.

EDIT: Also, that post took 10 minutes to write.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Marco

[Naruzen]

I'm with wadadouchebag. People getting mad cause he said one thing negative about Sonic Glitcherations.

[wadadouchbag]

thank you naruzen, Its nice to see people who have different opinions so we can work together to make a perfect sonic game..

[Soniman]

I'm with wadadouchebag. People getting mad cause he said one thing negative about Sonic Glitcherations.

People are getting mad because hes not making any sense and being somewhat irritating.

[wadadouchbag]

People are getting mad because hes not making any sense and being somewhat irritating.

I agree looking back it doesnt make a whole lot of sense but you can understand what im trying to point out.

Im not to experienced with the (miniquote and quote) so it makes it hard to see who iam typing to, seeing how i created this account yesterday it would be considered a miner issue.

but saying I dont make sense at all is just wrong seeing how you took the time to reply to Naruzen's comment in hopes he will agree with the majority...

[King Frosty]

I thought the complaining of the Genre Roulette was why everybody complained over Sonic Adventure 1 and 2. But besides that, I don't think they've lost too much credit.

[Chaos Warp]

Actually, I feel that Adventure gameplay has TWO things on Modern gameplay.

-It's easier to explore because he moves slower. Even if you made the Modern controls perfect, it would still not be as good (while still great) for exploring as the Adventure gameplay, just because he's slower.

-Sonic felt he was built for platforming. While platforming still works very well in the Modern gameplay, Sonic feels like he's more oriented towards speed. Even if they made the controls perfect, he'd still feel built for speed to an extent. Adventure has none of this.

So I feel a ideal mix of Adventure and Modern could remove most of the flaws with both. Take Adventure Sonic, give him the ability to reach twice his normal speed, with reasonable acceleration and a turning arc (albeit a tight one) at high speeds. Give him a spindash, and a Advance-style boost mode, with blur effects to empathize the speed. Add some slopes into the level design to use rolling and spindash, and to add a little of Classic into this too. The one flaw would be the speed would not be as high, but it would remove most of the other ones. I feel this would be (one of the possibilities for) the Ideal Sonic gameplay.

That being said, I would be equally fine if they continued to improve and expand upon the great Modern gameplay they have, which is most likely what they will do.

[Bolt The Cat]

Actually, I feel that Adventure gameplay has TWO things on Modern gameplay.

-It's easier to explore because he moves slower. Even if you made the Modern controls perfect, it would still not be as good (while still great) for exploring as the Adventure gameplay, just because he's slower.

-Sonic felt he was built for platforming. While platforming still works very well in the Modern gameplay, Sonic feels like he's more oriented towards speed. Even if they made the controls perfect, he'd still feel built for speed to an extent. Adventure has none of this.

So I feel a ideal mix of Adventure and Modern could remove most of the flaws with both. Take Adventure Sonic, give him the ability to reach twice his normal speed, with reasonable acceleration and a turning arc (albeit a tight one) at high speeds. Give him a spindash, and a Advance-style boost mode, with blur effects to empathize the speed. Add some slopes into the level design to use rolling and spindash, and to add a little of Classic into this too. The one flaw would be the speed would not be as high, but it would remove most of the other ones. I feel this would be (one of the possibilities for) the Ideal Sonic gameplay.

[Sean]

Enough. If you didn't see Carbo's warning on the top of this page then fucking read it right now. This is your guys' last warning, one more landmine and this topic is getting the boot and offenders will be dealt with accordingly.

[Kuzu]

....So yeah, as much as I love the modern gameplay, I have to say Adventure has the better controls, hands down. Sonic shouldn't feel so damn slippery when I move him around and in the Adventure games, he controls perfectly and my only complaint would have to be how he controls at higher speeds.

[Bolt The Cat]

One thing I didn't really like about the Sonic gameplay in the Adventure games was the level design. People complain about the Modern gameplay being too linear and not having enough platforming, but the Adventure level design was even worse. If you look at them closely, there's really not that many alternate paths or platforming. I mean, look at Metal Harbor. The majority of the level is either linear pathways, HA chains, or Light Dash chains. The gameplay may be better designed for momentum platforming, but it was poorly utitlized for that purpose.

[Solkia]

One thing I didn't really like about the Sonic gameplay in the Adventure games was the level design. People complain about the Modern gameplay being too linear and not having enough platforming, but the Adventure level design was even worse. If you look at them closely, there's really not that many alternate paths or platforming. I mean, look at Metal Harbor. The majority of the level is either linear pathways, HA chains, or Light Dash chains. The gameplay may be better designed for momentum platforming, but it was poorly utitlized for that purpose.

Seriously, this is what pisses me off about the linearity argument. The 3D games have Always been linear and people are just NOW complaining about it?

[Kuzu]

One thing I didn't really like about the Sonic gameplay in the Adventure games was the level design. People complain about the Modern gameplay being too linear and not having enough platforming, but the Adventure level design was even worse. If you look at them closely, there's really not that many alternate paths or platforming. I mean, look at Metal Harbor. The majority of the level is either linear pathways, HA chains, or Light Dash chains. The gameplay may be better designed for momentum platforming, but it was poorly utitlized for that purpose.

Because making 3D environments takes up a lot of memory, and having a massive level with different paths would take up a shit load of memory, even more than most systems have.

[Bolt The Cat]

Because making 3D environments takes up a lot of memory, and having a massive level with different paths would take up a shit load of memory, even more than most systems have.

The point still stands that the level design in the Modern games is better, even if only marginally.

[Kuzu]

The point still stands that the level design in the Modern games is better, even if only marginally.

They're both flawed to be honest and I would largely prefer something different. And this is coming from a guy who loves Generations.