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  • Takashi Iizuka on Sonic Team's Expansion and Shadow's Evolving Motivations - TSS Interview

    Sonic Team leader talks 2D Shadow stages, Maria, Doom Powers and more!

    It's going to be a big year for Shadow the Hedgehog. The fearless anti-hero is at the forefront of this year's Sonic brand marketing campaign, he's about to make his big-screen debut, and he's leading the pack in an upcoming re-release of Sonic Generations with a new and exciting 'Shadow Generations' campaign mode.

    This weekend, the spotlight was firmly on Sonic X Shadow Generations, and the response from fans across this community has been extremely positive. From what we've experienced so far at Summer Game Fest Play Days, we can definitely say there's a lot to get hyped about. But our impressions will come later.

    Because we were very lucky to be able to sit down with Sonic Team head Takashi Iizuka, aka the 'father' of Shadow the Hedgehog, to talk about the return of the Ultimate Lifeform and the overall scope for Sonic X Shadow Generations. We also offered some questions from the community, which Iizuka-san was very gracious in answering for us.

    Read on for our full interview, where Iizuka-san reveals the existence of 2D Shadow stages, discusses the approach to Sonic X Shadow Generations' level design, reflects on Shadow's motivations as a character, and speaks about the interesting choice to use 'Terios' as a bonus in the game...

    Sonic x Shadow Generations Art-resized.jpeg

    TSS: Hello, everyone! I am Nuckles87 of Sonic Stadium, and with me today is the head of Sonic Team, Takashi Iizuka. Hello, Mr. Iizuka, it’s been a while.

    Takashi Iizuka: Hello, yeah. Nice to meet you.

    TSS: So you’ve got a new game coming out of course, Sonic X Shadow Generations, and our questions are mostly about this, but we’ve also got some others including some from the community. So let’s get started. One of my big questions for this is, when did this game first enter development?

    Iizuka (via interpreter - Austin Keys): So I’m sure as everyone knows, [Sonic] Movie 2 ended with a wonderful reveal of Shadow, and we knew moving into [Sonic] Movie 3, Shadow was gonna have a nice spotlight for the movie. So we also wanted to make sure we had a game that would be out that would also spotlight Shadow as a character

    Iizuka (in English): 2022.

    TSS: So [this game] was in development around the same time as Sonic Frontiers then?

    Iizuka (in English): Yes.

    TSS: How does Sonic Team manage the workload between that project and this one?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So the Sonic Team has expanded greatly over the past years, and it’s now large enough that they can handle multiple projects all at the same time. So even though we do have a big team working on Sonic Frontiers at that time, there are enough people that they can also start working on Sonic X Shadow Generations, while also having another team work on Sonic Superstars.

    SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS (1).jpeg

    TSS: So, this question is from @superguy551: How have you approached designing Shadow’s levels, and how does that differ from modern Sonic’s level design?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So Shadow, as you know, has the ability to stop time with Chaos Control, and so one of the ways [we] wanted to differentiate the Shadow gameplay was to use Chaos Control and be able to have the players stop time and find different ways of doing the platform action in that level. So a lot of the level design does have Chaos Control incorporated in it as part of the fun.

    But [we] didn’t want to stop just there. [We] also added in brand new actions for Shadow in the form of Doom Powers, and these Doom Powers are going to allow Shadow to do lots of different actions in the game. And when [we] were making the levels and designing everything, [we] made sure, not only could the players use the Doom Powers in various ways, but also Chaos Control. And all of that would differentiate the Shadow gameplay from the Sonic gameplay.

    TSS: Now this next question is from Svend Joscelyne (or Dreadknux, my boss): Are the stages and White Space in the Shadow side using an adapted version of the Frontiers engine, or is it running on the same engine as the original Sonic Generations?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): Even with White Space involved, when we talk about the 'Sonic Generations' portion of Sonic X Shadow Generations, that was all originally created with an older version of the Hedgehog Engine. And so for this game, [we] kept that older version but, kind of, made some improvements - but kept it in that older version. For the 'Shadow Generations' portion, that was used with a version of the Hedgehog Engine that was many versions more advanced. So both versions of the Hedgehog Engine are powering this game, but it’s using different versions of the Hedgehog Engine.

    TSS: Can you tell us how many hours the main campaign will take, and how long to 100%?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): We can’t talk yet about all of the content.

    SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS (9).jpeg

    TSS: Alright. So, I noticed that Act 1 is playable out there. That presumably means there’s multiple acts; is there any kind of gameplay difference between the different acts of a level?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): 'Shadow Generations' is a different game from 'Sonic Generations', like both do exist on the game in one package, but because they’re both Generations games, we wanted to have a similar format. So just like how Sonic Generations has a 3D level that you get to play with the high-speed action, there’s also the side-scrolling gameplay for Sonic Generations... and for Shadow, [we] wanted to make sure [it] had 3D gameplay as well as 2D gameplay.

    TSS: What can you tell us about Shadow’s motivations as a character? Like, why does he fight to protect the world?

    Iizuka (in English): In this game?

    TSS: In general.

    Iizuka (via interpreter): As I’m sure you guys know, Shadow was created and was being used to get the retribution that Professor Gerald had on the world; he was going to destroy the world, but then remembered that Maria really loved the world, and so instead of destroying it, he actually saved the world. And ever since that, what he wanted to do is, for the memory of Maria, Maria loved the planet as it was, so it’s not really like he wanted to save individual people on the planet. He wanted to preserve the entire planet, because that’s what Maria loved, and he wanted to really preserve that.

    TSS: Moving away from Shadow for a minute... What can you tell us about Sonic’s current mobile strategy, particularly the focus on exclusives for subscription services?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): As I’m sure you know, we have Sonic Dash as well as Sonic Forces Speed Battle, both out for mobile, and they’re these really long selling, long running games. I think Sonic Forces Speed Battle has just topped 300,000,000 downloads, and so it’s one of these really great titles that gets a lot of people to come in and experience it and have fun with the characters. And in addition to those very mobile games, we also have the Apple Arcade Dream Team that released on Apple Arcade as a way to provide more games outside of the [console] consumer, providing games that will reach a different target audience outside of just the usual console games that we release. And hopefully we can continue doing this in the future.

    SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS (14).jpeg

    TSS: The community has expressed a lot of interest in seeing mobile titles like Sonic Dream Team and Sonic Rumble on PC and consoles. Is there any chance of seeing these releases launch outside of mobile?

    Iizuka (in English): Outside of mobile for Sonic Dream Team and Rumble…

    Iizuka (via interpreter): Sonic Dream Team is an Apple Arcade exclusive title, so that’s going to be the only place it will be offered. But for Sonic Rumble, we do know it’s releasing on mobile, and we’ll kind of see as it releases, as people pick up on the fun, it may start going to other places outside of it.

    TSS: I’m a big fan of NiGHTS into dreams and Journey of Dreams, and with SEGA doing so many revivals lately, is there potential for a new NiGHTS game or port in the cards?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): I would really like to do a brand new NiGHTS or remaster, I would like to see that content come out, but right now I’m in charge and the leader of all the Sonic branded content coming out, so I can’t really take the resources or development resources from Sonic and use it for something that’s not Sonic.

    TSS: Alright, now this can be a yes or no... do you have any ideas for a new NiGHTS game?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): [laughs] ... I have an image of what I would like it to be, yes.

    TSS: So this question is from Acquainted Guy: Any chance of other Sonic characters getting a focus in spin-off media or games?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So before, we didn’t really have lots of resources to bring to the audience, but things have kind of changed now, and we have a lot of different media resources that we can use to bring content to people. The Knuckles TV show on Paramount+ is one of those ways that we can spotlight a character and spend the time to really bring something new to the audience. Even our short-form animation that we released for the Chao is a way that we can deliver fun character moments to people in a way that’s outside of just the limited game resources that we have. And moving forward, hopefully we’ll have more media opportunities to bring more characters to the forefront for everyone to really enjoy.

    SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS (11).jpeg

    TSS: Now this question’s from Dustin Phillips: What are the chances of IDW characters like Tangle and Surge appearing in the games?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): I do work closely with the team at IDW when they’re making their new characters, and really making sure we’re having lots of fun in making really good characters. And I know in the mobile games we have released or will release the IDW characters. So as far as the potential future of IDW characters appearing in games, hopefully there’s a good chance.

    TSS: So one new announced feature for Sonic X Shadow Generations is character skins, such as the Sonic Adventure Legacy Skin and Terios. Terios in particular is a very deep cut, what made you consider this?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So it’s really Sonic Superstars that was the catalyst for this idea coming out with the Rabbit skin that Oshima-san wanted to see playable inside of Sonic Superstars. When he put it in there, he really liked that; when we released it, the fans also really liked that. And so when we were thinking about the Digital Deluxe Edition, what kind of content we should put in there, the whole idea of “Ooh, what if we put Terios in there,” as in, “we” being [myself] and the team, [when we] created Sonic Adventure 2, [we] were always calling the character “Terios.” [We] were very familiar with the character, so putting him in the game as “Terios” was a great idea that came from Sonic Superstars.

    TSS: How are skins implemented in Sonic X Shadow Generations? Are they purely promotional, or will there be additional skins that players can unlock in the game itself?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So the Sonic Adventure skin is something that if you’re pre-ordering the game, you will get that skin, and the Terios skin is for anyone who buys the Digital Deluxe Edition, they will also get that skin. And once you have that skin, you just go to the menu and select that you want to play as that character.

    SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS (2).jpeg

    TSS: Will we see the return of prior bonus features like the figurine gallery or the Sonic 1 Mega Drive game?

    Iizuka (in English): In Sonic Generations?

    TSS: Yeah.

    Iizuka (via interpreter): So Sonic 1 has been removed from Sonic Generations portion of the game, but the Casino Night game has been included so everyone will get it.

    TSS: Now final question, this is from Arsene: How did the Eggmans escape White Space at the end of Sonic Generations?

    Iizuka (in English): [laughs] Good question!

    Iizuka (via interpreter): Great question. The writer for the 'Shadow Generations' content is the same writer from Sonic Frontiers. I’m sure you know him, Ian Flynn. He did the writing for Shadow Generations and the new storyline. He asked the exact same question of [me]! Like, 'how did they get out?' Because he wanted to write in some more story, [wanted] to tell the story, but we couldn’t get into changing it. Sonic Generations ends with that ending, and so we want to leave it up to everyone’s imagination and guess how Eggman—the Eggmans—got out of White Space.

    TSS: Thank you for your time sir, and thank you, and we appreciate everything!


    Many thanks to Iizuka-san for his time, as well as Austin Keys for interpreting - and our sincere thanks and appreciation to SEGA PR for kindly arranging the interview. Sonic X Shadow Generations will be releasing on PS5, PS4, Xbox, Nintendo Switch and PC on October 25.


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    Sucks that Dream Team is stuck on Apple Arcade. That description of Shadow's mission statement is... not ideal but I guess makes sense. Digital Deluxe Editions are awful and I hate that Terios isn't on the physical version - I don't care if I can buy him separately later it doesn't really make it better.

    Any word on when the audio version will be available? Curious about getting the uncut interview.

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    It seems they are going more for the Lion King idea (original animated version) of moving on from your past with Shadow instead of what some fans expected, (not caring about Maria or Gerald at all) which tracks better with Sonic Battle and even 06. (Really Shadow the GUN agent is a path for him I wish they kept, it works so well)

    Its a shame that it seems Iizuka won't let Ian explain how both versions of Ivo got back and that he seemingly against fleshing out the Sonic portion more in general.

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    Iko

    Posted (edited)

    Isn't Sonic coloring the White Space by running really fast? Running fast somehow restarts the flow of time and allows to escape the White Space, so, the two Eggmen just did this.

    ef5d3fe4a5db15c2bf61b69bc681d4a3.gif

    Edited by Iko
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    Knowing that Ian Flynn even asked Iizuka-san about the Eggmen in White Space was really funny. 🤣 

    I'm interested in the tidbit about 2D Acts in Shadow Generations. I'm assuming there won't be a 'Classic Shadow' involved, lol :goof: But I wonder how those will play out, and whether they will do what they did with OG Gens and translate some of the 3D Shadow game set-pieces into 2D (ala the GUN Truck in City Escape)

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    1 minute ago, Dreadknux said:

    Knowing that Ian Flynn even asked Iizuka-san about the Eggmen in White Space was really funny. 🤣 

    I'm interested in the tidbit about 2D Acts in Shadow Generations. I'm assuming there won't be a 'Classic Shadow' involved, lol :goof: But I wonder how those will play out, and whether they will do what they did with OG Gens and translate some of the 3D Shadow game set-pieces into 2D (ala the GUN Truck in City Escape)

    For those who seen my “Shadow in Metallic Madness” Status Update, let’s all pray we actually get this.

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    jungle_penguins

    Posted

    I could've sworn Shadow was about fighting stronger opponents or something. Anyone have the run down on that? Did that change?

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    I'm very confused by the sudden absence of the Freedom Fighters question that stirred up so much Twitter traffic and discussion before the full interview released, it just seems odd that it completely vanished overnight. Was there a stated reason that I missed?

    What's going on with that?
    Screenshot2024-06-11191655.png.f1f41d82c1c99e3124eac1bfeccd461b.png

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    7 minutes ago, NoneTheRicher said:

    I'm very confused by the sudden absence of the Freedom Fighters question that stirred up so much Twitter traffic and discussion before the full interview released, it just seems odd that it completely vanished overnight. Was there a stated reason that I missed?

    What's going on with that?
    Screenshot2024-06-11191655.png.f1f41d82c1c99e3124eac1bfeccd461b.png

    There's nothing really to talk about here. Our interviewer attempted to ask a question, and it was shot down. It happens sometimes. We made a mistake broadcasting that fact publicly, and I apologise on behalf of the site for that, because it made it seem like there was more drama there than there really was. But the short answer is, no there's nothing going on.

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    9 hours ago, Dreadknux said:

    Knowing that Ian Flynn even asked Iizuka-san about the Eggmen in White Space was really funny. 🤣 

    I'm interested in the tidbit about 2D Acts in Shadow Generations. I'm assuming there won't be a 'Classic Shadow' involved, lol :goof: But I wonder how those will play out, and whether they will do what they did with OG Gens and translate some of the 3D Shadow game set-pieces into 2D (ala the GUN Truck in City Escape)

    Sorry, I can't get over the mental image of Flynn earnestly asking for the explanation for how the Eggmen escape, the the devs going like uhhhhh???

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    14 hours ago, GentlemanX said:

    Sucks that Dream Team is stuck on Apple Arcade. That description of Shadow's mission statement is... not ideal but I guess makes sense. Digital Deluxe Editions are awful and I hate that Terios isn't on the physical version - I don't care if I can buy him separately later it doesn't really make it better.

    Any word on when the audio version will be available? Curious about getting the uncut interview.

    Shadow's mission statement? Can you clarify?

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    Red Hot Jack

    Posted (edited)

    I am kinda glad they at least remember the original Shadow motivations in 2024, that is part of the character, but I really want to see Shadow move on from the past while acknowledging it, and I'm ready to see what his "moving on" means.

    The GUN agent role was so cool, I hope they mention it at least, with the human elements involved here unlike Forces and IDW, but I'm not holding my breath... if they want to cut that, have him do something else that is new.

    Also, really excited by the IDW in the games answer, good chance, and it hints that they will be in upcoming mobile games, maybe?

    Edited by Red Hot Jack
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    20 hours ago, nuckles87 said:

    TSS: Now this next question is from Svend Joscelyne (or Dreadknux, my boss): Are the stages and White Space in the Shadow side using an adapted version of the Frontiers engine, or is it running on the same engine as the original Sonic Generations?

    Iizuka (via interpreter): Even with White Space involved, when we talk about the 'Sonic Generations' portion of Sonic X Shadow Generations, that was all originally created with an older version of the Hedgehog Engine. And so for this game, [we] kept that older version but, kind of, made some improvements - but kept it in that older version. For the 'Shadow Generations' portion, that was used with a version of the Hedgehog Engine that was many versions more advanced. So both versions of the Hedgehog Engine are powering this game, but it’s using different versions of the Hedgehog Engine.

    So if I'm reading this correctly, if the original part if the game is still using the old engine, would the mods from the original game be compatible with Sonic X Shadow generations?

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    21 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    Its a shame that it seems Iizuka won't let Ian explain how both versions of Ivo got back and that he seemingly against fleshing out the Sonic portion more in general.

    Very much disagree with this. It doesn't actually matter how they escaped, all that matters is that they did. By bogging down the already extensive and contradictory lore of this franchise with details that hopefully will never even get mentioned again (I do not think the Time Eater and White Space should become recurring elements of the series) it only serves to further complicate things without any real benefit.

    Besides, nearly any official answer they could come up with will be a let down compared to the infinite possibilities you can imagine. Better to just let fans dream for themselves what might have happened.

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    1 hour ago, Metal said:

    Very much disagree with this. It doesn't actually matter how they escaped, all that matters is that they did. By bogging down the already extensive and contradictory lore of this franchise with details that hopefully will never even get mentioned again (I do not think the Time Eater and White Space should become recurring elements of the series) it only serves to further complicate things without any real benefit.

    Besides, nearly any official answer they could come up with will be a let down compared to the infinite possibilities you can imagine. Better to just let fans dream for themselves what might have happened.

    Yeah we aren't going to eye to eye because I disagree with practically everything you said here. I do not find the lore contradictory and I outright welcome the return to how things were handled before the Meta Era. The Sonic franchise's focus on it's lore and characters is one of the things that sets Sonic apart and makes him better than Mario IMO.

    As for the Time Eater and White Space becoming recurring elements, no one said that? At best someone else in another topic suggested that Ian may canonize his theory about Mephiles but that doesn't mean the Time Eater will return in a future game.

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    1 hour ago, The Swordsman said:

    I do not find the lore contradictory

    Where/when are Blaze, Eggman Nega, and Classic Sonic from? When does Sonic Chronicles take place? Is Spinball canon, and if so, is SatAM? What about Mean Bean Machine and AoStH? Where did the Super Emeralds go, and why did the number of regular Chaos Emeralds change so much in the games before Sonic Adventure? How did they un-explode the moon? Etc. Sonic is fun, but don't pretend that it's consistent.

    2 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    As for the Time Eater and White Space becoming recurring elements, no one said that?

    Yeah but, what difference does it make how Eggman escaped if they don't show up again? Whatever the answer may be, if Eggman doesn't need to escape White Space and/or the Time Eater then he will not have an opportunity to use this method in the future.

    Like, let's say that using the wreckage of the mechanical components enslaving the Time Eater, Eggman was able to create a tachyon cascade emitter that destabilized White Space and spat him back out where he entered. Or some equally sci-fi jargon-y answer. That's a fun fact I guess, but if he's never trapped in White Space again then it won't come up again. It's something you could ask on a trivia show, but absolutely pointless to the story of Generations and the franchise as a whole. So why bother when you could just let fans come up with their own ideas?

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    GX -The Spindash-

    Posted

    Let me phrase this in a different way:

    Sonic Generations has the tone of a goofy cartoon, and it has a goofy cartoon ending where its goofy cartoon villains getting stuck is the closing joke. Then in 2013, Sonic and Eggman are at it again in their wacky Lost World hijinx.

    It's wasn't written with the intent to have meaningful, long-lasting consequences. When you write a non-serialized cartoon, as Sonic in that decade leaned towards, you generally don't build it around laying out how one episode ends and the other begins. And even if they did, it's probably not going to be an especially interesting answer, because the actual narrative goal is "We needed enough of a reset to just be able to make whatever our next game is happen."

    It might not be a satisfying answer if you firmly believe the series needs to have a structured and document-able continuity of events, but not all answers are satisfying, and Sonic as a series has rarely proven itself very interested in giving us that.

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    jungle_penguins

    Posted

    Really it's a miracle Generations even directly ties in to Colors' ending in the first place. 

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    GX -The Spindash-

    Posted

    47 minutes ago, jungle_penguins said:

    Really it's a miracle Generations even directly ties in to Colors' ending in the first place. 

    And even then, it's only really that Sonic Team-Rocket'd him into space, and then they decided that there was a portal in space.

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    Starry Skydancer

    Posted (edited)

    I honestly thought Shadow moved from Maria's wish being his only motivating factor in saving the world, so I'm a little disappointed to hear Iizuka say that Shadow's only real motivation is still doing what Maria told him to.

    Edited by Starry Skydancer
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    22 hours ago, Metal said:

    Where/when are Blaze, Eggman Nega, and Classic Sonic from? When does Sonic Chronicles take place? Is Spinball canon, and if so, is SatAM? What about Mean Bean Machine and AoStH? Where did the Super Emeralds go, and why did the number of regular Chaos Emeralds change so much in the games before Sonic Adventure? How did they un-explode the moon? Etc. Sonic is fun, but don't pretend that it's consistent.

    Blaze: Alternate dimension

    Eggman Nega: Future

    Classic Sonic: Past (Seriously how is the continuity error ridden mess that is Forces still given more credibility over the multiple statements and Tailstube episodes, given it that doesn't even mesh how every other game does time travel?)

    Spinball canon? Yes. SatAM no. Those were just neat cameos for the minigame real pinball stages in the game. (You even see Sonic's reflection playing)

    Mean Bean Machine and AoSth canon?: No best you're getting is the Mania reference.

    Super Emeralds: This is a issue? They're are just the empowered Chaos Emeralds, they transformed back and drifted off like normal. (hence the term super) As for Sonic Mania, "According to Christian Whitehead, these are stone relics which were created in the absence of the Super Emeralds, as the Chaos Emeralds had drifted off into the Special Stage." -Sonic Wiki Zone.

    Moon: Though its a very unsatisfying answer I'll admit. the moon is just turned to show it's undamaged side. Frankly they should've just copied Sonic X but I digress.

    Now I purposely saved this one for last because it is the only one that you have a point on. While the extra emerald from Fighters has been attributed to Eggman copying your selected fighter with then Ian trying to extrapolate that to also suggest  Ivo has used fake emeralds for other stuff like the Pinball Fortress and they'll coyly reference it why strictly saying there was only 7 Chaos Emeralds and 1 Master Emerald, SEGA and the lore team has been very reluctant to actually address the issue. Which something disappointing about the Fang mini series.

    While some of these like Classic were the result of the current lore team fixing the mess the Meta Era made of the continuity, others like Blaze and Eggman Nega were settled years ago. I do not ignore what happens with lore, I simply acknowledge the work taken to repair it.

    On 6/12/2024 at 3:03 PM, Metal said:

    eah but, what difference does it make how Eggman escaped if they don't show up again? Whatever the answer may be, if Eggman doesn't need to escape White Space and/or the Time Eater then he will not have an opportunity to use this method in the future.

    Like, let's say that using the wreckage of the mechanical components enslaving the Time Eater, Eggman was able to create a tachyon cascade emitter that destabilized White Space and spat him back out where he entered. Or some equally sci-fi jargon-y answer. That's a fun fact I guess, but if he's never trapped in White Space again then it won't come up again. It's something you could ask on a trivia show, but absolutely pointless to the story of Generations and the franchise as a whole. So why bother when you could just let fans come up with their own ideas?

    Because by all accounts the bad doctor should've been doomed, it's a cop out. What wreckage? Seriously what wreckage? There is nothing but a blank white void and the two Eggmen. We are given literally nothing to actually speculate with. This type of thing is why there is very little videos from the Zelda lore community on Tears of Kingdom compared to Breath of Wild. A mystery is only interesting if it is solvable and the method, considering it works on White Space, could work on a similar situation that isn't strictly White Space.

    23 hours ago, GX -The Spindash- said:

    Let me phrase this in a different way:

    Sonic Generations has the tone of a goofy cartoon, and it has a goofy cartoon ending where its goofy cartoon villains getting stuck is the closing joke. Then in 2013, Sonic and Eggman are at it again in their wacky Lost World hijinx.

    It's wasn't written with the intent to have meaningful, long-lasting consequences. When you write a non-serialized cartoon, as Sonic in that decade leaned towards, you generally don't build it around laying out how one episode ends and the other begins. And even if they did, it's probably not going to be an especially interesting answer, because the actual narrative goal is "We needed enough of a reset to just be able to make whatever our next game is happen."

    It might not be a satisfying answer if you firmly believe the series needs to have a structured and document-able continuity of events, but not all answers are satisfying, and Sonic as a series has rarely proven itself very interested in giving us that.

    You are correct, this is indeed the original intent, it was made during the Meta Era where they were chasing Mario and his way of doing things after all. Its just that I had hoped that the Sonic portion would also see the fruits of what seems to be a revival of the continuity that the Meta Era wanted to move away from.

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    GX -The Spindash-

    Posted

    38 minutes ago, The Swordsman said:

    You are correct, this is indeed the original intent, it was made during the Meta Era where they were chasing Mario and his way of doing things after all. Its just that I had hoped that the Sonic portion would also see the fruits of what seems to be a revival of the continuity that the Meta Era wanted to move away from.

    It is an enhanced port of Sonic Generations. It's not a retcon of the Sonic side of the story into something else it isn't.

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    I’m not especially bothered by the lack of story in Generations. It was always intended as a greatest hits album of levels that were chosen based on popularity without any in-universe cohesion. Like, he’s in Crisis City because it’s the most well-known location in Sonic 06. That being impossible continuity-wise doesn’t matter for this game

    While I do really like Flynn’s writing, sometimes I do think he tries to over-explain things that are simple by design and it sometimes gets close to Disney+ Star Wars territory lol. I’m excited to see what he has in store for Shadow Generations, but I think it’s for the best that the original is untouched

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    18 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    Blaze: Alternate dimension

    That's not what 06 says.

    18 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    Eggman Nega: Future

    That's not what Rush says.

    18 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    Classic Sonic: Past 

    That's not what Forces says.

    And you didn't even address Sonic Chronicles. This is what I meant when I said the lore was contradictory. If multiple sources say different things that cannot both be true, that is the definition of contradictory. And that's the case whether or not they try to fix that mistake later, usually outside the games themselves so only super fans like posters here would even know they did.

    18 hours ago, The Swordsman said:

    What wreckage? Seriously what wreckage?

    Much like your moon answer, it's unsatisfying, but it was just offscreen. They just needed to walk a little further to find it. Like that's the level of explanation you're probably gonna get from an official source if you ever push hard enough to actually force them to come up with something.

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    1 hour ago, Metal said:

    That's not what Forces says.

    And you didn't even address Sonic Chronicles. This is what I meant when I said the lore was contradictory. If multiple sources say different things that cannot both be true, that is the definition of contradictory. And that's the case whether or not they try to fix that mistake later, usually outside the games themselves so only super fans like posters here would even know they did.

    Like it or not retcons exist.

    I apologize on Sonic Chronicles, to be honest I missed it while looking up the information. That game is straight up non canon, so it doesn't take place anywhere. (I assume it was thrown out due to Ken Penders, though I could be wrong due to them never trying to get that sequel from Bioware)  You don't need to be a super fan in able to watch Tailstube or in able see the wiki.

    1 hour ago, Metal said:

    Like that's the level of explanation you're probably gonna get from an official source if you ever push hard enough to actually force them to come up with something.

    The thing is and what started this argument, is I wanted Ian to do so like he apparently wanted to but was denied from doing, not Takashi Iizuka.

    19 hours ago, GX -The Spindash- said:

    It is an enhanced port of Sonic Generations. It's not a retcon of the Sonic side of the story into something else it isn't.

    That has a whole segment dedicated to Shadow that is bound to impact the story somewhat. The FRLG like additions Ian presumably had in mind isn't going to change the game into something it isn't.

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