Megathread Archie Sonic Main Discussion

[goku262002]

3 hours ago, RictalRose0 said:

Apparently Archie did address the Sonic situation (well not really, but they addressed it by consequence of addressing the delays of their other stuff) and all they said was that right now they are focusing on their new show, Riverdale.

...Where did you hear/see this exactly?

If this is true, then I don't think SEGA is going to take too kindly to them giving the "we got our own shit going on, screw your stuff for awhile" attitude they are giving esp. since this was supposed to be a big year in promoting the comic and brand and not just SEGA, but their own subscribers are getting the same kind of feedback.

You have a TV show, so the fuck what? you also have a comic business you have to run too Archie.

[Badnik Mechanic]

I'd also quite like to know where people are getting 'Riverdale' isn't good/off to a shaky start?

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/riverdale/s01

[SonicComicFanboy]

1 hour ago, Mayor D said:

I'd also quite like to know where people are getting 'Riverdale' isn't good/off to a shaky start?

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/riverdale/s01

 A good or bad score on RT does not factually represent quality or lack there of.

 

And as others have said, CW isn't as much a stickler for ratings as other networks are, staying in the 1 million range or close is just fine for them.  The show may not be failing by their standerds, but had it been on ABC, NBC or CBS it would definitely wouldn't have been renewed for a second season.  It isn't really a success or a failure, just doing good enough for a network with lax standards to let it continue on.  Not knocking on the CW mind you, its a fine channel, just saying it's not as critical of new shows as its competition.

[Badnik Mechanic]

10 minutes ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

 A good or bad score on RT does not factually represent quality or lack there of.

So.... show us a factually accurate source which says otherwise?

Edit: Here's another. 68, not exactly what I would call a bad or shaky start by a long shot.

[SonicComicFanboy]

2 hours ago, Mayor D said:

So.... show us a factually accurate source which says otherwise?

Edit: Here's another. 68, not exactly what I would call a bad or shaky start by a long shot.

 Eh, quality of a work is always subjective, the only facts involved would be the title, runtime, people involved, etc.

 

 But yea I won't say the show is off to a good or bad start, it is just off to an average one, which still makes Archie throwing all thier eggs in one basket on it just as ridiculous.  Until it becomes a MCU level success they are not justified in giving the middle finger to the fans of their comics.

[Badnik Mechanic]

1 minute ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

 Eh, quality of a work is always subjective, the only facts involved would be the title, runtime, people involved, etc.

 

 But yea I won't say the show is off to a good or bad start, it is just off to an average one, which still makes Archie throwing all thier eggs in one basket on it just as ridiculous.  Until it becomes a MCU level success they are not justified in giving the middle finger to the fans of their comics.

You know what I think? 

You said something you can't prove and are now pulling an impossible requirement to justify a stance.

[SonicComicFanboy]

32 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

You know what I think? 

You said something you can't prove and are now pulling an impossible requirement to justify a stance.

 Care to elaborate on that abit?

 

 To clarify on a comic book end I was mearly stating how it is bad business for a comic book company to give a middle finger to the fans of its comics, Archie wanting to put so much towards Riverdale while constantly delaying books, not only for Sonic, but for All-New Archie, Dark Circle, etc as well is NOT A good idea by any means.  The show may be an average success, and I understand Archie wanting to expand the name recognition of its brand, but it is not in a posistion where it can trade focus of one form of media for another.  Marvel has a huge safty net being part of the house of mouse, Archie being a small independent publisher does not have nearly as secure of one.  If Riverdale is a failure in the long run, that will hurt them and on top of that constantly delaying books in all your lines and changing ongoing series to mini-series without an explanation is a good way to loose readers.  Why stick with Archie when you could buy a book from Boom, DC, IDW Marvel, etc that is more likely to come out on time!?

 

 Archie is putting itself in a bad posistion.  Unless Riverdale explodes in popularity over thr next year they are going to be in for a really rough time.

 

 Also lets not forget they had to borrow money to get their All-New Archie books ,and possibly Riverdale if they used any of it for that,  off the ground.  Archie is not in good enough a spot to be doing what they are planning to do, and in the long run it will hurt them, they don't have the same quality safty net a bigger publisher like DC or Marvel has, but they don't seem to realize or care about that, they are to blinded by the fact they have a show on prime time television.

[Badnik Mechanic]

8 minutes ago, SonicComicFanboy said:

 Care to elaborate on that abit?

You have just said a TV show needs to obtain the same level of popularity as the Marvel Cinematic Universe. 

When has any TV show obtained the same levels of popularity of any major movie universe?

Quote

Also lets not forget they had to borrow money to get their All-New Archie books

And? 

So what? 

Yeah?

Take your pick of the replies. Companies borrow money all the time for projects if they don't have the capital to put it up front. What's the problem? 

 

You and other people keep saying 'not doing great' or 'failure' with regards to Riverdale and Archies direction....

Does anyone have any proof or figures that this is actually happening? Because I've only done some basic research since I first asked if people could state where they were getting the idea from that Riverdale was doing poorly... so far nobody has done so, but I've found plenty of positive feedback for it and the best counter so far has been "Well that's not a great source."

[goku262002]

1 hour ago, Mayor D said:

When has any TV show obtained the same levels of popularity of any major movie universe?

Its a weird opposite from Marvel's cinematic universe but I would have to say that DC's TV universe on CW has been doing allot better then their movie universe, and fans tend to know those actors from those shows more.

[Borvoc]

Okay, I don't have an opinion here, and I haven't seen the facts, but people seem to be conflating ratings and viewership. The people who say Riverdale is having trouble cite its million-ish viewership, and people who take issue with that cite it's ratings. These are two very different things, and I don't really have an opinion either way. I just wanted to point that out so that maybe we can be civil and un-reactionary.

An on unrelated note, I followed @Mayor D's link to Spoiled Nightshades, and was struck by the below picture:

Anyone else notice that no one's smiling? I don't read Archie, but the characters are always smiling—especially on the covers. And what's up with Archie's "Oh, I'm so cool" expression? I thought he was supposed to be friendly and relatable—not stuck up. Betty and Veronica too. Okay, all the characters in this shot. I sincerely hope this is not indicative of the tone the show is taking.

[Badnik Mechanic]

Just now, Borvoc said:

An on unrelated note, I followed @Mayor D's link to Spoiled Nightshades, and was struck by the below picture:

My link to what now?

[Borvoc]

7 minutes ago, Mayor D said:

My link to what now?

lol. Rotten Tomatoes. Sorry for the unnecessary wordplay.

Edit: To be clear, I didn't mean anything aside from randomly using synonyms. Not making fun or anything.

Edit 2: If I can ignorantly extrapolate from a single picture, this fits in with how CW also completely messed up the tone (among other things) of the Green Arrow mythos. Then again, CW is just a channel, and I'm really not sure how much say they have in grimifying shows on their network. I'll blame this fixation on modern TV in general, I suppose.

[Your Vest Friend]

Nightshade isn't really specific, Rotten Potato is about as accurate. 

[RictalRose0]

We got it from the recent panel did at that con, the name of the con is in the previous page I think. They didn't take questions, and they didn't say "So hey about those delays in our comics". No what they did was go "Basically right now Riverdale is our top priority" most of the panel also was about Riverdale, Riverdale tie in comics, and Archie's original works. I didn't hear a single "Sonic" on the entire thing. Also is not that Riverdale is falling or something, it's just not succeding to the rate of the investment they put on it. One million viewers per episode on the first season is not gonna cut it for Archie. They have big plans for their IPs too. There is no "ifs" about it, Archie will have to work really hard to get all this stuff going if they want a future on TV. 

And look, the comic delays started around the time Riverdale began airing, and will most likely last until it's done broadcoasting it's first season, which is mid-late April. So what Archie has to do after it's done broadcasting it's focus on pushing Riverdale comics and getting their new Archie stuff back on the shelves, since it's not just Sonic that got put on hold, it's everything. But Sonic is the least of their priorities right now. Maybe Sega doesn't care about it, maybe they're pissed off that they're damaging their brand. I don't know because Sega almost never talks about the comic and their business relationship with Archie. Either way Archie is seriously damaging the comic right now. I'mnot trying to spread panic or anything, but it just doesn't seem like Archie Sonic is gonna pull through these changes.

[CottonCandy]

At this point, I wouldn't mind if Archie gives up the sonic license. With all the delays and legal actions from past employers not contributing anything positive for the publisher. Plus, Riverdale has become a hit and I wouldn't be surprised if Archie put all their energy into that. 

I wouldnt mind if the sonic license is handed off to a different comic publisher. Wipe the slate clean and start over fresh. 

[SonicComicFanboy]

Personally I'd only be OK with Archie losing the license if Ian & co could stay on the book and just pick up wherever they left off at the new publisher.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Just keep the characters and keep the action intense. 'Tis all I say...

[RictalRose0]

I don't know man. Some of the Freedom Fighters might make it through, but I really doubt it. SEGA originally wanted to get rid of them and make a total reboot, game canon only. But since they're basically Archie's flagship Sonic characters they fought for them. A new company wouldn't. And while there is people that say there are many fans of the comic's OC stuff and wouldn't stand for it, do keep in mind Sonic MegaDrive and Next Level sold out and was one of the best selling Sonic books in years. And that had no OCs and almost no relation to the Archie canon. It was a game canon as you could get. And people loved it. The Sonic Boom comic was also doing fine considering it was based on a game that was received terribly and had the worst reception of a Sonic title in years. Though it did get cancelled, but we never really knew why.

[FriendBot]

Actually, Mega Drive wasn't as big of a hit as people think it is and The Next Level apparently didn't do very well. So saying "best selling Sonic books in years" is a bit of a stretch.

It wasn't explicit but the reason the Boom and Mega Man comics were dropped was due to a failed Kickstarter Archie made and I guess it put a dent on their finances so they had to drop those 2 series.

So yeah, that's that.

 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

That really depends on the new company. One could just as easily stay loyal to the long-time fans and want the other characters on board.

That said, Megadrive selling out doesn't exactly say that no one wants these non-game characters around, especially given how diverse this fandom is. And that also ignores that Megadrive sold out due to it being the first issue which tends to sell a lot before the figures dwindle in later issues. (The Next Level actually sold less than either Universe or the Main Comic in the same month, I don't recall which)

There's really no telling what could happen if a new publisher gets the liscense, as anything can happen.

EDIT-- The Next Level actually sold less than #266 and #267 of the Main comic released in the same month, but barely sold more than Sonic Universe 92 by a mere 87 issues. Figured I'd make that correction.

[Borvoc]

If Archie is just putting Sonic on hold in until April to focus on Riverdale in the meantime, I'm fine with that. It's just one more month.

[RictalRose0]

Well, we'll see what happens. I'm just not getting a good feeling from all this. If Flynn and the others are on board then maybe they'll keep some of the Archie canon characters. But I doubt they'll pick up where the reboot left. Which is a shame, I liked the Reboot canon a lot more that the old Archie canon in terms of potential and characterization .Though the Megaman crossover was really unnessesary and dragged on too long, and the memories thing where it was sort of a reboot but not really was a terrible editorial decision, but it didn't really matter after that so I just pretend it didn't happen. Not like they ever brought it up again anyway. Either way I myself don't really care that much. As long as it's well written and not terribly OOC or flat and boring then it's okay. 

[PC the Hedgehog]

So is Archie just going to "pause" the Sonic comic every time they delve into some fancy new project [The Archie reboot, Riverdale, etc.]? Because if so, that just makes me angry. If I pay for a year's worth of Sonic comics, I demand a dang YEAR of Sonic comics.

Please Archie, just give the license over to a company that cares about its fans, huh?

[Tylinos]

Just now, PC the Hedgehog said:

If I pay for a year's worth of Sonic comics, I demand a dang YEAR of Sonic comics.

Assuming the series isn't cancelled, that's still what you're going to get.  You're paying for 12 issues, not just however many come out in a year.  If only 10 come out in a year, you're still going to get two more.

[RictalRose0]

Oh yeah you'll get them, whenever they get around to it. Even if they eventually give the costumer the promised issues that's still terrible costumer service. At the very least they could put a notice saying "There are complications at the moment, do not worry, your issues will be delivered as soon possible". What do they expect their subscribers to go and play detective trying to figure out what's happening? I mean look at us, we have done all this lurking around and investigating and we still aren't sure, and Archie still has no comment on the issue. For a corporation to act like this, treat it's costumers like this? This is just sloppy, they should know better that to act like this.