News Sonic Frontiers Trailer

[NoKaine]

2 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

That is literally the point though; if they want my money they need to do something to convince me to spend it on their product. Only showing vague story details and empty environments without even a shred of gameplay does not make me interested in seeing more.

I'm not saying it's wrong to think "they should have shown more to get me interested", only that 1) "i want to see more" is a reaction that marketers want you to have, and 2) that not showing much is not itself a case of not having much. To my original point, if they didn't feel like showing it, they wouldn't.

[Kazhnuz]

To be fair, even if they didn't feel like showing them, they would have to show it at one point. They certainly don't have much flexibility, especially after showing the first teaser. They'll have to keep the ball rolling. It all depends of their condition of working ( Which aren't really great, they're gamedev, and it's the friggin hell of dev ), and their flexibility.

Now I don't think that they necessarily are not show gameplay because "they're afraid", tho. Can be simply something like a bad try at keeping mystery, very Sonic Team-y to do that xD It might also be simply because they have other things to show this time than just a gameplay : just some environnement of Forces would have not as much interest, as it wouldn't give such an information as "this game is openworld". I mean, in Forces I think we also got gameplay of a level because they nearly had nothing else to really show XD

( It doesn't mean that the gameplay is "good", just that I personally see some other reason that seems me more in check, especially as it's pretty possible to not show how bad gameplay is by selecting just some bits )

[NoKaine]

10 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Everyone already knows how money works. Of course Sonic Team has no obligation to please me, but I don't have any obligation to mince my words either. 

(I don't know why I would have to either but) sure.

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You are witnessing people explain why Sonic Team has not convinced them to hand over their money right now

...wait, do people actually think the trailer is meant to get your money out now? It doesn't come out in a year.

You're probably not literal. But in case you are--they're not concerned about whether you want to it now. That's typically why marketing cycles continue until (and sometimes after) the game is out.

 You can point out that the game isn't catching your eye. I can point out that the trailer isn't meant to get you to buy the game immediately. We're the same because we both have little to talk about.

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This basically had zero chance of escalating

It escalated when users post comments like this:

32 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

To be entirely fair, its always different people who say the same shit out of blind optimism. Just goes to show how young the demographic is skewered here because the OG's already understand.

I know that's not as volatile as calling someone a "fucking fucker", but this kind of smug dismissal (over Sonic the Hedgehog, of all properties) gets me upset and I want to hazard to think people are actually okay with this, just because it's not overt.

I do apologize, though. I shouldn't have quoted you, that anger was entirely misplaced. EDIT: Misplaced and too hot.

[Red Hot Jack]

There is no need to get upset, we are having or trying to have a civil discussion.

I don't think it's paranoia, it's not trusting Sonic Team anymore. I don't agree with that because I think every game is its own situation which is a mix of circumstances. 

[azoo]

Anyways, in a best case scenario where this doesn't feel quite like Forces with PSO2 combat tacked on, I dream of something that plays and flows similar to Defunct. That game has both a 'roll' (compress to the ground to go down terrain fast) and a boost move to get across flat/upward terrain, and it feels great when they're used together.

(play this game, it's good)

I kinda have no hope they're gonna implement flow or satisfying speed building/losing after the past two games, but I'd like to be proven wrong. Don't expect to, though!

[Zoomzeta]

So can we lock this discussion if it gets too toxic for its own good? 

That aside, I didn't come out of this Teaser trailer negatively or positively as much as simply curious. At the very least we know this game is meant to be a more open world experience, and that's the most I can take from it other than the fact thst Ian finally gets his shot at writing the script for a game for the first time in his life. 

I'll wait patiently for other news regarding the game in the future (The film has my current attention for the moment).

[Jango]

58 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

We lasted less than 24 hours. Anyone would think we're used to this song and dance by now... 

And it's always the same dance. The "it's too early to judge" samba and the "you're being pessimist" tango. Every-goddman-time. And it always turn out the same in the end: the game sucks nevertheless. A real surprise would be Sonic Team actually showing something substancial, deep, creative, but the game still sucks. At least they're not liars. The teaser is lame, the game is lame, the marketing is lame.

[Red Hot Jack]

3 minutes ago, Jango said:

And it's always the same dance. The "it's too early to judge" samba and the "you're being pessimist" tango. Every-goddman-time. And it always turn out the same in the end: the game sucks nevertheless. A real surprise would be Sonic Team actually showing something substancial, deep, creative, but the game still sucks. At least they're not liars. The teaser is lame, the game is lame, the marketing is lame.

I am curious though, you don't care about the open world, you don't care about the story, you only specified "it's gonna suck, why bother". So what would make you interested in the game? Assuming this is a tech demo and we are getting proper gameplay soon... in a month or more.

[Blue Blood]

10 minutes ago, Jango said:

And it's always the same dance. The "it's too early to judge" samba and the "you're being pessimist" tango. Every-goddman-time. And it always turn out the same in the end: the game sucks nevertheless. A real surprise would be Sonic Team actually showing something substancial, deep, creative, but the game still sucks. At least they're not liars. The teaser is lame, the game is lame, the marketing is lame.

I want to say that Lost World kind of fits that's bill. I was purposefully absent for a lot of that games hype so I could be wrong. But parkour gameplay, an original story and being a bold new direction hot on the heels of the well-received Generations had people very interested at the time. 

Anyway... Yeah, we're at that point where everyone's said everything that they have to say. There's not much to go on, so the discussions have already been brought around to arguments more pessimism and optimism etc etc. I've seen Sonic games suck a hundred times already, and I don't need anyone telling me that I could be wrong because of some profound new angle that they think I've never considered. I'm too old for that shit. Wake me up when people are actually ready to talk about the game, preferably when we get new info. 

[Dr. Detective]

I suppose that's the real reason I'm not freaking out. Despite this all looking like something I'd totally be into and totally hyped for back in the day, I've been burned so many times that finally getting something that feels like it might be what I want is cancelling the two sides of me out.

Thus I'm in this weird, mellow, neutral space where I'm just like "Yeah. This is neat. Can't wait to see more."

When I saw something in the lead up to Forces that I actually Iiked, I was all-caps hyped about it and this game already looks better than that and yet I'm just kind of... here for it but not chomping at the bit for anything. Not yet.

Then again, I tend to never get upset or angry at something that I don't have a clear enough picture of yet regardless so... who knows?

[McGroose]

12 minutes ago, Jango said:

And it's always the same dance. The "it's too early to judge" samba and the "you're being pessimist" tango. Every-goddman-time. And it always turn out the same in the end: the game sucks nevertheless. A real surprise would be Sonic Team actually showing something substancial, deep, creative, but the game still sucks. At least they're not liars. The teaser is lame, the game is lame, the marketing is lame.

I can't even recall the last time I've defended Sonic team, but I at least wait until I have definitive proof in front of me that their current product is going to be ass before I start becoming pessimistic or optimistic. As of right now, it is fair to judge the environments, the aesthetic, and we have some tidbits of evidence about what the story will be like, and that's about it. The gameplay? We know basically nothing that isn't a leak from a really rough build of the game, so what am I supposed to judge? I'm not pessimistic cause I don't know anything, but does that now automatically mean I'm optimistic? 

This isn't me trying to defend the current state of the gameplay by saying it'll improve down the line or that we haven't see enough gameplay yet (that happened a lot with Forces), there is literally no gameplay at all. Sonic standing on a cliff doing nothing doesn't count lol 

Amazing how people consider it optimism to not immediately shit on what is not known. That's literally nothing, no optimism, no pessimism. I'm just waiting to form any kind of opinion based on actual footage, which has yet to be seen. 

[Razule]

36 minutes ago, azoo said:

Anyways, in a best case scenario where this doesn't feel quite like Forces with PSO2 combat tacked on, I dream of something that plays and flows similar to Defunct. That game has both a 'roll' (compress to the ground to go down terrain fast) and a boost move to get across flat/upward terrain, and it feels great when they're used together.

(play this game, it's good)

I kinda have no hope they're gonna implement flow or satisfying speed building/losing after the past two games, but I'd like to be proven wrong. Don't expect to, though!

Man. Forget the environment not looking Sonic-like, the real shame is that we're at a point where movement like this in an open world Sonic the Hedgehog game isn't a given. 

[Cosmos Rogue]

To back up a little bit...

FWIW I think scrutiny towards Sonic's character model is absolutely warranted. Sonic's appearance is perhaps the single strongest aspect of the series; it helped sell tens of millions of Sega Genesises Mega Drives in the 90s, it sells good and bad games alike, and it was the make or break factor for the movie. Besides, the past decade has also trained the fandom to scrutinize Sonic's design; we've had the return of classic Sonic, Boom Sonic's bandages, and the narrowly missed disaster that was the original design of Movie Sonic in that time.

Sonic's appearance isn't going to change in Frontiers. The trailer is a part of Sega's sales pitch for Frontiers; that means they have already settled on which Sonic design they are using in the game, which Sonic design they are selling to us this time.

[NoKaine]

49 minutes ago, azoo said:

Anyways, in a best case scenario where this doesn't feel quite like Forces with PSO2 combat tacked on, I dream of something that plays and flows similar to Defunct. That game has both a 'roll' (compress to the ground to go down terrain fast) and a boost move to get across flat/upward terrain, and it feels great when they're used together.

(play this game, it's good)

I kinda have no hope they're gonna implement flow or satisfying speed building/losing after the past two games, but I'd like to be proven wrong. Don't expect to, though!

You're showing a game that's a pretty good example of how the environment works for the gameplay, and how this will not actually work for Frontiers.

Frontiers is very much easily more cramped with smaller areas than that game. Even if the map was more particularly elevated, it wouldn't have a humongous chasm like at 1:21. 

Defunct is also very empty in the map, which is something I assume we don't want out of Frontiers. Frontiers will likely have interaction with the game world that isn't just "fly like a rocket off to the distance."

That game seems designed for literally just the movement alone. Movement will be important in Frontiers but it will not be the only important thing. 

EDIT: Looking at that game, it's pretty much just Tony Hawk, isn't it?

[azoo]

Where are you getting the idea Frontiers will be more cramped? The footage we've seen so far shows it's gonna be anything but.

And I wouldn't call the lack of elevation, huge chasms or slopes as a good thing. Isn't the point here to emphasize the freedom of an open-zone? Wouldn't that means fans would want that space to build up speed and rocket around?

I'm just not sure how an argument was formed off of what I posted. lmao

[Polkadi~☆]

 

The Japanese teaser trailer was released too. One thing that sticks out is the voice is WAY clearer here, and it definitely sounds like Amy (albeit in Japanese).

If you're wondering what the voice says, it's pretty much the same as English: "Sonic, this way!" and "Looks bad! Don't do it!"

And the slogan that the game is going with: "The wind carries a voiceless voice."

[NoKaine]

9 minutes ago, azoo said:

Where are you getting the idea Frontiers will be more cramped? The footage we've seen so far shows it's gonna be anything but.

And I wouldn't call the lack of elevation, huge chasms or slopes as a good thing. Isn't the point here to emphasize the freedom of an open-zone? Wouldn't that means fans would want that space to build up speed and rocket around?

I'm just not sure how an argument was formed off of what I posted. lmao

This has a lot more stuff per square than Defunct. This is because they want you to interact with the world. Have things to do.

Huge chasms look cool, and you can fly, sure, but it's a Breath of the Wild-style open world, the kind of game that is meant to have things in them.

Assuming that the world will have things in them, either they will get in the way of your transversal or you'll easily miss them at high speed. 

And it's not an argument, unless you want to argue. I'm stating something I noticed in both. Defunct works well because the environment is huge, extreme, and empty. Frontiers' world is too small and compact to have that kind of high octane gameplay. So I think it'll be more slower and condensed.

I do kind of now want a Tony Hawk-style Sonic game, though.

[SenEDDtor Missile]

 

9 minutes ago, Polkadi~☆ said:

 

The Japanese teaser trailer was released too. One thing that sticks out is the voice is WAY clearer here, and it definitely sounds like Amy (albeit in Japanese).

If you're wondering what the voice says, it's pretty much the same as English: "Sonic, this way!" and "Looks bad! Don't do it!"

And the slogan that the game is going with: "The wind carries a voiceless voice."

"The wind carries a voiceless voice."

I'm trying to decide if they're trying to make it sound mysterious or not, because that sounds really redundant.

[Razule]

15 minutes ago, Polkadi~☆ said:

The wind carries a voiceless voice."

A voiceless voice in the wind. Like.. a wild breath?

[NoKaine]

Guys, I think this game is based on Breath of the Wild.

[azoo]

12 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

This has a lot more stuff per square than Defunct. This is because they want you to interact with the world. Have things to do.

Huge chasms look cool, and you can fly, sure, but it's a Breath of the Wild-style open world, the kind of game that is meant to have things in them.

Assuming that the world will have things in them, either they will get in the way of your transversal or you'll easily miss them at high speed. 

And it's not an argument, unless you want to argue. I'm stating something I noticed in both. Frontiers' world is too small to have that kind of high octane gameplay. So I think it'll be more slower and condensed.

I do kind of now want a Tony Hawk-style Sonic game, though.

I mean, you could easily do a lot of the ideas of Defunct while still having things be compact and not all be about moving constantly. It's not an extreme "one or the other" matter.

Besides, traversal is like the entire reason an open world Sonic is desirable to most people. Talking to NPCs and facing great obstacles/enemies is cool, but comes secondary to that. It's why I can't see the areas we've seen so far as necessarily good things, if they don't leave room for Sonic to move quickly and feel good doing it.

[Polkadi~☆]

9 minutes ago, SenEDDtor Missile said:

 

"The wind carries a voiceless voice."

I'm trying to decide if they're trying to make it sound mysterious or not, because that sounds really redundant.

It's a very literal translation. I'd change it to something that makes more sense, but then people would come down on me and say that's not what it says!!

How I read it is more like: "The wind carries a silent voice."

[NoKaine]

20 minutes ago, azoo said:

I mean, you could easily do a lot of the ideas of Defunct while still having things be compact and not all be about moving constantly. It's not an extreme "one or the other" matter.

Besides, traversal is like the entire reason an open world Sonic is desirable to most people. Talking to NPCs and facing great obstacles/enemies is cool, but comes secondary to that. It's why I can't see the areas we've seen so far as necessarily good things, if they don't leave room for Sonic to move quickly and feel good doing it.

I also think movement is imperative--I even think that if the movement is really good, then the game can still be good even if the content is lacking... but you kind of still need that content. EDIT: Having denser space is good for the content, is what I mean. 

EDIT: I also think you can still have good speed and momentum-based gameplay with that kind of space.

[SSF1991]

2 hours ago, Scar said:

If anything, being optimistic having seen zero gameplay, is hopeless naivety.

Fans wanted a new direction in writing, preferably Ian Flynn to be the writer. SEGA did that.

Fans wanted SEGA to take the series' gameplay into a different direction. SEGA did that.

Fans wanted Sonic games to become ambitious again, like the Unleashed days. So far, it's looking like SEGA did that too, though we'll need to see some gameplay to know for sure.

I understand the hesitance in giving the game any optimism, but there's a reason no one has completely written off the game either. It's not "hopeless naivety" when there's actually things SEGA has done that people wanted for years. There's a completely understandable reason to be pessimistic, optimistic, or even neutral about this game based on what we know right now, and I don't think anyone's in the wrong for that.

The amount of debate happening here over a reused character model though...that makes no sense to me.

[shdowhunt60]

I mean, at the end of the day we still have so little to go off of that we have no idea how Breath of the Hedgehog is supposed to play out.

I mean, for me personally, the fact that they're aping Zelda's aesthetic so heavily right down to the discordant choir melody backed by piano and synths doesn't sit well for me. It's just trying WAY too hard to come off as Breath of the Wild.

The only bit of reassurance is the fact that they're having Ian Flynn write for the story... Which is cool, but ostensibly we're going to be dealing with a non-linear narrative and that's not something he's had to deal with before.