News Sonic Frontiers Trailer

[McGroose]

14 minutes ago, Diogenes said:

There's no "paranoia" in being skeptical about Sonic games.

I think that it counts as paranoia if someone assumes the game will be bad without having even seen Sonic move yet in-game.

Once we're past that part though, than ya paranoia is totally justified. 

[Scar]

1 minute ago, McGroose said:

I think that it counts as paranoia if someone assumes the game will be bad without having even seen Sonic move yet in-game.

Not at all. 

Sonic Team have made 2 (arguably 4 counting SA1 and SA2) good Sonic games in the last 20 years - not at all a good track record. Its not paranoia to expect the game to be bad, its just being realistic.

If anything, being optimistic having seen zero gameplay, is hopeless naivety.

[Kazhnuz]

18 minutes ago, McGroose said:

I think that it counts as paranoia if someone assumes the game will be bad without having even seen Sonic move yet.

No, and honestly even if the gameplay was there and looked good visually it wouldn't be "paranoia" (not even counting my classic annoyance with people using casually words like that), and even without counting the last few games. People having good or bad impression with missing info is quite normal, in both direction.

It's just inferring the rest of information according to experience.

[azoo]

2 minutes ago, McGroose said:

I think that it counts as paranoia if someone assumes the game will be bad without having even seen Sonic move yet in-game.

Once we're past that part though, than ya paranoia is totally justified. 

After Lost World and Forces managed to mess up something as basic as Sonic's walk-to-run acceleration, I think "paranoia" is just proper concern. lol

[Wraith]

We're already at the part of the hype cycle where fans seriously try to argue that Sonic Team has no obligation to convince people that their game will be good

[Diogenes]

4 minutes ago, McGroose said:

I think that it counts as paranoia if someone assumes the game will be bad without having even seen Sonic move yet in-game.

Once we're past that part though, than ya paranoia is totally justified. 

The series' output has been bad enough that we have no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt. If they want me to believe the game might be good, they need to do something to prove it. Not showing any gameplay only gives me further reason not to trust them.

[Blue Blood]

2 minutes ago, Wraith said:

We're already at the part of the hype cycle where people seriously try to argue that Sonic Team has no obligation to convince people that their game will be good

We lasted less than 24 hours. Anyone would think we're used to this song and dance by now... 

[Kuzu]

6 minutes ago, Blue Blood said:

We lasted less than 24 hours. Anyone would think we're used to this song and dance by now... 

To be entirely fair, its always different people who say the same shit out of blind optimism. Just goes to show how young the demographic is skewered here because the OG's already understand.

[Shiny Gems]

13 minutes ago, azoo said:

After Lost World and Forces managed to mess up something as basic as Sonic's walk-to-run acceleration, I think "paranoia" is just proper concern. lol

Just curious, when you say "paranoia", what would you and others actually define it as?

Regardless, years of skepticism and being let down does those kinds of things to you all, huh?

[NoKaine]

13 minutes ago, Wraith said:

We're already at the part of the hype cycle where fans seriously try to argue that Sonic Team has no obligation to convince people that their game will be good

Sonic Team is not your fucking friend and has no "obligation" but sell you a product. They indeed have no obligation to throw out gameplay, that, I must stress, you will whine and cry about anyway, no matter what it is, if people are already bitching about the fucking character model...

If this is how Sonic Team wants to sell their product, then that's how they do it. Don't like it? Cool. Move on.

And anyway, you actually think "I want to see more of this game" is a reaction Sonic Team doesn't want out of the audience? Their only obligation is getting people's money, whether it's by showing you every single aspect of a game, or showing you just enough, or shitting themselves in public. 

No, no company worth their salt designs entire marketing campaigns about spilling as many details as possible to placate people who will be upset no matter what they do.

[Shiny Gems]

Just now, NoKaine said:

Sonic Team is not your fucking friend and has no "obligation" but sell you a product. They indeed have no obligation to throw out gameplay, that, I must stress, you will whine and cry about anyway, no matter what it is, if people are already bitching about the fucking character model...

If this is how Sonic Team wants to sell their product, then that's how they fucking do it. Don't like it? Cool. Move the fuck on.

And anyway, you actually think "I want to see more of this game" is a reaction Sonic Team doesn't want out of the audience? 

Um, yeah, you might want to chill. I mean, no trying to tell you what to do, but suggesting. People are in control of their own thoughts, and they have the right to think what they want, too.

[KingMario05]

Looks far too dull and blah for my liking so far, although Flynn writing is a major win.

And yeah, it looks like Sonic will be saving his friends after Eggy's shenanigans trap them in cyberspace, with many telepathically dropping hints along the way. Certainly what I'd do for a plot, really.

I'll say this much though: when you rescue Sonic's friends, they should be playable. I'm tired of having to rely on a broken Steam port of a Dreamcast game to play as the characters I wanna play as. And I'm not saying that they need to be total re-works, either. Really, Amy can be a slower Sonic clone whilst Tails could "fly" similar to whatever gliding ability Sonic gets in game. (Same with Knux, really.)

Please, Sonic Team. It's been fifteen years since 06. I think you can start trying to bring them back now...

[NoKaine]

Just now, CrystalMaelStorm said:

Um, yeah, you might want to chill. I mean, no trying to tell you what to do, but suggesting. People are in control of their own thoughts, and they have the right to think what they want, too.

Sure, but it doesn't make it less silly, or make comments like this:

6 minutes ago, Kuzu said:

To be entirely fair, its always different people who say the same shit out of blind optimism. Just goes to show how young the demographic is skewered here because the OG's already understand.

...any less obnoxiously condescending.

[Wraith]

4 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

Sonic Team is not your fucking friend

Ain't that the truth.

Guess it's a good time to remind you that they aren't your friend either, so I'd suggest not taking things so personally. I'd think you're the one that gets $60 if I choose to buy this game with the way you're acting.

[Kazhnuz]

6 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

Sonic Team is not your fucking friend and has no "obligation" but sell you a product. They indeed have no obligation to throw out gameplay, that, I must stress, you will whine and cry about anyway, no matter what it is, if people are already bitching about the fucking character model...

If this is how Sonic Team wants to sell their product, then that's how they fucking do it. Don't like it? Cool. Move the fuck on.

And anyway, you actually think "I want to see more of this game" is a reaction Sonic Team doesn't want out of the audience? 

Honestly, I'm hyped for this game (but I don't really dislike that much post-Unleashed games, just Forces that I find underwhelming and that it's going to my favourite genre and kind of aesthetic), but going to attack people simply because that they are saying their concern like that is both annoying and kinda stupid. Annoying because negative opinion aren't an attack on enjoyement of people that are having a good time. Stupid because what do you think will happens ? It's simply something that will make everybody camp even more on their position.

Especially when they're not attacking people having a good time, or not attacking you. It's just a fucking game, remember.

[NoKaine]

2 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Ain't that the truth.

Guess it's a good time to remind you that they aren't your friend either, so I'd suggest not taking things so personally.

I ain't here for fucking Sonic Team. If the game sucks, I won't buy it, which is genuinely more than what most people here, especially the hyper-critical ones, will actually do.

Pointing out that they're a company that wants your money and will market their games to get your money and not your pity is not me taking things personal. I'm pretty sure I was pretty neutral with that previous comment. EDIT: Eh, could be more neutral.

[Kuzu]

3 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

Sure, but it doesn't make it less silly, or make comments like this:

...any less obnoxiously condescending.

You're more than welcome to go to another site good sir, nobody is forcing you to post here.

[NoKaine]

Just now, Kuzu said:

You're more than welcome to go to another site good sir, nobody is forcing you to post here.

This is one of the few good places to talk about Sonic, though. Yes, even after all my bitching.

[Shiny Gems]

Honestly, I don't like at least some of the pessimism here too, but at least I can understand the reasons why.

To try to get back on topic, what is the biggest hope you guys have for this game, and biggest worry?

[NoKaine]

2 minutes ago, CrystalMaelStorm said:

Honestly, I don't like at least some of the pessimism here too, but at least I can understand the reasons why.

To try to get back on topic, what is the biggest hope you guys have for this game, and biggest worry?

Besides "being good", I specifically hope for that whole "big but separate levels" thing, like Odyssey.

[Kuzu]

5 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

This is one of the few good places to talk about Sonic, though. Yes, even after all my bitching.

Then please respect the fact that some of us have been here longer and have no reason to trust this series and we are within our right to express that. 

 

[Diogenes]

4 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

Pointing out that they're a company that wants your money and will market their games to get your money and not your pity is not me taking things personal.

That is literally the point though; if they want my money they need to do something to convince me to spend it on their product. Only showing vague story details and empty environments without even a shred of gameplay does not make me interested in seeing more.

[McGroose]

 

33 minutes ago, Scar said:

If anything, being optimistic having seen zero gameplay, is hopeless naivety.

"Optimism" lol I'm not even optimistic, I'm not pessimistic, I've seen no gameplay to warrant either reaction. I don't know what to think because I haven't seen enough. That trailer was basically just a way for Sega to show off their (sorta) pretty environments. The only thing I can judge is what I've seen, which is not gameplay. I don't know if it'll be good or bad because I haven't seen anything. I'm not going to judge anything if I don't see Sonic so much as move one step forward.  The previous games being garbage is not info to make an assumption for me yet based on what little we have. At least, not for me anyway.

Here's how optimistic I am for the game: I already don't really like what I've seen the more I think about it. I don't like how the aesthetic hardly fits Sonic at all and could have easily been pulled out of any other fantasy world, I don't think it looks visually all that impressive, and I hope they don't use the Forces model in the final game cause that's my least favorite Sonic model that isn't from 06. 

But none of that is gameplay. I've formed opinions on what I've seen, I have evidence to credit those opinions based on what is there. Shit from the past isn't good enough for me, especially when Sega pulls a 180 on every other game. I can still think the environments aren't the best while being impressed with Sonic's controls and level design. Possibly, possibly not, I don't know.

All I'm saying is wait and see. I do think it's silly to assume a game will improve significantly once you've seen the actual gameplay and think that Sega will somehow magically fix everything to your liking. That happened a lot with Forces and Lost World, so I definitely now hold the firm belief that, when it comes to Sonic Team, what you see is what you get. But, again, I haven't seen anything so I don't know what I'm gonna get. Whether or not I trust Sonic team (I don't) is irrelevant to me, I need firm proof. 

[Wraith]

15 minutes ago, NoKaine said:

 

Pointing out that they're a company that wants your money and will market their games to get your money and not your pity is not me taking things personal. I'm pretty sure I was pretty neutral with that previous comment.

Let me try and break this down for you carefully since I think you got lost somewhere.

Everyone already knows how money works. Of course Sonic Team has no obligation to please me, but I don't have any obligation to mince my words either.  You are witnessing people explain why Sonic Team has not convinced them to hand over their money right now, and what they can do to potentially convince them later. That's all.

This basically had zero chance of escalating until you started quoting people to explain that this is all a part of Sonic Team's master plan, and it didn't have to go any further without your breakdown up above over people "whining and crying".

Silly shit over a game I haven't actually expressed a strong opinion on yet. I've been holding my tongue compared to the last game and you guys are still on this shit. Ridiculous. Next time I'll just pull a Diogenes and call it dogshit straight on. You guys receive mild skepticism and active negativity the same way anyway.

[Shiny Gems]

1 minute ago, Kuzu said:

Then please respect the fact that some of us have been here longer and have no reason to trust this series and we are within our right to express that. 

 

I shoud probably say; though I can't say you were doing this, or anyone else with skepticism and cynicism for that matter, but I should probably point out nonetheless that the best way to express something is through a civil and friendly, or friendly-as-possible way.

Just wanted to give a heads up for future reference even if people weren't doing it, if you don't mind.