Sonic Mania (August 15th 2017, Christian Whitehead, PS4, Xbox One, PC, Switch) - The New Classic

[Zippo]

My two dream scenarios:

Ice Cap and Launch Base (the two stages I wanted) are appearing in Mania.

Sonic 3 Remastered is happening after all, and it's being bundled in a physical collection, along with Sonic 1-CD and Mania.

 

 

.....Let me dream.

 

[Chris Knopps]

2 minutes ago, Monkey Destruction Switch said:

I agree with Celestia. I don't even think Sonic's sprites in Sonic 1 and 2 look "cuter" than Sonic 3, or that Sonic 3 Sonic looks "older". It's just a different style.

I suppose the best way to put it is a preference for the style changes they generally adhered to back then. As time went on, he darkened, rounded out better, Mania is an attempt to warp him back to Sonic 1 with a much lighter color and more frames/animations, the later equally possible with the Sonic 3 sprite.

The thing is, the Sonic 1 sprite is better for the "cute" direction they're going for, it's a bit harder I think to make Sonic 3's design look and pull off cute things, and personally, I don't really follow Sonic because of being cute. It's because he's cool.

[Zippo]

3 minutes ago, Monkey Destruction Switch said:

I agree with Celestia. I don't even think Sonic's sprites in Sonic 1 and 2 look "cuter" than Sonic 3, or that Sonic 3 Sonic looks "older". It's just a different style.

Yeah, not seeing it either. Sonic 3 was just a visual overhaul, nothing else changed, as far as I am aware. What would continuity have to do with anything, visually speaking?

[Celestia]

15 minutes ago, Zippo said:

Sonic 3 Remastered is happening after all, and it's being bundled in a physical collection, along with Sonic 1-CD

Seems likely, if 3K Remastered happens in the first place which is still up in the air.

Quote

and Mania.

Almost certainly not.

Spoiler

(Okay, maybe in like, 20 years or something. )

 

[Diogenes]

Sonic 3's sprites are the "cute" version if anything, everything's rounder and he's got a softer expression compared to the 1/2/CD sprites.

[CleverSonicUsername]

There was a Launch Base tease? As much as I like that zone, and Ice Cap, I'll be really disappointed if Hydrocity doesn't make the cut. You gotta have a water stage, and it doesn't get better than Hydrocity.

Edit: What if the rings you enter will take you to a corresponding special stage. So rings in Green Hill take you to the Sonic 1 special stage, with the original levels or Mania featuring a new gimmick entirely?

That's probably thinking too deeply into things, though. :V

[Chris Knopps]

11 minutes ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

There was a Launch Base tease? As much as I like that zone, and Ice Cap, I'll be really disappointed if Hydrocity doesn't make the cut. You gotta have a water stage, and it doesn't get better than Hydrocity.

Hmmm...

I do wonder, what makes Hydrocity Zone such a must have for so many people?

Why not Labyrinth Zone considering how disliked it is and how having it redesigned in Mania could give it a new light of love and appreciation?

One reason I see for the Hydrocity Zone favoritism is because of just how sprawled out it is, how fast you can go, but couldn't this be a change implemented into the Labyrinth Zone as well so it's more like Hydrocity Zone but much better...?

Take what's hated and do something to make it beloved before focusing on what's already universally loved as-is.

Just uh... Just a thought.

You get a team that can make Labyrinth Zone of all places universally loved you've got yourself God-tier team right there.

[Diogenes]

6 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

Why not Labyrinth Zone considering how disliked it is

Not Labyrinth Zone, because of how disliked it is.

This is like when people call for a remake of '06. There's no reason for them to handicap themselves trying to rehabilitate a level people generally don't like.

[Chris Knopps]

1 minute ago, Diogenes said:

Not Labyrinth Zone, because of how disliked it is.

This is like when people call for a remake of '06. There's no reason for them to handicap themselves trying to rehabilitate a level people generally don't like.

Talks about Labyrinth Zone

Immediately resorts to 06 for a sound argument...

...Ah...

I'll respond anyways and say making Labyrinth Zone lovable isn't something to handicap anybody. It's called creativity. And going by what they've done with Green Hill, especially the second act going by a single image alone, yeah, I'd say it's possible to make people drool over Labyrinth Zone.

Open your mind and see the possibilities my friend. There's many a way one could make Labyrinth Zone into a fast paced, adrenaline pumping experience on par with Hydrocity Zone if one is willing to go the mile to do so. I'd say it'd be a journey well worth traveling toward rewards well worth obtaining.

One less thing to dislike about the franchise is a plus if you ask me.

[Diogenes]

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

I'll respond anyways and say making Labyrinth Zone lovable isn't something to handicap anybody.

You said yourself that taking a hated level (Labyrinth) and making it into a universally loved one would be a sign of a god-tier team.

1 minute ago, Chris Knopps said:

One less thing to dislike about the franchise is a plus if you ask me.

The original Labyrinth wouldn't become any less hated just because a reimagined version was good, any more than Splash Hill or Casino Street made everyone hate GHZ and Casino Night.

You brushed off my comparison to remaking '06, but this is exactly the same mindset, this idea that a "fixed" version would make everyone forget the original.

[Chris Knopps]

Just now, Diogenes said:

You said yourself that taking a hated level (Labyrinth) and making it into a universally loved one would be a sign of a god-tier team.

The original Labyrinth wouldn't become any less hated just because a reimagined version was good, any more than Splash Hill or Casino Street made everyone hate GHZ and Casino Night.

You brushed off my comparison to remaking '06, but this is exactly the same mindset, this idea that a "fixed" version would make everyone forget the original.

It's a challenge but it's not going to X-Treme the team working on it.

It might not still be heralded as others, but it would give it a positive light to reflect on/appreciate nonetheless.

A little confused by that statement... I actually loved Splash Hill and Casino Street, not the best stage layout but the designs were pretty nice.

I didn't intend for anyone to forget the original. The idea is to make folks find a way to appreciate it more while loving the new version.

[CleverSonicUsername]

Yo, Labyrinth is my favorite level in Sonic 1 and even I don't think it should be in Mania. We already got a retread of it in Sonic 4, Tidal Tempest is a pseudo-remake too.

[Chris Knopps]

3 minutes ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

Yo, Labyrinth is my favorite level in Sonic 1 and even I don't think it should be in Mania. We already got a retread of it in Sonic 4, Tidal Tempest is a pseudo-remake too.

Eyy, that's fresh. I like that. Kudos.

I'd like to think that, even though they did take inspiration from old zones, they still had enough of their own look as well as their own names and tracks to make them original enough to warrant not being categorized as remakes of any particular kind.

Although that argument is mainly just to say "I'm speaking in terms of a good/proper remake" basically, I still think that argument stands even without such a meaning of making it in mind.

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

I'm far from being a Labyrinth Zone hater, but like CleverSonicUsername, I agree it's gotten enough of a tribute in Sonic 4's ultra-creatively-named Lost Labyrinth Zone. Also, ironically, while it's obviously less liked than Hydrocity Zone, it's also more well-known due to its infamy. Hydrocity is a great zone but doesn't stick in people's minds as much, so I think that's all the more reason to give it another chance. It has so many cool features and deserves another chance to make use of its potential.

[___-_]

It'd be practically killing two birds with one stone choosing Hydrocity anyway since the zone makes little call backs to Labyrinth zone in of itself, too.

[Maxtiis]

Hydrocity was always unique for being a water level in a platformer that was actually very speed oriented, which is something that I'd always appreciated about it. Although I'd like to see what could be done to re-imagine it for Mania, I'd prefer seeing what Whitehead and his team could do with a completely original water level.

Plus water levels are always stereotyped into having the best music and I'd love to see what music Tee Lopes would compose for one, instead of just having him make another remix of Hydrocity Zone.

[Ayliffe]

5 hours ago, CleverSonicUsername said:

Edit: What if the rings you enter will take you to a corresponding special stage. So rings in Green Hill take you to the Sonic 1 special stage, with the original levels or Mania featuring a new gimmick entirely?

That's... actually not that bad of an idea to be honest. It'd definitely be a fresh twist on the traditional special stage approach.

[Ajavalo]

That wouldn't work, because special stages most likely aren't tied to a single zone as in the GBA-DS games. If you can enter any special stage from any zone of the game, the team would have to design 7*5=35 special stages total.

Why *5? Sonic 1, Sonic 2, Sonic CD, Sonic3&K, original.

[Psychicmoose103]

As much as I don't hate labyrinth, I would much rather have starlight and hydrocity

[CleverSonicUsername]

42 minutes ago, Ajavalo said:

That wouldn't work, because special stages most likely aren't tied to a single zone as in the GBA-DS games. If you can enter any special stage from any zone of the game, the team would have to design 7*5=35 special stages total.

Why *5? Sonic 1, Sonic 2, Sonic CD, Sonic3&K, original.

Yeah it'd be a lot of work, but either way it seems they're putting some work in with the Blue Spheres special stage, which aren't Mania's special stages. Point being, they're still going a bit above seven stages, though to exactly what degree and what form that may take we don't know.

Like I posted that idea, but I totally doubt that's how they'll handle it. It was just something I thought would be interesting so I shared it. :V

[molul]

We should definitely consider there's a Blue Spheres game mode in Sonic Mania's main menu, apart from the "story" mode. 

[expansivelovestories]

It is a bit of an enigma due to the different colors of both the sphere/planetoid's surface and Sonic.  Could there be a sprite color option in an official new version of S3K similar to how there are many sprite options in Sonic 3 Complete? 

( Overall I feel that there would be lots of collaborative communication, or at least agreement that it is ok for them to share some or many adjustments and ideas, with the S3 Complete team!  They were able to successfully fix many errors as well as implement quite a few good new features.  )

Or, does the differently colored surface combined with Sonic's coloration suggest that this is definitely somewhere in Mania?    Could it be used to unlock extras, and would it be that similar to Green Hill, if the one depicted isn't just a test using a familiar layout, that this is like a tutorial first stage, and the others will be all new?   D.A. Garden for example was able to make 14 entirely new special stage layouts for his version of S3K that really did work to be both newly challenging but always eventually solvable! 

Thankfully it is only basically seven (perhaps eight but this day is already partially complete) days until the panel  

 

 

 

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

1 hour ago, molul said:

We should definitely consider there's a Blue Spheres game mode in Sonic Mania's main menu, apart from the "story" mode. 

I actually have been thinking there's a possibility that Blue Sphere might be a mode entirely separate from the main game, bur just having it be another option on the main menu feels kinda...anticlimactic, in a way. I mean, even in its original release Blue Sphere was slightly "hidden", considering the screen originally acts as though the cartridge is incompatible ("No way? No way!") until you press the 3 letter buttons simultaneously. So just including it on the main menu would seem a bit too mundane, IMO.

[FReaK]

or maybe it's just a red herring and there is no blue sphere anywhere after all. hoax screenshot.

[Lord-Dreamerz]

11 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

JAPANESE Sonic, big thing right there. The west put their spin on him for a reason and Japan made the total Western switch in Sonic 3 because it worked so well compared to their "cute" Sonic.

I'm not saying it's completely bad to see Mania go back to the Sonic 1 design, but it DOES look weird for Mania to be a sequel to Sonic 3 and have Sonic looking like an even younger version of himself compared to Sonic 3, you don't age backwards. It's too much nostalgia pandering to the point you forget about continuity/consistence and its importance.

(Edit)

Not sure why they're so obsessed with having Japan's preference for a lighter colored Sonic either, it's overkill.

Opinions much? He doesn't look younger it's just a different art style... A very nice style too at that. Furthermore outside of mostly the box art and some of the old TV series... Sonic's style used in the mainline games was always the japan style in the past even with Sonic 3 and never used the honestly pointless western style. if the western look worked so well... why did they drop it later? That's right because it was unneeded and not canon. The normal style from japan was always the right mix of cool and cute. Is just bad stereotyping joke for companies to think westerners only can care for 1000% cool & edgy designs. Also it's the strangest thing how you are saying them basing the look after Sonic 1 is nostalgia pandering... but if they did the Sonic 3 look instead it wouldn't be???

Actually nearly everyday I look lately on the new Sonic game topics I see you wishing for random design changes and calling everything you don't want nostalgia pandering while ironically at the same time are wanting designs from old aspects of the series... AKA only wanting things mainly because of nostalgia. You can ask for what you want, but I'm just saying. :V