Sonic Lost World: Analysis, Fan Reception and Defense

[Milo]

C'mon. Next you'll be saying that SLW's Parkour move is a rip-off of Cat Mario's ability to climb up wa-

.............

 

- Parkour gameplay is a ripoff of Cat Mario wall scaling

- Tiny exploding bombs that follow you are ripoffs of Bob-ombs

- Visiting a tubular-shaped alien planet is a ripoff of the Galaxy duology, which are the predecessors of 3D World

- The snowball section is a ripoff of the golden ball rolling levels of the Galaxy duology games, which are the predecessors of 3D World

- The Deadly Six are a ripoff of Bowser's Koopalings because they are guardians of different worlds

- Sonic Lost World has the word "World" in it, which Super Mario 3D World has

- Wisps are a ripoff of Lumas, from the Galaxy duology, which are the predecessors of 3D World

- Wisps are also ripped from Colors, which is a Galaxy ripoff

- Eagle Wisp is a ripoff of the Super Mario World's cape powerup because they allow you to fly

- Generations has 3D capabilities, ripping off the "3D'" word in the Mario title

- Sonic 4's cat synths are from Cat Mario, thus making Lost World a ripoff of Sonic 4 which is now a ripoff of 3D World

- Sonic's run button is a ripoff of Mario's dash button from the New Super Mario Bros. games

- Sonic 2 has you go up in space, this is ripped off by Mario going up to a space level in Super Mario Land

- The entire classic Sonic gameplay is a ripoff of Mario Pinball

 

In conclusion: Sonic Lost World is a ripoff of the entire Mario franchise, game is shit -0/10 do not buy avoid like the plague call your local vermin extermination group to dispose of properly if you see a copy of this game in sight.

 

In all seriousness, I do not care much if Sonic Lost World has some strong similarities to Mario's games here and there. I think it's a good thing for Sonic Team to take a few cues from not just Mario, but some other platformers as well such as DKC, Rayman, and the like. If it improves the gameplay and level design to be overall more enjoyable overall (by means of interaction, exploration, creativity, etc.), I won't be one to complain. And I'm not typing this as a rebuttal/response to Yakuza, I'm fully aware with him (re-)clarifying that he never said doing such a thing was bad.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Yeow

[Kuzu]

I still think Lost World is going to be a good game, I'm certainly more excited than the initial reveal. I just wish it didn't seem like it's forsaken things I liked about the series.

[Radrappy]

I still think Lost World is going to be a good game, I'm certainly more excited than the initial reveal. I just wish it didn't seem like it's forsaken things I liked about the series.

 

what things might that be?

[MegasonicZX]

what things might that be?

He might be referring to all the things the series did previously and how it tried its best not to be mario (which admittedly I am pretty darn sad that they've gone this route for this game but I don't mind it). For me, I don't really mind it that much especially since sonic brings his own unique spin on things which always differentiate his games from mario anyway so they are never really alike in terms of the gameplay and story.

[NiGHTS]

If you don't think Sonic was influenced by Mario from day one I don't know what to tell you.

And I really don't see how can tie it specifically to Mario when it's stuff that's become part of general platformer conventions, just because Mario came up with a lot of it. It's not being more like Mario, it's just being more like a platformer.

 

He is right, Sonic was meant to be a Mario killer back in the day. The man himself even said, he loved Mario but he wanted something faster. A 2D platformer, hop on enemies to kill. You go forward and reach the goal, you have items to help yourself..... really in the end of it all. Sega has always glanced at Mario's direction. Without Mario there would be no Sonic. Now Nintendo has been helping Sega alot lately, so I see really no downside to this.

 

 

PS: I noticed two pages back, people are saying they gotta get use to the sudden change on how the game looks? The art style? We had it back in Sonic Colors but I didn't remember people claiming it as a jarring change.

 

Edited September 7, 2013 by Dead Master

[StaticMania]

Its more of the sudden shift from highly detailed surrealistic enviorment to a more cartoony simplistic(less detailed)enviorment. The actual setting of the levels have nothing to do with the visual style the whole game is trying to give off, if the level setting matches said style

[Bouldergeist]

He is right, Sonic was meant to be a Mario killer back in the day. The man himself even said, he loved Mario but he wanted something faster. A 2D platformer, hop on enemies to kill. You go forward and reach the goal, you have items to help yourself..... really in the end of it all. Sega has always glanced at Mario's direction. Without Mario there would be no Sonic. Now Nintendo has been helping Sega alot lately, so I see really no downside to this.

 

 

PS: I noticed two pages back, people are saying they gotta get use to the sudden change on how the game looks? The art style? We had it back in Sonic Colors but I didn't remember people claiming it as a jarring change.

 

I've just noticed you can see stars and the planet clearly in that screenshot

[Indigo Rush]

That's not a different art style, though. That's different stage theming. It's got just as much detail and "down to earth" textures as Unleashed has, but with wacky environments instead of real world settings.

Sonic Lost World not only changes up the stage theming, but it changes how the world is colored, shaded, illuminated and ultimately viewed. It's a different style of design right down to how everything is perceived by the viewer. Sonic Colors was kind of a sci-fi fantasy design while Lost World is a simple (albeit minutely detailed) cartoon.

Edited September 9, 2013 by Indigo Rush

[Narukami07]

I still couldn't fathom how some people (this was from a NeoGAF thread months ago mind you) actually thought that Sonic Lost World, in terms of visuals, looked like an "HD Wii game with Sonic Colors' models", and i'm not kidding since this actually happened after the reveal trailer. 

 

:/

Edited September 9, 2013 by Narukami07

[Mallard]

I'm honestly surprised that some people have been attacking Lost World's artsyle.

 

Yeah, it's more simplistic than Generations and Unleashed, but how is it bad exactly? I think the game, like all Sonic games really, looks gorgeous! I also love the way it's going back to the fantastic landscapes of ye olde Sonic games.

 

Totally digging the art design.

[Metal the Mario]

I'm honestly surprised that some people have been attacking Lost World's artsyle.

 

Yeah, it's more simplistic than Generations and Unleashed, but how is it bad exactly? I think the game, like all Sonic games really, looks gorgeous! I also love the way it's going back to the fantastic landscapes of ye olde Sonic games.

 

Totally digging the art design.

For some people, including me, the art style (or stage theming or whatever people have been correcting it to) just isn't their cup of tea, given what we've had previously.  That's not to say it doesn't look gorgeous or fit Sonic well; it just isn't my preference.

 

I've acknowledged that we're a pretty small minority, though.

[ArtFenix]

I'm honestly surprised that some people have been attacking Lost World's artsyle.

 

Yeah, it's more simplistic than Generations and Unleashed, but how is it bad exactly? I think the game, like all Sonic games really, looks gorgeous! I also love the way it's going back to the fantastic landscapes of ye olde Sonic games.

 

Totally digging the art design.

Because this art style looks like plastic world filled with plastic trees, plastic grass and plastic toys for enemies? Because the lighting/shading is nowhere near as good as it was in previous games? Because everything is cutified to the point when it doesn't even look like Sonic games I knew and loved? Because Sonic games were much more than this. Because this game is like Generations with all nostalgia pandering but much worse in terms of level themes rehashing and classic badniks overloads?

I always loved my Sonic games detailed and beautiful. SLoW doesn't do it for me at all. It looks bland and cheap for me. And I can't help it but feel like it looks more like a Mario game than a Sonic game.

I'm trying to find something I like about this art direction and there are a few screenshots I'm digging. Funny thing they're all more detailed or look more natural than that plastic toyish everything else.

As SuperUsername64 has said, it's not my cup of tea. Like, at all. I dislike this art direction and hope they will bring back Unleashed art style in future games. THAT was beautiful and actually felt like an existing living world, not like a bunch of random plastic toyish tube-shaped playgrounds floating in the sky for no reason.

 

I'm sorry if this sounds rude or something but I cannot express my feelings in a different way. I hate this style that much.

Edited September 10, 2013 by ArtFenix

[Faseeh]

Because this art style looks like plastic world filled with plastic trees, plastic grass and plastic toys for enemies? Because the lighting/shading is nowhere near as good as it was in previous games? Because everything is cutified to the point when it doesn't even look like Sonic games I knew and loved?

 

Hey, I think you're talking about Shadow the Hedeghog or Sonic Heroes (well, even Heroes is better than Shadow but still plastic) here. This is the Lost World section of the forum. 

 

that was a joke. a bad one. but yeah.

 

Because this game is like Generations with all nostalgia pandering but much worse in terms of level themes rehashing and classic badniks overloads?

 

How does it get worse than a game made for nostalgia and intended to look back at the past and actually copying? I mean what. What level themes have been rehashed? Okay, fine Windy Hill? Generations did that too. Frozen Factory? Generations did that too. Silent Forest, Frozen Factory the snowball one, Desert Ruins (all of it)....? Nope. 

 

I mean, yeah, to be honest, I'd like to see more new badniks too but I don't see anything wrong in bringing back a lot of the old ones AS LONG AS IT FITS, there's a VARIETY and it works. 

 

I get that you don't like the art style, and well, it just is a matter of opinion and I can respect that. 

Edited September 10, 2013 by Faseeh

[ArtFenix]

Hey, I think you're talking about Shadow the Hedeghog or Sonic Heroes (well, even Heroes is better than Shadow but still plastic) here. This is the Lost World section of the forum. 

I know perfectly fine what section of the forum this is, thank you very much.

Never been a fan of Shadow the ehdgehog art direction (although some levels DO look beautiful or nice). The only thing that's too much plastic-like in Heroes are the character models. In SLoW, however, EVERYTHING looks like plastic toys. No need for Heroes or Shadow comparisons. Those were completely different and were much better, at least Heroes was.

This looks quite natural and very nice. And it's the game from 2003!

For the more fair comparison let's show a screenshot from Generations cause it's pretty much the same art direction Heroes did but made with modern technologies. (it's still two years old and comes from the previous generation of colsoles)

...or this one. Comes from SaASRT

This looks plastic-y and toyish. Also, blocks, blocks, blocks. The whole game is made of blocks.

Now this looks better and is actually beautiful but again it doesn't really look natural. Same geometric stuff all over again.

This one shows just how lazy and bland this game's style is. Blocks, geometric 2D stuff for leaves, blocks again, repeat. Decent lighting and shading that makes sense? What is this nonsense?

And this is the next gen?! This is the future?!

 

 

 

 

I'm just extremely tired of constantly rehashing levels and badniks. Heck, there are a lot of awesome enemies from Sonic adventure, why not rehash them as well? But no, they're thinking that classic=superior and it's only partially right. I'm tired of all that bullshit about "we've decided to go back to Sonic's roots" for every single new game marketing campaigns since Unleashed! But at least the only thing Unleashed had that was heavily influenced by the classics were the 2D sections. The enemies were fine, the levels were amazing.

Edited September 10, 2013 by ArtFenix

[Zavok the SpinningSilver]

Because this art style looks like plastic world filled with plastic trees, plastic grass and plastic toys for enemies? Because the lighting/shading is nowhere near as good as it was in previous games? Because everything is cutified to the point when it doesn't even look like Sonic games I knew and loved? Because Sonic games were much more than this. Because this game is like Generations with all nostalgia pandering but much worse in terms of level themes rehashing and classic badniks overloads?

I always loved my Sonic games detailed and beautiful. SLoW doesn't do it for me at all. It looks bland and cheap for me. And I can't help it but feel like it looks more like a Mario game than a Sonic game.

I'm trying to find something I like about this art direction and there are a few screenshots I'm digging. Funny thing they're all more detailed or look more natural than that plastic toyish everything else.

As SuperUsername64 has said, it's not my cup of tea. Like, at all. I dislike this art direction and hope they will bring back Unleashed art style in future games. THAT was beautiful and actually felt like an existing living world, not like a bunch of random plastic toyish tube-shaped playgrounds floating in the sky for no reason.

 

I'm sorry if this sounds rude or something but I cannot express my feelings in a different way. I hate this style that much.

 

I agree with this somewhat. Art, the plastic - like look and the more cutsified style is something that isn't very much my cup of tea. It's like how Indy said about the difference between Colors and Lost World, instead of the more sci -fi / anime / cartoon I don't really know the word this is tough to name on the spot design I'd usually associate with Sonic, it's more of an in - your - face  "THIS IS A CARTOON" take that I'd usually save for something like Mario. Especially with many of the badniks, original concept art based design or no.

 

I'm just a bigger fan of this

 

 

than I am of this

 

 

It's not exactly my cup of tea, but I will say that it looks pretty good regardless. It's grown a little on me as I've seen more of it, and the little details are an unexpected but nice touch. As it's own thing, it's not OMG THE WORST THING IN EXISTENCE KILL IT WITH FIRE. I do want to go back to an Unleashed based artstyle, as I feel it was the perfect blend of fantastic detail and cartoony / anime flair. For what it's worth though, it does provide some good variety.

 

Just sayin.'

[Faseeh]

I know perfectly fine what section of the forum this is, thank you very much.

Never been a fan of Shadow the ehdgehog art direction (although some levels DO look beautiful or nice). The only thing that's too much plastic-like in Heroes are the character models. In SLoW, however, EVERYTHING looks like plastic toys. No need for Heroes or Shadow comparisons. Those were completely different and were much better, at least Heroes was.

 

>better art direction

 

You mean you prefer the art direction.

 

Honestly tho, I really do think Lost World looks more vibrant, lively than those two games.

 

 

I'm just extremely tired of constantly rehashing levels and badniks. Heck, there are a lot of awesome enemies from Sonic adventure, why not rehash them as well? But no, they're thinking that classic=superior and it's only partially right. 

 

This is where it comes in. You see despite the huge variety of badniks, a lot of fans can remember a lot of the ones, or at least how they looked like. They had a certain charm as compared to re-used standard GUN Bots from SA2. 

 

Adventure had cool badniks too, but not as memorable. The only memorable one I can think of is Rhinotank and Cop Speeder. Those won't fit here. Just slotting in enemies is not cool. There's no fun to that. Colours did Egg Pawns amazingly from Samurais to Chefs. Without that variety and overall how-it-works-with-the-stage, they're just there and kinda yeah know.... 'unsonic-y'.

[ArtFenix]

Rehashing only classic was only half of my point. The other half is - stop with rehashing! Make something new! This is something Sonic 4 episode 2 did a great job of! The, while not being entirely original, still looked very creative, the art style was amazing, as were the graphics, the badniks were NEW but felt like classic badniks.

The adventure enemies are more preferred but it's just me. I like it when it's something more than "little creatures got captured and turned into robots resembling enemies" stuff. That's why I love the E-series robots. The concept stayed the same, yet the look of the robots was much more cool.

[Straw Hat]

Oh for the LOVE OF FUCK...

[Kuzu]

Gettin real tired of the same pattern whenever I read this thread:

 

>Artfenix says he doesn't like artstyle

 

>Everyone tells him he's "wrong"

 

>Lather, Rinse, Repeat a few weeks later.

 

 

Can we talk about something else for change people? How many fucking times are we going to have to read the same shit whenever any mention of artstyle comes up. For the love of Christ, its not that serious.

 

 

Music, Story, Boss Concepts, anything. But no, its always the fucking artstyle.

Edited September 10, 2013 by Azure Yakuzu

[ArtFenix]

Gettin real tired of the same pattern whenever I read this thread:

 

>Artfenix says he doesn't like artstyle

 

>Everyone tells him he's "wrong"

 

>Lather, Rinse, Repeat a few weeks later.

 

 

Can we talk about something else for change people? How many fucking times are we going to have to read the same shit whenever any mention of artstyle comes up. For the love of Christ, its not that serious.

I just replied to the question of Mallard...It's backfiring as usual.

[Kuzu]

I just replied to the question of Mallard...It's backfiring as usual.

 

Was it necessary tho? We already know you hate the artstyle, so why repeat it again when you know what happens when you do?

 

I'm not saying you're not allowed to have post opinion but if you know its not a popular one, there's really no good reason to keep on repeating it. Or at the very least talk about something else.

Edited September 10, 2013 by Azure Yakuzu

[ArtFenix]

Was it necessary tho? We already know you hate the artstyle, so why repeat it again when you know what happens when you do?

 

I'm not saying you're not allowed to have post opinion but if you know its not a popular one, there's really no good reason to keep on repeating it. Or at the very least talk about something else.

I felt like replying to Mallard. It's my right. Was it necessary to try to make me "wrong" again after I did? I don't think so. Sorry, I don't think I'm the person to blame for repeating the circle again. And posting only "popular" opinions destroys the purpose of any forum.

Edited September 10, 2013 by ArtFenix

[Kuzu]

I felt like replying to Mallard. It's my right. Was it necessary to try to make me "wrong" again after I did? I don't think so. Sorry, I don't think I'm the person to blame for repeating the circle again. And posting only "popular" opinions destroys the purpose of any forum.

 

Oh don't get the wrong idea, I blame everyone because. Just like how you said its not necessary for people to prove you wrong, its not necessary for you to keep repeating the same statement "I hate the artstyle" when we already fucking know. We get it.

 

I almost get the feeling that you're intentionally doing this to piss people off.

 

 

EDIT: Ya know what screw it, I'm just going to go back and ignore this thread and let the mods handle it. 

Edited September 10, 2013 by Azure Yakuzu

[ArtFenix]

Oh no, don't blame me for supposedly bringing back the heated topic. It was already brought up even before I posted. people were discussing this without me but when I posted myself I somehow "ruined" the discussion? Lolwut. Does that make me "not allowed" to contribute?! Riiiiiight....

[Mallard]

Uh, what's going on. I asked a question and ArtFenix answered it, politely. I don't quite understand the heated atmosphere here.

 

I get the feeling I have missed a bit of a discussion on artstyle . Sorry if I dragged it back up, I am new here.

 

But anyway, I'll try to address ArtFenix's comments.

 

Because this art style looks like plastic world filled with plastic trees, plastic grass and plastic toys for enemies? Because the lighting/shading is nowhere near as good as it was in previous games? Because everything is cutified to the point when it doesn't even look like Sonic games I knew and loved? Because Sonic games were much more than this. Because this game is like Generations with all nostalgia pandering but much worse in terms of level themes rehashing and classic badniks overloads?

I always loved my Sonic games detailed and beautiful. SLoW doesn't do it for me at all. It looks bland and cheap for me. And I can't help it but feel like it looks more like a Mario game than a Sonic game.

I'm trying to find something I like about this art direction and there are a few screenshots I'm digging. Funny thing they're all more detailed or look more natural than that plastic toyish everything else.

As SuperUsername64 has said, it's not my cup of tea. Like, at all. I dislike this art direction and hope they will bring back Unleashed art style in future games. THAT was beautiful and actually felt like an existing living world, not like a bunch of random plastic toyish tube-shaped playgrounds floating in the sky for no reason.

 

I'm sorry if this sounds rude or something but I cannot express my feelings in a different way. I hate this style that much.

So..if I'm reading this correctly, your main criticisms are the rehashing and that the art design is plasticy and too cartoony.

 

I disagree with you on the rehashing front. Yeah, they are reusing old badniks, but I think that's great. Sonic has a rich culture of badniks and baddies, why not draw on them? Yeah, I would like to have some new badniks, but isn't it a bit nitpicky to be upset over new badniks? It's common for platformers to repeat enemies: Mario is a brilliant example.

 

I think most people's complaints about Sonic 4's rehashing was on level themes rather than badniks (and especially bosses).

 

As to your other point, I can see where you are coming from. It's coming from Sonic Team's idea in thinking that Sonic was more kiddie in the 90s than he actually was: look at Classic Sonic in Generations who is way more cuddly and teddy bear like than he was in the 90s. So yeah, I'd agree the game's art style is too plasticy and cartoonish.

 

However, I still think it looks great and is very Sonic. I agree with you that Generations has the better artstyle, but I think the main reason for the art style being simplified is to help with the gameplay. I.E. reduce the clutter of backgrounds Generations occassionly suffered from (Classic Green Hill is a great example) and help make more expansive levels due to the simplified art design (which shifts development power from graphics to gameplay).

 

That's what I would say in response