The Trayvon Martin Case

[Nepenthe]

He wasn't. The closest that happened is his neighborhood settled out of court. I was referring to the fact that the character assassination happened the second the media got wind of the case. I was also commenting on the irony of saying if someone popped him off then it was merely karma; compared to pretty much every post you made on the topic before the verdict was handed down.     For example:

I didn't wish him or call for him to be physically harmed. To be honest, I'd rather he spend his days in misery. I just said, on the off chance that someone does take matters into their own hands, I'm not going to shed a tear. I don't consider apathy for his life equivalent to telling someone to go out and murder him. Some people I don't care about; he's one of them.

[Patticus]

I'm less interested in the ruling than I am in the precedent the ruling sets. What kind of precedent is it?

[PSI Wind]

If it was a black man shooting a white man, he'd be found guilty.

[Voyant]

I didn't wish him or call for him to be physically harmed. To be honest, I'd rather he spend his days in misery. I just said, on the off chance that someone does take matters into their own hands, I'm not going to shed a tear. I don't consider apathy for his life equivalent to telling someone to go out and murder him. Some people I don't care about; he's one of them.

 

Like I said living a life in misery is way more deserving than just for someone to kill him off. Its a bittersweet feeling for me honestly.

 

 

If it was a black man shooting a white man, he'd be found guilty. 

 

 

Its really sad how true this is. I try my best to not bring race into an argument these days, but its true for this occasion. He would have been in jail a long time ago.

Edited July 14, 2013 by Voyant

[Wraith]

I'm less interested in the ruling than I am in the precedent the ruling sets. What kind of precedent is it?

 

 

That you can basically get away with blatant homicide if you target the right race and just cry "self defense!". Who knows how much more homicide could take place now that people know they could very well get away with it.

[PSI Wind]

Why do I still live in this shitty state anyways?

[Patticus]

So you're saying that the justice system is marred by institutionalized racism? In certain parts of this country, that sounds like a not unreasonable assertion to make.

[DGam'r]

If it was a black man shooting a white man, he'd be found guilty.

And if Trayvon Martin was white Zimmerman would be in jail.

[KittyNakajima]

I'm less interested in the ruling than I am in the precedent the ruling sets. What kind of precedent is it?

 

That it basically allows you to gun someone down in self defense. Despite the fact that you had previously followed them, potentially scaring them into a frenzy that was enough for you to use deadly force.

 

Excuse my language, but fucking bullshit.

 

Zimmerman is going to be another Casey Anthony. Looking over his shoulder and sleeping with one eye opened, worrying about that one person who is just pissed enough over the verdict to put that anger into action.

 

He is not going to have a normal life, regardless of how much he tries from this point forward. It will always be drilled in the back of his head that he took the life of someone over a cloud of assumptions he had swimming in his head during a neighborhood watch patrol.

[Tornado]

Opinions can change quite drastically when injustice happens. The problem is people depend on a certain system to do what right in the end...but when that doesn't happen...or WHEN IT KEEPS happening then what? We should let killer roam the streets happily?

 

Zimmerman was probably guilty as hell, yeah; but everything from the start of this case reeked of incompetence. Incompetence on the part of the media outlets, for failing to present the story in an impartial way leading the entire thing to look like some sort of personal hack job (NBC doctored the fucking 911 calls for crying out loud). Incompetence on the part of the police for failing to properly process the crime at first, instead just letting the guy go until public pressure caused them to cave and actually charge him with something. Incompetence on the politicians who got involved, making this an argument about self defense laws when they never should have been considered in the first place. And most importantly, incompetence on the part of the prosecutors for trying to get him on charges that they were most certainly never going to get after the above three scandals broke. Beyond reasonable doubt is the law for legal trials; and with all that shit being pushed on to this case, they were never going to get it with the way they ran the case.

 

 

 

And more importantly, most of the stuff has been known for a year now. Opinions shouldn't change that drastically from "the most we can hope for is a fair trial where he's charged with manslaughter" to practically condoning that someone put a bullet in Zimmerman.

 

 

I'm less interested in the ruling than I am in the precedent the ruling sets. What kind of precedent is it?

 

There won't be any. This has always been too much of a clusterfuck of a case for people on either side of the Castle Doctrine argument to call this a victory. It would be political suicide to touch this case, so no policy will come of it; and it will be controversial far beyond the ability to use it as proof in any future cases.

[Voyant]

 Opinions shouldn't change that drastically from "the most we can hope for is a fair trial where he's charged with manslaughter" to practically condoning that someone put a bullet in Zimmerman.

 

I don't see why not. :/

[SIXTH-RATE SOMA]

I don't see why not. :/

 

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

 

Basically, "righteous" or not, let's not all become homicidal jerks chasing after a homicidal jerk.

Edited July 14, 2013 by Sixth-Rate Soma

[KittyNakajima]

On Twitter right now, and while not surprised, the hashtag #IfIEverSawZimmerman is trending. In light of what happened with that teenager getting arrested for making sarcastic comments on Facebook, people really, really should be careful what they're saying right now.

 

First Amendment aside - I hope that tact is in the back of your mind when discussing this matter. It's almost a given that anything said about this right now is going to be heavily charged, but internet 101 also dictates that you can't indicate tone via text.

 

TL;DR - Don't write something that you wouldn't do or say, even if it's in a "joking" tone.

[PSI Wind]

Should I be scared living in Florida or would it just be Orlando?

[Conando]

Are you black? Then get the hell out as fast as you can.

[novelty]

Am I the only one who finds Zimmerman in a fair trial? Seriously, Everyone is up in arms about this because of what he looks like...but I do not see it that way. Zimmerman's alleged intent was not for advancement but for self-defense, and since the situation is in that category, then there is leeway to see what good can come from that situation. If Zimmerman outright said that he would "kill him to save the town" or "kill him because hes up to no good", then we have an murder in our hands and a focused intent for advancing his life. I just find the amount of white racism horrendous on other social networking sites, and I just do not agree with "If a white man kills a black man, the white man should spend life in jail".

 

Like I said when I commented on some other statuses: Zimmerman allegedly attacked Trayvon to save his "own life and the life of others". O.J. allegedly attacked Nicole and Ronald for "non-threatning reasons". Both got the same verdict. Think about it.

[PSI Wind]

Are you black? Then get the hell out as fast as you can.

No, but riots still scare me.

[Nepenthe]

No one hates him because he's Hispanic. People are angry that a known killer of a minor- the person who escalated the situation and ignored protocol and instruction- is not spending a day in jail. The price of our justice system is that truthfully guilty people sometimes get away because we start with a presumption of innocence. Zimmerman is one of the examples.

[Solly]

Thing is, self-defense couldn't be provably debunked. As long as Zimmerman feared death or great bodily harm, then it's within the law. And even if Zimmerman were the aggressor (still not proven) Martin wasn't (from a legal standpoint) acting in self-defense if he was hitting him while he was on the ground. We can hate the jury all we want but handing down another verdict would be hard. The anger should be directed toward the laws and definitions themselves.

 

The price of our justice system is that guilty people get away because we start with a presumption of innocence.

And yet, it's better this way, to let a potential criminal go than to put even more innocent people at risk of imprisonment.

Before you ask, no, I'm not deluding myself into thinking this doesn't already happen.

[Voyant]

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

 

Basically, "righteous" or not, let's not all become homicidal jerks chasing after a homicidal jerk.

 

Batman logic has never made sense to me. I know the joker lives on for the sake of the comic book...but reeeeaally that guy should have been done in a long time ago.

 

Not calling Zim "The Joker" here, but you can see what I'm saying. Despite this I don't think Zim is the type to ever pull something like this again after this scandal, this is one of those situations where you really got to reassess yourself.

Edited July 14, 2013 by Voyant

[CanofEpicSauce]

I smell a riot...

[turbojet]

You don't fucking shoot one of us and grin in our faces and shake our hands the next.

 

I am never forgetting this.

 

For anyone saying that this is not about race, fuck you, you entitled prick.

 

There are a litany of examples I can use.I am not going to act like a pseudo lawyer although I have more knowledge about law than most in this board. This was a classic example of critical race theory in the legal field. They stigmatized Trayvon as a thug when he was wearing khaki's with rolled up pants legs and a hoodie that looked nowhere near as intimidating as the defense made it out to be because he was black. Even before the trial, the police did not question the shooter and then did a toxicology on the dead body and a criminal background check on Martin. Not Zimmerman with a gun. You wonder why black people cry racism? You just fucking saw it. Regardless of the media frenzy perpetuating courtroom drama as the next reality television in place of news of revolutions around the world, this verdict sickens me and is why justice is a farce.

[Autosaver]

At least his reputation and life is ruined. He's not getting out of court without thousands of people being upset at him.

[Brad]

There's gonna be a hell of a uproar, I'm sure of it. This guy isn't ever going to live this down. He'll always have this hanging over his head, the media will keep his presence known, and people will not let him really be happy; at least for a while. I think that's the only slight positive outcome of this. 

[Nepenthe]

The anger should be directed toward the laws and definitions themselves.

Indeed we should, because it's asinine that being followed with a handgun is not reasonable enough for laws to assume you also have the burden of self defense. (Also, we don't know that Trayvon was "pummeling" Zimmerman from atop the entire time. That was never concretely established.)

I also want to say, I'm tired of this notion that the system is literally working when guilty men go free. That isn't a feature, it's a bug. An assurance that the system is the best thing we can think of, but I don't see why this in and of itself is celebratory. The system works well enough that we're kinda comfortable with it. But let's not consider this justice actually working. Again, the killer of an unarmed minor who escalated the situation went free. This is not ideal.