An atheist remark

[Random Rhyme]

Science/Logic? says its not possible to prove Gods existence so in the view of Science God don't exist.

Wouldn't it be more like:

in the view of Science we don't know if God exists or not.

[Pelly <3's U]

I consider myself fairly religious. Yeah, I think that was offensive. BUT. Your friend definitely overreacted.

So there.

So do you think it can be found offensive if someone says God exists?

[Random Rhyme]

So do you think it can be found offensive if someone says God exists?

I think that would depend on the person and how they take it.

[Pelly <3's U]

haha well of course it would, I think that could be said about anything. I'm asking if he specifically thinks, that since he found what I said offensive.

[Patticus]

Huh, I don't really think religion was created as a means of control. It's clear we all need something to believe in. It probably came naturally.

Religion, superstition and paranormal stuff in general evolved into existence as the go-to excuse(s) for any and all natural phenomena that mankind could not otherwise explain away - which was, for most of human existence, everything. Thunderstorm? Thor's having a fight! Bad harvest? Gods are angry! War going badly? God's on the other guy's team. Sun moving across the sky? Sun god has a flaming chariot! Stars and planets moving in the night sky over days, weeks, months and years? We're clearly in the centre of the universe! And so on.

Religion ultimately derives from the very Human quest for knowledge, our need to find explanations for everything that happens, in life and in death. Science derives from the same source. Theist or atheist, we all just want to find out more about the world we live in; and we do that by reading religious books and scientific journals, performing experiments and reading sermons, conducting research and archaeological or palaeontological excavations, stuff like that. It's like a forked path; some people travel one road, some the other.

I personally believe (and I know that what I believe the world ought to be and what it actually is are two different things) that religion's necessity and influence should by rights diminish inexorably toward oblivion as science advances, self-corrects and finds compelling explanations for the previously inexplicable over time, but I can't see that happening; in part due to our (perhaps eternal?) inability to prove/disprove god(s) with decisive evidence, and in part because people will always seek the comfort religion can bring.

Who doesn't like comfort?

[The Weeb with No Name]

Hmm.

What if, hypothetically, there was a religion that combined the "supernatural" with scientific evidence, grounding theistic concept in reality with irrefutable proof?

I mean not that any such thing exists of course you know just saying.

[Patticus]

You're asking a big question there: What if the twin pathways of science and religion converged again? What if indeed.

For the record, I haven't the faintest idea what might happen, but I know that certain groups are trying to turn Christianity into that religion (tieing fossil evidence to early man, disregarding carbon dating and evidence of evolution and so on), and I believe that Scientology also is trying to be that religion in its own twisted way. The trouble is, both sets of people (one being a minority part of a much larger whole) seem predisposed to ignore a great mass of scientific knowledge if it doesn't fit their somewhat narrower, less flexible world views. That ultimately leads to the continued separation of the two hypothetical paths.

[SuperStingray]

So do you think it can be found offensive if someone says God exists?

The thing is though, that's not necessarily reciprocable, Atheists don't follow science the same way the religious follow their faiths. They believe in it, but they don't consider it sacred, they consider it objective. Telling a religious person that God doesn't exist is like taking away a kid's teddy bear and throwing it in an incinerator where telling an atheist God exists is more like tickling behind his ear.

For the record, I haven't the faintest idea what might happen, but I know that certain groups are trying to turn Christianity into that religion (tieing fossil evidence to early man, disregarding carbon dating and evidence of evolution and so on), and I believe that Scientology also is trying to be that religion in its own twisted way.

I have nothing against Scientology as a faith. Intelligent aliens and angels are equally esoteric concepts. My problem is with them militantly trying to sue anything that so much as coughs in their church's general direction.

[Patticus]

They don't just sue: they follow people, they spy on those who try to and successfully do leave the organisation as well as those trying to find out about it (documentary film crews etc), their representatives deliberately use tactics in debates designed to rile up quite badly the person attempting to discuss the group or its activities. They're a thuggish cult dressed up as a religion, extracting vast sums of money from its membership, using duped celebrities and a huge portfolio of properties to add an air of respectability and credibility to the whole operation.

[Flyboy Fox]

And if you're ever moronic enough to let them have your contacts details, they will NOT leave you alone, EVER. *Cringes and drags an embarrassed hand down face* FFFFFFF....

[188Eternal]

LOL DON'T YOU KNOW EVERYONE WHO USES THE INTERNET AND PLAY GAMES ARE ATHEISTS?

Actually, there's this one dude who I know from the Heretic & Hexen community who is a very big-time Christian. He even posts statuses on Facebook along the lines of: "Reading the Bible by candle light... Intense!"

^Seriously, statuses like that make me wish that Facebook had some kind of a "dislike" button beside that over-rated "like" button.

This dude gets so angry on Instant Messenger whenever I start explaining to him my theory of all religions being an extra-terrestrial conspiracy for the doom of the Earthling human race. He gets so angry that he keeps blocking me out.

Then after a few days he cools off and unblocks me.

The only real reason why we even bother maintaining contact with each other is because Hexen& Heretic are very old games which hardly anyone plays anymore and we need people to play with.

So basically, me and him are just using each other for some online deathmatches despite being twats to each other.

And I'm also aware of religious nutters on Twitter and FormSpring and YouTube who are stalking one of my favourite celebrities and trying to sway her from atheism.

Anyways, despite being an atheist myself, I find myself guilty of either typing or saying or thinking the phrase: "oh god no, not again" ... Especially whenever I log in to see the nutters on the prowl.

Edited January 26, 2011 by DarkJedi188

[Emmett L. Brown]

I was raised religious, but eventually all my beliefs failed to stand up to the scrutiny of common sense and self-contradicting religious texts, so I defaulted to atheism. Having made my peace with the idea that there were never any gods to begin with, and that our lives are in our own hands, I see absolutely no point in trying to convince anyone else of this. Having something to believe in is comforting, and I really think it motivates a lot of people to do good things they otherwise would not have thought to do. As long as they're not using their religion as an excuse to torment or persecute others, I encourage spirituality and faith in something greater. But those who do use religions as a means to make the world a worse place to live in I despise all the more for perverting and corrupting what's supposed to help people co-exist peacefully.

So, basically, my notion is; gods not real, but religion a positive force, and extremists are assholes. With regards to this thread, I would say athiests should just respect religious people. Unless they're misusing their faith, getting them to abandon it won't accomplish anything at all.

[Flyboy Fox]

I definitely agree that religion doesn't HAVE to be a negative thing. If it helps people to live their lives and be comforted in times of need and to have an extra incentive to be good to one another, then that's great. It's only when it becomes a political lever or an instrument of judgement that it gets bad.

As a confirmed atheist, I have sometimes really envied the religious for their conviction in their faith. It must be nice to always feel loved and to have someone to reach out to in times of pain, and to know that no matter what hardships you face you will eventually have eternal peace and paradise and be reunited with your loved ones as long as you live a 'good' life by their religion's standards.

Sadly, the conflict between 'ways' of living that life 'right' between different religions and even different factions of religions lead me to believe that there is no way to be certain of going to heaven even if you believe in it =P

[Enraged Psycho]

As a confirmed atheist, I have sometimes really envied the religious for their conviction in their faith. It must be nice to always feel loved and to have someone to reach out to in times of pain, and to know that no matter what hardships you face you will eventually have eternal peace and paradise and be reunited with your loved ones as long as you live a 'good' life by their religion's standards.

I do not envy the ignorant. They can indulge themselves in delusions of grandeur as much as they like. People choose the outcome they find most comforting, irregardless of how illogical it may be. This is the fault of the Human mind, as we always need something to try and gratify and validate our actions. It is amazing how far people will go to try and bend others to their will. People wield their faith like it gives them divine protection from whatever horrific actions they may wish to commit. This inscessant need to subsume others and use God as an excuse for doing anything they want, is mainly the reason I despise religious people. Edited February 1, 2011 by Enraged Psycho

[LunarEdge]

I do not envy the ignorant. They can indulge themselves in delusions of grandeur as much as they like. People choose the outcome they find most comforting, irregardless of how illogical it may be. This is the fault of the Human mind, as we always need something to try and gratify and validate our actions. It is amazing how far people will go to try and bend others to their will. People wield their faith like it gives them divine protection from whatever horrific actions they may wish to commit. This inscessant need to subsume others and use God as an excuse for doing anything they want, is mainly the reason I despise religious people.

[Enraged Psycho]

To me, putting a gargantuan ammount of faith in something with almost no evidence whatsoever to support it, is in my honest opinion, completely misplaced, and being strongly aethiest myself, I see people believing in something which doesn't exist, ignorant. It is true that I was blunt in my presentation of my belief, but I don't see a need to beat around the bush. To me, the entire notion of religion is simply baffling in terms of just....How? How have so many fallen for this illusion? How have so many forfeited their lives to the pursuit of it?

Edited February 2, 2011 by Enraged Psycho

[LunarEdge]

To me, putting a gargantuan ammount of faith in something with almost no evidence whatsoever to support it, is in my honest opinion, completely misplaced, and being strongly aethiest myself, I see people believing in something which doesn't exist, ignorant. It is true that I was blunt in my presentation of my belief, but I don't see a need to beat around the bush. To me, the entire notion of religion is simply baffling in terms of just....How? How have so many fallen for this illusion? How have so many forfeited their lives to the pursuit of it?

Edited February 2, 2011 by LunarEdge

[Ekaje]

I do not envy the ignorant. They can indulge themselves in delusions of grandeur as much as they like. People choose the outcome they find most comforting, irregardless of how illogical it may be. This is the fault of the Human mind, as we always need something to try and gratify and validate our actions. It is amazing how far people will go to try and bend others to their will. People wield their faith like it gives them divine protection from whatever horrific actions they may wish to commit. This inscessant need to subsume others and use God as an excuse for doing anything they want, is mainly the reason I despise religious people.

Uh...not all religious people are extremist crusaders who use God as an excuse for all their actions. Most people I know haven't "forfeited their lives" and let it affect every aspect of their day to day lives, you wouldn't even know they were religious unless you specifically asked them.

Edited February 2, 2011 by Ekaje

[Lady Lily]

I'm not a religious person at all. But, I believe when it comes to the whole science part of it, people are scared of what they can't explain. They see it as a threat and need to know everything. If we were meant to know everything then we'd know it already. There are just something we're not meant to know, and we should leave it at that. Let people believe what they want and just deal with it. I actually like listening to other people's beliefs.

[Enraged Psycho]

Uh...not all religious people are extremist crusaders who use God as an excuse for all their actions. Most people I know haven't "forfeited their lives" and let it affect every aspect of their day to day lives, you wouldn't even know they were religious unless you specifically asked them.

I'm plainly aware of this, I never pretended it wasn't a generalisation, perhaps a poor choice of words originally. However, it has been the spawn of multitudes of wrong-doings not just at the moment, but throughout our history. The fact that shit like this goes on in the world constantly is enough. Heard of Rhoanda? Every person I know who is religious, is either a hyper-zealotic nutjob who tries to enforce their beliefs on others, or...Well, actually, there isn't an 'or'.

If you mean their beliefs are ignorant, than thats fine (in a sense), I just mean ignorant in a sense of general knowledge. The most religious of people can be much smarter than you and I.

I meant in terms of their beliefs. It's entirely likely that a religious person could be my intellectual superior.

Let people believe what they want and just deal with it. I actually like listening to other people's beliefs.

I allow people to believe whatever they want, I was simply expressing my concern over religion as a whole. There are always exceptions, (Uh-Oh, paradox.) but something which can, and has caused this much trouble and discontent should be treated with a wary eye. Edited February 2, 2011 by Enraged Psycho

[Ekaje]

I'm plainly aware of this, I never pretended it wasn't a generalisation, perhaps a poor choice of words originally. However, it has been the spawn of multitudes of wrong-doings not just at the moment, but throughout our history. The fact that shit like this goes on in the world constantly is enough. Heard of Rhoanda? Every person I know who is religious, is either a hyper-zealotic nutjob who tries to enforce their beliefs on others, or...Well, actually, there isn't an 'or'.

[Enraged Psycho]

Also, I may just be being pessimistic, but I think that even without religion, people would still find reasons to justify commiting atrocities across history.

This is most definitely true. As I said, we are always looking for reasons to validate/justify our actions, however poor or misguided. If there wasn't religion, we would certainly find something else. Would it worse though? Food for thought. Edited February 3, 2011 by Enraged Psycho