Confirmed: Iizuka is at Sega of America "Rumour: Overseeing Multiple Sonic Games/SOA to be Sonic Hub"

[Shadowlax]

On 4/17/2016 at 10:30 PM, SSF1991 said:

 

 

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I think time between games doesnt work for them, people still remember as we have all noticed time and again. I think they should put the work in, but people shitting on sonic is going to continue. It happened recently with 5secondfolms. I think sonic costituting so little of their game revenue is why they are trying to exspand sonic. But again folks are thinking and taking time.

 

[SSF1991]

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not excuses not try especially in this market.

Well, considering Sonic's situation right now, getting experimental and taking risks is not the best course of action for the time being.

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You act as if sega exists in a vaccume,

They don't. But they're in a very unique situation.

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yeah there are some chances to take, and it takes a while but you get a bunch of worth while things to sell, to fund your other things. 

Except SEGA doesn't need to do that. What's at stake isn't so much their finances, but their reputation.

You can be the richest company out there, but if no one has faith in it you're not going to get anywhere.

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I think sonic costituting so little of their game revenue is why they are trying to exspand sonic.

Um, no. That's not the reason at all. In fact SEGA considers Sonic as one of their cash cow IPs. Part of their restructure initiative, which SEGA spoke of, was to focus more on them.

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I think they should put the work in, but people shitting on sonic is going to continue.

It's going to happen no matter what SEGA does, but that doesn't mean SEGA should get reckless.

[Shadowlax]

That isnt experimental. Exspanding your brand investing in a "universe" is one of the safest bets of the modern age of entertainment. From nintendo to activision to disney expanding how folks can interact with their more cartoony characters. Its a safe ass bet .

I dont think their situation is that unique. They have some odd circumstances sure, but not to the point they cant be compared.

They kind of do. You said themselves they have limied staff, segas income last time i saw was on the down tic and iirc sega themelves about the monitary pains of hd development espically for a character who's gimic renders the most expensive part , the enviromemt useless. You know what fixes that? Alternate revenue streams. Diversify 

 

They think they think they can make more money with sonic and are expanding. Which was What i said and my point, but ok.

 

As mentioned before it not reckless its future prepping. Build a solid foundation.

[molul]

I'm having a hard time understanding the latest posts. Are you saying that Sonic Boom was a safe bet for Sega to sell more Sonic stuff and use the money to make better games?

If so, I can't say it looks like a better plan than investing on quality games.

But I hate Sonic Boom design, so my words are not meant to be the Holy Truth

[Shadowlax]

I think sonic boom is a poorly excuted excellent concept.

 

[molul]

What would that concept be and how do you think they should have executed it?

[Shadowlax]

1 hour ago, molul said:

What would that concept be and how do you think they should have executed it?

Sonic Boom in itself is trying be " adventure in spirit" trying to do something adventre-ey but not having to commit to everything that comes with that, I mean they already messed up by including shadow but its whatever. \

That isn't to suggest sonic boom is perfect I for one thing they made a giant mistake making the chracters so lanky and there plenty of examples on the net of bulking up characters, with out having to do that. Knuckles could have been salavaged via this method. Its also odd they didn't do that considering this falls inline with ratchet and clank type anatomy. But I can't complain to much because as much as I don't like the designs most peoples issues seem to be with in the games instead of their designs and their somewhat annoying presentation of such games 

 

The execution error is simple, they made bad product and it now reflects poorly on the rest of it. How they should have excited it, they should have been watchful and informed about RedButton and all its going on's. They should have released better products, and a more complete one because there are definitely some unfinished things in that game. And this would have been an interesting expansion to sonic instead of " an unneeded reboot" as many have dubbed it. Now its starts off with very poor word of mouth which is going to hurt it to some degree , but can walk back from. 

Now if you are talking about the games how to fix those, now while I would like to have  along conversation about game design and how sega for whatever reason thinks when it comes to fighting in a sonic games thinks we are complete idiots and shouldn't and more studio's should be less afraid to make a strait up action games because many times puzzle elements fall completely flat.. That is reserved for a a specific type of thread that isn't this one. 

[SSF1991]

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That isnt experimental. Exspanding your brand investing in a "universe" is one of the safest bets of the modern age of entertainment. From nintendo to activision to disney expanding how folks can interact with their more cartoony characters. Its a safe ass bet .

What? Perhaps there's a misunderstanding here, because I wasn't referring to Boom. I was referring to Sonic as a whole.

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I dont think their situation is that unique. They have some odd circumstances sure, but not to the point they cant be compared.

Very few companies, if any, have had the history that SEGA and Sonic has. No other franchise has been on such a wild roller coaster ride in quality and still be recieving new games. No other company since Atari has made it so far with hardware, only to fall so hard.

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They kind of do. You said themselves they have limied staff, segas income last time i saw was on the down tic and iirc sega themelves about the monitary pains of hd development espically for a character who's gimic renders the most expensive part , the enviromemt useless. You know what fixes that? Alternate revenue streams. Diversify 

SEGA of America has limited staff, and they've basically become the ones that seem to be developing Sonic titles now. SEGA's income has only been on the down tic because of the lack of pachinko/pachislot machines and just the somewhat quieter 2015 as a whole (They themselves mentioned the lack of releases for the machines is to blame in their reports). And SEGA does release a lot of non-Sonic titles.

12 hours ago, Shadowlax said:

As mentioned before it not reckless its future prepping. Build a solid foundation.

There's nothing solid about a ton of Sonic titles being released every year. It's a mess. And I've already explained in previous posts why its reckless.

[Chris Knopps]

I will repeat this...

Multiple Sonic titles in a year/a short amount of time isn't a bad thing/a mess, it's all about making a product consumers expect out of the franchise.

This whole "SLOW DOWN!! ONE GAME ONLY!!!" mindset... Oy... These are professionals, they've proven to be competent in releasing several Sonic games simultaneously. Just because recently they come off as a barrel of monkeys doesn't mean they have to be treated as such.

With any luck this years anniversary game and F&I will do just fine, and even if not, I look forward to the possibility of exclusive and unique handheld titles returning alongside console titles.

[Nepenthe]

Making multiple games on different platforms is something Sega has done since the franchise's inception, so I don't really believe it's the smoking gun that's been the source of all the franchise's woes, particularly when Sega is capable of outsourcing stuff like the the handheld games, Superstars series, and Riders to different studios. Plus, we have no idea how Sonic Team has fared over the years in terms of burnout; merely saying it's happening doesn't mean it actually is happening unless you have anecdotal evidence on hand. Honestly, the simplest answer to it all to me is that they fell victim to dumbass management either on part of directors, producers, Sega execs, or some combination of all three.

[Shadowlax]

29 minutes ago, Nepenthe said:

Honestly, the simplest answer to it all to me is that they fell victim to dumbass management either on part of directors, producers, Sega execs, or some combination of all three.

Probably. Sega has a history of this, to this day. 

LIke not checking what a developer is doing under their employ to find out they have cultivated a pile of shit. And one of the times that happened, said developer stole millions of dollars from them.

 

[Mauricius]

11 hours ago, Nepenthe said:

Making multiple games on different platforms is something Sega has done since the franchise's inception, so I don't really believe it's the smoking gun that's been the source of all the franchise's woes, particularly when Sega is capable of outsourcing stuff like the the handheld games, Superstars series, and Riders to different studios. Plus, we have no idea how Sonic Team has fared over the years in terms of burnout; merely saying it's happening doesn't mean it actually is happening unless you have anecdotal evidence on hand. Honestly, the simplest answer to it all to me is that they fell victim to dumbass management either on part of directors, producers, Sega execs, or some combination of all three.

It's still ONE of the problems. I can agree that the lack of good ideas and bad execution is a result of dumb management, but the lack of polish present in many 3d titles is the result of having little time to fix bugs and improve controls. I think Sonic Team should either make one game at the time or separate into multiple teams with MORE developers. And handheld titles could still be made by different developers, like you said.

[SSF1991]

22 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

I will repeat this...

Multiple Sonic titles in a year/a short amount of time isn't a bad thing/a mess, it's all about making a product consumers expect out of the franchise.

This whole "SLOW DOWN!! ONE GAME ONLY!!!" mindset... Oy... These are professionals, they've proven to be competent in releasing several Sonic games simultaneously. Just because recently they come off as a barrel of monkeys doesn't mean they have to be treated as such.

...Didn't we already go through this with you? An entire debate ensued, in fact...

22 hours ago, Nepenthe said:

Making multiple games on different platforms is something Sega has done since the franchise's inception, so I don't really believe it's the smoking gun that's been the source of all the franchise's woes, particularly when Sega is capable of outsourcing stuff like the the handheld games, Superstars series, and Riders to different studios.

No one's really saying it's the smoking gun, though. But it is one of the problems, in my opinion.

The main issue, to me is simply the Sonic game being good or not.

[Shadowlax]

8 hours ago, Mauricius said:

It's still ONE of the problems. I can agree that the lack of good ideas and bad execution is a result of dumb management, but the lack of polish present in many 3d titles is the result of having little time to fix bugs and improve controls. I think Sonic Team should either make one game at the time or separate into multiple teams with MORE developers. And handheld titles could still be made by different developers, like you said.

I think the latter should happen, but i don't think either of those fix the polish problem, its an ideology thing. 

[Chris Knopps]

On 4/19/2016 at 7:31 PM, Nepenthe said:

Making multiple games on different platforms is something Sega has done since the franchise's inception, so I don't really believe it's the smoking gun that's been the source of all the franchise's woes, particularly when Sega is capable of outsourcing stuff like the the handheld games, Superstars series, and Riders to different studios. Plus, we have no idea how Sonic Team has fared over the years in terms of burnout; merely saying it's happening doesn't mean it actually is happening unless you have anecdotal evidence on hand. Honestly, the simplest answer to it all to me is that they fell victim to dumbass management either on part of directors, producers, Sega execs, or some combination of all three.

I think Sonic Team, and primarily Mr. Iizuka, dug their own graves by taking complete charge of every single Sonic game coming out. They should have continued letting other developers make their own interpretations of Sonic as by and large most titles were fairly profitable and the success/fail ratio was equal to that of Sonic Team themselves so I didn't see it being an issue like Mr. Iizuka apparently did.

Now all we get are one trick ponies for games, there's not any variety really save for BOOM but... I blame the west for that since its been YEARS since they worked on a Sonic game beyond translation and had no idea what the flippin' flack they were doing apparently because of that time off.

I'd like to see games from others again, kind of sick of the single-minded direction currently used. Even when it comes to Nintendo's most popular franchises they never let one single man be in charge because they know the boredom that would follow, this is SEGA/Sonic Team's mistake.

[KHCast]

Multiple games releases a year aren't a problem, as long as you aren't doing what Komami did with that fucking "Month of Madness" shit. Mario releases a few games a year, but gives people enough breathing room to experience and enjoy each one. It doesn't feel like oversaturation even when it's being milked.

[SSF1991]

9 hours ago, KHCast said:

Mario releases a few games a year, but gives people enough breathing room to experience and enjoy each one. It doesn't feel like oversaturation even when it's being milked.

That's not the point, though. You can milk a franchise all you want, but if you're having to multitask so many projects that you don't have enough time to polish your games and fine-tune level design, then that can make things really difficult. Especially if one of those games has a lot of content in it.

[Scar]

11 hours ago, Chris Knopps said:

I think Sonic Team, and primarily Mr. Iizuka, dug their own graves by taking complete charge of every single Sonic game coming out. They should have continued letting other developers make their own interpretations of Sonic as by and large most titles were fairly profitable and the success/fail ratio was equal to that of Sonic Team themselves so I didn't see it being an issue like Mr. Iizuka apparently did.

I think the problem identified by SEGA (and/or Iizuka, if he indeed had any say in the mater) is to do with fundamental quality. Boom for a number of reasons was a technical nightmare, riddled with glitches, horrible framerate issues and so on. It was an unmitigated disaster from a critical point of view. I seriously doubt Iizuka will go over and homogenise Boom so that it falls in line with whatever work Sonic Team is doing, but I would not be opposed to him going over and giving a few pointers about what makes a Sonic platformer a Sonic platformer.

I'm not opposed to spinoffs, but some basic quality control in terms of framerate, glitches etc. would be appreciated. Along with some better game design - or at least something that makes it identifiably SONIC. Boom looked like an okay platformer to me, just not a Sonic platformer. I think some have said it looked like a poor-mans Jack and Daxter with some speed sections shoehorned in, and I'd be hard-pressed to disagree.

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Now all we get are one trick ponies for games, there's not any variety really save for BOOM but... I blame the west for that since its been YEARS since they worked on a Sonic game beyond translation and had no idea what the flippin' flack they were doing apparently because of that time off.

Huh? One-trick-ponies? What does that mean? Lost World was nothing like the 3 games that came before it. Boom was unlike either set. We have our Sumo Digital Spinoffs (which are fantastic might I just say). Where's the one-trick-pony? I don't really understand what you're talking about here.

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I'd like to see games from others again, kind of sick of the single-minded direction currently used.

Sick of the single-minded direction currently used...? What "single-minded direction" is that? Do tell? I can't seem to find it. Like I said before, Lost World was nothing like Unleashed, Colours and Generations. Boom was unlike any game before it. What are you talking about? Explain, cause right now you're saying stuff that doesn't seem to mean anything, as far as I'm concerned.

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Even when it comes to Nintendo's most popular franchises they never let one single man be in charge because they know the boredom that would follow, this is SEGA/Sonic Team's mistake.

What? Nintendo have some pretty huge figureheads that have been in charge of some of their biggest properties for decades. People such as Shigeru Miyamoto and Masahiro Sakurai. They certainly have other people working on the games, but those two figureheads have a great deal of influence as far as I'm aware. Heck Miyamoto has had some level of involvement be it producer, supervisor or consultant almost all recent Mario and Zelda games - including spinoffs.

I don't understand how having singular leadership is a mistake...

Again, explain, because I'm not seeing it...

[molul]

Well, singular leadership can lead to what happened to Yuji Naka if the company doesn't treat the person as the person deserves.

[Shadowlax]

On 4/18/2016 at 5:34 PM, molul said:

 

I think the 1trick pony statement is in reference ti theme rather than gameplay

[expansivelovestories]

With regards to the still unannounced new game, I was trying to remember when previous announcements and trailers occurred.  Generations was in April apparently, and Lost World was in May.  Perhaps there is only a short time remaining before something is revealed! 

[Badnik Mechanic]

All signs point to June now.

[Red Hot Jack]

I don't know what those signs are, but I remember the song Aaron hid in the presentation during the Sonic panel, that song listing months, and July was missing.

 

Also, I haven't been following this thread, so I wonder what Iizuka is doing in America considering Sonic Team works in Japan, I guess he is overseeing Fire & Ice and other possible spin offs, but it's still strange since the main game is being developed in another continent. 

[azoo]

Where's the proof that we're being pointed to June for an announcement? Can't just make a vaguepost in here and just expect that to suffice.

[Badnik Mechanic]

6 minutes ago, Azoo said:

Where's the proof that we're being pointed to June for an announcement? Can't just make a vaguepost in here and just expect that to suffice.

Because a lot of 25th anniversary stuff is apparently being officially announced/released in June and going up for pre-order.