Why is Tails considered physically weak?

[two tailed fox]

It is kind of sad how they turned tails into such a weakling. Sonic adventure 1 did a great job of Tails and developed him from being initially dependent on sonic, to more independent. He could also could fight and fly in that game. In sonic adventure 2, while he didn't physically fight he still was in the action on his robot. (Then again he was 13 in those games before they made the bad decision of changing his age to 8.)

I know that Tails main focus is technology, but that doesn't mean that he has to be useless in battle. Sonic basterdized is right! Tails is just like a princess that needs except he's not hot. (cute though )

[Blazey Firekitty]

I know that Tails main focus is technology, but that doesn't mean that he has to be useless in battle. Sonic basterdized is right! Tails is just like a princess that needs except he's not hot. (cute though )

[two tailed fox]

Yeah! I can picture it now.

Dear sonic,

Come to my workshop! I have baked a cake for you.

Your best pal,

Tails

And that's when robotnic comes in and steals tails thus beginning sonic adventure 360

(Oh dear god let's hope it never comes to this)

Edited October 12, 2011 by two tailed fox

[Blazey Firekitty]

Yeah! I can picture it now.

Dear sonic,

Come to my workshop! I have baked a cake for you.

Your best pal,

Tails

And that's when robotnic comes in and steals tails thus beginning sonic adventure 360

(Oh dear god let's hope it never comes to this)

Bwahahaha. XD

As long as we're on the subject of Nintendo games, I think it could be cool to have a game where Sonic and Tails interact in a "Banjo-Kazooie" kind of way, with each of them being always together, but with the player switching between them based on whether a given enemy or puzzle requires ground or flight maneuvers. I guess it would be kind of like Sonic Heroes, but with only two characters.

[two tailed fox]

Even though I have never played Banjo-Kazooie I actually think your idea isn't a bad one. Sonic games are not just about speed, there also about platforming. While I enjoyed sonic colors and sonic unleashed, no sonic games has done a almost perfect balance between sonic platforming and speed since the genesis 2d games (well i guess the handheld games are kind of good,). However, Ironically sonic adventure 1 and 2 (Sega's first REAL sonic 3d sonic game), actually did a good job converting 2d to 3d. You felt like you were going fast, but you could also go slow enough to get through the platforming elements.

Anyway I'll stop as This is going somewhat off-topic.

[Blazey Firekitty]

Even though I have never played Banjo-Kazooie I actually think your idea isn't a bad one. Sonic games are not just about speed, there also about platforming. While I enjoyed sonic colors and sonic unleashed, no sonic games has done a almost perfect balance between sonic platforming and speed since the genesis 2d games (well i guess the handheld games are kind of good,). However, Ironically sonic adventure 1 and 2 (Sega's first REAL sonic 3d sonic game), actually did a good job converting 2d to 3d. You felt like you were going fast, but you could also go slow enough to get through the platforming elements.

Anyway I'll stop as This is going somewhat off-topic.

That was interesting to read, I can definitely see where you are coming from.

The best place to start, in terms of getting Tails back on the battlefield again, would probably be to have him following Sonic again during gameplay...hopefully Generations will be doing just that, at least in some areas.

[Milo]

Well, when you're alone as a kid, you're usually afraid. When you have your badass older brother or parents with you, you tend to think you're invincible.

[Marcello]

If you're avoiding anything new to Generations, this is a bit of a spoiler..

Even SEGA knows Tails has become a pansy over the years:

Screenshot by Hogfather.

[Blazey Firekitty]

If you're avoiding anything new to Generations, this is a bit of a spoiler..

Even SEGA knows Tails has become a pansy over the years:

Screenshot by Hogfather.

[Xenos]

That is kinda weird how Modern Tails hides behind Sonic while Classic Tails just stands there. XD I suppose it could be explained by the older Tails having a better understanding of the threat...maybe Classic Tails is all like "I wonder what that face in the sky is?" while modern Tails is thinking "All of existence is doomed! Doomed I tell you!"

Agreed, Classic Tails to me, always had that strong naivety with him, he stared emotionless, blinking, with his two tails swaying when Robotnik came with that giant bulldozer drill thingy.

If I was his age and saw that back then I would've probably screamed.

[Aquaslash]

The last time Tails used any physical skills without mechas or weapons was Sonic Rivals 2. There he got into fist fights with characters much stronger than him, such as Metal Sonic, Espio, and a phantom Sonic, helped blow up a ton of Eggman Nega's mechas, and though under mind control, managed to hold his own against an inter-dimensional Chao eating demon and a possessed Sonic at the same time.

Basically, as with any other character, he's as capable as the plot needs him to be.

[Exploder]

If you're avoiding anything new to Generations, this is a bit of a spoiler..

Even SEGA knows Tails has become a pansy over the years:

Screenshot by Hogfather.

[Flyboy Fox]

Regarding Generations image:

Modern Tails does seem to be hiding behind his Sonic more than Classic Tails is... but then again, Modern Sonic's pose is much more protective of him. Like he's sweeping Tails back to keep him out of the way. Modern Sonic and Modern Tails both know trouble when they see it... whilst the Classic duo both seem to be kind of stunned and bemused by what they're seeing, not really sure what to do.

[Blazey Firekitty]

What Flyboy said makes a lot of sense, given the kind of threats the Classic and Modern versions of the characters face. The younger versions have never fought a cosmic enemy before, just Robotnik/Eggman and his various machines(Or similar, relatively down to earth foes like Knuckles, Nack/Fang, the Battle Kukus, or Witchcart), and are just seeing this sort of thing for the first time. While the older Sonic and Tails have had to fight mystic gods on a semi regular basis, and know just how dangerous those creatures can be.

[Way Past Cool]

Also in regards to the image...

Now don't me wrong, I'm as much for Tails not being sidelined as anybody, but I don't really see a problem with this still image. To me, it's either, as Flyboy described, a simple protective reflex from a hero for his best friend... or he's simply striking a very Sonic-esque defense pose and Tails just happens to be behind him. He's Sonic after all. Until I see the footage and story that surrounds this image, I'm gonna give it the benefit of the doubt.

Also, d'awwwwwww.

[Blazey Firekitty]

Agreed, Classic Tails to me, always had that strong naivety with him, he stared emotionless, blinking, with his two tails swaying when Robotnik came with that giant bulldozer drill thingy.

If I was his age and saw that back then I would've probably screamed.

And if the boss took long enough to attack, he'd yawn at it.

My mind unexpectedly plunged into the gutter, because now I can't stop imagining that Modern Tails is copping a feel from behind Modern Sonic. I guess I've been staring at that photo too long. XD

[batson]

I think the problem with Tails is that appart from the typical spin-attacks that most characters can do, Tails doesn't have any modes of attack that are quite as "obvious" as those of most other characters. Like, Amy has her hammer, knuckles has his fists, Espio has his ninja-type weapons, Big has plain strenght, Blaze has her pyrokinesis, ect. All of them abilities that are very obviously usefull in combat. And sure, Tails still has his tails, but they're not as obviously usefull in combat as most other characters special abilities. Also, it always appeared questionable to me whether his tails are actually supposed to be all that usefull as weapons from an "in-universe" point of view, or if his tail-based attacks are mostly just a gameplay mechanic.

This problem with Tails was very prominent in Sonic X, where the writers really didn't seem to know how to have Tails attack someone. The few times when he did engage in combat (without the aid of a machine), he usually seemed to try to kick or shove his opponents, which usually didn't seem to have that much effect (when he managed to land a hit in the first place, that is), probably because it was generally agreed that he simply wasn't as strong as many other characters. Im thinking particularly about the Metarex saga here, where Sonic, Knuckles, Shadow and even Amy were able to hold their own against at least some forms of metarexes, while Tails didn't seem to be able to do any damage at all against any of them.

[Blazey Firekitty]

It may be that writers sometimes forget that Tails's tails can be used offensively because they are mainly known for causing him to fly. They may at times forget that they can do other things. In the Advance Series, for instance, Tails could not only tail whip, but create a small energy blade in front of the whipping motion as a minor martial arts technique. You wouldn't even have to go that far, though. The tails can be used as blades while whirling around, as evidenced by Tails' ability to attack while flying in Sonic 3. The tails have been used to propel Tails while running, so he would theoretically be able to use them in some sort of dashing attack. Going further with the notion the tails as a fan, Tails could push Badniks off ledges or into other enemies by kicking up high winds. It's a matter of the writers doing research on past games, or taking more time to think outside the box.

[Scar]

I have no problem with Tails being physically weak. Why? Because he is one of the smaller, younger characters, and as a result is not going to be as physically strong or quick as Knuckles and Sonic respectively. Being physically weak has nothing to do with being a capable fighter. I'm almost twice as strong as one of my friends, but he represents England at Tai Qwon Do and would promptly hand me my ass in a fight.

Tails may be physically weaker, but he's smarter and a pretty decent fighter too. His twin-tails provide him with a means of attacking people who would otherwise be out of his league.

Yes, Tails is weak. No, this doesn't have a negative impact on the character.

[Blazey Firekitty]

I have no problem with Tails being physically weak. Why? Because he is one of the smaller, younger characters, and as a result is not going to be as physically strong or quick as Knuckles and Sonic respectively. Being physically weak has nothing to do with being a capable fighter. I'm almost twice as strong as one of my friends, but he represents England at Tai Qwon Do and would promptly hand me my ass in a fight.

Tails may be physically weaker, but he's smarter and a pretty decent fighter too. His twin-tails provide him with a means of attacking people who would otherwise be out of his league.

Yes, Tails is weak. No, this doesn't have a negative impact on the character.

So, he makes up for a lack of strength with skill? Sounds pretty reasonable. ^^

[Flyboy Fox]

I have no problem with Tails being physically weak. Why? Because he is one of the smaller, younger characters, and as a result is not going to be as physically strong or quick as Knuckles and Sonic respectively. Being physically weak has nothing to do with being a capable fighter. I'm almost twice as strong as one of my friends, but he represents England at Tai Qwon Do and would promptly hand me my ass in a fight.

Tails may be physically weaker, but he's smarter and a pretty decent fighter too. His twin-tails provide him with a means of attacking people who would otherwise be out of his league.

Yes, Tails is weak. No, this doesn't have a negative impact on the character.

I have no problem with Tails being weaker than Knuckles, Sonic, etc. It makes sense. He's smaller, lighter, less experienced due to age. I only have a problem with him being entirely useless. Why? Because, dammit, he has two freaking tails! It's entirely pointless to have such a unique trait - one which he's even named after - if it's never going to be used.

I also have a problem with the retconning. He used to be able to fight with his tails. He used to also be pretty darned fast. Now he barely even flies with his tails any more, and combat is a distant memory.

By all means, let him be more tactical and less physical in his attacks. But at least make his tails useful again somehow, eh?

Edit: Re-reading, I think we are actually on the same page. Tails doesn't need to be physically strong in order to do stuff. My gripe is mainly with the fact that he doesn't do anything with his tails at all any more ):

[Scar]

I have no problem with Tails being weaker than Knuckles, Sonic, etc. It makes sense. He's smaller, lighter, less experienced due to age. I only have a problem with him being entirely useless. Why? Because, dammit, he has two freaking tails! It's entirely pointless to have such a unique trait - one which he's even named after - if it's never going to be used.

He's probably physically weaker than every character except Cream, Charmy and Amy (who is as strong as, because of that hammer). Again though that isn't a problem as I stated earlier. That simply makes sense given how young he is and how small he is. And his twin-tails aren't used that often, because in the last few games they haven't been needed outside of Tails flying beside Sonic.

There is no point in using Tails' tails when he isn't playable.

I also have a problem with the retconning. He used to be able to fight with his tails. He used to also be pretty darned fast. Now he barely even flies with his tails any more, and combat is a distant memory.

This is true for all characters. None of them have made a mainstream appearance since Sonic 06. They don't fight or do much because they either aren't there or aren't playable, meaning the bad guys are left to Sonic, the only playable character. Nothing has been retconned.

By all means, let him be more tactical and less physical in his attacks. But at least make his tails useful again somehow, eh?

Again, as I mentioned. Tails doesn't fight, for gameplay purposes. Sonic does most of the fighting, even if support characters are there.

If there is a problem, it isn't isolated to Tails.

So, he makes up for a lack of strength with skill? Sounds pretty reasonable. ^^

Not really......well maybe.....

He makes up for his lack of physics strength and power, with his tails (which are essentially two helicopter blades/clubs). Given the fact that he's younger and less confident when it comes to fighting, he isn't particularly skilled, however I assume he must pick up a few tricks from watching Sonic.

[Flyboy Fox]

He's probably physically weaker than every character except Cream, Charmy and Amy (who is as strong as, because of that hammer). Again though that isn't a problem as I stated earlier. That simply makes sense given how young he is and how small he is. And his twin-tails aren't used that often, because in the last few games they haven't been needed outside of Tails flying beside Sonic.

There is no point in using Tails' tails when he isn't playable.

I'd still like to see more of him flying with them. Or hitting Sonic with one when Sonic makes a playful jab at his expense. =P

This is true for all characters. None of them have made a mainstream appearance since Sonic 06. They don't fight or do much because they either aren't there or aren't playable, meaning the bad guys are left to Sonic, the only playable character. Nothing has been retconned.

I'd tend to disagree just slightly. Like I said, Tails used to be almost as fast as Sonic, but later was distinctly shown to have only average or below-average speed. I'd say that's an active ret-con.

Again, as I mentioned. Tails doesn't fight, for gameplay purposes. Sonic does most of the fighting, even if support characters are there.

If there is a problem, it isn't isolated to Tails.

Certainly not disagreeing. But the topic is about Tails, so I focussed on him.

[Exploder]

Considering the last several responses, I have a feeling I have poorly named the thread. Perhaps it should be 'Why is Tails considered physically incapable?'

[Xenos]

I have no problem with Tails being weaker than Knuckles, Sonic, etc. It makes sense. He's smaller, lighter, less experienced due to age. I only have a problem with him being entirely useless. Why? Because, dammit, he has two freaking tails! It's entirely pointless to have such a unique trait - one which he's even named after - if it's never going to be used.

I also have a problem with the retconning. He used to be able to fight with his tails. He used to also be pretty darned fast. Now he barely even flies with his tails any more, and combat is a distant memory.

By all means, let him be more tactical and less physical in his attacks. But at least make his tails useful again somehow, eh?

Edit: Re-reading, I think we are actually on the same page. Tails doesn't need to be physically strong in order to do stuff. My gripe is mainly with the fact that he doesn't do anything with his tails at all any more ):

Agreed, I think Tails' uhm...tails, should be given a bit more recognition.

Generations I think, is starting that trend with the below imag-

I can't find it, but...

Spoiler Below: (I couldn't get the spoiler tags to work for some reason.)

There is a mission where Classic Tails has to help C.Sonic fly to the end of a Chemical Plant level, it seems from what I know, there is a lot of "Muck" that C.Sonic can't traverse alone, so he needs help from his right-hand man.