Is Sonic a franchise that can be truely loved by both genders?

[S0NIC-Keyblade 007]

*Warning, You'll be hearing about 30 seconds of my personal life*

So a few weeks ago in my Peer Leadership class I was asked to present something special to me infront of the class. I chose to present my Sonic plushy that I got at the 2008 Comic-con. So I explained to the class how important Sonic is to me and that I've been playing Sonic games since I was about three years old. And at the end of my presentation, I asked if my class had any questions or comments. A girl in my class said something along the lines of, "Since most video games are usually aimed at the male audience, would I as a girl find interest into Sonic?" I told her about Blaze the Cat who I believe pretty much symbolizes *girl power* for the Sonic franchise. However, this comment made me think about the balance of male Sonic fans and female Sonic fans. Considering the fact that this franchise's main character is a guy it is expected for most of the fans to be male. But just like Mario, Pikachu, or even Spongebob, I believe that Sonic is a character that can be loved by both genders. My concern though is, does the Sonic franchise really have a fair amount of fan service to offer to both male and female Sonic fans? Up until 1999 when Sonic Adventure was released and introduced Tikal, Amy was the only female Sonic character that we had in the games. I remember a few years ago Cream the Rabbit had quite an "infamous" fanbase and would call Sega sexist because of the fact that Amy was the only girl in the classic era and due to Rogue having a sexy appearance. I of course argued against this and well, it didn't turn out very well.

But anyway, I'll cut this short, I believe that Sonic is a character that can be loved by both genders but do you believe that the franchise has enough fan service to the female fans? Do you believe we should have more female characters? Do you believe that the female characters should have bigger roles in the games? I've seen many female Sonic fans on this forum, around the internet, and even at my school. This fanbase already has a diverse amount of opinions between the classic and modern Sonic fans though I would also like to see if this fanbase has a diverse amount of opinions between males and females. Discuss.

Edited February 15, 2010 by S0NIC Toadstool

[Nepenthe]

Speaking as a potential outlier of a female, I'm not moved by arguments over the ratio of male and female characters in any series I enjoy. In fact, gender equality is of least importance when I'm indulging in fiction as is race or religion or sexual orientation or whatever else can be gathered by the characters' collective backgrounds. And I don't understand anyone writing a potentially entertaining series because it doesn't feature a satisfying number of women (or men) without having seen what it has to offer. Ergo, I don't consider Sega obligated to add more female characters or give the existing ones more prominent roles, especially if it were only done so on the justification to purposefully take feminist stances. What I care about is whether or not any characters, new or old, male or female, are going to be characterized, written, and applied to the gameplay well. I mean, isn't that what ultimately matters?

Edited February 15, 2010 by Nepenthe

[redmenace]

What does it matter if it's male or female? A game should be played because they are fun, not because the protagonist is either male or female. I do agree both genders should be present for balance's sake though, but the number is not important.

Just for laughs, I doubt Tomb Raider was made with girls as their main target. Or a more recent example Bayonetta.

The sexism and sexuality thing? Screw that to be honest. No girl should feel insulted because Bayonetta is a sexy beast. In fact, they should be laughing at the cheesiness of it, because that's exacly what's its there for.

Edited February 15, 2010 by redmenace

[Nattala]

I'm a girl, I like Sonic and I don't care whether the characters are male or female, just whether they are good characters. Little kids might care more, when I was young I tended to prefer female characters over male ones but then again I also loved Dragonball Z as a kid so..... But I don't think Sonic's appeal lies mainly in one gender demographic, despite the fact the the majority of major characters are male, the characters are still colourful and unique so they appeal to both genders.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Nattala

[Sapphire]

I couldn't even believe this question when I first saw it! Anyways...I think that Sega should not add more female characters just to appeal to the girl gamers. I've never really thought to myself when playing a Sonic game "Wow, they really need to represent girls more!" And I don't really think that Sonic is aimed towards either guys or girls, just like it can be argued that it's not aimed towards just kids or just adults. Sonic is for everyone.

Edited February 15, 2010 by silversapphire

[S0NIC-Keyblade 007]

@silversapphire, Nattala, and Nepenthe

Quick question, since I can see the three of you are girls from your profiles, how would you feel if Sega made a female exclusive Sonic game, sorta like Super Princess Peach. Say you get to play as Amy, Rouge, and Blaze(just like you get to play as Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles in S3&K). And let's say the gameplay mechanics were designed overall pretty well and the game was overall looking SA2 quality, would you feel happy that not only that Sega making a high quality Sonic game, but also a Sonic game that is aimed towards female gamers such as yourself? Or would it not matter to you as long as the game is fun, and more importantly a Sonic game?

Edited February 15, 2010 by S0NIC Toadstool

[DaBatGuy]

@silversapphire, Nattala, and Nepenthe

Quick question, since I can see the three of you are girls from your profiles, how would you feel if Sega made a female exclusive Sonic game, sorta like Super Princess Peach. Say you get to play as Amy, Rouge, and Blaze(just like you get to play as Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles in S3&K). And let's say the gameplay mechanics were designed overall pretty well and the game was overall looking SA2 quality, would you feel happy that not only that Sega making a high quality Sonic game, but also a Sonic game that is aimed towards female gamers such as yourself? Or would it not matter to you as long as the game is fun, and more importantly a Sonic game?

I may not have lady parts (as far as you know ... ) but in regards to your question I think the idea of a "girly" Sonic game would be somewhat patronizing for female gamers. As the others have said the series is designed around fun gameplay and interesting, colorful characters that can appeal to anyone. Sonic may be a male character but he's very entertaining to watch and play as regardless of your gender.

Creating a "girls only" game not only turns off male gamers but also sends a message to females that there's something wrong with them liking the games as they are and that everything needs pink fluff to be acceptable. It basically establishes the concept of males and females as the default and deviant from the default respectively where females and all thing designed for them are inferior counterparts of a more generally accepted male default. The Nostalgia Chick goes into much more detail about it here.

[franklover]

I love sonic games and as long as its fun i dont care if the characters are male or female I would play them.

[Tornado]

I personally never thought the series was gender specific at all in any particular way (at least when it came to the games). You could (and I would probably agree) make the argument that this changed when Iizuka got his hands on the franchise, but as soon as he lost it again it seems to me that the everything went right back to being gender-neutral.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Tornado

[S0NIC-Keyblade 007]

Creating a "girls only" game not only turns off male gamers but also sends a message to females that there's something wrong with them liking the games as they are and that everything needs pink fluff to be acceptable. It basically establishes the concept of males and females as the default and deviant from the default respectively where females and all thing designed for them are inferior counterparts of a more generally accepted male default. The Nostalgia Chick goes into much more detail about it here.

I applaud the nostalgia chick, that video was really well made. I never really noticed all the female token characters in american cartoons. Now that makes me wonder if Amy was just originally planned to be a female token character in the 90s. Judging by her classic model, you can pretty much say she's just a slowed down female verision of Sonic with a hammer and a dress.

Offtopic: Considering Amy's classic model, we've seen all female Sonic characters wearing clothes. This is probably done to make the girls seems cute, however, do you think we'll ever see a male character wearing clothes to make him look cool or something? *Imagines Shadow wear Sephiroth's outfit*

Edited February 15, 2010 by S0NIC Toadstool

[TrueBlue]

I applaud the nostalgia chick, that video was really well made. I never really noticed all the female token characters in american cartoons. Now that makes me wonder if Amy was just originally planned to be a female token character in the 90s. Judging by her classic model, you can pretty much say she's just a slowed down female verision of Sonic with a hammer and a dress.

Offtopic: Considering Amy's classic model, we've seen all female Sonic characters wearing clothes. This is probably done to make the girls seems cute, however, do you think we'll ever see a male character wearing clothes to make him look cool or something? *Imagines Shadow wear Sephiroth's outfit*

Amy was the token damsel in distress when she first appeared, and it was only until the late 90s did she start to really develop into something more, with Sonic Heroes kind of being the end of a transition from damsel to heroine. So yeah, i'll agree that Amy was originally created to be a token character. But thankfully the change in decade bought a change of pace.

As for the clothing, i don't thinking its done to make a character cute. I mean Amy and Cream could be cute due to their personalities and such. I can only imagine the furore if they started appearing without clothes all of a sudden.

Wearing a Sephiroth outfit would be the last thing that Shadow would need. Though i suppose it'd be better than him cursing all the time.

[Sean]

I don't know how boys can enjoy the games, I mean the Sonic series is pretty girly you know.

[RedYellowBlueCR]

I never really seen a problem with the male/female balance in the Sonic universe. I think both guys and girls can agree that Sonic as a character, can be extremely loved.

[Extryn]

I'm female, I love Sonic, and not once have I ever thought "OH MY GAWSH I'M SO OFFENDED SEGA ARE SUCH SEXIST BASTARDS WHERE'S THE STRONG FEMALE LEAD CHARACTER?!" Of course it has occured to me plenty that there are far more male characters than female and I don't particularly care.

Note that I'm also quite the deviant female - I'm a complete computer nerd and system building is a hobby of mine, for one - so I might not be a good example of the entire female Sonic fanbase. At the same time I do have one female friend who's a gamer, also into Sonic, and three female friends who aren't really gamers but love Sonic. What the non-gaming friends like are the interesting characters and appealing plots, and of course the fun games.

I think there's a very big mis-interpretation of what females like to see. I'm sure most of us aren't interested in "girl power" or another female character to relate to, or even love plots. We're interested in the same sort of things that guys are half the time, especially when it comes to Sonic. Of course, this is just an assumption, I'd love to see what appeals to the male fanbase and see if it's the same stuff that appeals to the females.

Also note that girls are likely to be ATTRACTED to said male characters which provides a whole different, often unpleasant aspect of the Sonic fanbase >_>

In conclusion:

1. Sonic definitely appeals to both genders from what I've seen

2. Female fans often are interested in the same aspects as male ones and don't really need "girl power" or "strong females" to enjoy and relate to characters.

3. "Fanservice" for female fans? Heck, for a lot of 'em, the guys ARE the fanservice.

(ever noticed the insane amount of 12-year-old girls who think Shadow is hot? Also notice the insane amount of fanfiction which has been written by the same 12-year-old girls with little to no grasp of the english language.)

[Dejablue]

About the Smurfette principle. There may have been a point in the past where I would have noted this as a concern but now I hardly care. Especially in cartoons. Although for some reason I just tend to avoid shows with a majority female cast. Save for shows like My Little Pony(the old show not that new crap) or The Wild Thornberries ( mostly because I love animals) And Rainbow Brite... Modern shows today aimed at females often seem to want to mold young girls to be teeny bopper vapid myspace whores. Bratz anyone? And that...Fairy show on 4kids. What was that? Winx Club. Uuuugh.

And I admit I'm sometimes guilty of connecting to a male character over a female character. This could just be because I'm more attracted to the opposite sex but...eh. That proooobably doesn't sound good when I'm talking about cartoons.

But this isn't always the case. I was all about Sailor Moon when I was younger. My favorite Avatar:TLA character is Toph. But maybe this is because she acts like a tomboy?

At the same time I really like Amy Rose who is for the most part a very girly girl personality wise. And she's paaaaank!

This is such a psychological thing you could dig into for eons and have no real good answer.

Edited February 17, 2010 by Dejablue

[Sapphire]

@silversapphire, Nattala, and Nepenthe

Quick question, since I can see the three of you are girls from your profiles, how would you feel if Sega made a female exclusive Sonic game, sorta like Super Princess Peach. Say you get to play as Amy, Rouge, and Blaze(just like you get to play as Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles in S3&K). And let's say the gameplay mechanics were designed overall pretty well and the game was overall looking SA2 quality, would you feel happy that not only that Sega making a high quality Sonic game, but also a Sonic game that is aimed towards female gamers such as yourself? Or would it not matter to you as long as the game is fun, and more importantly a Sonic game?

I would actually kind of be offended if they made a game like that, because it would seem like Sega was saying that the main Sonic series and characters were aimed at boys. Basically agreeing with Dat Kool Bat Guy, it sort of seems to say that something is wrong with us girl gamers liking Sonic, which clearly there isn't.

And you know, I probably wouldn't even buy that game.

[redmenace]

I personally never thought the series was gender specific at all in any particular way (at least when it came to the games). You could (and I would probably agree) make the argument that this changed when Iizuka got his hands on the franchise, but as soon as he lost it again it seems to me that the everything went right back to being gender-neutral.

Unbalanced to which gender? Shadow's game generated a nice slice of fanboys because of weapons and vehickles and emoness, but it also generated a lot of fangirls because Shadow is sexy (WHAT) (I suppose some boys might think this too) and a badboy (WHAT) and yaoi fangirls pairing him with Sonic and I suppose the emoness also applies.

Edited February 18, 2010 by redmenace

[HunterTSF]

Agreed. Shadow the Hedgehog was a hit for both genders, seeing as it generated quite a large amount Shadow fangirls due to his coolness/sexyness factor.

Oh, and let's not get started on Sonic the Hedgehog or Sonic Rivals. Silver's gathered a huge following, and has been put through enough yaoi to rival Tails' in his short four year stay. Even I think he's cute.

Come to think of it - Sonic is a great series for girls! Its cast is primarily made up of cute teenage boys~!

Edited February 18, 2010 by HunterTSF

[gato]

I don't know how boys can enjoy the games, I mean the Sonic series is pretty girly you know.

Come to think of it - Sonic is a great series for girls! Its cast is primarily made up of cute teenage boys~!

THIS!

this series has almost every kind of "manga boys stereotype" I can think about... and almost all of them have also a cute appareance to complement that aforementioned stereotype, let's see:

Always reliable and cool teenager... check!

Cute little boy too mature for his age... check!

Guillible/innocent lonely teenager with a strong sense of duty and responsability... check!

Badass/antisocial teenager with conflictive past (lol tsundere?)... check!

Sk8ter/surfer boys... check!

Cute teenager carrying the world under his shoulders... check!

Little kid with a really childish/cute attitude... check!

Funny guy running his own business and has a strong sense of leadership... check!

Ninja (ninjas are cool and you know it)... check!

(Kinda) Silly and carefree guy wich believes in friendship above anything else... check!

Hope I'm not forgetting anyone...

Also you can add the fact that the girls are not always being just damsels in distress and (most of them) have strong personalities...

...

...

I wonder why the heck I got attached with Sonic in the first place?

I mean, I think a lot of us liked the "attitude" SoA sold to us, but I never liked the cartoons (I though Sonic was an ***hole), and I remeber myself wanting to be more like Tails...

Maybe I was a pretty girly boy back then O_o (I remember I also liked to collect some Garfield trading cards, wich were also pretty girly...).

[Phos]

I'm female, I love Sonic, and not once have I ever thought "OH MY GAWSH I'M SO OFFENDED SEGA ARE SUCH SEXIST BASTARDS WHERE'S THE STRONG FEMALE LEAD CHARACTER?!" Of course it has occured to me plenty that there are far more male characters than female and I don't particularly care.

Note that I'm also quite the deviant female - I'm a complete computer nerd and system building is a hobby of mine, for one - so I might not be a good example of the entire female Sonic fanbase. At the same time I do have one female friend who's a gamer, also into Sonic, and three female friends who aren't really gamers but love Sonic. What the non-gaming friends like are the interesting characters and appealing plots, and of course the fun games.

I think there's a very big mis-interpretation of what females like to see. I'm sure most of us aren't interested in "girl power" or another female character to relate to, or even love plots. We're interested in the same sort of things that guys are half the time, especially when it comes to Sonic. Of course, this is just an assumption, I'd love to see what appeals to the male fanbase and see if it's the same stuff that appeals to the females.

Also note that girls are likely to be ATTRACTED to said male characters which provides a whole different, often unpleasant aspect of the Sonic fanbase >_>

In conclusion:

1. Sonic definitely appeals to both genders from what I've seen

2. Female fans often are interested in the same aspects as male ones and don't really need "girl power" or "strong females" to enjoy and relate to characters.

3. "Fanservice" for female fans? Heck, for a lot of 'em, the guys ARE the fanservice.

(ever noticed the insane amount of 12-year-old girls who think Shadow is hot? Also notice the insane amount of fanfiction which has been written by the same 12-year-old girls with little to no grasp of the english language.)

Unbalanced to which gender? Shadow's game generated a nice slice of fanboys because of weapons and vehickles and emoness, but it also generated a lot of fangirls because Shadow is sexy (WHAT) (I suppose some boys might think this too) and a badboy (WHAT) and yaoi fangirls pairing him with Sonic and I suppose the emoness also applies.

It's the chest hair, isn't it?

That's what I'm thinking.

[Indigo Rush]

AAAAHHHHHH I CAN'T UNSEE

[Velotix von Skruviktorrius]

...Are you really calling Sean Connery an abomination of mankind? O_o

[Daisoku]

As one of those said Yaoi-loving Shadow fangirls, I answer on behalf of the rest of them that yes, it is indeed the chest fur/hair.

[gato]

I also noticed Silver has his fair share of chest hair, maybe that's why he is so popular

[Dejablue]

Agreed. Shadow the Hedgehog was a hit for both genders, seeing as it generated quite a large amount Shadow fangirls due to his coolness/sexyness factor.

Oh, and let's not get started on Sonic the Hedgehog or Sonic Rivals. Silver's gathered a huge following, and has been put through enough yaoi to rival Tails' in his short four year stay. Even I think he's cute.

Come to think of it - Sonic is a great series for girls! Its cast is primarily made up of cute teenage boys~!

Dude if you turned everyone into a human plopped them into a high school setting you could probably get a reverse harem anime out of this.