Sonic Forces TGS interview

[Badnik Mechanic]

After playing Forces today. I have reason to believe that the stages in this game might be short. Which is why they're not showing any others

People had argued that the stages wee cut short for the demo... well based on what I played today, they're not. That's the length of the stages.

I'll explain more in my writeup of the game on Saturday, but if the other stages are as short as the ones we've seen, it might explain the lack of exposure.

For info I filmed myself playing the Co-op stage today. After 1 play through I was able to beat it in 1:26...

I believe I can get this down to 1:20 if not better and this is without breaking the game or doing any exploits, you can literally fly over the entire level without even trying.

In fact you can probably beat this stage by only pushing 10 buttons in total, it's crazy short.

[The Deleter]

Yeah the stages have all used up their red ring locations by the time they reach the goal rings, as well. For example:

There's no way they're longer than what we've seen, unless they segway into bosses. And with the way bosses are segmented into their own stages, that seems doubtful, as well.

[Eternal EX]

Maybe the game is going to be built like Colors. Tons of mini or small stages per main stage?

[Mad Convoy]

That's good to keep in mind. Especially if the game proper has only 10 stages per character-- which would mean that I can estimate that the base game, using the time in the video @The Deleter posted (representing it as 1 min 24 sec) and not including cutscenes and time spent on customization, has a campaign around 42 minutes. Including the DLC Shadow campaign (ignoring he might be able to get through levels faster for the sake of discussion), that only bumps up the game to 60 minutes and 11 seconds total.

Yes, there is the possibility of there being more stages like Colors had, but as of now based on what we know, there's at least 42 minutes of main game content in Forces and the DLC doesn't help a whole lot. That... isn't too hype-worthy.

Granted, I actually didn't mind those 45 second levels in Colors and to a smaller extent Gens too much, as they were useful for me for helping to learn the game's mechanics and test out different strategies. However, I understand why some people would not like such short levels. That is definitely something to keep in mind for fans who were hoping for Forces to take some cues from Unleashed and the Adventures in terms of design and difficulty.

[The Deleter]

Good gravy, if this game is only 1-2 hours long, that's... uh, has a Sonic game ever been that short, outside Sonic 1 or CD when you know what you're doing?

I don't think the game will have stages only as long as Park Avenue in it's entirety, as I'm sure they'll get harder and more complex as the game goes on, but man, no wonder the game is only $30 if this is the case. Never even thought about how little stage count mattered if they're all as short as the stages we've seen...

[MegasonicZX]

Honestly my problem with the marketing for this game stems less from them not showing enough and more on them not showing anything good. I know that sonic team is better than what's been on display so far and I really want to get excited for this game but the only thing the footage has solidified so far is that these levels look pretty (and sometimes even that isn't really the case) with the actual platforming/action bits being really dull. Like I don't want them to show too much because I like having surprises to find in games but I want this game to spill out so much more because of just how little its actually managed to capture my interest so far outside of superficial things like story and the extended cast coming back.

[Eternal EX]

Keep in mind. While GHZ and PA were very short stages. Unleashed and Generations had it's few super short stages. Then the behemoth Eggmanland, Excellent (and still my all time favorite sonic stage) Jungle joyride, and Spagonia (generations). JJ was easily a 4-10 minute stage. While Eggman took me a max of 35 mins. With all of this said, Sonic isn't known for extremely long stages.

[Jango]

49 minutes ago, Eternal EX said:

Maybe the game is going to be built like Colors. Tons of mini or small stages per main stage?

I feel like this is the case. The first act of each location will be the longest, while the others will be short, gimmick-y acts, like Colors and Unleashed. Which kinda sucks, BTW. But honestly, what doesn't, right?

Also, I just wanted to say something that's on my mind, whatever if this isn't the ideal topic to do it: why do they still call Modern Sonic modern? Isn't the boost gameplay from 2005 (Rush)? How is that still modern? '-'

[The Deleter]

16 minutes ago, Eternal EX said:

Keep in mind. While GHZ and PA were very short stages. Unleashed and Generations had it's few super short stages. Then the behemoth Eggmanland, Excellent (and still my all time favorite sonic stage) Jungle joyride, and Spagonia (generations). JJ was easily a 4-10 minute stage. While Eggman took me a max of 35 mins. With all of this said, Sonic isn't known for extremely long stages.

True, but this near-a-minute-long nature applies to every stage we've seen of the game thus far. Even Classic Sonic's level, which is comparably big to the other levels, still clocks in at just 1:40 when playing... okay-ish.

Only exception I can find is the Avatar's Green Hill Zone level, and that's the one that makes the player wait around for the robot leg hazards...

[blueblur98]

of course there isn't only two zones!

there's three!

[Whatever the WhoCares]

I think this will be like Colors, but even more in that direction. Individual "acts" are less standalone than usual and instead the whole Zone is more like an overall 5-8 minute stage, maybe 12 minutes if they do in fact put in a large, zone-defining act in each stage a la Sonic Colors. Think Wave Ocean when it switches to Tails, except there's a score card in between. 

[ShadowSJG]

Are we getting news or not?

[Meta77]

Its only day 1 of TGS

[MegasonicZX]

Pretty sure we have a topic here that says they will be livestreaming footage tomorrow and sunday so expect info there if we get any.

Edit: Here we go

 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

2 hours ago, The Deleter said:

True, but this near-a-minute-long nature applies to every stage we've seen of the game thus far. Even Classic Sonic's level, which is comparably big to the other levels, still clocks in at just 1:40 when playing... okay-ish.

Only exception I can find is the Avatar's Green Hill Zone level, and that's the one that makes the player wait around for the robot leg hazards...

TBF, it's not saying a lot about what we've seen thus far amounts to two worlds and a total of six levels which is likely going to be the literal first two worlds in the game.

Either way, I'm really hoping this isn't the case. That it's like Colours with tons of mini-stages or maybe has Generations' mission mode, or just something because stages of this length would just suck hard.

[The Deleter]

17 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

TBF, it's not saying a lot about what we've seen thus far amounts to two worlds and a total of six levels which is likely going to be the literal first two worlds in the game.

Either way, I'm really hoping this isn't the case. That it's like Colours with tons of mini-stages or maybe has Generations' mission mode, or just something because stages of this length would just suck hard.

Well if Modern has at least 10 stages, and each playstyle gets equal treatment, that's around 40 stages altogether, which is about 4 more than Colors' 36. So it should guarantee the same amount of stages Colors offered right off the bat; it's just that Colors had stages that were a good three to five minutes long by the second world, at the very least. The fact that it was focused around wisps that made you stop and play around in areas for red rings didn't hurt, either.

[Sega DogTagz]

Colors also mandated that you complete those mini-acts in order to advance - which in turn made the game longer.

Games like Generations offered up extra levels and missions, but didn't force you to play more than a small handful of them, which lead to some rightfully deserved half-truths about how little content there is to the package.

 

I'd be fine with forces if it used a bunch of smaller levels as its padding mechanic. To be honest, a lot of the stages seem to be interconnected (you can see the destroyed pyramid base in the background of the Avatar GHZ level for example) which could set up a gauntlet mode that lets you tackle a mash-up of levels in one go. That would be fun.

[Multikaris]

1 minute ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Colors also mandated that you complete those mini-acts in order to advance - which in turn made the game longer.

Games like Generations offered up extra levels and missions, but didn't force you to play more than a small handful of them, which lead to some rightfully deserved half-truths about how little content there is to the package.

 

I'd be fine with forces if it used a bunch of smaller levels as its padding mechanic. To be honest, a lot of the stages seem to be interconnected (you can see the destroyed pyramid base in the background of the Avatar GHZ level for example) which could set up a gauntlet mode that lets you tackle a mash-up of levels in one go. That would be fun.

What if this game did BOTH? If it has both mini-levels and missions? And maybe throw in Unleashed's collection element? That would be a good way of lenghthening the game.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

It's worth noting that even though we don't know what they're like, Forces has missions like Generations ontop of it's normal stages. The demo menu at e3 showed that.

[SatAMhog]

If it's anything like Colors, then I'm fine with it.  I'd rather have my enjoyment in my short little spurts then have a level that's drawn out.  We'll probably get the length of a standard Sonic level in all the mini-acts.  All that matters is that the game is fun, and from I've seen it does look fun and the story is looking excellent.  I will be playing this with Japanese on with English subtitles...I just watched the Japanese dub of Sonic X and boy I have missed those voice actors.  I have to say that the new VA for Eggman got his prior voice actor's mannerisms down to a tee...heck, he even sounds the same!  

[The Deleter]

58 minutes ago, Sega DogTagz said:

Colors also mandated that you complete those mini-acts in order to advance - which in turn made the game longer.

Games like Generations offered up extra levels and missions, but didn't force you to play more than a small handful of them, which lead to some rightfully deserved half-truths about how little content there is to the package.

 

I'd be fine with forces if it used a bunch of smaller levels as its padding mechanic. To be honest, a lot of the stages seem to be interconnected (you can see the destroyed pyramid base in the background of the Avatar GHZ level for example) which could set up a gauntlet mode that lets you tackle a mash-up of levels in one go. That would be fun.

Generations managed to be just as long as Colors with it's main campaign, though. It had more side content in the form of missions, yeah, but it didn't need them like Colors did.

Also, the gauntlet idea would be the absolute best thing if it was the case, but the fact that you have to switch characters to play through the whole zone kinda muddies it up a bit tbh. You'd need to choose a wispon just like the level select, for example, and you would be running through the same areas as each other from time to time.

55 minutes ago, Miragnarok said:

What if this game did BOTH? If it has both mini-levels and missions? And maybe throw in Unleashed's collection element? That would be a good way of lenghthening the game.

Unleashed's sun and moon medals were one of the most hated elements of the game. They were a pain for those who didn't find them, and utterly useless for those who did. They artificially padded the game, and did nothing more than hinder the player from actually progressing through the game. Don't bring them back >:L

55 minutes ago, Shaddy the guy said:

It's worth noting that even though we don't know what they're like, Forces has missions like Generations ontop of it's normal stages. The demo menu at e3 showed that.

Hm...

They don't seem to be attached to the stage selection specifically. They're behind the Avatar's customizable features in the menu, so they seem like they're more a side-option rather than a full on stage selection menu.

Maybe SLW's missions are making a return?

[Blue Blood]

Remember, Forces has "missions" as an option in the world map. I'm guessing that are going to be like the missions in Unleashed, Generations, extra acts in Colours and indeed Episode Shadow - repurposed versions of existing stages. They're also going to try and get some length out of the Wisps with the custom hero stages.

I'm pretty certain that Forces is going to be pretty short, but it may well be full to the brim of superfluous levels/missions that nobody will ever play through by choice more than once. If I ever go back to any Sonic game released in the past decade, I only ever touch the full acts.

[Shaddy Zaphod]

Wait wait, Lost World had missions?

[The Deleter]

Yeah, about a hundred action-specific missions that Omochao handed out to you. You received wisps and power ups for your toolbox in exchange for completing them, as well as RC toys for co-op iirc.

Maybe there'll be unlockables in the form of Avatar apparel, if these are the same style of missions as SLW's? They're really gonna have to scrape the bottom of the barrel to figure out what the player should do to win them, lol. Hardest SLW's got was defeating 10 enemies with a bomb Wisp, and that was just because it was hard to control.

[Salamander]

Those sound like the missions which were in Rush Adventure and Generations 3DS; a solid one hundred missions based around iterations on the existing levels.  In Rush Adventure, all the missions were just about replaying a previous level under certain conditions (i.e. time trial, or collect X number of rings, or perform Y number of tricks, or find a hidden medal, etc.), but in Generations 3DS, only some were like that while others hosted unique level design for challenges which tended not to last very long (like fifteen seconds maybe).  As someone who's played all of them, I can honestly say that they were the living embodiment of quantity over quality.