What's a Sonic Game That Has No Desirable Qualities/Salvageable Materials Whatsoever?

[The DOMinator]

Heya! Ever since I got on summer break, I haven't done a whole lot on here, only really making weekly check-ins on the 52 Game Challenge, along with a couple other things, leaving my previous topics unchecked. I'll get back to them eventually (not that I need to, but I'd like to), but for now, I'd like to post something that I've been pondering on lately.

As per the title, are there any Sonic games out there that in your opinion have no redeeming factors about them, or have things that could've been salvaged? I ask this because despite how many "bad" (varying per opinions, of course) Sonic games that are out there, most seem to have at least something that's not half bad. If not that, at least something that could've had potential. An example of the former could be the music in Sonic 06, which is considered good by most. One for the latter could be Infinite from Sonic Forces, as if he would've been handled a bit better, he could've been a great villain, as many have noted. Being a bit more of an optimist, I can't think of a Sonic game that's that unlikeable right now, which is why I've come to all of you.

Now, I also would've asked the opposite question, as in, what's a Sonic game that's perfect in every way, but nothing is perfect, as there will always be some shortcoming. But if you could think of any, feel free to share.

[GX -The Spindash-]

Sonic Jam for Game.com.

Looks muddy, sounds worse than the broken Sonic Chronicles midis, handles miserably, messy level design, the "Sonic 3" portion is basically uncompletable unless you're Tails, and the platform it's on is so sub-par that it's unclear if they even could have done better on it.

[Ghelatlishol]

A Sonic Schoolhouse remake would be very popular with the Elementary school kids these days, it just needs to feature Movie Sonic and be a lot less creepy.

[GX -The Spindash-]

2 minutes ago, Ghelatlishol said:

A Sonic Schoolhouse remake would be very popular with the Elementary school kids these days, it just needs to feature Movie Sonic and be a lot less creepy.

Kids have access to better games these days, and edutainment games have come a long way from the "I dunno, solve this math problem" design from the 90s.

[Ghelatlishol]

Just now, GX -The Spindash- said:

Kids have access to better games these days, and edutainment games have come a long way from the "I dunno, solve this math problem" design from the 90s.

That's fine! It just needs to be of the caliber of edutainment games these days. Granted, I have no idea what that would look like...I'm from the WordMunchers and Jumpstart era.

[Diogenes]

Frontiers comes pretty damn close.

If I really, genuinely try to give it credit for something, about the best I can come up with is, the Titan bosses manage to present themselves as decently exciting spectacles, and actually being able to turn Sonic reasonably well is something the series has been missing for a while.

Platforming? They didn't even finish it, leaving the player with a dozen sliders to try and figure out how a Sonic game is supposed to feel.

Combat? Shallow, repetitive, and out of place. Why is this even here, but to pad out the game and copy every other open world game?

Level design? Take your pick, we've got the same tired boost game level design in the void of cyberspace, or the same tired boost game level design in the near-void of the overworld.

Aesthetics? Sure just drop Sonic and co into some generic asset pack environments and throw a bunch of rails and square platforms in the air. Why even try, right?

Story? Some of the most boring versions of these characters, given the most ham-handed "character development", plus the worst attempts at adding to the series lore since they retconned Shadow into being part alien. Or at least since they retconned the Babylon Rogues into having descended from aliens.
...why do they keep retconning things into aliens? This is the third time and it's never been any good.

[Scritch the Cat]

2 hours ago, Diogenes said:

Frontiers comes pretty damn close.

If I really, genuinely try to give it credit for something, about the best I can come up with is, the Titan bosses manage to present themselves as decently exciting spectacles, and actually being able to turn Sonic reasonably well is something the series has been missing for a while.

Platforming? They didn't even finish it, leaving the player with a dozen sliders to try and figure out how a Sonic game is supposed to feel.

Combat? Shallow, repetitive, and out of place. Why is this even here, but to pad out the game and copy every other open world game?

Level design? Take your pick, we've got the same tired boost game level design in the void of cyberspace, or the same tired boost game level design in the near-void of the overworld.

Aesthetics? Sure just drop Sonic and co into some generic asset pack environments and throw a bunch of rails and square platforms in the air. Why even try, right?

Story? Some of the most boring versions of these characters, given the most ham-handed "character development", plus the worst attempts at adding to the series lore since they retconned Shadow into being part alien. Or at least since they retconned the Babylon Rogues into having descended from aliens.
...why do they keep retconning things into aliens? This is the third time and it's never been any good.

You don't think open-world Sonic design has potential?  Because that was something widely desired by many fans since before Frontiers was even announced.

Edited June 28 by Scritch the Cat

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Nevermind how successful and acclaimed Frontiers was, in spite of its problems when people were gearing up to trash the game before they played it and decided it was more passable and even fun to play compared to Sonic 06 (although YMMV when it comes to the Final Horizon dlc). And even then, those problems are salvageable given how some have made attempts at modding it to various degrees.

I forget the name of the game, but it was one I played on the Mega Collection or SA1 DX in which its gimmick was about Sonic moving intentionally slow because Eggman replaced his shoes with lead ones that slow him down. I get why that was a thing: let’s market Sonic on the opposite spectrum by having him be at his slowest…

…that was still a worse idea than giving Shadow guns. There is no salvaging the idea of making Sonic slow as hell.

Edited June 28 by CrownSlayers Shadow

[ShadowXeldron]

2 hours ago, CrownSlayers Shadow said:

I forget the name of the game, but it was one I played on the Mega Collection or SA1 DX in which its gimmick was about Sonic moving intentionally slow because Eggman replaced his shoes with lead ones that slow him down. I get why that was a thing: let’s market Sonic on the opposite spectrum by having him be at his slowest…

Sonic Labyrinth? Never played it myself but I do know the lead shoes thing.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

50 minutes ago, ShadowXeldron said:

Sonic Labyrinth? Never played it myself but I do know the lead shoes thing.

There we go! That was the name of it!

And what’s funny is that I tortured myself into playing that game all the way through until the last level where I threw my hands up and gave up.

[Diogenes]

6 hours ago, Scritch the Cat said:

You don't think open-world Sonic design has potential?  Because that was something widely desired by many fans since before Frontiers was even announced.

Nope. With a decent engine you can throw Sonic into an open space and have some fun messing around, but I don't see a path to forming an actual worthwhile game out of that. Sonic level design needs a sense of direction and flow to it, which doesn't mesh with being able to approach any area from almost any direction. It's one of the reasons Frontiers puts most of its actual platforming either in cyberspace or floating above the map; it has to take you out of the open world and feed you into a linear sequence.

[ZinogreVolt]

None of the main games really fall into this for me, but if I had to pick it'd be 06. It's a far worse interpretation of a formula I really like, and outside of some occasionally good stage aesthetics (big fan of Crisis City and Kingdom Valley)  and music, it doesn't really have any elements I actively enjoy or appreciate all that much. Even despite the immense work put into P-06 cleaning a lot of frustrations up, I can still only barely jive with what it is innately. 

[Iko]

Easily Sonic Forces mobile, there is nothing good about that game.

It had a couple of qualities at first, but now those qualities are meaningless. The base concept was interesting, but the execution of it is bad and the game is not fun at all; the cast of characters was another quality, but now multiple playable characters aren't an exclusive of mobile games anymore, and I couldn't care less of some weird photoshop skins which look horrible most of the times.

The gameplay is pure frustration and annoyance, and it's completely inconsistent due to heavy use of invasive dynamic difficulty adjustment practices to force an outcome onto you regardless of your skills and your character's stats. The algorithm decides if you can win or you must to lose, it also decides your place in the chart, everything else is just an illusion, you are just playing a virtual drug.

[JPearce]

I hate to say it, but Sonic Dash in its current state. The card mechanic sucks, There's too many ads now, the world building mechanic from a couple of years back is non-existent, the interface is horrible, and the whole game feels just janky now. I might be a little bit biased because I grew up with the original version, but I feel like Sonic Dash just sucks now. 

[captobvious42]

Personally, Sonic '06. It was the one where I quit going "despite its glaring flaws, a Sonic game could still be fun." The hi-speed sections just wrecked the game for me, and, in hindsight, the story was a convoluted mess. I know its got its fans and I heard Project P-06 or whatever it's called has done a lot to fix that reputation, but it just wasn't for me.

Surprising, I don't consider Rise of Lyric to be that bad, but I played it almost a full year afterwards when I imagine updates brought it up to an almost playable state.

[Anonymous Gamer]

After witnessing July2612’s stream on it… BY FAR AND AWAY SONIC 2 MASTER SYSTEM.

Watch and suffer as I have.

[BountyHunter]

Pretty much the Dash mobile games.

[Anonymous Gamer]

1 minute ago, BountyHunter said:

Pretty much the Dash mobile games.

I haven’t played Dash & Dash 2, but I’m sure they’re far better than Jump.

[BountyHunter]

Jump was awful. They are better, but I still don't like em. Lol

[Metal-Mouth]

Uh.  I'm gonna pick a mainline game, and probably get a lot of hate for it.  Sonic Superstars.  I'm sorry, I despise that game.  It's almost Sonic 4: Episode 3.  Every other main Sonic game I can think of good things about, but not Superstars. 

As for "perfect" Sonic games: Sonic Mania, Sonic 3&K, Generations. 

[Anonymous Gamer]

6 hours ago, Metal-Mouth said:

Uh.  I'm gonna pick a mainline game, and probably get a lot of hate for it.  Sonic Superstars.  I'm sorry, I despise that game.  It's almost Sonic 4: Episode 3.  Every other main Sonic game I can think of good things about, but not Superstars. 

As for "perfect" Sonic games: Sonic Mania, Sonic 3&K, Generations. 

I respect your thoughts on the matter.

[LegoNess]

Sonic Eraser seems pretty irredeemable to me.

[cosmichaos]

On 7/31/2024 at 2:26 AM, Metal-Mouth said:

Uh.  I'm gonna pick a mainline game, and probably get a lot of hate for it.  Sonic Superstars.  I'm sorry, I despise that game.  It's almost Sonic 4: Episode 3.  Every other main Sonic game I can think of good things about, but not Superstars. 

As for "perfect" Sonic games: Sonic Mania, Sonic 3&K, Generations. 

I'm going to be completely honest, I forgot Sonic Superstars existed. But I don't know, no Sonic games quite fit the criteria of irredeemable, with the exception of Labyrinth, which was..... yeah.