Shin Megami Tensei (and related games) discussion.

[KrazyBean]

I don't think anyone did.

 

You don't think anyone said that this looks like Persona or you don't think that this looked like the crossover until we were told?

[JaidynReiman]

You don't think anyone said that this looks like Persona or you don't think that this looked like the crossover until we were told?

I don't think anyone thought it was the crossover.

 

 

Personally I thought it was Persona when watching it. At -first- I thought it was the crossover, but I was assuming I'd see the Fire Emblem characters more obviously at the start, not expecting them to have new outfits and designs. So after the first four characters were shown off I thought it was Persona.

[SuperLink]

I actually said "holy shit SMTxFE??" as soon as the trailer started, so.. whoops.

[Junko]

My reaction is as follows:

 

ATLUS

FUCKING SMTXFE

IT'S NOT DEAD

WAIT

WHAT

THIS ISN-

IS THI-?

HOLY SHIT

*chaos ensues*

[Dantemustdie00]

I actually said "holy shit SMTxFE??" as soon as the trailer started, so.. whoops.

I thought that as soon as they showed "ATLUS" then "Nintendo".

 

But this is what sealed the deal

 

Little Tiki was too easy to identify.

[JaidynReiman]

I thought that as soon as they showed "ATLUS" then "Nintendo".

 

But this is what sealed the deal

 

Little Tiki was too easy to identify.

I MISSED her because I wasn't paying proper attention. I didn't catch Tiki there, so until the ending I didn't realize it was SMT X FE.

 

 

 

My reaction is as follows:

 

ATLUS

FUCKING SMTXFE

IT'S NOT DEAD

WAIT

WHAT

THIS ISN-

IS THI-?

HOLY SHIT

*chaos ensues*

This was exactly my reaction.

 

 

I'm definitely intrigued. The trailer probably wasn't the best because it didn't explain enough and just gave us more questions. Granted, that's probably the intent. They WANT people talking about it and debating it, and they KNEW we weren't expecting this. They did the trailer this way on purpose; to get people talking.

 

 

We'll probably see more later that brings everything into perspective and makes it clearer how this is linked to both classic FE and various SMT styles.

[PSI Wind]

There are actually some really nice screenshots that aren't exactly all ~animu~

 

I love the second one especially. Those kinds of areas always look good.

[Sami]

You do have to keep in mind... Shin Megami Tensei is a massive multiverse. There's the main series and two major spinoff series, Devil Summoner and Persona. Then there's also a variety of other sub-series' as well.

To suggest that SMT is -only- what you showed is misleading. You're only looking at one aspect of the franchise. That's only the main franchise, its heavily varied.

There are, yes, some parts of this that bother me. But there's other parts that look pretty damn neat.

This game honestly reminds me of Persona more than anything (based on what little I've seen of Persona), which, yes, IS Shin Megami Tensei. Its just a branch of SMT.

If this really looked like Persona I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. I'd show you my posts in the P5 thread but they got lost in the wipe. I love Persona - but there are also some aspects of it that are extremely exacerbated in the spinoff games like Dancing All Night, the original content in Golden, and the anime(s) that I very passionately dislike.

Even taking those aspects of it into account, this is several times more flamboyant and absurd than Persona has ever been. Yes, even Persona 4. "But you liked the Persona 5 trailer!!" is a genuinely confusing defense for this game because they look nothing alike apart from being Japanese games with a broad anime aesthetic.

You're also acting like Fire Emblem hasn't been stripperific for no apparent reason. Which, well, it has:

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--2qUVbYGO--/18mh2vvu82yrtjpg.jpg

Of course this argument is probably going nowhere so I don't even know why I bother...

This is the reveal trailer. The reveal trailer.

After two years of anticipation, Atlus/Nintendo decided it was finally time to show the world their game, and this was what they chose to show us.

This is the Fire Emblem Awakening reveal trailer. Notice a difference?

Even if a game has dumb exploitative comic relief to get those otaku sales in some side quests or whatever, it doesn't have to be characteristic of the game's identity. A reveal trailer though? A main character whose superpower is to strip into her underwear or a bikini or whatever? Not exactly equivalent.

Also, you do realize that otaku isn't actually a positive term in Japan either, right?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=otaku

Despite what the west tends to believe, otaku is an extremely NEGATIVE term in Japan. And I don't think it has anything to do with what you're talking about.

Oh trust me, I'm aware. I've seen documentaries on Japan.

Fingers crossed we don't have anyone here who legitimately identifies as an otaku for some reason, here goes:

The Japanese connotation is totally valid and I have that in mind when I use the word. Otaku culture is disgusting. It's sexist and exploitative. It is genuinely disgusting.

Why does the female lead in this game strip into her undies? Why is there a visible thong on one of the other female leads? Why is "moe" so widespread? Why is popular anime like Sword Art Online so maliciously, disgustingly sexist?

Easy. 'Cause of losers like him:

and him, and him, and him and him and him -

You realize that Japanese entertainment media is currently in a huge rut because corporate suits see extreme amounts of money coming from otaku and have come to depend on them as whales?

Hayao Miyazaki hit the nail right on the head:

“You see, whether you can draw like this or not, being able to think up this kind of design, it depends on whether or not you can say to yourself, ‘Oh, yeah, girls like this exist in real life.’ If you don’t spend time watching real people, you can’t do this, because you’ve never seen it. Some people spend their lives interested only in themselves. Almost all Japanese animation is produced with hardly any basis taken from observing real people, you know. It’s produced by humans who can’t stand looking at other humans. And that’s why the industry is full of otaku!"

- Hayao Miyazaki

But yes, to answer your question, I am more than aware of the connotation of the word.

As far as not knowing what to expect... Honestly, this isn't that far from it. I had no idea what to expect, but all I've seen of SMT is brief glimpses at Persona, which is in the more modern day style of things with some fantasy elements, so I knew that would not mesh with Fire Emblem at all.

Anyone could see that SMT and Fire Emblem are way different from one another, and pretty much everyone I've seen was totally confused as to how they'd go about combining the two together. The only thing I figured was "strategy RPG."

Even from this I'm still not quite sure, but its definitely set off a large variety of reactions from different people wondering what the heck else is going on and how else this might tie into the various franchises.

... You just said that all you've seen of SMT is Persona. In what world would that make your expectation of the game more valid than someone who actually knows what mainline Shin Megami Tensei is and what it's supposed to look like?

The only thing I was arguing against is the notion that it would somehow not be anime.

I've already talked about this but whatever I'll go over it again.

Usually, to avoid confusion, I say "animu" when I'm describing exploitative, stylistically trashy otaku bait. You can look at my post in the Direct Thread:

HAHAHAHAHA THIS ART STYLE IS THE MOST HILARIOUS ANIMU OTAKU TRASH I'VE EVER SEEN HOLY SHIT I CAN'T BELIEVE I WAS EXCITED FOR THIS

FUCKING DYING

Most people just say "anime".

This is seriously the most ridiculous, tired semantic argument. We all know what everyone means by "too anime". Seriously.

People knew it would be anime.

Nobody expected it to be ~~~ ANIME ~~~

[Mauro Fonseca]

I'm pretty sure everyone knows what people mean when using "anime" as a derogatory adjective. It refers to otaku-bait moe/idol culture sexploitation shit. Neptunia, NIS, Compile Heart, Senren Kagura, 70% of the Vita's library, and like 99% of anime coming out these days. I swear the semantic argument of "BUT COWBOY BEBOP IS ANIME" or whatever comes up every time someone uses the word even though everyone and their dog knows the speaker isn't referring to stuff like Cowboy Bebop or Akira at all when they describe something as "too anime".

 

I've already talked about this but whatever I'll go over it again.

 

Usually, to avoid confusion, I say "animu" when I'm describing exploitative, stylistically trashy otaku bait. You can look at my post in the Direct Thread:

 

Most people just say "anime". 

 

This is seriously the most ridiculous, tired semantic argument. We all know what everyone means by "too anime". Seriously.

Also, I want you to please note I understand you've got a point, even though I think you're overreacting to it because it's always funny when you overreact to things on the internet

 

But Hayao Miyazaki is personal friends with otakus

 

He's personal friends of Hideaki Anno, who's constantly used as a "oh he hates otakus" guy while having fucking Strike Witches DVDs proudly displayed on his office

 

His two famous indictment of otaku were not moral judgments or anything- one time it was purely for aesthetic sense, the other he was talking about airplane otaku

 

I just think this is worth mentioning because you and so many GAFites and Tumblrites get so obsessed with the so fahnny Miyazaki gif edits and whatever they start to forget you're editing the man's words

[Sami]

Also, I want you to please note I understand you've got a point, even though I think you're overreacting to it because it's always funny when you overreact to things on the internet

But Hayao Miyazaki is personal friends with otakus

He's personal friends of Hideaki Anno, who's constantly used as a "oh he hates otakus" guy while having fucking Strike Witches DVDs proudly displayed on his office

His two famous indictment of otaku were not moral judgments or anything- one time it was purely for aesthetic sense, the other he was talking about airplane otaku

I just think this is worth mentioning because you and so many GAFites and Tumblrites get so obsessed with the so fahnny Miyazaki gif edits and whatever they start to forget you're editing the man's words

I'm not referring to the joke quotes, just that particular indictment of the industry and its style.

But yeah I know about the airplane thing and "anime was a mistake".

Edit - also weaboos are just non-Japanese otaku. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Mando-Whirl-Wind]

Honestly, we should probably just calm down, and wait and see what happens, apperantely there will be a developers blog, but other than that we probably won't get any more info till E3

 

Also Happy colorful looking stuff on the outside is nothing new for any of these developers, I mean look at the dark scary core of Kirby

[Mauro Fonseca]

It's also how most people would describe everything you and many GAFfers are trying to describe without needing to get replied to with "but Bebop is anime too"

 

Or as most /v/irgins angry with this trailer were putting it, "weebshit"

 

Now that's a clear cut term if I've ever seen one :V

[Brad]

Wait, hold on. This?

 

That game was SMTxFE? Really?

[KrazyBean]

Wait, hold on. This?

 

That game was SMTxFE? Really?

 

Oh yes it is most definitely the SMTxFE crossover. Surprising, I know.

[MegasonicZX]

Honestly while I can't blame anyone for being surprised about the artstyle I think its a bit of jump to say it sucks right off the bat, I mean heck when you look at a game like earthbound for instance it may seem like a kids game but it had some pretty dark and heavy themes underneath, maybe we'll get something similar with this.

[Komodin]

I know I've already said that I'm gonna give the crossover a chance, but I'll be honest: when I first saw the reveal trailer, I was constantly looking over my shoulder, worrying if anyone else was in the room.

[JaidynReiman]

Honestly while I can't blame anyone for being surprised about the artstyle I think its a bit of jump to say it sucks right off the bat, I mean heck when you look at a game like earthbound for instance it may seem like a kids game but it had some pretty dark and heavy themes underneath, maybe we'll get something similar with this.

Its not the artstyle most people are confused about, its the theme.

 

 

 

Wait, hold on. This?

 

That game was SMTxFE? Really?

A few people I've noticed caught on when they saw Tiki (not Awakening Tiki but young Tiki from the first FE) about halfway through the trailer, but Bill Trinnen spelled it out quite clearly after the trailer. It was confusing, though, because they didn't say what it was before it showed, and when it aired most everyone seemed to be like "Ok, what is this?" Then Bill Trinnen came out and said it was SMT X Fire Emblem.

 

 

It does appear its mostly Fire Emblem characters in an SMT type of setting. We still don't know much about it, though, it shows a bit of the gameplay and a few other... odd... things, but its still basically just another teaser. Granted, its more of a teaser than the original one was as it does show actual gameplay, but since its given very little context, it basically is just a teaser saying "hey, more info coming soon."

[Mauro Fonseca]

Yeah, setup pretty much appears to be "HERE'S PERSONA. THE MAIN PROTAGONISTS ARE MODERN-DAY VERSIONS OF FE CHARACTERS!"

 

Which I guess is a crossover, but it's clear they jumped the gun with the first teaser announcement.

[Brad]

I'm not really a player of either title and I wasn't paying much attention, so I just thought it was some modern day animu dating RPG and gave it no mind. Art style didn't match anything I've seen from FE though.

 

Colour me shocked.

[JaidynReiman]

I'm not really a player of either title and I wasn't paying much attention, so I just thought it was some modern day animu dating RPG and gave it no mind. Art style didn't match anything I've seen from FE though.

 

Colour me shocked.

Fire Emblem: Awakening is often called a dating sim... I'm definitely intrigued by it so far. Parts of it I don't like, but the gameplay seems like it could be interesting and I like the idea of FE characters in a modern day setting (which is also what IS liked about the idea, too).

 

 

 

Also I'm starting to think "Sigurd" may actually be Celiph. It would make sense as well. Son looks kinda like his dad. Granted, if speculation holds then its likely Marth is a descendant of Sigurd anyway.

[Salamander]

Regarding the concept trailer, then after at latest the first year had gone by with nothing heard then I took it for granted that the concept trailer was literally just announcing that they'd decided to do a crossover before they'd decided anything about it, which is why the only things they showed were copy-pastes of old character art.  And I think that that's still correct.

[JaidynReiman]

Regarding the concept trailer, then after at latest the first year had gone by with nothing heard then I took it for granted that the concept trailer was literally just announcing that they'd decided to do a crossover before they'd decided anything about it, which is why the only things they showed were copy-pastes of old character art.  And I think that that's still correct.

I don't think its quite that much. I think they had some ideas but realized they didn't quite work the way they had original thought, so they went back and thought things over again. I don't think they'd have announced it with literally nothing at all planned.

[Kuzu]

I had forgotten how taboo Anime can be on this board.

[WhoWhatMan]

Wasn't one of the ideas they had for Awakening is to take place in a modern setting? They probably decided to switch the theme and style into what we got because Altus is pretty good at making a RPG that takes place in modern times.

[Junko]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3s2xk0700f8eio0/Wii%20U%20-%20Shin%20Megami%20Tensei%20%26%20Fire%20Emblem%20Crossover%20Project%20Gameplay%20Trailer.mp3?dl=0

 

I ripped the trailer theme if you want it.